Is GE failing?

I heard a tv news head discuss this, and my first thought was, what a minute...isn't that like saying, that suddenly there's not enough air, or something...I mean, something stinks, how can a company undoubtedly used by everyone on earth, no matter what, be having trouble.

If GE is in trouble, isn't this a case of gross mismanagement? My feeling for these giants that are going down or have gone down is that the profit margins are terribly top heavy for a chosen few, otherwise, wouldn't most companies still be doing okay, not great, but still open for business? Is "failure" a matter of not making the gazillions they usually make in a month? I'm talking about the profit margin, not the ability to keep the 10 mansions forever in comfort... margin.

the profitable weapons industry and then fail, but not as they are now.

Care to provide any evidence for this?

I know they make jet engines for military applications and are involved in collaborative efforts with other weapons makers, but it seems to me General Dynamics, Textron, Lockheed and Boeing each do a shitload more business in the weapons sector than GE does.

I am happy to be proven wrong so please, cite your reasons for suggesting that General Electric is "the largest weapons manufacturer in the world."

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

Top 10 World-Wide Defense Contractors, 2008
Rank Name Country/location
1 Lockheed Martin United States
2 Boeing United States
3 BAE Systems United Kingdom
4 Northrop Grumman United States
5 General Dynamics United States
6 Raytheon United States
7 EADS European Union
8 L-3 Communications United States
9 Finmeccanica Italy
10 United Technologies United States

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defense_contractor

Those are weapons systems that they are able to integrate using their mission management software. They don't make any of those, as far as I can tell; I recognize many of those as being Boeing or Lockheed Martin, and I googled a few of the ones I didn't recognize at random to find who made them; none were GE.

For a decade I've avoided investing in defense contracting companies, such as Halliburton, but GE was never flagged as being one of them.

If you think that's awful, I suppose that's your right, but I think there ought to be a limit on such things. I mean, I don't think you should avoid watching the Sci-Fi channel because it's owned by NBC which is owned by GE, nor do I think you should avoid traveling on United Airlines because they buy airplanes from Boeing which also builds guided missiles.

lib2DaBone
Member since Oct 31st 2006
Number of posts 2260

A HERETIC I AM
Member since Aug 04th 2003
Number of posts 5560

Well, that certainly is a unique argument, ya fuckin' newbie. :P

Unfortunately, this post will be deleted if I tell you to kiss my ass, so I won't.



What I will say is posting a list of weapons systems does NOT sustain the claim that GE is "the worlds largest weapons manufacturer".

In fact, it's patently WRONG, but don't let that stop you from calling me a troll merely because I asked you to prove they are the worlds largest weapons manufacturer. Heaven forbid I shoot holes in a meme you and others seems to want to desperately cling to.

Yeah...I can Google too.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defense_contractor

                               Top 10 World-Wide Defense Contractors, 2008                             

Rank 	   Name 	        Country/ 	2007 rank 	Defense revenue 	% of total revenue
                                location                         (US$ billion)                         
1 	Lockheed Martin       United States 	  1 	             38.513 	                 92.0
2 	Boeing 	              United States 	  2 	             32.080 	                 48.0
3 	BAE Systems 	      United Kingdom 	  3 	             29.800 	                 95.0
4 	Northrop Grumman      United States 	  4 	             24.597 	                 77.0
5 	General Dynamics      United States 	  6 	             21.520 	                 79.0
6 	Raytheon 	      United States 	  5 	             19.800 	                 93.0
7 	EADS 	              European Union 	  7 	             12.239 	                 21.3
8 	L-3 Communications    United States 	  8 	             11.239 	                 81.0
9 	Finmeccanica 	          Italy 	  9 	             10.601 	                 53.6
10 	United Technologies   United States 	  10 	              8.761 	                 16.0

Source: www.defensenews.com
Huh. Interesting. GE ISN'T EVEN IN THE TOP FUCKING TEN!

Don't strain yourself, MORON.

Not only are they (GE/MSNBC/CNBC) doing PR-damage control because Jon nailed them so well, they're in a tight spot about going out and saying they're fine when they're not.

They should cut that part loose, take the loss and move on.

The rest of GE remains profitable.

And could take down everything else. Same thing as what's happening to CitiGroup and Bank Of America - something so large has the potential to be wiped out by one of its parts. Which is why we had Glass-Steagall and other laws enacted after the Great Depression, to avoid this. But St. Ronnie Reagan got rid of some of those, and Bill Clinton got rid of the rest, handing his signing pen to CitiGroup CEO Sandy Weill as a memento of the victory.

I forget the source so I can only paraphrase.

Basically, companies that provided financing directly to purchasers of their products are having a more difficult time right now. You've got the car companies but companies like GE as well. Because the financing was for their own products, there was a tenancy to loan money to purchasers who possibly shouldn't have been extended the credit or given different terms. And now the sales are down because 3rd party lenders have tightened up the credit and the self-financiers have had to as well.

http://gecommercialfinance.gecapsol.com/cms/servlet/cmsview/ComFin_Corp/prod/en/main/index.html

They are involved in almost everything you can think of, from credit cards to aircraft and ship financing.

An associate of mine suggested "anymore, they are a financial company masquerading as an industrial."

That they were in BIG trouble and could be dead by June.
Remember that GE credit is HUGH and if it fails it brings down everything else with it.

Wouldn't it be funny if their two biggest money makers were Keith and Rachel?
How ironic would that be?

This would be sweet.
Seeing that scumbag Jack Welch going down the tube would be sickly satisfying.
About 7 years ago all the managers in my organization were agog over the Jack Welch book about leadership, and we were told that we all had to read it.
"I ain't reading that garbage" I said in a meeting only to hear "Why not?"

My response?

"Because Jack Welch is a scumbag and a prick, and I don't think that anyone who was responsible for dumping millions of gallons of PCB's into the Hudson river can teach me a goddamn thing".
Reading the book was then deemed "elective" as opposed to "required".

I'm SUCH a pain in the ass my manager told me later.
Fuck him, I still work here and he doesn't.

(edited to add, I'm not sure if Welch is still running the operation, but after hearing Joe Scarborough say the other morning that Obama should call Jack Welch because HE could get us out of this mess, any pain that comes to Welch is fine with me).

Here's a good link covering naked shorting of GE CDS and how they're driving the company into the ground.

http://market-ticker.denninger.net/archives/849-Stop-OTC-CDS-Abuse-NOW.html

I will be extremely upset if MSNBC removes them due to GE financial troubles.

and they cost about the same as a share of GE stock.... FWIW

maybe not. bombs, lightbulbs, electronics, loan services, electronic medical record, t.v. corporations... what don't they make? food? do they make food?

but, I think the company has too many diversified products to fail completely - NBC, all those refrigerators and other appliances, light bulbs, electronics. Heck, their growing infrastructure and alternative energy businesses could really blossom as the Obama administration invests in infrastructure and alternative energy. They still managed a net profit of $17 billion last year, though that was down from $22 billion the year before.

That said, GE Money/GE Capitol, or whatever it is, is about 1/3 of its total business and their biggest business segment. Not many businesses can survive a complete collapse of 1/3 of their total business.

I actually believe in GE because of their power technology. They have a green program. They also will be involved with electrical grid reconstitution as well as nuclear power plant generation, as well, possibly, with clean coal technology (although there are better companies to invest in for this concern).

This is the only company whose stock drop is shocking me. I expected the banks to drop like stones, but not GE.

They need to sell off their financial interests.

let GE Capital go the route of Citi.