Backfired

Some feedback on a forum from evangelicals on Warren being chosen to lead the invocation.

From Billy:

I was very disappointed when Rick Warren gave his pulpit over to Obama a year or so ago, concerning the AIDS epidemic. Obama is an unapologetic supporter of unrestricted abortion, which has been responsible for more deaths than all the years of AIDS. A little leaven leaveneth the whole loaf, and Mr Warren should realize that the leaven of compromise is the beginning of unending compromise.

From Anonymous:

When I first saw this headline, I thought it was a joke. For a man like Rick Warren to give the invocation for a man that has pledged to sign the Freedom of Choice Act is beyond the pale. Moreover, the Orwellian concept of “social justice” with which Pastor Warren is so enamored belongs in the dustbin of history. To the trained ear, “social justice” is nothing but political cover for yet another failed government-run welfare program. I am a Christian trying to live a Christian life, and I feel no guilt for my disdain for the latest civil-rights fad called “social justice.” I do not believe that anyone’s compassion for God’s children must be directly proportional to his or her support for wasteful government programs that do little more than ensure reelection.

From Anonymous:

This is one swearing in of a President I will NOT watch..especially with the sickening thought that Rick Warren will be there saying Lord knows what. His way and Obama's do not meet.

From Anonymous:

I have had about all I can stand of Rick Warren's double standards. WHOSE side is he really on anyway? I'm beginning to think all he cares about are his questionable political connections. When I saw your article announcing his participation in "that one's" so called inauguration ceremony it absolutely sickened me. It isn't enough Obama is so full of himself that he "thinks" he's God. - Apparently now Rick Warren believes he is too. This is a complete mockery of all things sacred.


http://www.cbn.com/CBNnews/504326.aspx


Cant wait to see the cbn forums tomorrow.

comments I have had the misfortune of reading here at DU.

what's your point? Both sides believe they are right and the other side is evil. That is not a healthy attitude for people in our nation to have.

when what the nation most desperately needs is a return to reason.

exhibited both here and at the Free Republic. Catering to that hatred and intolerance is not going neither sane nor reasonable.

What is needed is dialogue. Only dialogue can make evangelicals see that gay people are PEOPLE, not agents of Satan or whatever.

Why give him this enormous stage? Symbols mean things, unless you really are too starstruck to see that.

Did Brown vs Board of Ed happen because the NAACP 'dialogued' with the Klan?
Does abortion exist because pro-choice women "dialogue" with the men from Operation Rescue?

I call bullshit. Everything doesn't get put to a vote. Everything doesn't get lobbied. Some things happen by sheer political fight.

There is NO reasoning with these fools, and they will NEVER vote for our side. What is so hard to understand about that?

and that certain political and socialogical processes are inevitable and inate in human nature.

Rational nations work to ensure that fundamentalists (and their agenda) are relegated to the fringe- and not granted national prominanence- and honered- on momentous occasions.

It's NOT the rational thing to do.

and delusional.

And yes- the rational thing to do is to relegate them back to the fringe- and as far away from having any sway over public policy (or even the appearance of influence) as possible.

Let 'em in the door- and as we've seen, we get Terry Shaivos and endless fights over evolution, womens' health care, you name it.

Time for a change- or (as was once said on the Republican end: elections have consequences).

:eyes:

For example, there's a cadre of anti-vaccination crusader on DU (and throughout the progressive community).

They also need to remain relegated to the fringe- rather than elevated to national prominence.

This isn't always a partisan deal- though in many areas- right wing fundamentalism for example, it invariably lines up that way.

relegating evangelicals to the fringe is like the folks in Lebanon trying to relegate Hezbollah to the fringe. Won't work.

We're probably talking about < 20% of the population are deep end fundies- including kids, though one can quibble about the exact numbers and breadth of definitions.

And the idea ought to be to shrink that number (or hold it in place) not promote its increase.

ESPECIALLY as it applies to issues of public public-

and expecting these people to REASON?

:rofl:

You're a riot.

then lower my opinion of you?

in fact, I was almost shocked I forgot to put you on ignore from the primaries.

Fixed!

that they no longer appreciate appalling (jaw dropping) things when they see or hear them.

Living abroad- where there aren't fundies mouthing off everywhere you turn- where there's no hate radio and the media doesn't promote a culture of lies, gives one some perspective on just how far off the deep end some people in America have (acceptably?) gone.

(This is even true between certain regions in the states).

This may split reasonable evangelicals from the fundy nut-jobs. The fundy nutjobs are to far gone to change their minds when it come to same-sex marriage, but I think the more reasonable evangelicals can be made more tolerant. Shunning them will just drive them into the hands of the nutjobs.

than to have reignited unecessary and foreseeable conflict- and then having to go around engaging in damage control before even having been sworn in!

All this does is draw the battle lines even brighter- the anti-abortionists (those who fight agianst Warren's holocaust) -and the creationists- they're not going to be swayed by this (or any other effort at appeasement).

If 25 years of dealing with them hasn't taught the Democrats that, then one has to figure than nothing will.

Have you been alive during the past thirty years?

I've suffered through listening to culture war BS all my life. I'm sick of it. people screaming "EVIL BASTARD" at each other with nothing constructive getting done.

that these people will not ever vote for obama, whether rick the bigot warren is on stage or not . all obama did was create a huge rift in his own party. these people wont change.

he doesn't need them to vote for him. He needs them to open and up and listen to reason. Gay rights will come the way all other rights came, by society becoming enlightened, not at the point of a sword. The only way you enlighten is to TALK not ATTACK.

of course he's driven by self interest.

It's one thing to open a dialogue, it's another one to endorse a bigot by giving him a prominent role in your inauguration.

But then I'm just one of those "nuts" who believes in social justice.

since he stands a very good chance of being killed in office. I guess you will need to coem up with some other way to dismiss Obama's noble actions.

we could ask the Pope to start the beatification process now.

Do you seriously think that the southern United States "became enlightened" and that's why African Americans are not slaves and have civil rights today? I've lived in the south for thirty years and I'm here to tell you that if some of these white folks down here didn't have to obey laws "at the point of a sword," if you will, they'd act like it was 1845.

Did the world stop Hitler by encouraging him to "open up and listen to reason?"

Are you on drugs? Can I have some? You live in a happy little fantasy world.

Not all people who give credence to Rick Warren fall into one neat category.

not all evangelicals are alike. I will post more responses from an array of evangelicals when i find them. if i find any that decide to vote for obama because he chose rick the bigot warren to speak, i will post those too.

:eyeroll:

when I find it I will post it. or if you find it before me you post it.

to the left on social issues.

to bring the rabid bigots to our side?

:shrug:

...the extrmeme fundamentalist far right not liking this is NOT actually a "backfire".

it isnt working. it wont work.

:rofl:

it was supposed to appease them and make them LIKE Obama more.
it didnt.

Why exactly do you assume the people on that message board are the types of minds the reaching across was intended to change? Hmmmm?

Think it over. Take as long as you like.

he is neutering the fundy influence. Look at how much weaker Warren is with the raging wingnuts....Is he busy weilding a scapel while everyone is expecting a sledghammer?

and bring them over. even if warren is weaker to them, theres a thousand other hagees and dobsons waiting in the wings. appeasement doesnt work. especially when it costs you your base voters.

It took me a few days to fully appreciate the value of that political judo move.

of Rahm Emmanuel. He has a LOOONNGGG history of pissing off the base and has the mistaken belief that the base will continue to support the Democrats blindly. And if Obama is relying that much on Emmanuel, what does that say about President Change?