Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Studies find mercury in much U.S. corn syrup

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010) Donate to DU
 
Lucian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 02:28 AM
Original message
Studies find mercury in much U.S. corn syrup
Former FDA scientist finds detectable amounts in 9 of 20 samples

updated 6:47 p.m. CT, Tues., Jan. 27, 2009

WASHINGTON - Many common foods made using commercial high fructose corn syrup contain mercury as well, researchers reported on Tuesday, while another study suggested the corn syrup itself is contaminated.

Food processors and the corn syrup industry group attacked the findings as flawed and outdated, but the researchers said it was important for people to know about any potential sources of the toxic metal in their food.

In one study, published in the journal Environmental Health, former Food and Drug Administration scientist Renee Dufault and colleagues tested 20 samples of high fructose corn syrup and found detectable mercury in nine of the 20 samples.

<snip>

More here.

Is there anything safe to eat anymore? :scared:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
BrklynLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 02:31 AM
Response to Original message
1. We should not be using high fructose corn syrup in anything!!!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tblue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 02:33 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. I keep hearing this, but i don't know why. Can you pls exlplain?
Aside from the mercury, I mean. Thx.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
kirby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 02:45 AM
Response to Reply #3
8. Here is an explanation...
Table sugar (sucrose) contains 50% fructose and 50% glucose. HFCS contains 55% fructose and 45% glucose.

Glucose is the preferred energy source of the body, so it rapidly enters the blood stream for use by cells. This elevates your blood sugar levels, and causes insulin to be secreted (among other hormonal changes). Insulin also stimulates the manufacture of LDL ("bad" cholesterol) which increases prescribing of statin drugs.

Fructose takes a different biochemical pathway and is stored directly as body fat, contributing to weight gain.

This is why eating tons of sugar - be it sucrose or HFCS - is evil and contributes to obesity through weight gain, diabetes (through weight gain and decreased insulin sensitivity) and heart disease (weight gain, increased LDL production).
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
HughBeaumont Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 05:42 AM
Response to Reply #8
14. OMG are you kidding me? And here the corn people were telling us all along it was not that BAD . .
:eyes:

I guess you never hear this side of the story on those pro-HFCS commercials; just a bunch of people who give dumb looks when asked why it's bad for you, like none of us read or anything.

The thing is, table sugar can be eaten in moderation. With the inclusion of HFCS in even things like bread (??), it makes moderation kind of difficult.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
trotsky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 08:41 AM
Response to Reply #14
21. Well, honey is also 55% fructose. But no one's screaming about that.
I bought into the early scare on HFCS but after studying the issue more, I think the problem is overuse of sweeteners in general - ANY kind - not just HFCS.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
kirby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 11:23 AM
Response to Reply #21
31. That does not make it good, does it?
Edited on Wed Jan-28-09 11:31 AM by kirby
I mean unlike HFCS, our food chain has not adopted Honey as the primary sweetener in the majority of products. If we did so, the extra 5% fructose change in our diets might spur the same complaints. Supposedly, the average American consumes 12 teaspoons of HFCS every day.

One difference though, in relation to this Mercury study, is that HFCS is pretty complicated to produce. It requires many chemical steps and enzymes to create. All those extra steps introduce things that can go wrong. In this Mercury case, two of the reagents they use to manufacture the HFCS may have contained Mercury. Of course the HFCS trade association says they purchase Mercury free reagents (and/or they have done so 'in recent years') so the study is 'outdated'.

The highest level of contamination found in the study (http://www.ehjournal.net/content/8/1/2) was 0.57 micrograms of mercury per gram of HFCS. The EPA says that an average-sized woman should consume no more than 5.5 micrograms per day of mercury, meaning that the average American consumer may be eating five times the upper safety limit of mercury every day due to high-fructose corn syrup consumption if they consume the foods tested in the study.

Me personally, I try to avoid it, but like you say, moderation is important too.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 01:01 PM
Response to Reply #31
40. That doesn't make it bad, does it?
Just because sugar cane and sugar beets winds up as 50% glucose, 50% fructose, that does not mean that it's better than the 45% glucose, 55% fructose from corn, apples, or honey.

"The highest level of contamination found in the study (http://www.ehjournal.net/content/8/1/2 ) was 0.57 micrograms of mercury per gram of HFCS. The EPA says that an average-sized woman should consume no more than 5.5 micrograms per day of mercury, meaning that the average American consumer may be eating five times the upper safety limit of mercury every day due to high-fructose corn syrup consumption if they consume the foods tested in the study."

It would be nice if this author, or anybody else, could report the actual numbers in a proper, peer-reviewed journal.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
kirby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 01:27 PM
Response to Reply #40
43. The article says it was peer-reviewed...
First, it seems that increasing the entire populations daily fructose intake by 5% is worse. As I mentioned before in a post before it has been shown to have negative impacts on the some peoples bodies. Obviously high sugar intake can be bad, but this seems worse.

Second, are you saying the article is junk science?

Here is the link to the actual article with actual numbers. The article claims that is was peer-reviewed. I cannot vouch for the quality of that review.

http://www.ehjournal.net/content/pdf/1476-069x-8-2.pdf
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Avalux Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 05:17 PM
Response to Reply #43
69. It's not just that - HFCS is not a natural substance, like sugar.
Edited on Wed Jan-28-09 05:18 PM by sparosnare
Corn goes through a lot of chemical changes to morph into HFCS. Scary - and also scary that it's used in so many products. I gave up eating anything containing it about a year ago.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 05:19 PM
Response to Reply #69
70. Neither is refined sugar, if you want to be honest.
Sugar cain goes through a lot of chemical changes to morph into table sugar.

Nobody with a high school education should be afraid of a little science.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Avalux Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 05:29 PM
Response to Reply #70
74. Really? Can you explain those chemical changes?
Edited on Wed Jan-28-09 05:30 PM by sparosnare
Sugar cane goes through a lot of processing steps (not chemical); the only additive is lime juice to remove impurities.

Nobody thinks of sugar when they see a field of corn; it takes a lot to turn it into 'sugar'. Corn goes through 5 or 6 various steps of fermentation and chemical treatments. Alpha amylase and glucose isomerase - enzymes used in the process, are genetically modified to up the stability of HFCS.

Bad stuff.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 06:02 PM
Response to Reply #74
76. Sure.
Sugar cane is shredded and treated with water, and the solids removed.

The liquor is treated with calcium hydroxide to prevent the natural hydrolysis of sucrose to fructose and glucose (which is what happens in the stomach, btw, or with HFCS).

It's then bleached with sulfur dioxide.

Filtered, centrifuged, and concentrated.

Then refined by treatment phosphoric acid and calcium hydroxide to form precipitates of undesirables. Or alternatively, treatment with with carbon dioxide and calcium hydroxide.

It's filtered through activated carbon, and crystallized under vaccum.

"Nobody thinks of sugar when they see a field of corn"

The people who understand the natural world do. Farmers, scientists, and food lovers.

"it takes a lot to turn it into 'sugar'. "

Sweet corn contains a lot of sugar. That's why it's sweet. As soon as it's picked, enzymes in the corn stick sugar molecules together to make starch molecules. With the production of HFCS, you take corn starch and enzymes and reverse the process.

"Alpha amylase and glucose isomerase - enzymes used in the process, are genetically modified to up the stability of HFCS. "

These enzymes, which are also naturally occuring, btw, are sometimes genetically modified to increase the efficiency of the process. They have nothing to do with the stability of HFCS, and they are not in HFCS once it leaves the plant.

"Bad stuff."

Only to the ignorant.


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Avalux Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 06:47 PM
Response to Reply #76
78. So how much is the HFCS lobby paying you?
Go ahead and believe that crap is OK to ingest; up to you. Not nice to call someone ignorant just because your views are different.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 06:51 PM
Response to Reply #78
79. How much is Jenny McCarthy paying you?
"Not nice to call someone ignorant just because your views are different."

I suggest remedial science courses at your nearest community college.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
whopis01 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 09:07 PM
Response to Reply #74
80. It isn't lime juice that they add to it - it is lime (the chemical compound)!
Edited on Wed Jan-28-09 09:12 PM by whopis01
I believe that it is the calcium hydroxide version of lime - but whichever form it is, it is not remotely related to lime juice.

There are several other chemicals added along the way. HFCS is definitely not good for you, but to act like sugar from cane is some pure, natural good for you substance is ridiculous.

Bad stuff.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
conscious evolution Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 08:03 AM
Response to Reply #8
16. It is also linked to ADHD
The cocacola corporation is sitting on a study that shows a definitive link.Unfortunately that report is buried deeper than ingredient X.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
trotsky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 08:42 AM
Response to Reply #16
22. That is an astounding claim.
Do you have any proof whatsoever, or are you just spreading unfounded rumors? If the report is so buried, how did YOU find out about it?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
conscious evolution Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 09:00 AM
Response to Reply #22
23. Thru a friend
who worked for them(reported directly to the Board).
I was asking him if it was true that the new coke/classic coke fiasco in the eighties was just a disinformation campaign to hide the swithc over from cane sugar to HFCS.{This was also sort of confirmed by an acquaintance who was on the board of cocacola.He would not actually admit it but his reaction and body language told me I was on the right track}
He said it was true.He also told me that I am one of a handful of people in the world to figure that out.
Then he told me the rest of the story.That people in the federal gov knew about the link also and wanted hfcs in the food supply for their own reasons.
Cocacola may not like the fact that I am saying this but they will never sue me over it.The LAST thing they want is letting people have the power of discovery in such a suit.

My friend also told me of quite a few interesting tidbits concerning coke.
Did you know they have a team whose only job is to bury by any means possible(usually by throwing around tons of money) any stories about product contamination and/or food poisoning caused by their product?That such occurances happen on a regular basis?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
trotsky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 09:03 AM
Response to Reply #23
24. So no, you have no proof.
Thanks for confirming.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Kalyke Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 09:12 AM
Response to Reply #16
27. Interesting.
My son doesn't have ADHD and was not allowed to drink soda until he entered school and begged for it.

To this day, though, he's still not allowed to have tons of the stuff - it rots the teeth, makes kids spin out of control and is, well, not as good as water, milk or juice.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BrklynLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 12:49 PM
Response to Reply #8
37. Thanks for the back up.
I added some info from Wikipedia that substantiates what you said and also adds more info about the influence of the corn agri-growers and corporations like Archer Daniels Midland who produce the HFCS.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
dorkulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 02:42 PM
Response to Reply #8
59. This doesn't explain why it's any worse than cane sugar, which is what everyone seems to be saying.
We already know sugar is bad for us.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
kirby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 04:28 PM
Response to Reply #59
63. I thought that is what I explained...
Maybe I did not explain it well...

HFCS contains 5% more fructose compared to cane sugar. The body converts fructose differently than glucose. Glucose goes to the muscles for energy,
Fructose goes to the liver. When the body has excess Fructose it converts it to Triglycerides which can be bad for you and it is more easily stored in fat.

Thus, this extra 5% contributes more to weight gain and such.

Fructose can be advantageous for people with diabetes since it has a lower Glycemic Index though.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 05:22 PM
Response to Reply #59
71. It's not.
There's no evidence that it's any worse than table sugar. And plenty of evidence that it's no more worse.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=102&topic_id=3639008
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BrklynLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 12:47 PM
Response to Reply #3
36. See info here...
Edited on Wed Jan-28-09 12:50 PM by BrklynLiberal
Some highlights..but the whole thing is worth reading. Google "history of high fructose corn syrup" and see what you get. Make sure to check the source of the articles so as to be aware of any bias. It is always good to know who sponsored any studies that you read about.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_fructose_corn_syrup


A system of tariffs and sugar quotas imposed in 1977 significantly increased the cost of importing sugar, and producers sought a cheaper alternative. High-fructose corn syrup, derived from corn, is more economical because the American and Canadian prices of sugar are twice the global price<16> and the price of #2 corn is artificially low due to both government subsidies and dumping on the market as farmers produce more corn annually.<17><18> HFCS became an attractive substitute, and is preferred over cane sugar among the vast majority of American food and beverage manufacturers. For instance, soft drink makers like Coca-Cola and Pepsi use sugar in other nations, but switched to HFCS in the U.S. in 1984.<19> Large corporations, such as Archer Daniels Midland, lobby for the continuation of these subsidies.<20>

Other countries, including Mexico, typically use sugar in soft drinks. Some Americans seek out Mexican Coca-Cola in ethnic groceries, because they feel it tastes better or is healthier than Coke made with HFCS, or because they believe it will have less effect on obesity



<snip>

Critics of HFCS point out a correlation between increased usage of HFCS in foods and obesity rates in the United States over three decades. Some allege that HFCS is in itself more detrimental to health than table sugar (sucrose); others claim that the low cost of HFCS encourages overconsumption of sugars. The Corn Refiners Association has launched an aggressive advertising campaign to counter these criticisms, claiming that high fructose corn syrup "is natural" and "has the same natural sweeteners as table sugar".<25> Both sides point to studies in peer reviewed journals that allegedly support their point of view.

In his recent book In Defense of Food: An Eater's Manifesto, journalist Michael Pollan claims that the way that the body processes HFCS is different from the way it processes the glucose and fructose found in other sugars. Digesting sucrose requires the production of an enzyme called sucrase, which breaks the bond between the glucose molecule and the fructose molecule. Because the body regulates its production of sucrase, it can only digest sucrose at a certain rate. Because digesting HFCS does not require sucrase to be digested, the rate at which it is digested is not similarly regulated by the body

Elliot et al.,<26> implicate increased consumption of fructose (due primarily to the increased consumption of sugars but also partly due to the slightly higher fructose content of HFCS as compared to sucrose) in obesity and insulin resistance. Chi-Tang Ho et al. found that soft drinks sweetened with HFCS are up to 10 times richer in harmful carbonyl compounds, such as methylglyoxal, than a diet soft drink control.<27> Carbonyl compounds are elevated in people with diabetes and are blamed for causing diabetic complications such as foot ulcers and eye and nerve damage;<28><29>

A study in mice suggests that fructose increases obesity.<30> Large quantities of fructose stimulate the liver to produce triglycerides, promotes glycation of proteins and induces insulin resistance.<31> According to one study, the average American consumes nearly 70 pounds of HFCS per annum, marking HFCS as a major contributor to the rising rates of obesity in the last generation. <32>

<snip>
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Horse with no Name Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 02:34 AM
Response to Reply #1
4. I'm hoping we quit giving this charity to the corn industry
It is truly killing us all.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Lucian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 02:36 AM
Response to Reply #1
5. No kidding.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
vadawg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 02:31 AM
Response to Original message
2. grow it, collect it, catch it, shoot it yourself seems the only way
N/T
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Lucian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 02:38 AM
Response to Reply #2
6. And shooting it isn't always safe either.
Around here, you can get Chronic Wasting Disease from deer.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chronic_wasting_disease
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
vadawg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 02:42 AM
Response to Reply #6
7. lol wasnt thinking of deer, track rabbit if your urban
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
surrealAmerican Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 08:31 AM
Response to Reply #7
18. It is likely never safe to eat ...
... urban animals of any kind. Look at what they eat.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Sebastian Doyle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 02:59 AM
Response to Original message
9. NOW can we stop using this fucking poison??
Not like it wasn't already killing people as it is, but now mercury poisoning on top of the rest?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Lucian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 03:19 AM
Response to Reply #9
10. I definitely am going to stop using it. Cold turkey.
It's going to be rough because I'm kind of addicted to Dr. Pepper. But I'd rather go through withdrawal than die of mercury poisoning.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
lildreamer316 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 04:18 AM
Response to Reply #10
11. It wasn't so bad for me..
but my body metabolizes sugar much, much better than HFCS. I still drink sweet tea (I'm in the south & make my own; been cutting down on the sugar for that bit by bit & trying stevia instead, but it's slow). I actually don't miss soda as much as I thought I would.

It is hard to keep from eating HCFS when you don't know it. Some items I don't suspect have it in them.

If I get a craving for 'bubbly' tasting beverage, I use a small amount of seltzer water in some fruit juice.

So far so good..best of luck for you. OH! and partially due to cutting out HCFS as much as I could; I have dropped from a size 10 jean to a size 6.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Lucian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 04:33 AM
Response to Reply #11
13. About seven years ago,
I quit drinking pop for almost a whole year, but then I got back on it. This time, I'm going to quit for sure. It's not the sugar or caffeine I crave in pop. It's the carbonated water I crave. But I'll try seltzer water. I've never had it before.

Thanks for the advice. :hi:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
HughBeaumont Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 05:43 AM
Response to Reply #13
15. Boylans.
Awesome soda.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
mykpart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 04:21 AM
Response to Reply #10
12. Look for Dublin Dr. Pepper
Dublin is a small town with the only Dr. Pepper bottling plant that still uses sugar.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Kalyke Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 09:16 AM
Response to Reply #12
28. Or just buy Coke products from the "Latin" section of the grocery store.
They contain sugar - not HFCS - and taste about a brazillon times better.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
backscatter712 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 11:41 AM
Response to Reply #28
34. Yes! Mexican Coca-Cola for the win! n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
cascadiance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 01:28 PM
Response to Reply #28
44. You can get cases at Costco of Mexican coke, which even the WTO has tried to stop!

The problem is that when you have our ag industry subsidized for producing corn, then HFCS-based sugar products can be made that much more cheaper for export to other countries too, like Mexico, when they in effect "dump" HFCS-sweetened soft drinks there at prices cheaper than other cane sugar-based soft drinks can be produced locally, putting Mexican farmers out of work so that they either:

a) sell off their farms to the government and work at an outsourcing company there.

or

b) move up here for work.

The following articles talk about how the WTO has claimed that the tariffs that Mexico tried to impose on HFCS-based American exports into Mexico were a trade barrier, when in fact the U.S.'s subsidized exports at artificially lower prices I would submit are the culprits.

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0EUY/is_/ai_n16110567

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0EUY/is_/ai_n14941047

http://www.geocities.com/jonclark500/stories/coke.html

http://www.foodnavigator.com/Legislation/Mexico-may-appeal-WTO-decision

http://www.rushfordreport.com/2003/11_2003_Yankee_trader.htm
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
thesquanderer Donating Member (647 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 05:26 PM
Response to Reply #28
73. or kosher for passover
I've been told that the kosher-for-passover variant of coke doesn't have HFCS, so that might be something to check, when it's "in season"
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Sebastian Doyle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-29-09 01:50 PM
Response to Reply #73
81. Unfortunately, the Kosher Coke isn't widely distributed.
Seems to only go to areas with higher Jewish populations. Which is logical, given the intended market of the product and it's limited quantity, but not good news in this one-synagogue town. I still have yet to actually see a bottle or can of this now legendary product.

The Mexi-Coke probably still tastes a little better though, as it's in glass bottles and not plastic. I've heard most of the Kosher Coke is in 2-liter bottles.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
CoffeeCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 11:31 AM
Response to Reply #10
32. Have you tried Diet Dr. Pepper?
I'm sure you have...but it seems like a reasonable alternative. It
tastes much like the original.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 11:52 AM
Response to Reply #10
35. Try Dublin Dr. Pepper.
Dublin, Texas that is. It's a long story, but the bottling plant in the little town of Dublin, TX is not a part of the great Dr. Pepper conglomerate (which I believe is a part of the Bush/Carlyle portfolio). The little plant is independently owned and still uses cane sugar in its Dr. Pepper. For years, you could pay through the nose to get their small glass bottled Dr Pepper. Now they also can it for competitive prices. For those of us who drank the beverage in our long ago childhood, the drink is a taste of home. Sure I know sugar is bad for you, but I know I digest and deal with sugar better than corn syrup. Plus it is less cloying and nasty. I have been known to purchase a Mexican Coca Cola every once in a while because they are usually made with cane sugar. (Mixes with bourbon really well.)

Here is a link to the history of the Dublin Dr. Pepper company. http://www.dublindrpepper.com/history.aspx

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tridim Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 05:11 PM
Response to Reply #10
67. That's what I thought too.
But now I like a nice cold glass of water much better than I ever liked Dr. Pepper. I used to drink about 4 cans a day.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
thesquanderer Donating Member (647 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 05:23 PM
Response to Reply #10
72. Dr. Pepper
Well, diet dr pepper presumably has no HFCS...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 08:08 AM
Response to Reply #9
17. isnt it in so many things. unexpected things. seems to be in all we buy. n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
trotsky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 08:40 AM
Response to Original message
19. Some perspective is needed. There is no need to scare anyone.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BrklynLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 01:13 PM
Response to Reply #19
41. Check your sources
Wikipedia on Sandy Szwarc, who writes that blog:

Szwarc's article which won the Internet category of the International Association of Culinary Professionals Bert Greene Award<3> argued that the risk of mad cow disease affecting humans, especially in the U.S., was negligible.<4> Her article approvingly cited Frank Furedi, the U.S. Department of Agriculture, the National Cattlemen's Association, the American Meat Institute and a USDA commissioned study by the Harvard Center for Risk Analysis.

Szwarc "has also written and spoken on junk science; risk analysis and communicating risks to consumers; food and health fears; and the economic, political and public health implications of science-based policy decisions. Contributing to Competitive Enterprise Institute and Tech Central Station, she authored Fishy Advice: An Examination of the Evidence and Politics Surrounding the Dangers of Methylmercury in Fish and Mercury Emissions (Competitive Enterprise Institute, Issue Analysis, December, 2004)."<2>

Szwarc's written works have also included a series of articles published by the Competitive Enterprise Institute, a Washington D.C. libertarian think tank. Her articles, published between March 2004 and January 2006, sought to convey reassuring messages on mercury in fish and from power plant emissions.

She has written several article mitigating the effects of mercury toxicity on humans,<7><8><9>disputing the scientific research which has shown that methyl mercury harms consumers of fish and that mercury spills in schools are harmful to children. She has argued that United States' Environmental Protection Agency moves to curb mercury emissions were excessive.


from Wikipedia on Tech Central Station:

TCS is an initialism that now stands for "Technology, Commerce, Society"; when the Web site was founded in 2000, those three letters stood for its original name, "Tech Central Station." The journal was originally published by DCI Group, a lobbying and PR firm based in Washington, D.C.. In 2006, it was sold to Nick Schulz, who had been its editor since 2001.<1> Before the sale, it was "hosted" by James K. Glassman, a resident fellow at the American Enterprise Institute and syndicated columnist. In 2006, he left TCS to become editor of The American; Schulz, while continuing to operate TCS, followed Glassman to The American and soon replaced him as that magazine's editor.

In its original incarnation, TCS was primarily funded by sponsors that included AT&T, The Coca-Cola Company, ExxonMobil, General Motors Corporation, McDonalds, Merck, Microsoft, Nasdaq, and PhRMA. However, according to the website, the sale of the journal in 2006 rendered all previous sponsorships expired.<1>

TCS raised doubts about global warming and the film An Inconvenient Truth.<2>



http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Competitive_Enterprise_Institute


The Competitive Enterprise Institute (CEI) is a advocacy group based in Washington DC. It calls itself "a non-profit, non-partisan research and advocacy institute dedicated to the principles of free enterprise and limited government. We believe that individuals are best helped not by government intervention, but by making their own choices in a free marketplace."<1>

Until August 2007 CEI's website CEI stated that it served "as both a think tank—creating intellectual ammunition to support free markets—and an advocacy organization—putting that ammunition to use in persuasive ways."<2>

It postures as an advocate of "sound science" in the development of public policy. However, CEI projects dispute the overwhelimng scientific evidence that human induced greenhouse gas emissions are driving climate change. They have a program for "challenging government regulations", push property rights as a solution to environment problems, opposed US vehicle fuel efficiency standards and been a booster for the drug industry.


Check out who funds this "Think Tank" in addition to tobacco companies and gasoline companies
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
trotsky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 01:39 PM
Response to Reply #41
45. Yes, others have already attacked the person through tenuous links like that.
Can you dispute the FACTS, please?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BrklynLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 02:38 PM
Response to Reply #45
58. Are you a professional comedian, or do you only do it as a hobby?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
trotsky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 03:00 PM
Response to Reply #58
62. So you can't debate the facts, and now you engage in ad homs on me.
That says it all.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
kirby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 01:41 PM
Response to Reply #19
46. I dont consider her a very reliable source...
She is the one who claims Mad Cow disease doesnt affect humans. She write and speaks for conservative think tanks, etc. She falls into the category of industry shill, in my opinion.

I am skeptical of her whole 'environmental mercury' is fine for you claim. That is one of those doublespeaks. I do not think 'environment mercury' is what is contaminating the caustic soda (lye) that is used to make HFCS.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 01:43 PM
Response to Reply #46
47. ..
"I do not think 'environment mercury' is what is contaminating the caustic soda (lye) that is used to make HFCS."

So then where do you think the mercury is coming from?

Bear in mind, there was no detectable mercury at all in most of the samples.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
kirby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 01:51 PM
Response to Reply #47
48. Huh?
Bear in mind, there was no detectable mercury at all in most of the samples.

Did you read the study? I posted to link in a previous respone to you. Goto the last page, Table 1. It shows many samples that exceeded the DL.

'environmental mercury' sounds like 'clean coal', doesnt it? Your source claims it does not harm anyone and that is is not really absorbed in the intestinal track. However it is transferred via the placenta to the fetus. That is why doctors warn woman of child bearing years to avoid fish that can be high in mercury.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 02:17 PM
Response to Reply #48
51. You're dodging the question.
Where do you think the mercury comes from?

11 out of the 20 samples had no mercury.

"'environmental mercury' sounds like 'clean coal', doesnt it? "

No. "Clean coal" is a sales pitch. Environmental mercury is a real thing.

"Your source claims it does not harm anyone and that is is not really absorbed in the intestinal track."

My source says no such thing.



Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
kirby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 02:25 PM
Response to Reply #51
55. I didnt dodge anything...
1) The manufacture of HFCS uses caustic soda (also known as lye). Creation of the caustic soda can be done in several ways. One way uses the mercury cell process.

Here is a neat animated diagram of the process.

http://www.eurochlor.org/animations/mercury-cell.asp

2) You claimed NO samples had detectable levels, that was not true if you read the info. 9 out of 20 samples tested positive for mercury!

3) Your source, and I quote from her webpage said:

"But an important fact the media has left out of this story is that elemental mercury is not a health threat when ingested (or handled) because virtually none (less than 0.1%) is absorbed through the digestive tract (or skin)."

You are very defensive about just the facts. Do you have a vested interest here?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 02:32 PM
Response to Reply #55
56. ...
"1) The manufacture of HFCS uses caustic soda (also known as lye). Creation of the caustic soda can be done in several ways. One way uses the mercury cell process."

That's certainly a possiblity, although you haven't got any evidence. If that's true, then it'd have nothing to do with HFCS. Anymore than any other food products which use lye.

Regular, old fashioned table sugar, for instance.

"2) You claimed NO samples had detectable levels, that was not true if you read the info. 9 out of 20 samples tested positive for mercury!"

No, I didn't. Read better.

"But an important fact the media has left out of this story is that elemental mercury is not a health threat when ingested (or handled) because virtually none (less than 0.1%) is absorbed through the digestive tract (or skin)"

Again, read better.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
kirby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 02:51 PM
Response to Reply #56
61. I stand corrected on one point...
You said: 'Bear in mind, there was no detectable mercury at all in most of the samples.'

Your finely crafted sentence of 'at all in most of the samples' is what you stated. You did not say NO samples, so I apologize. The phrasing seemed to minimize the fact that 45% of the samples tested above the detectable levels. Fair enough.

But your two other points I do not concede. To claim that if mercury contaminates a products used in the production of HFCS, it lets the HFCS manufacturer dismiss responsibility, is absurd. That would be the same a allow a US Pharmaceutical company to claim ignorance of Melamine contamination from their Chinese suppliers. In fact the trade lobby for HFCS claimed in a recent press release using carefully worded language much unlike your sentence above that they switched suppliers sometime in 2005. This implies that some they are getting caustic soda from suppliers who use other methods like membrane technology instead of the mercury cell technique.

I'm not sure what your last 'Again, read better' even refers to. I directly quoted the website you sourced. I stand by my point that she claims it is not a health threat and due to intestinal absorption but negates to mention transmission to the fetus during pregnancy.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
underpants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 08:41 AM
Response to Original message
20. I thought my soda tasted a bit funny
mmmm Meeeeeeeercury!!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pink-o Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 09:06 AM
Response to Original message
25. The more years I spend on this planet, the clearer it becomes that processed foods
are Satan's tools!!!! (not seriously, don't believe in God or the Devil)

But really: most people don't read the labels when they buy their nutrition in boxes with expiration dates 50 years from now! How can that possibly be good for you? And every year, there's something else those greedy corporations throw into our food supply which makes us sick and eventually kills us.

It's up to us to question: the same way we questioned Bush's policies in Iraq or the no-bid Halliburton contracts, by looking into the agendas of those dispensing info. If it seems hinky, it probably is! And we need to leave those boxes on the shelves and start buying food that you can recognize again.

I don't believe we can eskew all processed foods all the time--and our bodies are pretty adaptable if we encounter a few toxins here and there--but a steady diet of boxes and plastic soda bottles full is like signing the last part of your life over to Big Pharma. We have to educate ourselves re nutrition--trusting the Corporations to give us good, safe food is as destructive as trusting Bush's foreign policies.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Kalyke Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 09:07 AM
Response to Original message
26. Yay!!
Now those people in those "it's OK to eat high fructose corn syrup" commercials can have a definite answer when those other idiots try to foist it on them in cereal or soda or Popsicles and ask why they don't want it.

I HATE those commercials and always shout "Obesity" or "Diabetes" when the idiots ask what is wrong with HFCS!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
conscious evolution Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 09:22 AM
Response to Original message
29. Anyone know the chemical properties of HFCS
Most searches I have made give the properties for fructose and sucrose or glucose.
However,I found one(only one) site saying this is the chemical makeup- C8H3Mg2

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_the_molecular_formula_of_High_Fructose_Corn_Syrup
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 12:51 PM
Response to Reply #29
38. High fructose corn syrup is 55% fructose, 45% glucose.
In a dihydrogen monoxide solution.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
conscious evolution Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 04:50 PM
Response to Reply #38
64. Looking for the exact chemical properties
as it would be written out.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 05:11 PM
Response to Reply #64
66. Are you asking for a chemical formula? Because it's a mixture.
C6H12O6(aq) + C6H12O6(aq)

in H2O.

Or are you looking for chemical properties? Which chemical property are you interested in?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
conscious evolution Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 05:29 PM
Response to Reply #66
75. to clarify: molecular formula
I found one site that says the formula is C8H3Mg2.
I am trying to confirm this.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 06:03 PM
Response to Reply #75
77. It's not C8H3Mg2
That's some high school kid fucking around with you.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Tesha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 09:25 AM
Response to Original message
30. "Detectable amounts" is a ridiculous standard
Nowadays, analysis tools are so sensitive that you can probably
find "detectable amounts" of just about anything in anything.

Exposure to the air downwind of a coal-burning power plant
*UNDOUBTEDLY* puts "detectable amounts" of mercury into
everything exposed to that atmosphere (including you and me).

Tesha

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
kirby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 11:32 AM
Response to Reply #30
33. Are you thinking 'Trace amounts'?
Regardless, in this study, it was not some 'trace' amount:

The highest level of contamination found in the study (http://www.ehjournal.net/content/8/1/2 ) was 0.57 micrograms of mercury per gram of HFCS. The EPA says that an average-sized woman should consume no more than 5.5 micrograms per day of mercury, meaning that the average American consumer may be eating five times the upper safety limit of mercury every day due to high-fructose corn syrup consumption if they consume the foods tested in the study.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 12:52 PM
Response to Original message
39. You realize that HFCS comes from corn, right?
Corn comes out of the ground?

The ground has mercury in it?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Lucian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 02:10 PM
Response to Reply #39
49. I prefer my corn mercury-free.
And no, the ground just doesn't have mercury in it. Mercury comes from volcanic sources. Do you see any sign of volcanism in the Midwest, where most of our corn comes from? I don't.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 02:15 PM
Response to Reply #49
50. You don't live on a well, do you?
Edited on Wed Jan-28-09 02:21 PM by Bornaginhooligan
"Mercury comes from volcanic sources. Do you see any sign of volcanism in the Midwest, where most of our corn comes from?"

Oh sweet jesus.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Lucian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 02:22 PM
Response to Reply #50
54. Well?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 02:33 PM
Response to Reply #54
57. A well. A groundwater well.
Those things that have to be regularly tested for poisonous metals in the ground.

Mercury, for instance.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
kirby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 02:17 PM
Response to Reply #39
52. That is not where the mercury is coming from...
The manufacture of HFCS uses caustic soda (also known as lye). Creation of the caustic soda can be done in several ways. One way uses the mercury cell process.

Here is a neat animated diagram of the process.

http://www.eurochlor.org/animations/mercury-cell.asp
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 02:22 PM
Response to Reply #52
53. The article makes no claims and presents no evidence where the mercury comes from.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BrklynLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 01:14 PM
Response to Original message
42. K&R
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
varelse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 02:45 PM
Response to Original message
60. That's only 45% of the samples
and I'm sure the "detectable amounts" found will be eventually declared to be "safe levels" by the FDA.

*sigh*
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
earth mom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 05:06 PM
Response to Original message
65. Gawd damn greed is killing all of us!
:grr:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
JFN1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 05:13 PM
Response to Original message
68. How can we buy more of their crap
if they kill us all from buying their crap?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Wed May 01st 2024, 11:59 PM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC