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First Horatio Alger, now American Exceptionalism... give me a fucking break!

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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-25-08 11:14 PM
Original message
First Horatio Alger, now American Exceptionalism... give me a fucking break!
Sorry, but I hate propaganda... and this is as thick as it gets
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Fumesucker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-25-08 11:16 PM
Response to Original message
1. Some context would be nice..
I don't watch TV so I'm not watching the convention.

Those two concepts rankle me too.
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-25-08 11:19 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. First commenter said, Michelle's story is that of Horatio Alger
now we have a second commenter (both AA by the way) saying that her story, the descendant of slaves, is now the wife of a presidential candidate, Reverent Jim Revers by the way.

A little US History... which rankles some folks, but we didn't only have AA slaves... the 17 century saw plenty of poor white in service for life, and by the 18 we had indentured servants

Slavery is a dark mark in US History, but the propaganda has to stop... doesn't help us one iota
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Phredicles Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-25-08 11:29 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. He's saying she likes boys? 'Cause Horatio sure did.
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 12:03 AM
Response to Reply #4
12. Oh com'on get out of here? A Republican right wing hero was GAY?
:sarcasm:

I know, I know, but many of the folks who buy this HA crap don't know that
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amandabeech Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-25-08 11:39 PM
Original message
Indentured servants did not serve for life.
Edited on Mon Aug-25-08 11:42 PM by amandabeech
The usual term was 7-8 years, which was considered adequate service to compensate the master for his or her payment of the servant's crossing from England.

Nadin, I know that you did not go to school here, but you really owe yourself an introductory course in U.S. history at a local college. Or just read some college level text books.

The other alternative would be for you to simply stop posting anything having to do with U.S. history because you make big mistakes almost every time you post.

You don't help your reputation around here by making things up.
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-25-08 11:59 PM
Response to Original message
9. You are right, indentured did not
but there was an earlier period where servants did serve for life. Lasted a generation or so and it was very early in colonial history

Hackett has written extensively about it, and it is not well known

What am I saying? People in this country, mostly, don't know what happened last week, let alone in the 1600s

By the way, I commend you... since YOU DO
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amandabeech Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 06:10 PM
Response to Reply #9
16. Thanks for your much improved post.
I'll check out the Hackett.

BTW, I know plenty of people who grew up here who know a little history. Maybe you're just hanging with the wrong crowd.
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amandabeech Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-25-08 11:39 PM
Response to Reply #2
8. Aggravated duplicate post.
Edited on Mon Aug-25-08 11:41 PM by amandabeech
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apocalypsehow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-25-08 11:28 PM
Response to Original message
3. Well, I hate to break it to you, but for better or worse do you know what the American people tend
to do when a political party puts speaker's up on the stage during their televised national convention who proceed to tell those same Americans that the country they live in basically sucks thanks to its past history?

What they tend to do is turn around and deliver 49 states to that party's political opposite number in the presidential election.

You may think it's "propaganda," and I may (to some extent) agree, but people don't like to hear their cherished ideals pissed on during events like this: they like to hear their fondest hopes affirmed.
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DBoon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-25-08 11:31 PM
Response to Reply #3
6. small children will never elect you president
if you go around saying Santa Claus isn't real
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apocalypsehow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-25-08 11:37 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. For better or worse, that's how politics works if you want to govern. Don't get mad at me, I didn't
make up the rules governing human nature. I'm just describing it as it currently exists.
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 12:01 AM
Response to Reply #7
10. Nah, we need to grow out of the imperial myth.
Fortunately the collapse of empire will do that... perhaps then we will mature as a nation and stop believing in the Clauss
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Mudoria Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 06:46 PM
Response to Reply #10
17. What empire?
I must of missed the news the day they announced that..:eyes:
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 12:06 AM
Response to Reply #3
13. By the way... if you WATCHED the coverage you'd get it
it was NOT michelle Obama laying it thick... or Ted Kennedy. They played on the themes around the edges

It was the MSNBC commentators...

You can tell the difference?
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provis99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-25-08 11:30 PM
Response to Original message
5. do we get to hear about Manifest Destiny to save the world, too
You know, "Last, best hope of mankind" (except for the other 4 dozen other wealthy democratic countries), and crap like that, too?

Yeah, even Democrats sometimes tend to overdo the maudlin, we-are-the-champions obnoxiousness that the rest of the world identifies with the loudmouths of America. It'll be gone in four days when the convention is over.
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 12:01 AM
Response to Reply #5
11. I am sure we will, before the convention is over
it is the retelling of the imperial myth going back to oh Jackson...
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Cleita Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 12:14 AM
Response to Original message
14. I don't understand you.n/t
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 12:15 AM
Response to Reply #14
15. Translation, the imperial myth is now old and trite
and this is what this is about
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