If you're doing well in this country, then you should pay your fucking share.

It really cracks me up to see people earning over $250K whining and crying about the possibility of having to pay more taxes. Boo-hoo-fucking-hoo. I laugh my ass off to see rethugs suggesting that we should actually CUT taxes for corporations. Hey, if any of you rethug/freeper/troll assholes are reading this, I got two words for you - FUCK YOU. You want to keep all your filthy money to yourselves, you want to hoard all your earnings in your offshore bank accounts, FUCK OFF. You'd rather see people starve in the streets, dying in hospital waiting rooms, rather than fork over a single fucking dollar. Of course, you have no problem paying a minimal amount of taxes if you know that it's going to help the Defense Dept create new war machines, new ways to kill people; or to Fatherland Security if you know that it's going to go to new ways to suppress protesters.

Paying tax is a privilege and the taxes should be used to protect and rebuild American schools, roads, bridges, etc.

If you are doing well here, then it is your duty to pay your fair share to support the country that enables you to prosper.

society plays a huge role in being able to be successful, from the roads and other infrastructure, to the people who are potential consumers to the stability of the economy. There's also some amount of luck and good connections involved.

The "self bootstrappers" don't realize that no one exists in a vacuum and that pulling yourself up by your bootstraps is literally and physically impossible.

I recognize hard work, drive, and good ideas are a HUGE part as well, but those things will do you no good if you're stranded in the wilderness without a society of consumers and/or investors.

I love paying taxes myself, as everyone should.

My wife and I are both working professionals who do very well for ourselves. Not $250K a year well, but very well nonetheless.

I always argue with my parents (who also do extremely well for themselves) over this. I say I SHOULD pay more taxes and that I do not have any problem doing so. I point out that the bumper sticker slogan is true: Freedom ISN'T free, and that since I chose not to serve my country in uniform then I have no right to complain about taxes because it is the only way that I support this country. I don't always like how they are spent, but that's the breaks and that's why I get involved in issues and politics, etc. so I can have some semblance of say in how my money gets spent. But when it doesn't get spent the way I like it, I don't whine about it or think that I should have to pay less.

I forget who said it, but I agree that those who want a bigger piece of the pie should pay more of the cost for having a pie in the first place.

I had an argument with another educated professional colleague who made the argument essentially that "I worked hard for this."

Yeah, getting a basic education in public schools.

Going to a University funded in part by the public.

Getting a post-doctoral position funded by the National Institutes of Health.

And so on...

EVERYBODY pays taxes so that these things can be done in order for the academically talented to advance. NOBODY "does it on their own".

Another proud taxpayer here.

not the rates.

People making $40k/year are paying a higher effective tax rate than people making $300k/year... even though $300k/year is a category that gets taxed more heavily.
The ones making lots of money can afford to participate in good number of tax dodges and hire accountants to make sure they pay as little as possible.

There should be a single flat tax and a single exemption that everybody gets.
(that's not what Boortz and the other flat-earthers are calling for)

If you eliminate all the loopholes the wealthy will be paying far more than they do now under "higher" tax brackets.

It would burden those making less far more than those making over $250K.

I agree the current tax code is a joke, and we really do need to simplify things. Instead of a single tax rate, it should be a series of tax rates depending on your income. I realize that's pretty much what we have now, but eliminate all these tax credits and shelters that the rich use to get out of their obligations.

but it would be far more equitable than what we have now.
And it doesn't have to burden the middle class anymore than the current system.

Assume the single write off is $40k and the flat rate is %19
(I don't know what the average effective rate for $40k but I think it's around %21)
People making under $40k would get everything back and people making $41k would pay lower taxes than they do now.
(I'm pulling the numbers out the air, but they should illustrate the idea)

I don't believe a tax rate has to be progressive for the policy to be effective and equitable... as long as the policy is sane.
I know that's like the third rail for some progressives but ... so be it.:P

I'd really like to see a serious change that was based on rational thought but I don't think it'll ever happen.
Like I said before... too many fingers in the pie.
Get rid of write offs/tax credits and you'll have thousands of individual groups screaming bloody murder.
(and that's the only way I could see a single rate being possible)

my table got messed by when the journal narrowed its width, but the numbers are there

http://journals.democraticunderground.com/hfojvt/69

A 17% flat tax would save people with incomes over $1,000,000, 56 billion in taxes. If it's revenue neutral, that savings will have to be made up by the middle and lower classes.

The answer is not a flat tax, but a more progressive tax. Bring back 5% brackets at the bottom and bring back 70% rates at the top.

This is the great mythology developed by the GOPers. They say, well, the top 1% control 28% of the wealth and pay 40% of the taxes! How is that fair? It's fair because what they pay makes no dent in living even a ridiculously luxurious life and passing that to their kids unto five generations. So I don't care that they pay more than the other 99%, even if it is not commensurate with what they "control." Most of us take a significant hit relative to total income and net worth at tax time. The uber-wealthy do not, even when they pay far more. Fair share does not mean equal share. It means fair relative to your total LIFE chances.

:loveya: I'm so glad you put that in your journal. I needed to read that this morning. You have a way of framing profound chaos a lot of us experience in a way that at least gave me perspective. Thanks for that.

It just angers me when people bring up solutions like "coddle the wealthy, because they are the ones who'll lead us". News Flash: no one NEEDS a billion dollars when millions cannot eat and have no health care.

And what are we getting for funding these corporate bailouts? A recession and job losses by the multiple thousands, that's what. This is the Republican/corporatist way of saying "thanks".

their kids have 3 school fundraisers before Halloween because there isn't enough money for anything.

or the ones that their business buys and then they lease back (doubling the write off)
:eyes:

the tax system is so screwed up we should completely scrap it and start over.
Unfortunately there are so many people with fingers in the pie that'll never happen.

That pathetic Repuke Bushie reject Ari Fleisher was again pushing this meme last night on "The Daily Show"!

They are so utterly obsessed with the idea of continuing to additionally burden the working class of this country to the point where we have a permanent majority underclass. They can then retreat behind the safe walls of their gated communities, where they can count their money or whatever they get off on doing...

CHANGE IS COMING, ASSHOLES!

So what, if that many people are making only enough to survive why should they pay taxes just because? Stupidest Repuke talking point ever.

in 2005 there were 134,372,678 income tax filers. 1,761,041 of them had adjusted gross income of zero or less (and yet still paid 133,370,000 in taxes). In 1998 of a population of 272 million, 78 million of us were under the age of 19, about 28%.

Crud, I just realized that does not help since many of those are joint returns, and also some, like mine, did not pay taxes even though we filed a return.

Still, the 50% number is believable to me. First, because lower income couples with children are getting Earned Income Credits. Second, because of the child tax credit a family of four making $39,000 pays no income taxes. Approximately 40% of households make less than $40,000 a year. Then there are deductions and credits. A family of four making $49,000 a year, for example, can put $10,000 in an IRA and pay zero taxes. That's how I avoided income taxes myself - by putting $500 in my IRA (and I got a double benefit, a deduction on line 17 and a retirement savings credit on line 32)

That's under current law, and Obama has promised to create more credits which will reduce taxes for even more people.

They should WANT to pay for it now rather than pass the cost on to their grandchildren.

Assholes.

You should, in any case, feel a tax burden analogous to that felt by other Americans, and that means paying a hell of a lot in taxes.

Please don't think that all people that are doing well, with kids in private schools and that drive suv's are like that. I canvass and phone bank for Obama/Biden. I feel very passionately about this campaign. I firmly believe that trickle down does not work and you need to strengthen the middle class for sound economic growth. I proudly display my Obama/Biden sticker on the back of my suv and drive through the car line at my kid's school for all to see and question me if they like. I'll be glad to let them know where I stand! My husband and I never complain about paying out share.

and rightly so.

The greatest battle since WWII, to protect our way of life against the forces of oppression -- except this time, no one needs to sacrifice anything (except about 100,000 troops; what a deal compared to 60 years ago, huh!).

Raisng spectre of Herbert Hoover.


Getting heated.

The poor send their sons and daughters to fight in wars so the rich can have the safe playing field they enjoy and exploit. The guy who busts his ass at a hard physical job on Monday, wakes up on Tuesday sore from the day before and does it again and again just to barely feed his family, as the CEO of his employer makes 475 time his salary.

What really gets me about the rich is that it's not a set amount of money that they need, but a constant increase, no matter what it does to the country or the rest of us.

The sky's the limit, but there's only so much sky, fuckers!

In fact, I would happily pay more, if it meant universal healthcare, fixing our nation's infrastructure, and perhaps maybe someday public higher education.

I don't at all like the fact that so much of my tax money has gone to pay for an illegal invasion/occupation, but I still agree that everyone should pay their fair share so that we can have a working society. I'm an idealist, I guess.

and are willing to pay more taxes. I'm ok if the taxes go to paying for more health care or infrastructure, but not all that happy paying for a useless war. 250K is NOT rich in Los Angeles.