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Cash_thatswhatiwant Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 03:19 AM
Original message
Oprah: Why Women Are Leaving Men for Other Women
Cynthia Nixon did it. Lindsay Lohan's doing it. TV shows are based on it. Is it our imaginations, or are wives and girlfriends ditching their men and falling in love with other women? New science says that sexuality is more fluid than we thought.

At a Halloween party last October, Macarena Gomez-Barris, dressed as a flamenco dancer, put out a bowl of her homemade guacamole and checked on the boiling pot of fresh corn in the kitchen. She'd recently separated from her husband of 12 years, and the friends streaming in now were eager to meet her new love, who, on this night, was the pirate in the three-cornered hat carving pumpkins outside. After her marriage broke up in 2007, few of those who knew Gomez-Barris had thought she'd be single for long—"a catch," they called her—and they were right.

An animated 38-year-old, Gomez-Barris seemed to have it all—a brilliant career, two children, striking looks. Her family had come to the United States from Chile when she was 2 to escape Augusto Pinochet's military dictatorship and to pursue the traditional American dream. While studying for her master's degree at UC Berkeley, she met a charismatic Chilean exile and fiction writer named Roberto Leni at a salsa club in San Francisco. "We had instant chemistry, and he was my soul mate," Gomez-Barris says. They married and eight years later had their first child, a son.

The trouble began after they moved to Los Angeles, where their daughter was born and Gomez-Barris's academic career took off at the University of Southern California. Leni spent his days caring for the house and children. "I was in the more powerful role," says Gomez-Barris, a PhD and an assistant professor in the sociology and American studies and ethnicity departments. "I made more money and was struggling to balance my work and home life."

"Immersed," is how Leni puts it. "She lived and breathed USC. All her friends were professors, and eventually I was obsolete. I'm nothing the system considers I should be as a traditional man. I'm not ambitious. I don't care that much about money. I was brought up among torture survivors, and the most important values were in the emotional realm of human experience, to soothe and support."

His noble ideals unfortunately clashed with day-to-day realities. "Someone had to care about making money to support our family," says Gomez-Barris. Despite efforts to save their relationship in counseling, they ended up separating.

Single again at 36, Gomez-Barris dated a few men, none seriously. "They were not so sure of themselves in their careers or financially," she says. "It was a time of real exploration and personal independence, and I became very rational about the kind of partner I wanted and needed"—someone, she hoped, who would match her intellectual ambitions but also take care of her and her children.

At a party one night last March, Gomez-Barris ran into Judith Halberstam, PhD, a professor of English, American studies and ethnicity, and gender studies at USC. They had met in 2004 and admired each other's scholarly accomplishments, occasionally finding themselves at the same campus parties. But while they shared an affinity for politics and social justice, they were seemingly miles apart in their private lives. Halberstam, nearly 10 years her senior, was openly gay.

That night, Halberstam, who had also broken up with a partner of 12 years, spotted Gomez-Barris standing across the room and thought, "Now, there's a really beautiful woman." "I saw her differently then and developed a big crush on her," says Halberstam. "Yet it made me nervous, given that I have a history of unrequited love with straight women. Then again, you don't choose who you love."

Gomez-Barris noticed that Halberstam was more attentive to her than usual, even flirtatious. "She got up and gave me the better seat, as if she wanted to take care of me. I was struck by that," she says. A few weeks later, Halberstam suggested they go out for dinner, and again, Gomez-Barris was impressed by qualities she liked. "She chose a Japanese restaurant, made reservations, picked me up at my place—on time. I felt attracted to her energy, her charisma. I was enticed. And she paid the bill. Just the gesture was sexy. She took initiative and was the most take-charge person I'd ever met."

Intrigued as Gomez-Barris was, it still never occurred to her that they would be anything more than friends. While she'd been attracted to women at times, she assumed she would eventually fall in love with another man. "I was still inscribed in a heterosexual framework that said only a man could provide for my kids and be part of a family," she says.

On a warm spring night in Malibu, after attending a film screening together, Gomez-Barris and Halberstam walked on the beach, a beautiful pink sunset rounding out a perfect evening. They kicked off their shoes and ran, laughing, through the rising tide. "At that point, things were charged with sex," Gomez-Barris remembers. Her feelings deepened, and not long afterward, they became lovers. "It was great, and it felt comfortable," she says of the night they first became intimate. "What blew me away was that afterward, Judith held me to her chest. So I got passion, intimacy, and sweetness. And I thought, 'Maybe I can get all the things I want now.'"

more @ source
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ColbertWatcher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 03:36 AM
Response to Original message
1. Because they're lesbians? n/t
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SeattleGirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 05:39 AM
Response to Reply #1
6. Not always.
I know women who are essentially straight. Got disgusted with their relationships with men. Decided to try a relationship with a woman. Found more disgust.

For them, I think it's more a matter of learning how to be in a relationship with someone, regardless of sexual orientation.

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timtom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 07:53 AM
Response to Reply #6
9. A superb answer.
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PfcHammer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 08:06 AM
Response to Reply #6
13. Then what?
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ColbertWatcher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 05:58 PM
Response to Reply #6
29. But, what if they are lesbians?
People do not choose their sexual orientation.

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misanthrope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 06:14 PM
Response to Reply #29
33. That's not what the OP seems to suggest**nm
**
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ColbertWatcher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 06:25 PM
Response to Reply #33
37. Seems like it to me. n/t
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misanthrope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 06:35 PM
Response to Reply #37
39. I was being sarcastic**nm
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ColbertWatcher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 07:25 PM
Response to Reply #39
47. Opps! My bad! n/t
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sendero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 06:16 PM
Response to Reply #6
34. You noticed that too....
Edited on Sat Mar-21-09 06:17 PM by sendero
... I decided long ago that most homosexual men were born that way but maybe not most homosexual women. IMHO.

I also noticed that most homosexual men LIKE women, just not for bed. Most homosexual women don't care for men in any capacity.
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blonndee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 06:20 PM
Response to Reply #34
36. "Most homosexual women don't care for men in any capacity"??
Where in the world did you get that idea?
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Lex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 06:52 PM
Response to Reply #34
40. That's so damn stupid and wrong.
Maybe it makes you feel better to think that for some reason, though.



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uppityperson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 06:59 PM
Response to Reply #34
43. "Most homosexual women don't care for men in any capacity". Um, wrong
try again.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 07:15 PM
Response to Reply #34
44. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
shirlden Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 08:04 PM
Response to Reply #34
58. Excuse me !!!
This lesbian actually prefers the company of men.....gay or straight. In all my 50 years of being "out" and about, I have never met a lesbian who disliked men in general. That is just a myth about the big bad dyke man hater. I find the stereotyping offensive.
I have also met women who were in loving committed relationship who said they never believed they were gay, just that they fell in love with this one particular woman. They always said if that relationship went bad they would never go after another woman. And in the two cases that were great friends of mine, the relationship lasted for many many years......until one of the partners died.

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Fuzz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 08:16 PM
Response to Reply #34
62. Ridiculous. Holy crap.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 11:27 PM
Response to Reply #34
89. WAIT . . . homosexual women do CARE about homosexual males, at least . . because . . .
homosexual females made every effort to help and assist in San Francisco with the

AIDS epidemic. And, a documentary I saw on this suggested the opposite . . . that

the San Francisco community had been male/female homosexuals but gradually the females

felt that the males were making them unwelcome. And, still, I think homosexual

females continue to aid the homosexual male community in the epidemic?

"In any capacity" may be somewhat correct but also somewhat wrong . . .


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Politicalboi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 01:59 AM
Response to Reply #34
99. I'm a lesbian and I get along
Better with men as friends. I'm butch and I was a tomboy so I played with boys, I have 3 brothers 1 gay 2 hetro no sisters. My last job I worked in was 90% men and I loved it. I'm in the butch/femme community and there aren't as many of us as there are Andro's. It's possible not every gay was born that way. I think child molestation could have a part in it. I believe it did with me. My best friend from high school was sexually abused as a child and she's a lesbian too.
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lumberjack_jeff Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 11:32 AM
Response to Reply #34
116. Remember, it's think... then type. Think... type. Like that. n/t
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Rhythm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-23-09 02:01 AM
Response to Reply #34
152. W.T.F.??!
I've been out for 25+ years, and cannot think of a single lesbian like what you just described. Even the butch-est of the gals i've known over the years have gotten along well with men, so long as those men weren't trying to convince them that all they needed was a "good dickin'" to turn them straight.

:eyes:
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readmoreoften Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 08:11 PM
Response to Reply #6
60. So, they're bisexual. Whatever.
Seriously. You don't make a commitment to being in a romantic, sexual relationship with women if you're not into romantic, sexual relationships with women.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 11:22 PM
Response to Reply #1
86. I've read that more males are homosexual than females ....
but that more females will turn to homosexual relationships!

Even though the females are supposedly straight -- they find, like this woman,

disappointment with males -- sometimes violence from males -- and they are more

comfortable in a realtionship with a female.

Now . . . whether this means that more males are bisexual, as well, I don't know . . .

Maybe it means more females are bisexual???

Help -- !! Kinsey ... where are you ?

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Bryn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 01:54 AM
Response to Reply #86
98. I remember reading "Goddess" book about Marilyn Monroe
when someone accused her of being gay, she spoke out saying "I don't see anything wrong with it if there's so much love in it." (it was thought that she had a relationship with her acting woman teacher.) Liz Taylor insulted her at a night club, calling her "Dyke", Marilyn just said nothing and walked off.

French actress, Catherine Deneuve was on Kathie Lee/Reggie show one morning in 1995 or so. Catherine said French women like making love to other women. "It doesn't mean we're lesbians. It's just that we're open."

So I imagine that more females are open to bisexuality. I had a very good friend who was a straight woman who fell in love with another woman and was very happy. It has never happened to me, but I don't think it's impossible even though I consider myself a heterosexual woman who loves men.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 11:23 AM
Response to Reply #98
108. Interesting . . ..
I had heard this about Marilyn and never thought of her as bisexual ---

Not sure that I've seen the book "Goddess" -- and I think it's an apt way to describe

Marilyn, in the oldest sense of the word. Diana, as well. The idea of rising goddesses.

And I love Marilyn's answer.

Also think Catherine Deneuve's response very honest and enlightening.

Yes --- I think Americans have been brought up with very rigid concepts of sexuality --

and would include myself in that. Patriarchal religion certainly plays its role in that!

It has never happened to me, but I don't think it's impossible even though I consider myself a heterosexual woman who loves men.

Same conclusion I've reached.

And as I read Marilyn's and Catherine's responses, I wonder if they are perhaps simply more

loving people. As Cathereine said . . . "more open."


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treestar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 02:26 PM
Response to Reply #86
126. I ran across the theory somewhere that everyone is potentially
bisexual - it is just a matter of degree. Like most things, there are grey areas.
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XemaSab Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 10:13 PM
Response to Reply #1
145. Sexuality in women is fluid
You would do well to learn this.
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slampoet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 03:39 AM
Response to Original message
2. Oprah should be the LAST woman to do a show on this.
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MicaelS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 04:26 AM
Response to Reply #2
4. My thought exactly
I imagine she'll come out one of these days. She'd better, I doubt any man on earth could stand being married to her. :puke:
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LostinVA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 08:01 AM
Response to Reply #4
12. Why the puking? Oprah is an attractive woman
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MicaelS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 08:30 AM
Response to Reply #12
18. Because...
Her show from the very beginning has been predicated on the concept of bashing men and blaming men at every available opportunity. It translates to "If men would only do what women wanted, the world would be a perfect place."
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HarukaTheTrophyWife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 08:32 AM
Response to Reply #18
20. Oh yes, the poor oppressed men
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Sultana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 08:52 AM
Response to Reply #20
25. LOL
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LostinVA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 08:33 AM
Response to Reply #18
22. Her show is nothing of the kind, and I'm not an "Oprah" fan
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Missy Vixen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 07:16 PM
Response to Reply #18
45. You're joking, aren't you?
Have you ever watched her show? I have.

Bashing and blaming men at "every available opportunity"? Maybe you landed on Dr. Phil's show by accident.
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Dollface Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 08:08 PM
Response to Reply #18
59. And your point....?
:evilgrin:
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elshiva Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 10:01 PM
Response to Reply #18
140. Not an Oprah fan at all here, but it is NOT about "bashing men."
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Hello_Kitty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 11:10 PM
Response to Reply #18
149. Men have Howard Stern and porn.
On Oprah's show, you see women complaining that their husbands don't help out around the house or that they're not fulfilled in their relationships. Most "men's" entertainment is predicated on the concept that women are bitches and sperm-recepticles. What are YOU complaining about?
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NaturalHigh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 10:00 AM
Response to Reply #12
28. Attractive?
I guess attraction really is subjective. Not that I didn't know that all along, but she is about the last woman I would ever label as attractive.

On the flip side, I do think that Oprah has done a lot of good things for a lot of people.
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citizen snips Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 10:29 PM
Response to Reply #4
71. hmmm that makes for a good poll
Edited on Sat Mar-21-09 10:29 PM by citizen snips
Do men find Oprah attracting?

I vote no.
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elshiva Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 10:03 PM
Response to Reply #71
142. Who cares if she is attractive or not? That's not relevant
to this discussion at all.
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PM Martin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 01:58 PM
Response to Reply #4
122. As you said.
Oprah has nothing but contempt for men. :puke:
So what she is saying is that women need women and men should drop dead.
That has always been how she has been. A vile thug.
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XemaSab Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 10:22 PM
Response to Reply #4
147. What???
Because she's a strong woman?

Right. :eyes:
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QC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 08:36 AM
Response to Reply #2
23. Actually, I'm sure that she and Gayle could offer some interesting insights
into this phenomenon.

Oops, did I say that?

Never mind.
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MilesColtrane Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 03:50 AM
Response to Original message
3. I hope Ms. Halberstam doesn't lose her job, or she could be an ex-soul mate too.
That seems to be pretty important to her partner.
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Ferretherder Donating Member (991 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 07:17 AM
Response to Reply #3
7. My thoughts, exactly!
This woman seems to be an extremely self-centered social-climber, not a person who is just looking for 'someone to stop and smell the roses with'.

Thoroughly Modern Millie.
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KittyWampus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 07:34 PM
Response to Reply #3
48. I'm glad to not be the only one who had that thought.
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Heidi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 11:27 AM
Response to Reply #3
112. You think it's about financial security? I think you're missing the point entirely. (nt)
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MilesColtrane Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 11:39 AM
Response to Reply #112
119. I'm just going by what she was emphasizing.
"Someone had to care about making money to support our family,"

"They were not so sure of themselves in their careers or financially,"

"I was still inscribed in a heterosexual framework that said only a man could provide for my kids."

"And she paid the bill. Just the gesture was sexy."

I wish them luck.
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SoCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 05:36 AM
Response to Original message
5. "...While she'd been attracted to women at times,..." says it all for me
she's a bisexual woman who married a man, and then changed her mind....no trend-setter here, just a dissatisfied woman who decided to switch, and found a woman she loved, instead of another man:)
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Withywindle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 07:56 PM
Response to Reply #5
55. Didn't even "change her mind" per se.
She had a relationship, it didn't work out in the long term, she got over it and moved on to another relationship.

People of all orientations do that same basic thing all the time. The only thing that makes this "news" is the genders involved, and if you know a lot of bi people, that's not unusual either. :)
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Nye Bevan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 07:40 AM
Response to Original message
8. Old news.
This kind of behavior has gone on for years in "The L Word".
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LostinVA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 08:01 AM
Response to Original message
10. Because they are gay or bisexual -- no big mystery here
Edited on Sat Mar-21-09 08:03 AM by LostinVA
No matter what straight porn shows, straight women do not have sex with women or relationships with women. Gay women do. Bisexual women do. If a woman says they are straight, but were just experimenting or whatever, they are lying: they are bi, and don't want to admit iot for some reason.
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KittyWampus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 07:37 PM
Response to Reply #10
50. but I though sexuality was a spectrum with some straight people perhaps being slightly
toward the other direction?
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Prometheus Bound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 10:45 PM
Response to Reply #10
73. I live in a city with hundreds of thousands of female domestic helpers and no available men for them
Edited on Sat Mar-21-09 11:09 PM by Prometheus Bound
I used to think like you but I know of several cases where this is not the case and have heard of many many more. It seems that often one partner may be lesbian, but the other is not. I haven't talked to any of them personally about their relationships but my wife has and it seems they want a partner and simply have no alternative.
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LostinVA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 11:15 PM
Response to Reply #73
84. Then they're bi
Edited on Sat Mar-21-09 11:16 PM by LostinVA
People who are straight do not have relationships with a same sex mate.

I honestly don't understand why this is so hard to grasp.

I wouldn't have a male partner if I was stuck in a place without any available and compatible lesbians. BECAUSE I'M NOT STRAIGHT.
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Prometheus Bound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 11:31 PM
Response to Reply #84
90. I understand your frustration but you need to get out more.
I had a hard time believing it as well. But there's a whole fascinating world of relationships out there that you obviously are not willing to consider possible.
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LostinVA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 01:22 PM
Response to Reply #90
120. They are bi -- I am worldly and sophisticated enough on this issue
Edited on Sun Mar-22-09 01:23 PM by LostinVA
:eyes:
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Prometheus Bound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 02:52 PM
Response to Reply #120
130. For you be so certain on the issue, I doubt you know any couples in such a relationship.
Where at least one of the two is heterosexual, but because of circumstances opts for a homosexual relationship.

Simply dismissing it as impossible because you wouldn't so it makes no sense.
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rug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 08:01 AM
Response to Original message
11. Why isn't flvegan all over this thread?
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flvegan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 07:42 PM
Response to Reply #11
51. !
:rofl:

I like to watch.
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mitchum Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 08:18 AM
Response to Original message
14. Florence King calls this "the Jason's Mommy Syndrome"
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XanaDUer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 08:28 AM
Response to Reply #14
15. Lol!
:rofl:
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mitchum Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 08:31 AM
Response to Reply #15
19. I recall her using the phrase "Uncle Wiggly and cunnilingus in the Cabbage Patch"...
in the essay

Nice to see you! :)
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aikoaiko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 08:29 AM
Response to Original message
16. This is true of men too, sometimes it just doesn't matter who meets a person's needs.

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HarukaTheTrophyWife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 08:33 AM
Response to Reply #16
21. If a woman (or man) is straight, a same-sex partner will not meet their needs
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aikoaiko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 08:36 AM
Response to Reply #21
24. I would agree with you in the long run, but necessarily in the short term.

Lots of straight men go to tearooms to have sex men because it meets their sexuality needs. Sometimes there are short-term "friends" relationships based on that same premise.



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HarukaTheTrophyWife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 09:07 AM
Response to Reply #24
26. Those dudes aren't straight, no matter what they say
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Withywindle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 07:53 PM
Response to Reply #24
54. No, straight men don't do that.
Bisexual men in denial about being bisexual do.
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aikoaiko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 08:12 PM
Response to Reply #54
61. That's kind of tautological.

Some men who engage in that activity consider themselves to be perfectly straight. Sexual identity and sexual behavior don't always correspond.
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Withywindle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 10:27 PM
Response to Reply #61
70. And why, may I ask, do they consider themselves "perfectly straight"?
Could it be because they don't really grasp bisexuality? Could it be that they have ignorant stereotypes about the kind of men who have sex with other men and say "I'm not like that!" Could it be that they're closeted in one way or another?

I mean, I've had a majority of romantic relationships with men but I identify as bi because, duh, I've had sex with both genders and hope to again. It's not rocket science! If you have capacity to feel attraction to both genders, that's what "bi" pretty much MEANS.
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aikoaiko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 10:53 PM
Response to Reply #70
76. Here's the thing you're missing -- one doesn't have to be attracted to a person/gender in order ....

...to have an orgasm when receiving oral sex from that person/gender.

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Withywindle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 11:12 PM
Response to Reply #76
83. I don't know if I believe that!
Edited on Sat Mar-21-09 11:14 PM by Withywindle
Admittedly, I'm bi, as I said, but would a truly straight person really seek it out?

Would a truly straight woman actively go seeking oral sex from other women? (without a male audience, mind you)


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closeupready Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 10:54 PM
Response to Reply #83
148. Does a guy with an erection who wants a free BJ/release seek out BJ's
from others, regardless of gender? Um, yeah.
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Withywindle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 11:21 PM
Response to Reply #76
85. And also, you know what?
If you have the capacity to enjoy any form of sex with both genders....


how is that a bad thing? If you manage to really enjoy coming while having a sexual experience with a person of the gender you always thought you weren't attracted to...

AWESOME. Something new and cool has happened, and you've learned something new about yourself. There is no reason to think being bi is shameful. (From my point of view, I think it's the pinnacle of humanity. :evilgrin:) You should order a cake and celebrate!
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HarukaTheTrophyWife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 10:51 PM
Response to Reply #61
75. Just because someone's a closet case doesn't mean they're not gay
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aikoaiko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 10:54 PM
Response to Reply #75
77. I agree that some of the men are probably closeted, but not all.
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HarukaTheTrophyWife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 11:00 PM
Response to Reply #77
79. If a man fucks another man, he is at least bisexual, no matter how much he says he's straight
I don't understand how that is hard to comprehend.
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LostinVA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 11:07 PM
Response to Reply #79
81. Yup, straight men do not have sex with other men -- gay and bi men do
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aikoaiko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 11:07 PM
Response to Reply #79
82. We'll have to disgree then.


I think you're stuck in your tautology and limiting the human sexual response because of it.

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HarukaTheTrophyWife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 11:24 PM
Response to Reply #82
87. Oh for fucks sake
I'm not limiting the human sexual response. I'm just saying that straight people don't sleep with people of the same sex.
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aikoaiko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 11:33 AM
Response to Reply #87
117. Ok, I'll try one more time.

Do you believe that someone can be neutral sexual attaction to someone of the same sex?

Do you think that someone could still have an orgasm from someone they have neutral sexual attraction to?

I think the answer is yes to both and thats how an authentically straight person can have sex with someone of the same sex.

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elshiva Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 10:07 PM
Response to Reply #87
143. Yes, indeed!
:thumbsup:
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 11:34 PM
Response to Reply #79
91. WAIT . . . what about the 240,000 male-on-male RAPES in our prisons every year . . .??
Edited on Sat Mar-21-09 11:34 PM by defendandprotect
Are all those men who rape actually bisexual?

Could be? I'm just asking!

Meanwhile, the guy who gets raped, immediately upon his release from prison'

is said to rape a female . . . "to prove his manhood/hetereosexuality" --- !!!

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HarukaTheTrophyWife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 11:40 PM
Response to Reply #91
92. Rape isn't sex
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 11:08 AM
Response to Reply #92
103. dupe
Edited on Sun Mar-22-09 11:11 AM by defendandprotect
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 11:10 AM
Response to Reply #92
104. Granted, rape is about domination . . .
and women in prisons are also being betrayed and "sold" by guards to

male prisoners.

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dysfunctional press Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 11:25 AM
Response to Reply #61
110. if they considered themselves to be a giraffe- would that make them one?
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aikoaiko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 11:35 AM
Response to Reply #110
118. No, I don't think so, but I think the comparison is poor.

Sexual identity is comprised of self-assessment of sexual desires, attractions, and behavior. Being a member of a species is not.

Now if you think one should define their sexuality by whom they have sex with only, then I could see your point.
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dysfunctional press Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 01:40 PM
Response to Reply #118
121. by just about ANY rational definition- a guy who has sex with another guy is NOT "straight".
no matter what he might like to tell himself.
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aikoaiko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 06:50 PM
Response to Reply #121
134. No, not by any rational definition because it depends on your premises.

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dysfunctional press Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 06:58 PM
Response to Reply #134
135. using rational premises...AND rational definitions- straight men do NOT have sex with other men...
no matter WHAT you want to keep telling yourself.
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HamdenRice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 11:18 AM
Response to Reply #54
106. Your position is a bit over-determined. Ever heard about what happens in prison? nt
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 11:27 AM
Response to Reply #106
111. Yes . . . and I was also making that argument . . .
and, of course, it is homosexuals who are abused and anyone who can be branded

homosexual so there is a lot for these males to hide behind in prison.

The idea of confinement barring access to females, the idea of rape as domination which

is certainly true, and the idea of controlling and punishing "effeminate" males.

If Kinsey is right, the yardstick is more like elastic -- and there looks like a very

wide bisexual middle!!!

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dysfunctional press Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 11:27 AM
Response to Reply #106
113. heavily closeted gay men come out of those closets?
:shrug:
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HarukaTheTrophyWife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 09:54 PM
Response to Reply #106
138. The #1 voice of gay people speaks
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dysfunctional press Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 11:24 AM
Response to Reply #24
109. no, they don't.
straight men don't have sex with other men.
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KittyWampus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 07:36 PM
Response to Reply #21
49. if their primary need is to find someone to pay for them and their kids.... I think they would.
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Withywindle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 07:50 PM
Response to Reply #49
53. If their primary need is to find someone to pay for them...
...then they're what the porn industry calls "gay for pay" and what a lot of judgmental people on DU will call something far less kind than that! (See, renting by the hour is terrible, but a lease-to-own agreement, if you're a woman who's just concerned with a potential partner's salary --why, that's marriage! And marriage is always OK, right?)

Doesn't sound like the case with this woman per se. Sounds like she's bisexual to me. And also has that "knight in shining armor" thing going on--which is fucked up regardless of the genders involved--but considering what she's been through, I'm glad she's found it.
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rucky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 08:30 AM
Response to Original message
17. Because we're clueless?
I think I may have just made a case-in-point.
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NaturalHigh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 09:58 AM
Response to Original message
27. "New science says that sexuality is more fluid than we thought."
So is this saying that we do have some choice in our sexual preferences?
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Lex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 06:16 PM
Response to Reply #27
35. maybe it is not the same for everyone . . . for some
it is definitely NOT a choice, for others, maybe it is

But my question is, what difference should THAT possibly make?

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NaturalHigh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 09:50 PM
Response to Reply #35
63. Just an observation...
Don't blow a gasket.
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Lex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 10:26 PM
Response to Reply #63
69. Haha
you call that blowing a gasket?

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NaturalHigh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 10:36 PM
Response to Reply #69
72. No, not at all.
I was just hoping you wouldn't progress to that point.
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Mike 03 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 06:00 PM
Response to Original message
30. I don't blame them, and in a sense they are probably doing us guys a favor.
I think I like living with a dog and a cat.

I can get up whenever I want. I can listen to the radio all night. I can get up at midnight and do yoga if I want to...

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LWolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 06:11 PM
Response to Reply #30
31. lol
After 2 marriages and 23 years, I discovered the joys of living alone.

The dog, the cat and I are perfectly content.

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SmileyRose Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 06:26 PM
Response to Reply #31
38. I hope you aren't in Florida or Alaska. They are about to outlaw that.
"The dog, the cat and I are perfectly content."

:evilgrin:
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LWolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 06:56 PM
Response to Reply #38
41. Heh.
Luckily, I'm firmly ensconced here on the left coast. ;)
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 06:59 PM
Response to Reply #31
42. I feel exactly the same way now. It took a while but
I'm loving this!

:hi:
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Withywindle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 08:03 PM
Response to Reply #31
56. Even when living with romantic partners, I always knew my pets were more devoted for the long haul.
But wait...I had a male cat for 14 years (he was with me longer than 7 apartments, 3 boyfriends, and 2 jobs). Then he died, and two years later, I got my current kitty friend...who's female.

Did I leave a "man" for a "woman"? I mean, I know we bi folk do that, but...did I have a chance at a magazine feature that I missed?
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LWolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 09:57 PM
Response to Reply #56
64. .
:rofl:

I've had both male and female cats and dogs. My horses are all female. My hens have a rooster; I used to keep more than one, but their competition for attention from the girls raised the level of aggression. Now I keep one, and they keep him busy enough that he doesn't have the time or energy to think about being territorial. ;)
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seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 10:21 PM
Response to Reply #30
67. just sayin
even the married an do those things too, or in my marriage anyway, wink
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BlooInBloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 06:12 PM
Response to Original message
32. This is so fucking stupid.
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dem629 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 07:17 PM
Response to Original message
46. The most critical sociological aspect of this issue is whether
the women are hot.
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ogneopasno Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 07:48 PM
Response to Original message
52. Sexuality is fluid? NO WAY!
AMAZING!
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mudesi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 08:03 PM
Response to Original message
57. I'm No Scientist, But All Women Have Some Bisexual Tendencies
That's just observation. It might have to do with hormones or something, I don't know. But women are more likely to be attracted to other women as well as men.
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smalll Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 10:05 PM
Response to Reply #57
65. History tells us you (and the rest of America) have got it ass-backwards.
Bisexuality in women? Exceedingly rare in most cultures and most time periods. Bisexuality in men? Pretty much par for the course (viz, prisons, navies, English "public" schools, the Greeks, etc. etc.) Why? Mostly because men want sex more than women, so they'll be less likely to be picky, gender-wise, when they feel the call of nature.

Deal with it America. You've got it ass-backwards.
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bluedawg12 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 01:34 AM
Response to Reply #65
94. Good for Americans a rich supply of bi-women
the more for us!

America stay as sweet as you always were.
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lilyreally Donating Member (67 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 10:08 PM
Response to Reply #57
66. Never.
The plumbing is just wrong. Strong "eew" factor. So I would have to disagree with you based on my personal experience and that of the many girlfriends I have. This has come up in conversations, especially when we all travel together and then have wine parties in one of our hotel rooms before bedtime. We all agree that we love each other's company but just could never play for the other team.
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seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 10:23 PM
Response to Reply #57
68. nu uh. lol, nevah. or not yet anyway
and i am working on half a century
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LostinVA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 11:24 PM
Response to Reply #57
88. I'd say you are totally off the mark
I've asked my sister this question,"If you were stranded on a desert island with another woman, would you ever have sex with her?" No was her answer, and I believe her.
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bluedawg12 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 02:58 PM
Response to Reply #88
131. Plumbing and a strong eeew factor, women only, men make nice friends.
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Brooklyns_Finest Donating Member (747 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 11:49 PM
Response to Reply #57
93. +1
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Cash_thatswhatiwant Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 01:49 AM
Response to Reply #57
96. they have found that women who were straight were sexually excited when
Edited on Sun Mar-22-09 01:49 AM by Cash_thatswhatiwant
shown born of gay men, gay women or straigh man/straight woman.

straight men were only excited by straight man/straight woman.

http://www.scienceblog.com/cms/study_suggests_difference_between_female_and_male_sexuality
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bluedawg12 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 03:00 PM
Response to Reply #96
132. Excitement is one thing, what you do with it is another.
I suppose I could be turned on by watching something with men in it, but not turned on to have sex with them, rather, being a lesbian I would turn that energy to my same sex partner.

Shrek had that effect on me. :P
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Kitty Herder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 10:10 PM
Response to Reply #96
144. Being excited by images is one thing.
Edited on Sun Mar-22-09 10:14 PM by Kitty Herder
Actually being attracted to a real person and wanting to do something about it is another. This is just my opinion, but I think that women in our society are enculturated to see sexy images of women as exciting. Our tv, magazines, movies, etc. all make the connection that naked woman = sex. So seeing a naked woman is exciting because it is shorthand for SEX. I could be wrong, of course. It would require more study to determine the reason for this difference between the sexes.

My experience is that I do sometimes find myself excited by sexy images of women, but I've never had the same feelings of attraction for a woman that I do for men. Although I am open to the idea, I've just never felt it. (Yet. Maybe I've just never met the right woman.) Perhaps with women, it is the feeling that matters more than the physical excitement? Personally, I can be excited by an image, but not particularly effected by that excitement, not necessarily attracted to the image that causes it. Maybe that's true for the majority of women.

edited to add: One thing I forgot to mention is that I usually imagine myself as the woman/women in erotic images. I automatically put myself in her shoes. For me, at least, that is the main source of excitement.
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LeftyMom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 01:53 AM
Response to Reply #57
97. Profile says: male
Shocking. :sarcasm:
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seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 08:36 AM
Response to Reply #97
100. lol. what i thought. ... n/t
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Chovexani Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 08:46 AM
Response to Reply #57
101. Dear mudesi,
Edited on Sun Mar-22-09 08:47 AM by Chovexani
Stop watching Cinemax late at night. It lies to you.

Signed,

The Women of America

PS: Those of us who are actually bisexual are not that way to be man candy either.
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TwilightGardener Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 11:15 AM
Response to Reply #57
105. Mmmm... no. Don't think so. I have never been attracted to a woman.
"All women" is way too sweeping a statement.
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Starry Messenger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 11:21 AM
Response to Reply #57
107. You are definitely no scientist. n/t
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Peacetrain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 11:30 AM
Response to Reply #57
115. Being neither bi-sexual or lesbian.. I cannot speak for anothers
sexual needs and desires are. That is an individual component unique to that human being. Being a woman, I am attracted sexually only to men.

That does not mean I do not love being with women, my friends hugging them etc. But when it comes to the "sexual" lust of life, women do not have the right equipment for my individual sexual preference.

So your premise that ALL women have bisexual tendencies is in a word nutty and an insult to all of us, what ever our sexual preferences and needs are. We cannot interchange them willy nilly.
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bluedawg12 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 03:03 PM
Response to Reply #115
133. As a gay woman, I agree. Men are nice and make great friends
but beyond that nada. I expect that straight women feel the same in reverse.

I kinda am starting to hate these stupid labels about people. :eyes:
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Peacetrain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 07:24 PM
Response to Reply #133
137. Exactly..
:hi:
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Lorien Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 11:32 PM
Response to Reply #57
150. Um, no. But I wish that I did
I'm pretty fed up with the opposite sex. They're fine as friends, but I'm not interested in the servant/ brood mare/ whore position that those wanting a"relationship" seem to think that I should be fulfilling.
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seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-23-09 12:03 AM
Response to Reply #150
151. wasnt too long ago i was wishin i was lesbian too... lol lol
just cause males.... ok, some males (rollin eyes).... are such assholes.

but if you arent, you arent

kinda like the guy that has so bought into his porn he posts that ALL women are bi..... ba hahahaha
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NoodleyAppendage Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 10:47 PM
Response to Original message
74. Typical. She struggles to gain power and advantage, but really wants to be "taken care of."
Modern women are studies in contradiction.

J
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leftofthedial Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 02:35 PM
Response to Reply #74
127. In many ways, men are not allowed to be culturally stereotypical "men,"
because that persona is frequently said to be offensive to women.

In some ways though, women are not only allowed, but encouraged, to be like that image of men.

Turns out, some aspects of that "offensive" persona are *exactly* what women want--even the women who decry that persona when expressed by men. They reject it in men and seek it out in other women.

Not enough of us are willing or able anymore to be two *people* in a relationship. Not two jobs, or two careers, or two bank accounts, but two *people*.

I find both women in this article appalling.
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ismnotwasm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 10:58 PM
Response to Original message
78. I was reading an article
About this er, trend. It was in "More" magazine, I think. Somewhere in the article it was delicately suggested that perhaps, um "hormones" in the case of older women less estrogen, had something to do with it. I immediately took the article to a Gay male friend (It was at work, I only read trash at work for some reason)and asked him "So does a man become more gay when his testosterone levels fall as he grows older? He laughed at me of course.

These women were obviously bi-sexual to begin with and did not have the cognitive ability or sexual communication skills to acknowledge it outside of fantasy--or at all--until a certain point in their lives.


I've always felt sexuality is a type of continuum anyway. Not lying to oneself and not lying to others in personal relationships is the best policy IF that is even practically possible on any level, and for so many LGBT's it most certainly is not.
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kentuck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-21-09 11:05 PM
Response to Original message
80. Very interesting article ...
...and comments.
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Gwendolyn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 01:41 AM
Response to Original message
95. Bwahaha! Oprah has an opinion now about how people will fuck. Amazing!

Only in america.
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lightningandsnow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 08:47 AM
Response to Original message
102. Sexuality is fluid, kiddos.
I was talking to a (mostly heterosexual female) friend yesterday, and she said "You know, I'm pretty much as straight as it gets, but if a girl were to come along, I wouldn't turn her down just because she's a girl."

Take societal expectations away, and a good number of people aren't that phased by gender. That's not to say that everybody is naturally bisexual, just that there are more than three options. (100% gay, 100% straight, 50/50 bisexual)

Also, gender is fluid too. But that's for another time.
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Kitty Herder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 10:00 PM
Response to Reply #102
139. Well said.
I totally agree.
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Lyric Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 11:28 AM
Response to Original message
114. Who CARES? Jesus.
Let's just love who we want to love, fuck who we want to fuck, and knock off all the gossipy bullshit. Other peoples' sex lives are none of our business, assuming that everyone involved is a consenting adult.

If the title read, "Why Women are Leaving Blonde Men for Brown-Haired Men," nobody would give a damn. Why this society obsesses over gender and sexual orientation, to the point of OPPRESSING people, I will never understand.
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leftofthedial Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 02:04 PM
Response to Original message
123. less risk.
Edited on Sun Mar-22-09 02:05 PM by leftofthedial
cultural and societal programming.
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Fleshdancer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 02:12 PM
Response to Original message
124. I know a few woman who have done this
One woman started dating a woman after her divorce to her husband. The second woman divorced her husband because she fell in love with a woman...this one was a complete shock for everyone who knew her, but she really does seem happier.

I personally think the confusion is due to the lack of acceptance of bisexuality. People get so wrapped up about the actual act of sex so they don't step back and really think about what sex is and what it represents. Humans don't engage in sexual activity just for procreation purposes. It's a physical expression of attraction, lust, and love. We're all capable of seeing beauty in both genders and a percentage of people are capable of physical attraction toward both men and women. Since that ability is there, then bisexuality is a given. I don't understand why this is so hard for people to understand.

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treestar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 02:24 PM
Response to Original message
125. Not seeing a trend here
Just one woman's story.
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MrScorpio Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 02:38 PM
Response to Original message
128. Some of these women are disregarding gender while others are bi-sexuals or lesbians
Each individual story tells its own tale
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Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 02:42 PM
Response to Original message
129. the woman's name is "macarena". is this a popular one in chile?
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Yavin4 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 07:13 PM
Response to Original message
136. Here's My $0.02 - Let People Love Whomever They Want
As long as it is consentual and healthy, then people should love whomever they want to. Forcing people into boxes or roles does not work in a truly free society.

A lot of people shouldn't even be married as evidenced by the divorce rate, spousal abuse, and marital homicide.

Allowing people the freedom to love whomever makes ALL relationships stronger.
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Kitty Herder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 10:01 PM
Response to Reply #136
141. Hear, hear! nt
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Stevenmarc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-22-09 10:19 PM
Response to Original message
146. .
Edited on Sun Mar-22-09 10:20 PM by Stevenmarc
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