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Pat Buchanan: Christian monarchy is fine with me

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dorkulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 06:19 PM
Original message
Pat Buchanan: Christian monarchy is fine with me
Just saw this exchange on Hardball. Pat can be so smart sometimes it's easy to forget what a nut he really is, so I thought I'd post this little reminder.

The subject is Iran. Pat starts out well, endorsing Obama's handling of the strife in Iran (for some in GD-P, this makes him better than Maddow or Olbermann). Joan Walsh says how great it is that Dems and Repubs all agree on the importance of democracy. Chris hears an opportunity to needle Pat on his latent fascism.

Chris Matthews: I don't want to let Pat off the hook. Could it be that Wolfy, Wolfowitz, one of the real intellectuals of the neocon school, that you normally disagree with and I disagree with on military policy, could be right about the ideology they hold that there is an incipient democracy in the Middle East and that we ought to tap it? Are they right more now than they were a week ago?

Pat Buchanan: I think in the Middle East, everybody in the Middle East would like to vote for their own leaders. In Iran, that is pro-American but in Saudi Arabia, in Egypt, I'll tell you, the pro-American governments would go down and you would get the Muslim Brotherhood, and another Iran in Saudi Arabia.

CM: And we'd have to live with it. And that's why you Pat Buchanan, although you are a libertarian in many ways, you do not--no, you're a nationalist actually--you are not what you like to call, derisively, a democratist.

PB: No, I don't believe there's a great salvation in a political process at all. I believe in different--in far different things. I put democracy far down the line in the--I think a devoutly Christian, conservative traditionalist country, even if it's a monarchy, is fine with me.

CM: Your Franco is talking, Pat. Franco is speaking even now.

PB: Well he was better than the alternative, Chris.


So, for Buchanan, the only problem with theocracy in Iran is that it's the wrong religion being used to oppress people.

One thing I noticed was that Buchanan was gone from the airwaves last week, when Von Brunn and Roeder had sparked a nationwide discussion of domestic right wing terrorism. He was gone from MSNBC and The McLaughlin Group. Normally I can't turn on my TV without seeing the old cracker. I wonder what he would have said had he been on. I wonder if that's why he wasn't on.

I understand why Buchanan gets this kind of work--he has been articulating conservative arguments better than nearly anyone else for decades, and he doesn't just shout his opponents down, but considers their points and responds intelligently, not with dumb name-calling. But his beliefs are a lot more extreme than most Republicans, and now here he is pretty much coming out in favor of a Christian theocratic revolution. I don't know, I guess I should be used to it, but this seems like a pretty serious thing for him to say. What if Rush said it? What if Cheney said it? Why does Pat get away with it?
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Warpy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 06:22 PM
Response to Original message
1. Why doesn't this POS just move to the UK?
Northern Ireland especially is beckoning, although I dislike siccing another witless right wing Proddy onto them.

I hope his ancestors are haunting him.
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LeftishBrit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 06:28 PM
Response to Reply #1
8. Thanks but No Thanks!!!
We've got enough neo-fascists of our own, thank you very much!

Northern Ireland already had to suffer Paisley and the Provos; it doesn't deserve Pat.


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underpants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 06:23 PM
Response to Original message
2. Conservatives by nature at least implicitly believe in the divine right of kings
Liberal Democracy means that the right to govern is consented by the people
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dorkulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 06:25 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. To be fair, he's pretty much right about Egypt and Saudi Arabia.
Democracy there would put Wahabbi extremists in power, and they really are just the pits.
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burning rain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 06:49 PM
Response to Reply #4
11. The al-Saud have been very blunt....
that Osama bin Laden could win a democratic election there.
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dorkulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 07:06 PM
Response to Reply #11
18. And we'd still buy oil from him. nt
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madaboutharry Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 06:24 PM
Response to Original message
3. The media sees him like the "crazy old aunt" because of
his undeniable charm. And he is charming. But he is also a fascist, and for that the media has failed by allowing him to have a platform.
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dorkulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 06:27 PM
Response to Reply #3
6. At least MSNBC's "Colmes" isn't a total wuss.
I give them credit for not picking a David Brooks type to be their "Republican" shill.
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CTyankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 06:26 PM
Response to Original message
5. I take it, from his statement, that he would NOT have been a supporter of our American revolution?
England under the reign of George III was undoubtedly a Christian monarchy.

So much for Pat the patriot...
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dorkulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 06:28 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. Almost definitely not, I'd guess.
He also thinks WWII should have been avoided and Hitler could have been "contained."
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CTyankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 06:31 PM
Response to Reply #7
9. My example and yours really makes me wonder why he is given any respect whatsover
by the MSM.
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dorkulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 06:40 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. He's just a good debater.
A master-debater, even. :hide:
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CTyankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 06:56 PM
Response to Reply #10
12. Well, he WAS. I don't think, at his age, he could do it again
even if he wanted to...:rofl:
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rpannier Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 06:56 PM
Response to Reply #5
13. Probably not
George III was rather anti-Catholic
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dorkulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 06:58 PM
Response to Reply #13
14. Good point. Pat wants a CATHOLIC monarchy.
He should be more specific.
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undeterred Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 06:59 PM
Response to Original message
15. The married white fundamentalist Christian heterosexual male
can be pretty delusional if he's given too long a leash.
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madokie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 07:00 PM
Response to Original message
16. I'll be happy to see him no more
what a work pat pukecannon is, I'm series!!!!!bigtime!!
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dorkulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-19-09 03:42 AM
Response to Reply #16
34. 'pukecannon' lol


:rofl:
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 07:03 PM
Response to Original message
17. Wasn't that mind-blowing
Pat is a fascist.
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dorkulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 07:10 PM
Response to Reply #17
19. Definitely.
I couldn't believe how--well, how honest that was. Also, I was genuinely surprised he would say that--and I thought I knew Pat.
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LeftishBrit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 07:13 PM
Response to Original message
20. Franco was 'better than the alternative'?
Wow just wow (but I could have expected this, as he has defended LePen in the past).
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dorkulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-19-09 07:27 PM
Response to Reply #20
36. I know
anything but socialism! :crazy:
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chollybocker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 07:24 PM
Response to Original message
21. Generalissimo Francisco Franco is still dead.
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dorkulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 07:54 PM
Response to Reply #21
27. But his spirit lives on...
:hide:
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Mari333 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 07:26 PM
Response to Original message
22. kookaburra sits in the old gum tree
yep, thats Pat. koookooooo
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Droogie666 Donating Member (73 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 07:28 PM
Response to Reply #22
23. Who Cares
What that loser thinks?
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votingupstart Donating Member (535 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 07:29 PM
Response to Original message
24. hes an idiot... do we really expect anything different........ nt
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Dr Fate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 07:29 PM
Response to Original message
25. He should buy some shitty little island and start a Christian Kingdom then.
Edited on Thu Jun-18-09 07:30 PM by Dr Fate
Maybe we could help him raise the funds, and send his fellow travelers along with him...
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dorkulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 07:43 PM
Response to Reply #25
26. There's already one in Florida.
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donco6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 08:00 PM
Response to Original message
28. Surely he's read about Calvin's Geneva.
There is no such thing as "a" Christian. There are many different types. And when one is empowered, the others HATE him. Just like Islam, and any other religion with many sects.
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dorkulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 08:02 PM
Response to Reply #28
29. Blasphemy! BURN THE HERETIC!
:spank:
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donco6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 08:03 PM
Response to Reply #29
30. Drowning in Lake Geneva was the preferred method.
But there was some burning too. Gotta keep all the various torturers employed, I guess.

Really, the Calvinists loved to "baptise" the Anabaptists PERMANENTLY. Such Christian love!
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dorkulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 08:12 PM
Response to Reply #30
31. They were only following orders.
It's not their fault Anabaptists need to be killed.

I think Calvin is Pat's kind of guy.
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fishwax Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 08:13 PM
Response to Original message
32. "Your Franco is talking"
:rofl:

"Well he was better than the alternative, Chris."
:scared:
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dorkulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 08:18 PM
Response to Reply #32
33. I'd like to kick him right in the Franco
:spray:
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Vidar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-19-09 06:03 AM
Response to Original message
35. Forward into the past!
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woo me with science Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-19-09 07:28 PM
Response to Original message
37. Great timing on this, too.
How's theocracy working for Iran?
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dorkulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-19-09 08:23 PM
Response to Reply #37
39. Ah, but that's not a CHRISTIAN theocracy.
That's the problem.
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NC_Nurse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-19-09 07:33 PM
Response to Original message
38. Great! Move to one, Pat. See ya...
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-19-09 08:38 PM
Response to Original message
40. Drop "Christian" and I'd bet there are plenty who would agree with him.
I've suspected for a couple of decades now that a large amount of Americans would be perfectly content in a monarchy.
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AsahinaKimi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-19-09 08:55 PM
Response to Original message
41. "Christian monarchy is fine with me"
Edited on Fri Jun-19-09 08:55 PM by AsahinaKimi
I really think the Fundies are jealous that some countries in the Middle East are run as a theocracy. IF some new country sprung up with a Christian Monarchy or as a Christian Theocracy would they pack up and flock from this country to go there?

Then again, trying to change the United States into a Christian Nation is still pretty much a goal
of some people in this country.
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Zomby Woof Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-19-09 09:11 PM
Response to Original message
42. To say that Franco was better than the alternative
:puke: Is to deny the brutality and repression of that fascist POS's reign.

It may be out of print, but an imporatnt Spanish history book on my shelf is "The Franco Years: The Untold Human Story of Life Under Spanish Fascism" by Jose Yglesias. The author is like a Spanish Studs Terkel, interviewing ordinary people who survived those years, and uncovering what they endured.

Buchanan is a Nazi, and that is not a term I use lightly, a la a discussion board epithet.
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dorkulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-19-09 09:57 PM
Response to Reply #42
43. He needs to grow a little moustache
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