Another thread for those of US that support the prosecution of Bush administration criminals by the

Obama administration.

There is legislation to accomplish this-The Executive Branch Accountability Act of 2008 was introduced by Wisconsin Representative Tammy Baldwin (D) in September.

DUer davidswanson posted about Baldwin's Bill on After Downing Street.org
http://www.afterdowningstreet.org/baldwinbill

Robert Parry (along with many others) warns our President-elect about the possible/likely consequences of not holding the criminals of the Bush administration accountable in an article from his Consortium News site
"Obama: Beware the Lessons of '93"
http://www.consortiumnews.com/2008/111108.html

I demand the prosecution of individuals like Richard Bruce Cheney, Donald Henry Rumsfeld, Paul Wolfowitz, Elizabeth Cheney, Alberto Gonzales, Tommy Thompson, Lurita Doan, Douglas Feith, John Yoo, Viet Dinh, General Richardo Sanchez and many others (name your own Bush administration criminals in this thread).

Who here also demands the prosecution of Bush administration criminals by the Obama administration?

I will support that effort until they are locked up or six feet under.

Just wondering. Some things are complicated.

a restoration our Constitution, Bill of Rights, and of the rule of law.
:patriot:

I just want the truth to come out, even if it means some very unsavory, guilty-as-hell types will get relatively light punishment.

Instead of individual accountability -- making a few, unlucky, high-profile public criminals pay, for the sins of the many, my dream scenario is to use provisions of The Patriot Act to turn the whole "national security" apparatus on its head.

The reason being is that so many of those "black ops" and "black budget" operations are compartmentalized. The whole dirty business -- you have to assume -- is conducted on a 'need to know' basis. And those that really know what's going on, don't care; while those that might otherwise care (or be tempted to turn on their more corrupt brethren), don't know...

How else can you explain the fact that the "War on Drugs," for example, has been waged for so long (with so little apparent 'success') while so many have gotten so rich off of it?

The recent offer by President Morales, in Bolivia, and his minister, Mr. Quintana, (Agence France Presse, Nov. 6th or 7th, I think) to provide proof, to President Obama, that the D.E.A. has been actively involved in promoting narco-trafficking, in his country, must be accepted.

Taking that one step could go a long way towards restoring America's place in the world, and that's more important to me than any public stoning ceremony, however satisfactory it might be, in the short term.

leaves office, he can simply pardon their way out of trouble.

...blanket pardons anyway.

Just ask Nancy Pelosi.

Call in the Jury, Bailiff.

Mr. Foreman, have you reached a Verdict?

As much as we Americans demand the prosecution of these individuals, the only way the world will heal is if they are prosecuted by a globally mounted tribunal.

We should also consider the fact that Bush and Cheney, through the auspices of the Secret Service (and at a cost, each, exceeding $23 million over the next ten years) are basically going to be prisoners in their own sorry hides.

That and the vindication of the Constitution and a return to the rule of law (and of course, the impending success of the Obama presidency) should be enough punishment to send them to their graves.

Send them to the Hague!

Send them to the world court so their SC cronies can't review the case. Let the world be their judge.

and it is the world that needs justice here. The world is the victim of this crew.

But, I think it will take a long time before international trials can even be begun. The economic crisis will distract many people who would otherwise support this.

We are going to hear -- Obama needs our support. It is not the time for vengeance. Very persuasive and, perhaps, valid arguments against demanding and obtaining justice will be raised.

We have to be very patient and never, never forget what these men have done.

We must remember the price for forgetting. We will have another administration, be it Democratic or Republican, that follows the precedent set by the Bush administration and simply sets aside the rule of law invoking the excuse that national security is the supreme priority. No, human rights are the supreme priority. The only national security that matters is the national security of the rights of Americans and all other people in the world. Protecting human rights, and nationally that means protection constitutional rights, is the only way to insure the national security of the United States.

So, let's never give up bringing these people to justice -- but as Obama said, for crimes committed not for policy errors.

It is a violation of international law to use the military to kill people in a sovereign country, especially when that sovereign country told us to keep out.

The Bush Administration has sanctioned the use of missile firing drone robots to kill people in Pakistan. It has repeatedly used these robots piloted by both the military and the CIA. One would think the World Court would have a strong case in this matter.

....or from anyone else, he's not the man for the job. constitutional expert, indeed.

Give them their fair and due process.

:kick:

K&R!

...I have a pretty hard time overlooking the wholesale subversion of the Constitution and tricking the nation into war by lying to our faces.

It will happen whether we do it ourselves or not. One does not go around destroying a country, kill untold how many and walk away from that and remain free. bushco may walk away a few days, weeks maybe but not for long.

I just don't see Obama going after the War Criminals. He has pretty much said that he would rather close the book and move on. The Democratic Congress certainly isn't going to rock that boat.

I think we need to Privatize the effort.

I will donate $500 to ANY organization that will place a Bounty on Bush/Cheney to be paid to anyone who provides concrete evidence that leads to their indictment or arrest.

A small, transparent trust located in a neutral country like Switzerland could administer the fund. If the BOUNTY is promoted internationally, it would quickly grow to Mega-Millions.

The fund would also be tasked with running full page Wanted For War Crimes ads in major Global newspapers every 3 months until the Bounty is awarded or depleted.

I believe that such a fund would be wildly popular worldwide, and provide the administrators an opportunity to make a little money.
I have neither the resources or skills to institute such a fund, but like I said above, I am willing to donate $500. I also believe that there are at least a million more worldwide (extreme minimum) who would also be willing to donate....that adds up to some serious money.



It is clear that the Opposition Party (Democratic Party) and the US Justice Department will do NOTHING to hold the criminals accountable.
A private organization representing Citizens of the World would have better results.
After observing the response to Michele Bachmann's appearance on MSNBC, I have no doubt that such a fund would be a HUGE success.

Even if Bush/Cheney are never arrested, a Mega-Million Dollar International Bounty would certainly keep them looking over their shoulders, curtail retirement travel plans, AND serve as a warning to future "Unitary Executives".

It would also put a nice ribbon around the Bush Legacy.

I would dig very very deep to donate to a cause like that.

It would basically take just a simple website to get it off the ground, along with some kind of set-up to make the reward official and secure and some lawyer-types to keep everything copacetic.

We've been too long waiting and working our butts off exposing these CRIMES AGAINST HUMANITY.

Sorry Bob, for full caps...

Thanks for Post...and a K&R...

prosecution. (That I've read). If you could elaborate some. I wrote a letter to The Hague and got a response. Outlining why they cannot prosecute * Inc. If they can have a solid case against ANY of them, hell yes I'm in favor of it.

here's a bit about Daddy's girl ELIZABETH CHENEY, bluesmail

Right Web profile
Elizabeth Cheney
http://rightweb.irc-online.org/profile/3376.html

Source Watch profile
Elizabeth Cheney
http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Elizabeth_Cheney

Robert Dreyfuss article on Elizabeth Cheney (May 21, 2006 The American Prospect)
"The Commissar's in Town"
http://www.prospect.org/cs/articles?article=the_commissars_in_town

She was "matchmaker" for Wolfowitz and his girlfriend at the World Bank Shaha Ali Raza, she brought Kyle Sampson (ALBERTO GONZALES chief of staff) to DC, I know my BFEE fairly well, bluesmail-and ELIZABETH CHENEY is another of their CRIMINALS that the Obama administration should prosecute...

Oh yeah, she (Elizabeth) is deep into it also. Thanks for the reply. :hi: (Now if nothing awful happens before Jan 20th).

Lynne was a Lockheed Martin Board Member, she parties, writes for and lends her name to many RW strongholds including the American Enterprise Institute-she has a "close" association with Senator Joseph Lieberman--for those that have a "need to know" here are a couple of Lynne Cheney profiles

Lynne Cheney profile from Right Web
http://rightweb.irc-online.org/profile/1071.html

Lynne Cheney Source Watch page
http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Lynne_Cheney

:hi:

Prescott Bush in return for getting him elected. We need to stop this branch of evil from flowering into another generation.
http://www.matchdoctor.com/blog_96657/Do_You_Know_the_Origin_of_the_Pledge_of_Allegiance.html

Just because we bombed "brown people with funny names" is no reason for the mainstream media to ignore this. It's disgusting.

Without it, all acts of the regime are formally approved by Congress -- and done so in the name of the American People.

Sadly, the DC-Dems', http://www.talkingimpeachment.com/blog/Hall-of-Shame-Inductee----Barak-Obama.html">including Obama's, Impeachophobic complicity winds up doing more damage than the actions of the regime itself.

Failure to impeach "legitimizes" the torture and war crimes.

--

How can we deliver a warning to future tyrants that THE AMERICAN PEOPLE WILL NOT TOLERATE such lawless behavior in the future?

Only by convicting the tyrannous, unAmerican, despotic Bushies TODAY, can we be assured that furture despotic tyrants will be suitably warned as to the consequences.

Half-measures, like those taken against Nixon's crimes, and eighth-measures, like the impotent Iran-Contra "investigation", clearly only embolden the Criminal Tyrannous Bushies.

No, only FULL MEASURES taken by a Free Nation to defend itself from wanton shameless serial State Criminality will serve to deter future Bushies from taking the tyranny EVEN FURTHER if we are foolish enough to let them steal another election again.

Emperor George P. "Caligula" Bush, anyone?

And he will make W. Bush look like Caligula made Tiberius look, if we allow this monster int he making to gain power over us.

No, the ONLY way is Investigate, Prosecute, Convict, and INCARCERATE. And if the trial suggests innocence, unlikely as that may be, then they should be released.

But what are the chances of THAT? 1-in-10? 1-in-100? 1-in-1000?

Lower, probably. These Bushie Fuckers are as guilty red-handed as the nazis were at Nurmburg - 99% certain. All that is required is the national integrity and will to follow where the facts lead.

Caligula is Latin for 'little boots', a name given to the Emperor by Roman soldiers when he was a boy and would dress up in the uniform of the day.

Even the staff at the WH call him Caligula.

http://faculty.uccb.ns.ca/philosophy/caligula/Calhistorical.htm

that IF we allow the monstrous Great-Grandchildren of Nazi-Friend Prescott Bush into the White House, they'll make W. Bush seem like an intellectual, and honest as Mother Theresa.

But thanks for the info, anyway.

:hi:

I assumed you knew. :hi:

You never know when I might need your help with something I stated wrongly but you know the actual answer to it.

So, please don't take that as a suggestion to stop or anything.

I welcome someone setting me straight if I've got my facts wrong. Only way to make sure I don't make the same mistake again.

:hi:

As one old-timer in the CIA once told me:

If you don't step on your dick once and a while, you're not trying hard enough.

n/t

When I do well, I hear it never.
When I do ill, I hear it ever.

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leave them to the mercy of the international criminal court in the hauge.

Nominated.

Obama is committed to right-of-center rule and a kumbaya attitude toward the repukes.

He'll make the same decision Clinton did--to ignore abundant evidence of a departing bush's extreme crimes in the name of "moving forward" and "avoiding divisiveness."

The only hope the world has for justice for the bush cabal is an international effort like the one directed at hunting down escaped Nazis. There is no Justice in the USA if the perpetrators are part of the oligarchy and the crimes are big enough.

They're high crimes.

and don't forget Rove. This is not a far left issue, it's a matter of justice. Investigate 9/11, stolen elections, lies leading to war, outing a CIA agent. That should cover murder and treason, though there are many more crimes they committed that require that a light be shone on the cockroaches.

If they get away with what they've done to this country, it *will* happen again.

Lock them up.

How long do we have to wait for the world to come get these criminals? I've been waiting for 8 years and it hasn't happened yet.

Because they will never be "fairly" tried within our own country!

prosecute those fuckers to the full extent of the law.

I am going to need some form of justice. I have seen America suffer too much from these criminals. History demands the truth.

he is still up to no good. and we must prosecute this SOB and rest of his cronies.

TO PROSECUTE THESE CRIMINALS...

But you can dream all you like.

But you know what, there have been many great accomplishments in history that people had said couldn't be done. The election of the first black president last week was one of them.

He's just their puppet.
The fish I want to fry are the neocons.
Bush is enough of a coward that I'm sure he'll turn on him the second he senses danger.
Anyway, I can dream.

but it doesn't change the fact that chimpy isn't going to be prosecuted here or anywhere else. Just because one amazing thing happens doesn't mean anything is possible. Pigs aren't going to fly. And chimpy isn't going to be prosecuted.

Shoot the messenger if it makes you feel better.

But you know what, you can never truly know anything for certain. Though something may appear to look outside the realm of possibility, that doesn't always mean things couldn't change over night. Maybe I'm just an eternal optimist. Call me that if you'd like. But you know what, it's something I'm proud of. I'm not ashamed of being somebody who holds on to hope no matter how hopeless others around me may feel.

but while maybe I can't say with 100 percent certainty that pigs will never sprout wings and fly, its unlikely enough that I don't spend any time thinking about it happening. Same goes for chimpy and his being prosecuted.

Other Nazis were prosecuted and condemned in Israel.Louis XVI,the post-mortem condemnation of

Stalin,Milosevic at The Hague,Pinochet is in deep shit,Ferdinand Marcos removed from power and

died in exile,Musolini,Chauchescu, the list of tyrants and other big criminals who paid for what

they did is very long so why not the Bushies ? :grr:

on what is uncovered by the investigations that justice demands the Obama DOJ to launch. If he fails to fully investigate, I will be sorely disappointed.

definitely. these bastards can't get away with what they've done.

He is the one who yelled throughout the halls of the WH that he would get Saddam...but not in those terms...curse words abounded. He is where the buck stops. Send him to the Hague; it is better than what he gave Saddam. The treatment that Bush gave Saddam is despicable, considering that we attacked his sovereign country and then did not even insist he be tried at the Hague...of course during which Saddam would have exposed all the shenanighans of the Bush crime family.

Certainly not under these swine, but most likely not under Obama either. For a Constitutional scholar, Obama seems a little too tolerant of the astoundingly brazen international crime wave these mass murderers, thieves and imperialist plunderers have compiled.

No matter. There's no real push in D.C. for making Bushie accountable. Nor does there seem to be much interest in indicting them on the most serious criminal charges possible -- with high treason and mass murder reason enough to send them all to hell on earth.

Incredibly, nobody even seems to want Cheney to get his just deserts, along with a few hundred more representatives of of the very worst of the worst humans have to offer. Everybody knows they're going to skate. About the best anyone can hope for is some version of the Mossad kidnapping Adolph Eichmann, flying him to Israel and trying him on multiple counts of war crimes, for which he was convicted and sentenced to death.

So absent the feds, what's next? How about this strategy...

The Prosecution of George W. Bush for Murder

by Vincent Bugliosi

He's not screwing around either:



Or this:



As to logistics and the legal framework, he's looking for one or more state and local prosecutors -- hundreds would be better still -- to bring indictments for murder against Bushie (first degree, I hope?) from jurisdictions across the country: every state, county or municipality where a member of the US military killed in Iraq used to live. As Bugliosi told The Nation in a June 2008 interview:



That would be nice for a change. Some 15-year-old black kid gets caught in the act of boosting a can of Coke from the 7-11. If he's not blown apart by the night manager's shotgun, he still has to survive a half-dozen or so newly militarized "protect and serve" locals, who might just decide to blast him into hundreds of small, unidentifiable scraps for the pure excitement of it.

For the Bushies, though, things have always been a little different. Maybe that's about to change. Plus, The Commander Guy loses his diplomatic immunity on inauguration day, making him eligible for a date with the ICC.

Same goes for the plague of insiders, made men, murdering swine and conniving propagandists this administration has vomited up on the shores of Chesapeake Bay.

Could be that the fun's just beginning. When Madame Defarge shows up with her knitting needles, it'll be time to pop the champagne corks.


wp

would probably do wonders for our standing among the community of nations. We might even be seen as a civilized country again.

This letter from a nun who was tortured in Guatemala makes the same points.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/11/13/AR2008111303842.html?nav=hcmoduletmv

Go Beyond Closing Guantanamo
Friday, November 14, 2008; Page A18



If President-elect Barack Obama's goal is to engender a "global wave of diplomatic and popular goodwill," closing the prison at Guantanamo seems a pretty cheap way to achieve it. I would think the world would be more impressed if we brought to trial those who ordered or facilitated the torture that went on.

Even if the new administration is expected to outlaw torture, it should be noted that the practice is already illegal. It is precisely for this reason that once the Obama administration takes office, there should be an immediate investigation of President Bush, Vice President Cheney, former defense secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld and others to determine whether they should be prosecuted on charges of violating U.S. law.

SISTER DIANNA ORTIZ
Washington
The writer, a U.S. citizen, was abducted and tortured in Guatemala in 1989.

crimes, and they are still stirring the pot. I hope the International community finds a way to come down hard on them. War criminals they are all of them.:mad:

The likelihood of actually taking these people to court in their lifetime is highly questionable. Their legion of attorneys would tie the courts for years with appeals.

What I do think is possible and perhaps even more effective would be for the congress to investigate and publicly condemn their flagrant abuse of power. They could absolutely refute the fallacies advanced by this administration of executive privileges never envisioned by the framers of the Constitution and reaffirm the priority of congress in legislative matters that has been trampled by the executive misuse of Signing Letters.

The Republicans got away with Iran Contra. They may have got away with the K K K assassinations.
They got away with Allende. They brought back all the people who invoved to do their thing under Cheney.

What message does it send to the Norquists who might get away without prosecution? They will bankd together and there will be another Cheney to organize all the others on behalf of the 'barons'.

(Though the FBI was supposed to be investigating Norquist for owning a company with Saudi pathners that was suspected of funding bin Laden, nothing has been announced or I missed it and he is sitting in jail today. Heavy sarcasm. We all know how Ashcroft and Gonzales folloed through on behalf of the people - such as finding nothing in the put options.)

These people committed every possible crime against the world from imprisonment with trial for an act on 9-11 that was a crime not a reason for war against innocent people which was really about theft.

To sell a nation down the river - us and Iraq - and bringing homeowners, kids, hopes, and faith with it - deserves a message and the rule of law.

so far, and no matter how much I want a war crimes tribunal{un}, I will trust our former constitutional lawyer and professor, to judge when and how is appropriate. I am certain he seethes, from the insults that Bu$h has launched against our Constitution. And I am certain he understands the symbolism involved in WORLD healing. His world healing has already begun. I believe new peace openings will flood in soon after Bu$h goes to paraguay. When our boys come up with a theoretical model for a sustainable economy, and the corporate implications of that, hope, will buoy the markets, although subdued. Then, when we have all the facts before us, we act in thorough justice. That does not preclude ensuring the world that justice WILL be done. Give Goergie a few moments to revel in his fantasy legacy. As he said, if Laura and Barney the dog still continue to lick his ass, that's livin'. As for his last minute easter eggs, expunge them with prejudice. And any trace of him possible. Work tirelessly in congress, to rid his contributions, with improved legislation. With different attribution. Rid our culture of his symbols. Lock them in his library. Any reference to his contributions, should be approved by a truth commitee. Refer to his reign as the dark period. Widely acknowledged as a cultural truth. As a talisman against any other tin pot dictators that think family sperm donation entitles you to the reigns. Like McCain. This death tax protection reflex of these wastrils unveils them, almost immediately. We, as a culture, are about to insist on merit of the individual, as the sole indicator of status. Expect legacy enrollment in college to be curtailed. If nothing else, we have a powerful meme against monarchy. The generation, raised as a presidents son, should prolly be rejected out of hand. They harbor raging oedipal complexes, that must'nt be allowed near the button. Or any of uncle sams china. Freudian slip. Clods Are out of fashion for the moment, but maybe now would be a good time to tax heavily any RANCHES bought by the second generation of power. And just for good measure, give Bidens kid a nice safe job. Keep him away from lobbying. For all our good. And finally, break the lockhold on including a hick, in all we do. It's like some damn affirmative action crutch. They are gonna have to earn their stay, like everyone else. There is a lot WE can do. As a peer group. Our power as a collective unconscious, is just begun. With the bully pulpits ALL occupied by dems, and all WHINING, all the time, from pubs, our positive example will shine through. Loving our neighbor will be the nail in the pub coffin. And then, we imprison Bu$h. My point is, I finally had a dem to vote for that I trust to have all his bases covered, and wait for his moment, as a sly lawyer does. WE HAVE A MAN OF FAITH IN CONSTITUTION!

an "unknown subject" in Washington and elsewhere.

Who else is with US on this? Kick.