"Racialist". Two days ago, I'd never heard the term.

Today, this crazy old Nazi bastard Von Bruun, who should have been locked up, attacks the Holocaust Museum.

I read how one of his followers called him a "racialist".

Yesterday, I hear a clip of Newt Gingrich revising his assessment of Sonia Sotomayor from "racist" to "racialist, if you will".

So, I get it from these two guys in two successive days.

Had you heard of "racialists" before this week?

I sure hadn't.

... and I thought it was so funny how he was pronouncing racist.

But I've been hearing it a lot lately and was curious so looked it up in the dictionary and sure enough, it is a word meaning basically the same thing as "racist". Huh. I did not know that.

I can't remember who he was interviewing when he asked "Ain't dat a bit racialist?" I thought it was pretty damn funny when he said it, and a lot less funny when Lizard Gingrich said it.

and Newt using it should scare you... it does scare me.

It is part of the White Christian identity movement, a member of the group.

Did Newt know something we don't?

I just think it's a very weird coincidence that this would happen on back to back days. Or is it?

This didn't just "happen".

Do you have a link for this?

I believe in "force upon the plain" or something like that. The book details the militia movement in the US up to the 1990s

Link to book

http://www.amazon.com/Force-upon-Plain-American-Movement/dp/0806129263

There is a lot of material on this and you can find it

"Race Over Grace: The Racialist Religion of the Christian Identity Movement"

http://www.amazon.com/Race-Over-Grace-Racialist-Christian/dp/0595281974

perhaps now people will start to get it, we have an insurgency...

That helps tie it together.

So, Newt is sending coded messages to the extreme right base?

That's what this looks like.

He, Hannity, Rush, and the rest:

"I'm a White Corporatist Racist"

I mean, you see it and I see it... :shrug:

racial code and white identity code for years... if not decades by now.

Why I shake head whenever I see blacks and hispanics join the party...

standard American Academic English

Possibly, the book is more of a critical expose. "Race OVER grace" :shrug:

Book excerpts here:

http://books.google.com/books?id=w2O7KUOIcO0C&pg=PP1&lpg=PP1&dq=Race+Over+Grace:+The+Racialist+Religion+of+the+Christian+Identity+Movement&source=bl&ots=TxRAqbDsYE&sig=V7aX-EyliBWJXFBsiJ_CJZ94wsE&hl=en&ei=m3EwSsyTJYSKtAPTlKXKAw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1#PPA85,M1

"Race Over Grace
Race over Grace is a fascinating, critical look at a religion on the margins of modern American culture: the Christian Identity Movement. Embraced as truth by some in militia and far-right racialist groups, and by others not politically involved, Christian Identity is supported by advocates who promote such disturbing beliefs as the Jews being the literal offspring of Satan and that only Caucasians may go to heaven. In this book, Reformed scholar and pastor Dr. Charles H. Roberts examines the historical underpinnings of the movement and its better known exponents, past and present. He provides the reader with a uniquely Biblical, Reformed, evangelical analysis of the major doctrines of the movement."

The loops of logic she must pass through are not followed by her offspring.

the world view is actually, and scarily so, internally consistent. I did some research for a novel years ago... novel never saw the light of day... but the things I learned while dong the research are scary and amazing

racialist - a person with a prejudiced belief that one race is superior to others

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/racialist

I think racist is the more common word. Not sure where this one came from but it just sounds stupid. But maybe I am just ignorantalist.

That makes you an educationalist.

:)

:P

They have a far deeper use and depth of understanding of the English language. At least that's my experience listening to them.

They say "alluminium". Obviously not the way it's spelt.

Then again, I ain't no linguist, so what do I know?

I mean, the spelling of the word and the pronunciation have a different number of syllables. What gives?

Most metals end in "-ium". I once found a good online description of the difference, but I don't remember where now. Google/Bing for the two names would probably find it.

Why don't they spell it that way then?

Weird.

on edit: ok, I just looked up "aluminium" and it is the British version of "aluminum". So, I realize what you were saying. The brits do spell it how they say it.

whew! Glad we got that all worked out. :)

Sorry for wasting your time.... :)

use than American, but means the same as racist.

then again I am a dumb shitalist

Artists oil paint while running marathons. They tried to get it added to the Olympics but failed when acrylicists demanded entry, also. Olympicists said thanks but no thanks.

:crazy:

They make up words that sound "sciency" to conceal the hate. It's protective camouflage. If you don't know the source, it's easy to miss the subtext.

But they also use it to appear "reasonable" and suck in the unsuspecting. No one wants to seem uncouth, so if you have hateful views it's easier to sell them to people under a "credible" guise.

See: The Human Biodiversity Institute. It sounds like an interesting group on the surface, but it's actually a RW eugenics think-tank. http://www.tsroadmap.com/info/human-biodiversity.html Think "The Bell Curve".

The fact that they call themselves "think tanks" is enough to make Orwell spin in his grave, much less the name they design for themselves.

Without a complicit M$M, they'd have been toast during St. Ronnie's tenure.

Never have we needed our fifth estate to call "bullshit" as much as we do now, at a time when you can count the number of real journalists on one hand.

I found the term used quite often in regard to a number of New England tribes, their histories, their attempts to gain federal recognition, and the attempts to oppose those tribes.

I can't quote exactly a single example and it's unlikely I can look them up. But trust me, there's plenty damned enough of it in the historical record.

One argument which has come up more than once is a "racialist" argument against a tribe being Indian. Some New England tribes did not share the European infatuation with phenotype, and freely allowed escaped slaves and freemen to marry into the tribe. Over time, some tribal descendants now carry mostly African features.

In every New England recognition case, invariably, some wise guy has to argue that because the tribal members no longer look Indian, they have somehow lost their "Indianness," or some poop. Those arguments always get tossed early because the federal government long ago put the race issue to bed, preferring instead to track a group's political and social histories and requiring only proof of descent from an original tribe to satisfy the genetic component.

But there's no damned doubt in my mind that racialism used to count for a lot. Beginning in the early 20th Century, a great number of New England tribes had schisms in which the "white" Indians attempted to disenroll the "black" Indians. The reason why is readily apparent in the contemporary accounts, in which the governmental authorities lament the mongrelization of the once noble savages, and similar patronizing bull crap, all the while making sure the tribal members are non-citizens and dirt poor. Back then, and I suppose even today, some wish to believe that poverty, indolence, and ignorance are genetically transferable traits, rather than the unfortunate byproducts of the racial prejudice the authorities themselves were practicing.

(yes, Virginia, there are dictionaries printed on paper)

Racialism = 1. a doctrine or teaching, without scientific support, that claims to find racial differences in character, intelligence, etc., that asserts the superiority of one race over another or others, and that seeks to maintain the supposed purity of a race

Racialist is one who adheres to these teachings, etc

Racism = sense 1 is the same as racialism, with racist being one who follows those teachings

I take this to mean that racism and racialism are nearly interchangeable, as are racist and racialist. I would imagine that one segment of society might prefer to use one term over the other, much as some people would say “faux outrage” rather than “false outrage” or “uber intelligent” rather than “over”

Societies fuck up words sometimes, or I should say, take a fucked up word and run with it. For example, "normalcy". It was supposed to be "normality" but some Pres said it in a speech (Coolidge, Wilson, Hoover, I dunno...I forget) and wallah, it's a word! Another one is "athleticism." N'uch thing. Made up. But people use it. And soon enough it'll be a real word just like "racist" or "normalcy."

but the word at discussion here is currently code

I was just kinda explaining that I'd heard it before and that I sorta knew where it came from, even though the details I remember from a high school lesson 30+ years ago are a tad sketchy.

it is fun to see how language evolves.

We used to have a dictionary from 1914 around the house somewhere, and some type of Montgomery Wards catalog from back in the days of telegraph. I've also got a book somewhere on my shelf by Steven Pinker called something like Words & Rules, or The Rules of Words. Language evolution is fascinating stuff.

Heretofore my most common experience with the term was in an academic setting.

The term "racialist" is sometimes used rather than "racist" to describe an individual who, for whatever reason, believed the concept of "race" was inherent, i.e. not socially constructed, and classified humans according to race as though it were a natural biological classification. A racialist might or might not be a racist, i.e. one who believes in the inherent superiority of one race over another.

As an example, Ivan Hannaford uses the term in this manner in _Race: The History of an Idea in the West_.

Clearly that is not how the term is being used here except in the context of using it rather than the term "racist."

Don't you read the other responses before giving the stupid knee-jerk reaction that dozens of others have made?

You sometimes see it used also as a "softer" term out of concern for "civility" (which folks can definitely overdo).

Okay, any fool can look up the word "racialist" online. Do y'all think I didn't know that before?

No fool, rosesaylavee provided this answer in post #3: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=5822877&mesg_id=5822903

Wow, posters seem to assume that we haven't heard of Google.

Many posters want to inform me that it's British. Big fucking deal. Does the average goob who listens to hate radio know or care?

The point, which should be OBVIOUS to anyone reading my original post is,

1) Newt Gingrich calls Sotomayor a "racialist", and
2) The next day, a "racialist" attacks the Holocaust Museum!

Insert Tab A into Slot B.

Lather, Rinse, Repeat.

Sit, Stay, Treat.

Come on, DU, you can do better.

suggests that maybe it wasn't expressed very well. Most of these answers seem like perfectly reasonable responses to your original message. When you say "it SHOULD be obvious"—well, evidently it wasn't, or so many people wouldn't have responded in a way that caused you to be so irritated with the glaring shortcomings of the rest of us. Get over yourself.

See my post below. Modern popular racist language from the likes of Limbaugh, Beck, Hannity, Savage, etc. would have elicited swift condemnation 30 years ago when I was a teenager and most of the U.S. was struggling to accommodate the civil rights movement. They've managed to turn "dog-whistle" speech into standard discourse.

The word "racialist", when used by separatists is meant to present a reasonable face to racism. That is, "I'm okay and you're okay as long as we don't share the same breathing space." I think that Newt purposely used the term to broaden its usage beyond the white separatist subculture, to propel it into the common vernacular. If racists like Newt (and we must remember that it was Newt that turned "liberal" and a host of other liberal associations into dirty words) can successfully brand Sotomayor as a "racialist" even a few percentage points beyond the usual bottom feeders and a "racialist" that garners liberal support, then he succeeds in promoting the white separatists agenda. Think of "racialist" as the 21st century's equivalent dog-whistle to "state's rights."

I agree.

It will be interesting and dismaying if we see an increase of the term. Years ago Michael Moore had an extremely loosely moderated political discussion board that was invaded by "separatists". Their main course of action was to appeal to ethnic pride. It was really quite insidious but, sadly, worked on a small number of people. In most cases that small number of people did not agree with the solutions presented by the racialists, but, wrongly ended up acknowledging and admiring the reasonableness of their argument.

I am interested in how this "dog-whistle" speech gets into the discourse.

Here is a recent example of moving the concept of racialism from the confines of the white separatist movement into the mainstream and trying to make the "left" own it.

http://corner.nationalreview.com/post/?q=MTJlM2RhYzNmNGJmNGM1NjFhYjlhYTA5ZTJmYmE3NmE=

Is that expressed well enough? Can you understand that?

I've never even seen or heard from you, anonymous unprofiled poster.

Brave words, idiot.

effort to inform you, because of these words in the OP - your words:

"Had you heard of "racialists" before this week?

I sure hadn't."

You say you had not heard the word, some of us have. Save your "faux" outrage (that's false, in case you haven't heard of that one,)

Lighten up, Francis.

edited to add: definition in my post #35, pasted here for you

Racialism = 1. a doctrine or teaching, without scientific support, that claims to find racial differences in character, intelligence, etc., that asserts the superiority of one race over another or others, and that seeks to maintain the supposed purity of a race

Racialist is one who adheres to these teachings, etc

Racism = sense 1 is the same as racialism, with racist being one who follows those teachings

I take this to mean that racism and racialism are nearly interchangeable, as are racist and racialist. I would imagine that one segment of society might prefer to use one term over the other, much as some people would say “faux outrage” rather than “false outrage” or “uber intelligent” rather than “over”

Separatists try to legitimize their racism by promoting the ideology of white pride as equal to black pride. The distinction being that the "races" can only be "proud" when separate from each other.

A racist is one who elevates one "race" above another. A racialist recognizes that each "race" has the potential to prosper only amongst their own kind. This is, of course, a slight of hand intended to give the white racist separatist movement a sense of equilibrium... i.e., "You're as good as me, except when you live next door to me."

The white separatist movement use the term "racialist" as an equivalent to "ethnic pride" and have been insinuating its usage into common lexicon as an appeal to all bigots of any ethnicity.

:eyes:

Naturally, I let PBS know.

Look for more of these coded messages in the months ahead.

sign me up for that, plz