The Real Health Care Fight: Those who have Insurance v Those who Don't

Having watched the Health Care Debate(?) I am fast reaching
the conclusion that the real fight going on here is a battle
of those have versus those who do not.

Sure they pick up on some issue(the more shocking the better)
--the "death panels" or the government will be killing Granny.
This may lead to socialism(most of those screaming this could
not even give a real description of socialism).

For people to "take to the streets" they must really be threatened
or better still feel they are losing something.

Going back in my memory to point of change and the RWers took
to the street. There were polls indicating the great majority
of Americans have some type of Health Insurance. All of a sudden
Americans love their Health Care so said the polls.

Since there is nothing definite to tell people what the new plan
is going to provide or take away. Those with Insurance have
been stricken with the fear---what will happen to my Health Care
Insurance. Am I willing to give up some of benefits to help
others? Let us be honest, no redblooded American is willing
to have something taken from them in a blind situation. Emotions
take over and Imaginations go wild.

We now have a fight---Those who have versus those who do not have.
The GOP are better at understanding Americans at a gut level.
The RWers are out to defend themselves. It would not surprise
me for there to be Democrats among them.

I am not saying they are right or wrong, just making an observation.

I've been on the receiving end of the crimes of the for-profit insurance criminals.

I know a LOT of people who have insurance who feel the same way I do.

informed and we are liberals. The average American does
not even know what Single Payer is.

No plan has been discussed with the American People.
No real sell of Health Care Reform has been put out there.

The Republicans have picked pieces from the various plans
and have been permitted to demonize any Health Care Reform.

I include myself. Liberals never seem to know how to sell
anything. They assume everyone knows and understands what
they are saying.

Activists sing to the choir. You have to get out in the country
and talk to everyday Americans.

The biggest mistake has been not having the Democratic Party
all on one page with one plan before the American People
had the chance to become frightened and angry. Ready to block
anything because they fear they will have things taken to give
to others.

Single-Payer supporter

NOBODY is answering the premium question.

What if you have stage 4 tragicsoapoperadisease? Will you be covered? You clearly WON'T be working, although you may have non-poverty income on LT disability. Will your premium be different than a young healthy adult? Will you get treatment if you can't afford your premium?

This is not a dramatic question. The cost of health insurance for people that use it or need it the most is not much different than the cost of health care itself. I have not seen this part addressed by either side.

Are there level premiums? Does the government plan on charging a different rate for smokers vs. non-smokers? Okay that was dramatic. Because it implies that the government has a vested interest now in testing non-smokers for nicotine by-products. Excuse me, lab that has the nicotine by-product test has a vested interest in getting the government to pay for their test.

We're not answering these questions because we're a bit like ostriches when it comes to the facts. The idea is not the best idea; a good start maybe, but by god we better know the answer before people start getting boosted from private insurance.

over a longer time period.

that can't imagine themselves having to share.

They want to have YOURS too!
Share?! You would have me, a good Kreestian Share anything?!
We must kill sinners who don't do as I say gawd told met to make you do.
Comply, convert or die. No insurance for sinners, like homo democrats etc etc.
I may be goin too far, but I have heard the nonsense since I was a teen ager and when I came out in my early 20s I have heard and put up with enough harassment, physical attack, lost jobs (and thus insurance) been homeless because I did not have insurance I could not get health care to be well enough to hold a full time job, and a part time job at minimum wage or even two are not enough to live like a human being.

I think it is ironic that these same people claim to be Christian, to be christian you should think about actin in a Christlike way like treating others with respect.
Give a hand up to those who are down, not kick them and scream that they are sinners and not worth the dirt it would take to cover up your body.

Most Americans who have two brain cells to rub together would want their fellow citizens to be covered.

I don't get the mindset of these people against health care reform other than they have been frightened by the r/w spin.

Most of those who are "happy" with their health insurance have never seen the business end of their insurer's CLAIM DENIED edicts. They've never had $100,000 in hospital charges dumped into their lap, after their carrier says they won't pay that portion of a $500,000 bill.

Most are happy with their health insurance because they've never really had to call on it for catastrophic care.

All Health insurance really ensures is that each of us will die fighting a insurance company for coverage we thought we already had.

is because the middle class is screaming. The working poor and working class have been getting screwed for decades. Now that the misery has worked it's way up the to what's left of the middle class all of a sudden we need reform. Of course the reform the middle class will "settle for" keeps on screwing the working poor and working class but the point never was to provide every american with health care it was to give a bit of relief price wise to those in the middle class.
Keeps them quiet.

Plus there are lots of us with health insurance who remember not having it. I grew up with no health insurance and minimal health care, I don't want that for any child.

And this is why the dems are losing the fight. Most people are at least OK with what they have. a Major change is not what they want. Yes some reforms and can be done but a complete overhaul or single payer will not fly with most at this time.

another way to look at it is that the real fight is between the corporate-government complex (we've gone way beyond the state of affairs in the days of Eisenhower) and the people.

that is exactly how they are trying to frame it.

The fight should be who manages your care, you and your doctor, or some corporate bean counter.