First Officer on doomed Buffalo Colgan Flight earned $16,254 a year!

WASHINGTON — Colgan Air has revised its pilot hiring standards in a way that would have disqualified someone as inexperienced as the pilot of the doomed Flight 3407, the company said today as hearings into the Feb. 12 crash turned to the company's hiring and employment practices.

In addition, testimony revealed that the copilot of Flight 3407 — which crashed into a home in Clarence, killing 50 — had a gross annual salary of about $16,254 a year.

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Under questioning from investigators, Mary Finnegan, Colgan's vice president for administration, acknowledged that when Renslow was hired, the minimum number of flight hours to be considered for hiring was 600 hours.

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Investigator Roger Cox said his research showed Colgan pilots making $21 an hour — or $16,254 a year.

Finnegan said the hourly salary is closer to $23 an hour, meaning Shaw would have made more than $16,254. Nevertheless, Cox questioned whether that is enough for Colgan employees such as Shaw who are based in Newark.

http://www.buffalonews.com/home/story/670165.html

Shameful they pay like they are a fast food restaurant not an airline where a plane load of passengers put their lives in the hands of pilots who probably have to work 2nd jobs to make ends meet! Remember pilots are limited to a set number of hours they can fly a month so that $21-$23 an hour is misleading.

wages are on the decline in most jobs these days.

I've known about the pay rates for a long time - these people make roughly what a waitress at Sonic pulls in. It's barely above minimum wage, and usually graduates from flight schools work for them to get hours to move up to a major commercial carrier. There are some good pilots who work in commuters, but there are also enough of them without a lot of experience that I'll never put my life in their hands.

I too have known about their fast-food pay and the fact many of them have to work 2nd jobs just to stay solvent. Makes the fatigue factor high. Also means you may not be getting the best quality of pilot.

And I've read that the pilot spent the night before the crash sleeping in the crew lounge - he probably had to commute to his base and didn't have the money for a hotel. Not a very restful place to sleep and fatigue might indeed have been a factor.

plus had a cold for which she had said she should've called off sick. I'm wondering if their chatter in the cockpit while on approach was because they were both fighting fatigue.

depending on where you're trying to go.. its *lots* of Colgan Air or Chautaqua Air, etc.

$16,254/yr divided by 2080 hrs per yr = $7.81/hr. The min. wage in NY is $7.15/hr. It'll go up to $7.25/hr in July.

Read the FAR's - 1000 max.

So NO this guy isn't working for minimum wage PLUS he is getting very expensive jet time building up from commercial to ATP rating which nobody can afford to get outside of on the job.

Doug D.

A full time job that pays $23 per hour would be $48,000. So they are paying $23 per hour for limited hours.

ATP's are limited to 1000 hours a year which actually means 21,000 to 23,000 a year based on 21 to 23 dollars an hour.

This doesn't sound like a lot but what the guy was getting in return was a chance to build hours on expensive hardware he could never afford to rent or own himself.

Even a little Cessna 172 costs 80 to 120 dollars per hour these days - jet time is astronomical unless it is on the job training. (OJT).

600 hours doesn't sound like a lot of time but it only takes 250 hours to become a licensed commercial pilot. To be an Airline Transport Pilot requires 1500 hours - this guy was building the experience difference to get to an ATP rating.

Instead of blaming the crash on inexperience or underpaid pilots, let's wait for the NTSB to investigate and announce an ACTUAL cause of the crash. There is no clear correlation between the salary of an airline pilot and his safety record and the total number of hours isn't necessarily an indicator either beyond a certain point.

Doug D.
Licensed Private Pilot,
Aerospace Engineer

When you have paying passengers in the rear expecting their pilot has sufficient skills to handle the aircraft and conditions he/she will encounter on the flight. Already Colgan has admitted some culpability in saying they will not hire a pilot with the lack of experience the Captain of this flight had when originally hired. And the fact he had failed three "federal" flight checks.

While the NTSB hasn't come out with a final ruling its sure looking like the pilots didn't know how to handle the icing and the stall.

These commuters should be forced whether by union rules or federal flight rules to pay a sufficient salary that they can attract more skilled pilots.

There has to be a better way to get pilots that are proficient and not get them OJT and hours on expensive aircraft that doesn't put the ignorant paying passengers in jeopardy by the lack of experience of their pilots. I would think at least $50,000 a year should be the minimum a pilot flying a commuter should be paid.

On edit:

Officials with Continental's regional carrier, Colgan Air Inc., acknowledged at the hearing that Shaw was paid about $23 an hour and had a salary of $16,254, although she could have earned more if she worked extra hours.

She previously had a second job working in a coffee shop.

Wonderful - my copilot might also have been my waitress!

The salary of the pilot, Capt. Marvin Renslow, who commuted from his home in Florida, was not disclosed during the proceedings. But Colgan said the average salary for its pilots is around $55,000.

Still low IMHO for a Captain piloting an aircraft that can carry 40+ passengers.

Hudson River hero pilot expressed concern
Just over 10 days after the crash, the pilot who guided his disabled passenger jet to a safe splash landing in New York's Hudson River in January told a U.S. congressional aviation committee the "untenable financial situation" for pilots and their families leaves him "worried about the future of the profession."

Sullenberger, who was hailed as a hero for his calm actions on Jan. 15 as pilot of US Airways Flight 1549, warned of "negative consequences" to the safety of the industry without experienced pilots, who have been forced to accept massive salary and pension cuts from airline companies focused on trimming costs.

"I do not know a single, professional airline pilot who wants his or her children to follow in their footsteps," Sullenberger told the committee at the time.

http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2009/05/13/buffalo-crash-probe051309.html

Captain Sully was sure speaking the truth!

Do you think that every doctor you meet in a hosptital is fully licensed and ready to hang out their own shingle or perhaps are some of them INTERNS or RESIDENTS?

How many lawyers are full partners in their firms from day one? There is a considerable apprenticeship in the law business as well even beyond professional licensing requirements.

On the job training is common practice in a lot of areas - including aviation.

The airline DID meet its requirements under the FARs regarding the requirements of the pilot and the copilot with room to spare. She was not required to hold an ATP to be copilot, just a commercial which she had. The captain was pilot in command, she was second in command.

And regarding "failing" Federal flight checks.. what the hell is that supposed to mean? It doesn't fit with any FAA definition I know about. There are requirements for BFR (biennial flight review which you really can't fail), medical exam requirements (6 months for ATP, 1 year for commercial, 2 or 3 years for private depending on age). There are requirements for IFR, 6 instrument procedures in 6 months which any airline pilot would satisfy on a weekly if not daily basis. I'm not aware of any other requirements - can you please be specific with what "Federal flight checks" means?

and FYI, there is NOT a shortage of pilots right now, there is a glut of pilots, raising salary would not bring you any better crews because there is such a surplus of them that the airlines are furloughing them.

The low salaries are a product of supply and demand. Airline travel has dropped off and the airlines can pick and choose their crews and cut the wages because there are more pilots than pilot's seats available.

The salaries quoted are pretty typical for regional commuter airlines, they are not low by any means.

Doug De Clue
FAA Licensed Private Pilot,
Bachelor of Aerospace Engineering, Georgia Tech
Orlando, FL

Sometimes DU can be a shoot first, ask question later site. But its also a place where people with actual knowledge can set the record straight for the armchair know-it-alls.

Thanks again!

Fatigue is one of the explanations offered on why Capt. Marvin Renslow and first officer Rebecca L. Shaw reacted as if they were startled when a stall warning sounded when they approached the Buffalo Niagara International Airport.

Meanwhile,

jet time is astronomical unless it is on the job training. (OJT).

Shouldn't the airlines be paying for the OJT? Having a plane full of 49 people, not to mention the one on the ground, their lives to OJT strikes me as, well, insane.

...shoving parts into a bandsaw or machining center amd pressing the "Start" button. I make considerably more than that annually even on my reduced 32-hours-per-week work schedule.


I don't even have to program the machining center. Just adjust or change the tools occasionally.



I'm licenced to drive a warehouse forklift, if that helps any.


And I'm flying in 8 days.




Shit. :-(