Why Pot Should Not Be Legalized in the USA

1. Government would legalize if and only if it could control all production.

2. Government would commission studies to determine the toxicity levels of THC.

3. Studies would show that the THC levels of marijuana are too high and would argue public policy dictates that decreasing the levels would keep its citizens safer.

4. Government production of marijuana hybrids with lower THC levels would begin.

5. Weakened marijuana would outrage the public.

6. The public would grow its own to have access to good weed.

7. Government would arrest and prosecute citizens growing marijuana, citing the danger of homegrown, high-THC level pot.

Is this nightmare scenario only in my head? Do I need to give the weed a rest?

I just had an image flash through my head:

A joint with a filter on it. Out of a pack. With a tax seal on it.

I clutch my bag of pretty bud, and run away ------------------------------------------------>

IF we do legalize, something would need to be done to keep Big Tobacco out of it.

with organic methods and no GM seed.

Big tobacco would run away.

themselves don't want it legal, ALL THEIR COMPLAINTS SUDDENLY MAKE MORE SENSE.

Amazing how that works out.

Legalization would affect their income. What they don't realize is that they'll also be able to make a good living by going legit.

Tridim, big corporations own this country. You and no one else is going to 'require' them to do shit. Commercial Cannabis would be as fucked up as a quarter pounder with cheese.

We can get it done any way we like if we remain engaged.

You have given up before we have even started. I can draw no other conclusion that you're a worthless citizen, at least on this issue. You're completely useless in our fight for freedom.

A worthless citizen? :cry:

None of which are a Quarter Pounder with Cheese. They have yet to close down the diners, I notice. And gee, thus far the cops have not tried to shut me down when I-gasp-cook my own lovely organic local cheeseburger. In fact, I see huge groups engaging in public grilling, almost all summer long.

and locally grown. They're made out of venison. :hi:

hehe... and the notion that corporations would fuck cannabis up more than drug cartels... or do you only buy from home-growers and medical-marijuana providers?

Growers would respond to market demand, especially from the older upscale stoners with disposable income("Doobie Dads" and "Mari Mamas", I suppose the pollsters could call them)that wanted a mellower buzz. If we can brew Bud Light, we can grow Light Bud.

for growing such sticky, fragrant and potent bud. I so miss the days of brown Mexican squashed into bricks. I miss all the seeds too. You knew your weed was "mature" by how brown the seeds were.

I'm wicha Cowboy. :sarcasm: as if it's needed.

I like my weed strong of course, but I also enjoy the smell and taste. I'd rather have a somewhat less potent weed that was a tasty smoke and that I could enjoy like a good cigar rather than getting totally blazed from a decent-size joint. When I lived in Amsterdam I was all over the super-sticky stuff at first, but after about 6 months I actually got kind of sick of it and switched to something milder.

Sometimes the strong stuff actually makes me a little sick. Maybe I'm just a pot pussy. (can I say that?

Besides it tastes to freakin' good! :)

It's like having a glass of whiskey to sip...I like whiskey but I don't pour one so I can get drunk fast, or I'd drink moonshine or one of those 60% vodkas. Similarly I don't like my pot so strong that toking a few times while watching a movie or reading makes me incapable of following the plot or holding a conversation. The nicest weed I've smoked was of medium strength but had great aroma etc. too, whereas some of the really strong varieties don't necessarily taste that great.

then I could give it to my elderly mother to stimulate her appetite and ease her pain.
Plus put a smile on her face.

That sounds just horrible.

so that the Mob and the cartels don't recoup their losses by pushing even uglier shit in neighborhoods of color as they did after Prohibition ended(see "The Godfather").

That deliberate Mafia decision to flood places like Harlem with hard drugs helped destroy the Harlem Renaissance and did horrible damage to Rainbow communities, I've always thought that the damage this did to the anti-segregation was a major reason J. Edgar Hoover and the FBI held the ridiculous position that there was no such thing as organized crime in the U.S.(a position they didn't reverse until 1962, IIRC). The Mob was doing what The Highest Racist Transvestite in the land wanted them to do.

Though I do think that, should weed be legalized, "corner boys" (to use the term from the Wire) should be allowed to add their time "slinging" weed to their resumes. In fact, I think that shops in any City with an "inner city" be given incentives to hire the corner boys to work the retail. For several years at least. In my experience, lots of the guys working the corners move mostly weed... but those who're happy to move crack, smack, and whatever else might come into their hands won't feel much interest in retail jobs. So, those who feel an interest in moving to the legit side should be given some encouragement.

Of course, my experience is with Oakland, and there's no significant Mafia presence there... so maybe the East Coast has a different set of priorities.

Bastards.

My head spins at the thought of Monsanto's advertising campaign

And Marlboro would make marijuana cancerous. Fuck those companies, grow your own.

They're not ripe yet.

Pot is not as dangerous as alcohol. You can make your own beer and wine so why not grow your own pot?

There will always be scientific studies to support your thesis.

Pharma Lobby rules. Big Pharma would be the one to really take a hit if pot becomes legal. They would lose a mess of sales on drugs for conditions and drugs for the side effects of drugs for conditions.

I'm not giving up.

Even if legislation was being advanced to legalize it.

From a poll last month.

And the pro-weed folks these days are very effective, like NORML, MPP and Rick Steves.

Some of the tight-bud red-haired stuff was just WAY too potent. One bong hit and you were too stupid to open a pack of Oreos - which is bad, given the circumstances.

They also started to lace weed with PCP (I suspect meth is the choice now) and you just knew it wasn't right - tasted funky. Regulating it and taxing it would at least keep it cleaner (don't even get me STARTED on tobacco products because I know those aren't clean), but it would be worth paying the tax to get a safer product. And growing tobacco is legal for personal use - I would expect the same for pot.

1. Production would be for profit by greedy corps.
2. Gov't wouldn't care because greedy corp lobbyists would tell them not to.
3. You'd have to pay more for the good stuff (no different than now)
4. No.
5. No.
6. Just like people grow tomatoes.
7. No.

Only in your dreams.

Government would certainly have a say in the quality of the weed. It would have to.

Perhaps the prosecution of home-growers is preposterous, but one never knows.

The grow like tomatoes line is generally used by spindly kids with three spindly seedlings swimming in potting mix and too much water.

And how many tomato plants are ripped off under cover of darkness?

How many tomato plants are ripped off under cover of darkness?

Got a number? Or is that just an attempt to cause speculation and distract people?

So what else is new?

:shrug:

Your first premise is unrealistic. Why would the government legalize it only if it could control all production? It's much more likely to be under corporate control.

But anyway, at worst, your scenario brings things full circle.

The industry would likely be private and not public.

I don't get the whole premise. Are you saying that if pot is legalized, it would just become a pain in the ass to get good stuff so we might as well keep it illegal?

It's 180 degrees out of whack. It makes no sense at all.

A friend of mine who's a brewing enthusiast is getting ready to do this as a part time business. I forget the exact #, but the paperwork needed to do so was somewhere less than $500. A few hundred for a grower's license (more than 10 plants or something) wouldn't be a crushing obligation.

8. Pfizer, Eli Lilly et al would lobby millions of dollars to get legislation passed that required all sellable MJ be produced via certified growers.


9. Pfizer, Eli Lilly et al would make sure these growers bought their patented seeds.


10. Pfizer, Eli Lilly et all would air wall-to-wall MJ commercials on TV, radio, and run magazine ads, giving people who still want to try to raise their children to be drug-free that much harder a time.

Really, I think these fears are rather overblown (even if not entirely serious).

Oh won't someone please think of the children? Well how about the kids that see their parents go to jail because they get caught with a couple of oz's?

:smoke:

If pot gets legalized then only the lazy will get shitty pot. You can grow excellent pot, it just takes a bit of effort. You can grow shitty weed by throwing all your seeds in your backyard. It is a WEED and it grows like one.

Nothing bad will come of legalization. And we are getting closer every year.

BTW if you are looking for something to do with your seeds for the time being, my friends and I used to throw ours on the lawn of the local police station ;)

I hated coughing up black shit. I'm on a break for a while but when I come back, it's vaporizing. The only smoke I like is incense.

Tobacco is a regulated and taxed product.

You can still grow your own and sell it.

Why would we assume that legalization of marijuana would be any different.

Most people just don't bother.

Please check out who already owns the rights to any production/marketing of any future legal cannabis.

You guessed it, the tobacco companies.

Just like the oil companies already have the rights for mass solar components sewed up in the US.

Did research in the 70s about how to purchase solar components wholesale. None were available in the US.

Australia and Japan had them flying off the shelf though.

Ain't life grand under the one corporate sky?


Just my dos centavos

robdogbucky

Unlike alcohol, which a test can be administered to show you are blasted at this moment, there is no test for MJ that shows one is under the influence. That makes it tough for the police state to bust you because they don't like your looks.

involving saliva on something that must be like a piece of litmus paper, that can be used to gauge whether you have ingested cannabis within eight hours (may be more or less, not 100% sure of the timescale).

Australian police rolled out random drug testing a couple of years ago. I believe there are similar tests used for amphetamines and possibly ecstasy.

Edit to add: Random for drivers only, like roadside blood-alcohol tests. Hell, if it was truly random, they would get me every time I walked down the street.

Of course the government is going to get involved, the only reason they would allow it is so they can make money. Even though they don't have the right to 'allow' us something we should already have, but that's another matter.

Alcohol comes in all strengths, and in a variety of types. You can get a beer (which you can legally make at home) to wine (which you can legally make at home) all the way up to Everclear (and they still make moonshine in Appalachia, it's illegal however). Whatever the market wants, that's what people will get.

I imagine it will be like tomatoes. You can go to the store and get the garden variety, sort of bland tomato, that just does the job, or you can grow your own tomatoes, or you can go to specialty stores and markets and get rare heirloom tomatoes. There will be Wal-mart marijuana and boutique marijuana.

Higher THC weed is not more dangerous, it's safer. You smoke less to get high, saving your lungs.

Ultimately, if your 'nightmare scenario' comes true, then all people will do is what we have now: growing it illegally. I suspect thought, that enforcement would become much less of a priority as society comes to accept weed. It might become like fishing without a license instead of this depraved act that gets you locked up with murderer and rapists. I'll take my chances with legalization, thank you.

a small scale for money or goods, it's unlikely you'll get nicked for taxes or business licenses.

why would pot be different?

as near as I can figure. One, is that it would be extremely hard for the government to regulate with an excise tax as they do tobacco and booze, because everyone would grow a plant or 12 in their closets, and two, because they would be admitting that their ENTIRE DRUG CONTROL POLICY IS WRONG, FLAWED, AND A COMPLETE FRAUD.

It has been stigmatized with what is still considered by republican oppressions since the 30's; as a 'rebellious' aside...leading to thoughts of 'up-starty-ness' and free thought or maybe even new, or dare I suggest: American Thoughts, hence, the allusion to 'jazz musicians', social revolutionaries, etc...control has always been where it was at for usurpers of freedom & liberty i.e. the denial of the pursuit of every other persons happiness but for they whom will deny it

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QZdhcNegZgU :kick:

for several reasons- it's not necessarily easy to grow, the smells can be pretty strong, and there are quantity issues- as harvest is not continuous.

Like myself, I have a handful of friends who are self sufficient in dope supplies. We all grow outdoors and you can become very efficient at it, learning how to maximise yield, depending on your environmental situation.

It's not particularly hard work, but you need to be methodical, observant, well organised and totally able to keep your mouth shut.

i used to grow it in containers when i lived in the city- but my neighbors were cool about it. but- i smoke A LOT of weed- and i couldn't grow enough in one season to last the whole year.

Fortunately most home and medical growers are very proud of their craft and produce the most potent and aromatic cannabis in the world.

I live in a med state, and have seen lots of legal gardens.

the vast majority of casual smokers are not going to want to be hassled with growing it themselves. and even a lot of the serious smokers won't have access to growing space.

That the drug control policy is wrong and flawed as it relates to prison.

So one down, one to go. That doesn't sound impossible.

to bother if I could just go a couple of blocks and buy it already prepared.

Here's a hint: criminalization is the most extreme form of government regulation that there is.

It's inevitable.

Fortunately it's not. Cannabis garderners are extremely passionate.

the market place is going to decide the direction that it needs to go. Note that toxicity studies have already been done on THC. The LD50 is absurd.

But, just to be clear - you'd rather support a system of mass incarceration that costs society billions a year and even more in the human costs to keep marijuana illegal - just so you can not have to worry about the government regulating it? Gotcha.

:smoke:

Preferring total decriminalisation.

With the rather innocent and naive presumption that clones or cuttings are a good and sustainable way to grow and that sensimilla (unfertilized female flower - therefore no seeds)is somehow superior to picking out seeds.

With these attitudes and legalisation, I predict that in a few decades seed would become scarce. There will always be diehards like myself who cultivate a sustainable crop each year, saving seed, introducing new varieties, but we will die out. The future of the noble weed will be totally encased in the iron fist of the corporatists.

Another thing, if legal, weed will be taxed just like booze and other legal drugs. It is not out of the question that home growers can ultimately be prosecuted for tax-evasion crimes.

Think this thing through to all the different conclusions and make a list of all the bad things that can happen in the long term. There is far more at stake than being able to get a hit for the weekend.

That's what I'd do.

that is the answer.

One of the main reasons people like Senator Webb want full legalization on the table.

With decrim the black market will continue and people who grow a few plants for their own consumption will continue to go to prison. We already have decrim in several states, and that's how it's shaking out.

Once it's legalized the states will likely have some say as to what's grown and who grows it. Secondly none of your nightmare scenarios are worse then what we already have. And lastly, there is nothing wrong with strong weed. If it's too strong smoke less or leave it alone. We shouldn't throw people in jail just because you prefer dirt weed.

Oh, look: Cheetohs!

That is the only way to ensure that you have a choice to grow your own or buy it from someone or business.

It's an herb. It should be treated as if it were carrots.

No debate, no taxes, no problems...B-)

You're arguing that if we legalize cannabis, through an unlikely sequence of events we reach point 7 which is no different than the status quo. Where's the harm in legalization then?

Luckily I have availed myself to another case study and the argument almost seems sound.

:)

You think being forced to take a smoking room in a hotel is bad now...

What a weird argument.