Am I a liberal or am I just pissed at the right people?

I have not studied political science.

I never went to college.

I have never had a fancy coffee drink in my life.

I live in a red state (Fla).

I own a gun.

I work hard, in the heat, and have never asked anyone for anything.

I am white.

I was raised in the backward isolated hills of north Alabama.

I even live in a trailer.

You may ask how this hillbilly could be a liberal, sometimes I ask myself that same question. The answer may be that I hate a liar and a hypocrite.

I have lived among the poor all of my life. sometimes I have even been one of them. I have seen how steep the road upward from the bottom is. I know how little actual help there is for Americans when bad things happen in their lives. How the only thing that is trickling down to street level is hate.

I have seen people desperate to get off drugs and no options because the only response society has is indifference or jail. I have seen homeless people who got that way simply because they got sick or their cars broke down and they could not get to work. I have talked to profoundly mentally ill people who just wander the streets. I have lived next door to at least 20 Guatemalans in the same small house. I have looked at the worst this country has to offer and I am terribly ashamed.

I have also seen and personally experienced the doors that are slammed in your face when all you are trying to do is get back on your feet. Just lose your car and then your job and then your home and then try to get them back. In this country it is next to impossible. In my personal experience all it would have taken was a head gasket to prevent the rest from happening. Life is a slippery slope on the bottom.

I guess what I am trying to say is that I know neo-conservative policies are responsible for a lot of the misery that is in the world. They have turned greed into a virtue and hatred for the poor into love for country.
I know them for the selfish liars they are. Does this make me a liberal or am I just pissed off at the right people?

That much is sure. But I'm a fraid you're going to have one of those fancy coffee drinks before we can call you a "liberal"... ;)

They have this collection of turds they're constantly rearranging. It's still shit.

:pals: it makes you both.

I seem to remember stories of a certain carpenter that lived and worked among those that were sick, poor, outcast, on the fringe of society, and he fought against the powers that be to change things.

even though I am an atheist.

Though, as far as I am concerned, he comes closest to Jesus Christ of anyone I know.

My roots almost preclude my having a liberal idealism. Sometimes I feel like mutant.

That's what my folks taught me at an early age and I still believe should be true.

You obviously see the world clearly. You think. You're a rational, decent human being. Why wouldn't you be a liberal?

By the way, you write very well. You write much better than many people who went to college.

I think you're just pissed off at the right people. As someone who is also pissed off at the right people, your point is well made.

I did study political science.

I went to college. Twice. Or even thrice.

I own an expensive espresso machine.

I grew up and live in a blue state.

I was raised in an affluent university town.

I live in a trailer. Without electricity. Because I just bought land. And am building a house.

So we're from two different sides.

I also despise liars and cheats. I want my taxes to help those who need help. I know the war on terrorism is empty. I know the drug war is a ploy. I want health care far more than defense build-up.


It doesn't matter who you are or where you came from. Being in touch with reality, and having common sense are what bring us together.

Reality is vicious. And that's why we need to be liberal in order to create a GOOD society. Lions and tigers rip us to shreds. We don't need conservatives who do that. We learned from the jungle. That's the reality I speak of. The one where we surpass the sickness and violence.



If Jesus had been a conservative, he'd have let the money changers stay in the temple, and he'd have kicked out the poor.

to an excellent post. :thumbsup:

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You can see other people and place yourself in their shoes.

The vast majority of conservatives I have talked too are either unable or unwilling to do that. As far as they are concerned, if others have problems it must be something they brought on themselves. After all, the conservative speaking doesn't have this problem. So it must not be a real problem.

they discover our views, because the word Liberal has been redefined by the GOP as something dirty and shameful. The only shameful thing here is that we let them get away with it, and continue to shy away from the word. I AM A LIBERAL AND PROUD OF IT!!

What do our opponents mean when they apply to us the label "Liberal?" If by "Liberal" they mean, as they want people to believe, someone who is soft in his policies abroad, who is against local government, and who is unconcerned with the taxpayer's dollar, then the record of this party and its members demonstrate that we are not that kind of "Liberal." But if by a "Liberal" they mean someone who looks ahead and not behind, someone who welcomes new ideas without rigid reactions, someone who cares about the welfare of the people -- their health, their housing, their schools, their jobs, their civil rights, and their civil liberties -- someone who believes we can break through the stalemate and suspicions that grip us in our policies abroad, if that is what they mean by a "Liberal," then I'm proud to say I'm a "Liberal." ~JFK

I think there's a segment out ther that erroneously believes if you're wearing black leather and riding a Harley Davidson, you MUST be a right wing fanatic. I have taken quite a few of them by surprise. :hi:

:toast:

Don't you find it great that because of the way we look, some of them actually listen to what we have to say :hi:

I think the universal "biker respect" opens doors for us that would be closed for many others. What I have found out is, many of them are completely disgruntled with the Bu$h* admin, they just don't know which way to go now.

Makes you an middle-aged Accountant.

neo-conservatives being at the root of much of the misery in this world. I think most people who have ever experienced personal hardship understand the importance of helping others, and others just understand because they were "raised right" as we say in the south. What's so disheartening is the attitude of "So?" of these neo-cons who seem to think that the suffering of others has nothing to do with them, that "those people" somehow deserve to suffer homelessness, to watch loved ones die for lack of health care, to watch their children go to bed hungry. It makes me angry to see people born with everything think it is their innate worth, rather than sheer luck that gave them these advantages, and that they owe the world nothing in return. But I do believe a different time is coming, and we just have to hold on. BTW, I always read your posts, wise man. As someone else said, you remind me of another carpenter I've heard tell about.

:hi:

Great post! :applause:

We are a lot alike. I traded in the hot outdoor job for a desk job several years ago, but we're pretty much the same on the rest. We're definetly pissed at the same people. :thumbsup:

"I have seen how steep the road upward from the bottom is. " Amen/Ramen to that.

You and I should be liberalism's core demographic.

Society should be structured that it serves the public directly. For too long we've deferred to the investor class who believe that what serves them, serves us indirectly.

is being screwed by the Republicans and their notion of a "free" market, which only gives your boss the freedom to take away your benefits, cut your pay, increase your hours, and then outsource your job and lay you off! You, of course, have the "freedom" to quit, only to look for a job with another soul-less dictator, who puts you through the same thing! Republicans want to deregulate our bosses so that they can regulate us to death!

You are very intelligent and politically savvy indeed!:-)

great post btw.

I would say you are a populist, like many other good ol boys and girls, down here, living as you live.


The problem is, IMO, talk radio that's available to listen to all day, convincing those that are populist that they are in fact liberal-hating conservatives.

i don't know how this happens but it does.

You just explained one reason so well why people that rely on rw radio and tv vote against their own self-interests so often.

I look at my current BF - he's a moderate, but he's a blue-collar guy. he's in his company truck all day, and the only things avaialble to listen to in his area are country, bluegrass and talk radio.

And when we talk politics soemtimes he'll rattle off soemthing that I don't think he even realizes comes formt he radio. Thankfully he's good at critical thinking so we can back to a more moderate position fromt here, but still. talk radio is like mind-control.

the other stuff rots your brain. unless its the johnny cash, waylon jennings version of country music. i would bet it isn't :)

you can definitely bet it isn't. It's that CMT Toby Keith crap. bless. It's like I have to exercise damage control everytime we talk.

And you are one even if you don't know it.

I apologize for Florida. I have tried. :shrug:

See below

Although I am willing to let you stay if you admit to eating cheese and drinking wine.

if we liberals are to be inclusive, I'm sure that we have room under the big tent for ice coffee, sweet tea, and cool spring water....

right there with ya.

great post!

The heart and soul of the group I seek to identify with embodies caring, integrity, compassion, reasoned thought, and an ability to view differing perspectives. I would say that you share those same ideals and therefore shun the hypocrisy of those that currently constitute the right wing.

Thanks for sharing your story. :thumbsup: :hi:

But I teach a bunch of non educateds.

I am curious.

:hi:

I suspect you are .........I've read your meme

you are here solely to create attention for yourself with your blather. Not sure what purpose it serves, but I suspect this board will not be home for you for long.

Nicely done.

This is happy horse manure. This persona is duping the unwitting. Stay away. If you fell for this one what else have you been bequiled. No uneducamated has this vocab.

Since you seem to think that my vocabulary is too good for a wage earner. I will explain. I did not stop reading and learning the minute I graduated from HS. I read about 20-30 serious books a year. Even when I was homeless I still browsed the shelves at goodwill. If you will re-read the post I never claimed to be uneducated, only that I never had the higher education that seems to be the norm among self described liberals.

In my experience, right-wingers tend to be satisfied if they accrue personal wealth and power. They don't much care about the rest of the world. Progressives, on the other hand, tend to look around at the whole world and care about people beyond themselves.

Republicans say, "I got mine Jack, and yours too - suckers!"
Democrats say, "Let's share and make the world a better place for everyone."

Which would Jesus be?

Maybe you should see if you can get some!1!1! :yoiks:



http://news.softpedia.com/news/Anti-Stupidity-Pill-Has-Been-Developed-32245.shtml">Believe it or not, the first pill that could cure stupidity was recently developed, German newspaper states

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What do you want on your pizza? :hi:

Neither does Woody Allen.

Nor Bill Gates.

oh and someone who does have education is Mr George W Bush, a Master's Degree in Business I think it is.

as luring.

"I never had the higher education that seems to be the norm among self described liberals."
Point 1 seems to be a chastisement and from outside.

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Do you make a habit of going around picking fights with people on boards that you've newly joined?

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gets shown the door.

If you truly believe in helping one another, then consider that calling another poster a liar might not be the most effective approach to building bridges to interreliance.

I presented to all a story of a very tough time in my life and a point of view that many will never see.

The best I can gather from your cryptic one line remarks is that you think I am some sock puppet with a hidden agenda. Nothing could be farther from the truth. I have always presented myself the way I am, The internet is too full of bullshit for me to add more.

You do not seem to have a remark about the subject of my post, but you went directly for an attack on my character. That is the main tool of the self centered conservatives who continue to ruin our world.

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The DU rules can be found by clicking the little "DU rules" button on the bottom of the page. I recommend that you take a look.

Fine, feel that way if you must. If you cannot believe that a working man can express himself well, then that makes you an intellectual snob.

If you attack my post that is calling for sympathy for the poorest people in our society, well then that makes you a conservative. Go elsewhere.

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poor = uniformed, ingnorant, superstitious. Is that what you are saying?

I am an angry carpenter because of empty-headed snobbery like that.

You seem to be working under a sweeping generalization. Another conservative trait.

an out of home person. Thought you might give it up but you've read my responses. How do you continue on with this cosmic debris?

I mean really are you aware of the life changinging time that is upon us. I'm not talking apocalypse but the end of cheap energy.

The line that you may be fed can either be corroborated or refuted at www.theoildrum.com. I've read it for two years now and know some of the acronyms.

Your responding says to me that you might want go beyond what you've been told. I have few answers. I met this Indian guy who told me that when things got tough, "Take to the Loom." Make your own clothes. When that didn't solve, "Bake bread." Pretty simple huh? Specifically.

I asked you if you think poor=stupid, what say you?

I think the disjointed logic he uses, the non-sequitors, the peculiar and unexplained figures of speech, point to either something wrong with his brain chemistry or just an unusually creative troll. Either way I see no reason to worry about him. He may or may not be able to explain his point coherently if he wanted to, but by now it looks unlikely to happen for either reason. You can go about your business on DU in peace. :)

maybe two or more at once.

I am in full agreement with your assessment.

Is it because MA is the most LIBRUL state? Also creative profile that includes stereotypical liberal profession and hobbies.

Could be he's just drunk or stoned. :shrug:

Ersatz any objective documentation of this story we have this man's words and our own presumptions to rely on for discernment, and yours reveal a pompous and classist sense of superiority.

On an unrelated note, your proofreading abilities give me no reason to believe that you are qualified to teach children.

Enjoy your short stay.
:hi:

:P

I haven't seen that before. Maybe my browser is just screwed up.

???

why yes.... our country is no better than the least amongst us. There is no "We" in a society unless we give a damn. there is no country until we give a shit about each other. Being American isn't about wearing flag pins or sticking flags on our vehicles....

are now finding that homelessness is closer to the middle class than they thought. Many people are only one paycheck away from being destitute. As a child my grandparents told me that the Democratic party was for the working people and I firmly believe that. Of course there are Democrats out there who act like Repubs. but for the most part the Democratic party tries to take care of those who aren't living in mansions and at times have hard times. I don't like the fact that FOX and the Repubs have made the term liberal sound so disgusting. As many have said Jesus was a liberal. They don't like him either for if they did they wouldn't treat people like they do. Many of these Christians do not act like Christ.

I was raised in the hills of western NC, in what wasn't much more than a shack that grew out of a log cabin. It got electricity only 5 years before I was born. I grew up hearing how lucky I was not to have to bring water up from the springhouse in back or have to use the privy up the hill. Yes, I did consider myself lucky, all things in perspective. Still do.

I own a rifle and a shotgun. I still live way-out in the country. Though my place is a sanctuary, if something attacks my dogs or appears rabid, it's up to me to dispatch it as quickly and humanely as possible. The eldest dog is my partner's assistant, one in whom we've invested a great deal of love, devotion, training and attention. She is his freedom to move about in the world. Worse than losing a "child", he would lose his mobility assistant. I can't let that happen. Those who would remove all guns, please consider this. Just askin' to see if from this side.

I work hard, always have. My granddaddy, a strong Democrat if there ever was one, was the sickest man I ever knew who got up and went to work every day, with only one lung. Hard work and paying attention in school were the only way out of the holler. Granddaddy was right. I've seen most of America, a bit of Europe and Australia. Being the breadwinner of the family, I work a fulltime job, plus bringing up our farm, plus doing weddings to keep things moving. Thanks to neocon outsourcing, there'll be no retirement, so I'm having to hustle double-hard now because the clock's tickin'.

I'm white. Mostly. Being Appalachian, I have some mysterious Native and Melungeon roots. Some called us "black Irish", some called us "part Indian", some called us far less charitable names, and historically we were considered the lowest of the lowest of the low. I don't care what anyone calls me, except late for supper :)

My home is a modular, double-wide format. I was lucky enough to find a foreclosure on a big piece of land out in the country that I could actually afford to keep. I was doubly blessed in that I had the VA behind me to secure a 100% loan. I figured I'd earned that, having extended active duty once, then going back into active reserves voluntarily and extending again. From the shack of my childhood, to the rental crap I've put up with along the way, from the brief stint of homelessness, no castle could be finer to me than what I've got. I've seen the barrel from the bottom up and it's not pretty.

I've been the poor, lived among the poor, and have floated among some of the very richest of society. Give me the poor any day. They know everything they've got and however little it is, they're grateful for it. The rich generally don't give a damn unless they're helping themselves to more of it -- or someone else's.

Oh, brother, you're so right. We have so much to offer and we sure could do better by one another. This crap about "self-reliance" that the RW love to spew comes from a bunch of spoiled brats who never had to struggle for a thing. There's no such thing as a self-made man. We're each a product of what we've given and absorbed along the way. It's compassion and empathy, a willingness to prevent problems before they happen, to have felt that pain and wish up to Whatever It Is that nobody else ever has to feel it -- that makes us either lefties or liberals. Or as granddaddy would've said, just plain "decent".

One more thing: bad shit does happen to good people. Been there, done that. And you're right, it's almost impossible to get help. A leg-up is not at all the same thing as a hand-out, I don't care how the RW try to paint and spin it. Nobody in a bad situation wants a hand-out (unless they're bone-sorry to start with); only a chance to do for themselves. Even people in desperate situations still have dignity and pride. I know. Been there.

The RW often seeks to dehumanize first, stripping dignity and pride, rather than looking at a situation first to see how to fix the problem now and immediately thereafter to prevent the problem from happening again. There are no quick-fixes to anything when the messes are as big as they've made them.

But I refuse the wear the shame that belongs to the neocons. Let them wear their own damn shame home. They made their own shame and they're not going to put it on me, or you, or anyone else here. Hold your head up, friend. We might not can change the world, but we can paint our corners of it any color we want to. Mine's bright blue, and I suspect yours might be, too. :pals:

Thank-you for your story. I have given it some thought and rather than liberal I prefer human being. Conservatives have ruined the name of what may be the only thing that insures the continued existence of humanity.

:patriot:

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:shrug:

because of what they've done to it. They've tried to paint "liberal" is, as weak, or effete or something like that. What they've demonstrated is "conservative" as, is greedy, lazy, grubby, thieving, lying, conniving, hypocritical, bigoted, racist, homophobic, xenophobic, hard-headed, narrow, and downright mean.

It is written, a tree shall be known by its fruit. What fruit have the conservatives borne? Just take a look around. The damage is plain for any fool to see.

Any more, when I think of the word "liberal" what comes to mind is someone who might be willing to do whatever it takes to make sure that somebody they don't know has a safe place to sleep or a hot meal to eat tonight and a way to provide it for themselves tomorrow.

When I think of the word "conservative" the first thing that comes to mind is a person that would steal the sheets of someone's clothesline to wear to steal the wood off someone else's shed to burn a cross in somebody's yard they don't know and holler verses from a Bible they don't read to make sure that they were less able to deal with life tomorrow.

Now, if a body had to pick a label...

Just sayin'.

You sir are a genius.

a lot of folks try to paint all us southerners as backwards and hardheaded. You and I have battled that all our lives. We're not all that way. I had to take up for Texans on another thread, because there are a lot of stories being floated by the RW noise machine about stereotypes that sometimes sucker even the smartest of us in. Your story spoke to me strongly because it is so very similar to mine. I'll bet that you and I aren't the only ones.

You and I are both here trying to show that just because "everybody knows" something, it ain't necessarily so. "Everybody knows" liberals are latte-sipping, limp-wristed, gun-grabbing, Bible-thumping... well, you see what I mean?

No, we're not at all like that picture that's been painted and stuck on us. We're people who give a damn. We give a damn that our children will have trees instead of parking lots, clean air instead of asthma, water that's fit to drink instead of stuff that's out of a jug that costs more than gas. We give a damn when someone is in trouble/hungry/homes because this is a land of plenty and there's no reason for it.

I've come to love DU because, yeah, we scrap amongst ourselves like any family does, but at the end of the day, we get our stuff together and head in the correct direction. We're willing to learn something, take it in, make our corners of the world a little bit better place.

I'll say it again. We might not can change the whole world, but we can make our corners of it a little bit better. Y'never know. Those corners get a little bit bigger all the time. There's another carpenter who has a lot of my respect, one who also led by example. He didn't bash anybody, didn't put folks in trouble down, tried to help where he could, took up for the poor and the hungry. He painted his corner and while it didn't change the whole world, it made a whole lot of it a better place.

You, sir, made DU a better place by leading with a powerful OP that opened a door for a whole lot of folks. I appreciate your courage and the opportunity to back you up.

:thumbsup: :thumbsup:

:D


:kick:

He spoke truth to power.

I bear witness.

Here we are together. We're a whole lotta very different folks, but what makes us different from the RW is that we give a damn about something outside of our own selves. You can call that lefty, liberal, human, or like my granddaddy said, just being decent. Whatever that quality is, I'm not going to let them take that last shred of decency or humanity from me or anyone else while there's breath in my body.

Thanks, Carpenter, for being the OP for reminding us who we really are. Don't matter none what we call it. It's still decent.

You and I live in near the same part of the world. I enjoyed browsing your website.

Thanks for the welcomes. It's good to be surrounded by fellow Tarheels. We gonna turn this mutha blue this year or what?

I'm behind in pics and posts on the site; been busy DU'ing when I should have been gardening (oops!). I've got wedding and commitment gigs through August, but I'll try to catch up after that, promise :) Thanks for visiting :hug:

:applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause:

I was talking to my nephew the other day. We both grew up in "upper" lower class homes. We were commiserating about how unfair it was not to get accepted to the universities of our choice while others less qualified seemed to have it so easy. He blamed the poor inner city African-Americans getting a free ride and getting all the slots. I told him when I was in his position I blamed all the rich well-connected losers whose parents donated to the alumni fund.

I told him that whom we choose to blame says a lot about each of us. It made a big impression on him.

I mean DAMN! Your logic is impeccable.

.... and wish more Americans could.

My experience isn't exactly the same as yours, but close enough that I've reached the same conclusions.

I don't really consider myself a liberal any more. I'm for economic and societal justice.

I loathe the neo-cons and the Bush asslickers and I know history will be harsh to them, and just wish there could be some criminal justice thrown in.

But one thing is for sure, we ARE pissed off at the right people. And we're not alone.

I'm both a liberal and pissed off at the right people too! :P

And for a lot of similar reasons as you posted and some of my own.

Great post!

:kick: & Recommended

you without using your critical thinking skills, and I'm very glad for that!

Big question is what the hell "the right" means nowadays. Corporate privateering, imperialist terrorism, greed, .... Anything else? Ah yes, the "religious right" with it's "the state in every bedroom" morality, which perfectly synchs with the imperialist program of "the state in everyone's mail".

it makes you *right*

:)

Except I humped and bumped rug instead of knocking nails.

Joe Bageant calls me "the Brokeback Carpet Layer"
something I'm not entirely comfortable with considering I'm straight.

But, if I hadn't bought this brokedown old sailboat to live in with my SSI disability back money,
and I didn't have a retired carpet store owner friend with a farm he lets me park it on for free,
I'd be brokeback and sleeping under an interstate bridge in a bedroll.

Some of us manage to find a flat branch to perch on.

While the thieves drink Courvasier and drive ferraris

and doesn't automatically think that it is that person's own fault. A liberal loves this country, but is not willfully blind to its many shortcomings. A liberal speaks of people who are different from himself with respect and curiosity, rather than knee-jerk hatred. A liberal understands the importance of working hard, but recognizes that in this country, it is possible to work your ass off in the increasingly soul-killing, unrewarding service jobs that are all we have left; and never have anything to show for your labor and work-ethic. A liberal wants to solve the problems we have as a nation, rather than distract attention from them, which only causes new problems.

You're a liberal, buddy. Be proud. I know I am. :pals:

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feed me.

Good riddance... :eyes:

I'm not sure what you are. Possibly some kind of mineral.

Fun to play with, though. I hope we get to keep it for a while. Cat toy.

:P

My Parents still watch Faux News, and they say that my 14 year-old is "brainwashed" because I tell him the facts. He's staying with them for the summer because he took them up on an offer to send him to 'yacht camp'.

Yeah, they're those kind of Republicans... while still otherwise very bright people.

I get a chuckle because he's been getting their goat lately.


Nonetheless, once anyone with even a modicum of critical thinking skill takes an objective look at what's going on (which is a real trick with the corporate media), he concludes that these days, Republicans and the Corporations are out to screw the public for real... and to hell with the law and the Constitution.

I'm not a 'liberal' even though I agree with them most of the time these days... I'm just a conscientious patriot.

Welcome to the club.

The important thing is that you know what you're pissed off about and why. This whole business of people pretending that "liberal" politics has anything to do with your beverage preference or the car you drive has never been anything but a crock. As a "latte-drinking, Volvo-driving liberal" who rarely drinks coffee and doesn't own a car, all I know is that people who believe the "liberal" view of things do so because they've either seen the kind of things you've seen, or they are more affected by hearing about those things than by hearing theories about the "invisible hand of the market" or how we can "topple Islamo-fascism" by blowing stuff up.

My political "partisanship" is that I call 'em like I see 'em. And whatever party I end up affiliated with because of that, so be it.

This post will leave the greatest page in about half an hour. I am deeply flattered by the response it received. I hope that you are all well and that none of you will ever have to endure life on the ragged edge. I even wish the drunk guy from Tampa well, he has some problems that would not be so bad if someone just gave a damn.

It has been fun but it is my bed time, sweet dreams.

Take it easy... B-)

Good for you.
:thumbsup: