I say we ask the protesting seniors at these Town Halls to turn in their Medicare cards.

These nuts are parading around with signs about Socialism and Communism -- and Don't Let the Government Touch My Healthcare .... I think they should be asked to put up or shut up. If they feel so strongly about Socialism, and don't want the government involved in their healthcare they should have the courage of their nutty convictions and give it up. They should be good free-marketeers and go out into the insurance market and buy some health coverage ... with all their freaking preexisting conditions!

And all the rest of those reichwingers should never ever sign up for Social Security or Medicare when they reach the age of eligibility. I know some who have railed against both for years. If they really understand and believe what they say, they shouldn't take the money. I say we ask for their "Socialized Medicine Membership Cards" at these meetings.

And tell them they need to stay off the "socialized" roads on the way home too.

Seriously! We should do this every time we hear a senior complain about it. I want to hear their response (which will likely be in the form of stunned silence).

Into the system and deserve coverage. You would do well to remember that they are correct.

The elderly are worried that there will be rationing (which Obama has admitted) and they will be given a pain pill instead of a new hip.

They have a right to worry about their futures and you should not be so narrow minded as to think that they should forfeit what they paid for and have a right to receive.

We need a debate, not angry dismissal of those who have concerns.

They need to be awakened to the fact that they LOVE their government-run healthcare system. Wake fucking UP!

I am young enough, though, that I will likely never see Medicare as a benefit when I am that age. Hopefully, we will have single payer by then. I am glad to have been able to help them foot their medical bills only to have them be ungrateful.

And both of them have been drawing social security and medicare for over 20 years. Neither thought they'd ever see a dime.

and eligible for social security disability, you will be eligible for medicare no matter how old you are. i started collecting disability at age 49. i have chosen to remain on my husband's insurance because the coverage is better right now.

in other words, a cumulative total of 10 years.
this means those who are quite young and have not put in enough time paying in are not eligible.

I'm not sure it's works like that. What if the parent is blind and has a child
that is also blind. Both possibly have never worked. I think they both get
SS disability. My son is deaf and his children are hearing, but they all get
SS disability checks.

that is paid to people like my brother, who has Down syndrome and has collected it since he was young, and based on financial need.




As opposed to SS Disability:

But so have I. Those railing against healthcare reform want social security to fail. I know, my own mother is one of these "concerned" elderly folk. What she really is is a disillusioned fool who has watched FOX news for too long. Believe me, she's not "correct" about anything. She'd certainly love all future generations to forfeit what they paid for and have a right to receive. So I'm not gonna think twice over suggesting she take her own medicine.

sign carrying swastika waving - and you act like they are open to debate???

huh?

However, it is a socialistic program which is what these people are against. I don't think anyone expects that any of these people will give up what they are entitled to, but it does point out their hypocrisy to them and that maybe, just maybe, some of them will think about it in a different light.

The matter is not taking away something people have paid for. The matter is demonstrating the hypocrisy of those who say "no government health care" while they are receiving exactly that through Medicare and/or Medicaid. If there is a government system of any kind which we use, we have all paid into it. The point is demonstrating that a lot of these people are protesting against the very concept they actually love in practice.

But let's keep in mind it was always the Republicans that supported Medicare cuts.

Obama never said he wanted to ration care.

and ask questions, raise concerns, and allow others to do the same. But, they're not saying they "have concerns". They're saying they want the government to stay out of health care. I say we give 'em what they want.

No more medicare for you!

Every single paycheck they take money out of MY paycheck for THEIR Medicare. You don't see me bitching, yet the ungrateful wretches at the townhalls think I don't deserve Medicare as well in return for my payments. I would GLADLY cough up the premiums they do and get what they get medical care wise.

worked for pay a day in their lives. I know, because my church is full of these. Women didn't work outside the home in their day. Thus, they never paid into medicare or Social Security, and their husbands didn't really pay in enough to cover them. So, the "I paid in" argument doesn't fly.

And Medicare and Social Security both make use of funds being paid in now to cover current expenses. We're supporting them, they're getting government health care. They should shut up.

:eyes:

Then they are supported by the rest of us. Many seniors now, especially women, never had the income or job longevity to have contributed much to social security. They still collect. That one of them questions "socialized medicine" is ludicrous. We are all taking care of each other. If they have a problem, I'm in agreement with OP. Don't collect. Get OFF SS -- use your own funds for daily living, see how long that works.

When did Social Security enter into the discussion?

what is the eligibility requirement for Medicare? age alone? or is their a "work credit" aspect to that as well?

by dragging SS into the picture.

I just went over to medicare.gov to look for the answer to this question.



Everybody is "eligible" for Medicare at age 65, but only those who meet the same requirement for collecting SS, i.e., 10 years of paying into the system, can get it without paying.

Good work on this thread, btw. Really. It's clarified things SO very much. :sarcasm:

The whole POINT of the fucking thread was about those who are eligible due to age. :eyes:

Fucking hell.

If they wanted to "debate" anything, they wouldn't be shouting down those people trying to debate it.

Please provide a quote from the President stating that rationing would mean seniors would get a pain pill instead of a hip replacement. I eagerly await your response.

Seniors retired now, on Medicare or SS are getting their bills paid by those of us still working, and paying the taxes. There is no way they ever paid in enough to cover their costs.

You have no understanding as to how the system works.

before they come running back for help. :eyes:

It's funny my mother is on eof those always blasting social security and big government and blathering about socialism. But I once asked her if she returned her social security checks to voice her disapproval. She hung up on me and didn't talk to me for a year. :o)

See social security and medicare is for them....but not for their children or grandkids. THAT would be socialism.

It sucks not being on good terms with my mom. She doesn't even know my kids. But I know her mother would disapprove of her behavior. Grammy loved FDR and was a democrat through and through.

are not a needs based program. She can hate everything about the Federal Government. That does not matter, she paid into the system therefore she is entitled to the benefit regardless of her views.

her husband worked. She's collecting his benefits. I know how ss works. She thinks it is socialist like everything in the government. She likes to complain about it, but it doesn't stop her from collecting it. Even worse is my Dad's sister (another teabagger) who has lived off of welfare and food stamps her whole life. Both these women are complete f'ing idiots. Dropouts. You're not going to get anywhere attempting to reason with them.

It's pretty sad that people here so easily swallow and regurgitate RW talking points... they could at least say 'thank you' when someone helps them out.

And it's a government-administered program. They need to stop bitching about government health care or stop using medicare.

from the TYRANNY of socialized medicine!

it would be "celebrating freedom" from Statists and Communism!

Health Care industry telling them to do it. After all, they'll do anything for their health care industry!

That would kill two birds with one stone. End a socialistic program and wipe out the deficit. Should make pukes incredibly happy. Damn, I should have been a politician.

:applause:

Most of them don't even have their cards any more.

"Social Security and Medicare are govvermint-run programs"

Other signs could ask the question, "Who do you think runs Medicare and Social Security?"

I don't know. It's hard to say how to get factual information into their thick skulls.

The country is being divided, young against old, black against white, Right Wing against everyone, etc.

Don't play into it. All elderly people are not Republicans, nor are they stupid. Many of them were in the streets protesting during the Viet Nam War. Yes, there are some damn fools in that age bracket, and there are many damn fools in your age bracket. Don't make this a fight between generations. And don't paint everyone of a certain age as ignorant.

If you do you are playing right into the Republican plan.

Patiently explain to those who appear confused and stupid concerning health care. If they continue to act like morans, at least you've done your part by trying to give them facts. Even if they appear to be deaf to information, maybe it will impress them enough calm them down and make them think. Don't allow the Republican extremists to manipulate you.

....and also hand them generic applications for private pay insurance along with a cost per month print out.

:hi:

but one has to realize that since the "break," for more time to "discuss," the healthcare options in Town Hall meetings requested by the Rethugs during an August "recess," so that the 1,000 page draft bill would not be passed immediately (I think the Dems have enough votes to do that, with extreme pressure on some blue hounds), we have been in the PR battle that they hoped would buy them time to muster suppport to defeat it.

I visit another board, a college sports board actually, that has political threads, and it has all the usual suspects that have come out of the woodwork since last November, now heeling to all the drumbeats issued by the reactionary right, foaming at the mouth in exploitation of the Town Hall situation, citing "ironies," of how now the Dems/left are squawking when they, the Pubs/reactionaries, dare to voice their dissent. They take pains to trot out the pics of the disrupters being normal joes, bringing their kids to the TH, etc. They claim they are no different than anti-war protestors, you know the ones that are called traitors when they exercise their 2A rights, yet were confined to the FS zones since the Bushies decided free speech in the form of protest would not be appropriate in a time of "war," etc. That is why they seized upon the St. Louis incident, by the time the facts are exposed a couple of news cycles are dominated by the breathless reporting of an "innocent," black man being beat up by union thugs, it will be on to another manufactured outrage that serves their purpose of defeating any meaningful healthcare reforms.

Their response to pointing out the irony of many of the nutters being of SS and Medicare age is countered by them citing that they have the most to lose, hence, they have the biggest reason to be "discussing," these reforms. I doubt pointing out to them the ironies of being critical of systems they currently rely upon will gain much traction. They have thought this through and this is how they are responding to that. Remember that to many of them this is just a game being played with only the thought of "winning," that game being the only thing that matters. Not the well-being and future of our nation's healthcare.

How convenient that all of that concern for loyalty and security for the Pres is thrown out the window when the Pres is a Dem and he has a peaceful agenda and is merely trying to improve the lot of everyday Americans in accord with the original principles this nation was founded upon. Not to mention the threat against his life due to blatant racism. Too bad there are such powerful lobbyist groups still controlling the legislative process here and that they can mount such a PR battle against folks' interests and even enlist them in the cause.

Make no mistake about this, they are prepared for this PR battle and have unlimited resources to wage it and now the heat will be turned up. They really don't care if one of their nutters goes off and attempts to act out for a place in history. We sure have seen enough volunteers reacting to the "dog whistle," of racial hatred and deep-seated fears of "socialism," etc.

Don't lose our collective cool. I think the policy of continuing exposure of the nutters is the best antidote, but the psy ops is in full swing, don't be suckered or fooled into over-reacting or of getting off-message. We all have some skin in this game and unfortunately those that are perpetrating the quasi-violence in "dissent," in the form of "discussions," against the proposed reforms are brainwashed by the agit prop and their own fears to continue this fight that they view as saving their way of life. If they only could wake up.

I'm afraid that I am afraid to leave my computer today for fear of missing something, as this is getting hairy out there and I don't think they will desist until some real harm is done. In that regard their program is working out. Let's hope the Pres and his strategy of giving them enough rope and being honest about what his proposed program actually contains can prevail. Our nation's future health depends on it. Please pray for our Pres to be safe.

Just my dos centavos

robdogbucky

It would be good if someone made up some standard forms to bring. I saw one on another thread, it started out with "Citizens Against Government Run Healthcare" or something like that, and then it went on to state that the signers were against it, and therefore were going to refuse (or turn in their cards for) Medicare, Medicaid, SSI and the like.

K&R

If they don't like government-funded health care, fine. Medicare goes right off the fucking table, since it is also -- according to their definition -- Communist and Socialist.

How ya like them apples, Grandma and Grandpa????