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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-19-09 08:40 PM
Original message
The Psychology Behind the Birther Movement and its Corollaries
The election of Barack Obama to the U.S. Presidency proves that racial prejudice among the American people has dissipated a tremendous amount since the days of slavery – much more so than many believed possible at the beginning of 2008. But at the same time, the desperate hysterical reaction against the Obama presidency among a sizable minority of Americans shows that rabid racism is still a formidable force to be reckoned with in our country.

President Obama receives about 30 death threats a day, a large proportion of them overtly racially tinged, representing a 400% increase over death threats received by his predecessor, and a higher rate than for any previous U.S. president. Worse yet, there is evidence of increasing racially motivated violence against African-Americans in our country.


THE BIRTHER MOVEMENT

The Birther Movement, which claims that Obama was not born in the United States – and therefore is not eligible for and not legitimately elected to the presidency – has come to symbolize this racial reaction against President Obama. A recent nation-wide poll shows that 11% of adult Americans believe that Barack Obama was not born in the United States, 12% are not sure, and 77% believe that he was born in the United States. But these opinions are greatly skewed demographically and by political party:

Percent of adult Americans who believe that Barack Obama was born in the United States:

Democrats: 93%
Independents: 83%
Republicans: 42%

Northeasterners: 93%
Midwesterners: 90%
Westerners: 87%
Southerners: 47%

Blacks: 97%
Latinos: 87%
Whites: 71%

Undoubtedly, the legacy of slavery in the United States has tremendous influence on these statistics. Slavery existed for a much longer period of time in the southern states than elsewhere in the United States. Humans have a need to justify their actions. In order to justify using other human beings as slaves, as well as the brutally violent treatment perpetrated by slave masters upon their slaves, the southern slave masters had to argue – to themselves and others – that their slaves were sub-human. That attitude became deeply ingrained in southern culture and was transmitted down through the generations.

The results of this attitude are shown in exit polls from the 2008 Presidential election, which showed Barack Obama losing the white vote to John McCain in all eleven states of the old Confederacy (by 14 to 78 percentage points in the individual states), while winning the white vote (19 states) or the white plus Hispanic vote (4 or 5 additional states) in most of the non-Southern states in the country.


Absence of evidence that Obama was born outside of the United States

As someone who is acutely aware that world history is permeated by dark conspiracies perpetrated by the powerful against the masses of ordinary people, that these powerful elites routinely make every effort to cover their tracks, and that that my own country is not immune to this phenomenon, I hate to reference mainstream sources on this issue. And I have to admit that I have virtually no expertise in judging the validity of birth certificates.

But the fact of the matter is that there has been NO credible evidence whatsoever to substantiate the claims of the birthers that Barack Obama was not born in the United States. Hawaiian health officials have authenticated Obama’s Hawaiian birth certificate. None have refuted it. The birth certificate has been examined by experts. A birth announcement of August 13, 1962, announces Barack H. Obama’s birth in Hawaii:


THE PSYCHOLOGY BEHIND THE BIRTHER MOVEMENT

In his book, “The Sane Society” (which H2O Man recently recommended to me), the humanist psychologist Erich Fromm discusses among other things the five human psychological needs that differentiate us from animals. In this post I’ll discuss three of them – the three that seem to me to have relevance to the Birther Movement:


Rootedness

Human beings throughout history and over the course of their lives are faced with the choice of clinging to what is familiar versus going out on their own to develop their own individual personalities. Another way of looking at this choice is security vs. independence. Fromm singles out nationalism and racism as the two most common strategies that Americans (and others as well) use to cling to the familiar to an extent that is very unhealthy:

Man – freed from the traditional bonds… afraid of the new freedom which transformed him into an isolated atom – escaped into (a state) of which nationalism and racism are the two most evident expressions… Along with the progressive development… went the development of the negative aspects of both principles: the worship of the state, blended with the idolatry of the race or nation. Fascism, Nazism and Stalinism are the most drastic manifestations of this blend of state and clan worship, both principles embodied in the figure of a “Fuehrer” (Fromm wrote this in 1955)…

The average man today obtains his sense of identity from his belonging to a nation… His objectivity, that is, his reason, is warped by this fixation. He judges the “stranger” with different criteria than the members of his own clan. His feelings toward the stranger are equally warped. Those who are not “familiar” by bonds of blood… are looked upon with suspicion, and paranoid delusions about them can spring up at the slightest provocation. This… not only poisons the relationship of the individual to the stranger, but to the members of his own clan and to himself… his capacity for love and reason are crippled; he does not experience himself nor his fellow man in their – and his own – human reality.

Nationalism is our … idolatry, our insanity. “Patriotism” is its cult. It should hardly be necessary to say, that by “patriotism” I mean that attitude which puts the own nation above humanity, above the principles of truth and justice; not the loving interest in one’s own nation…

Thus it is that Dr. Fromm equates excessive nationalism and racism with insanity. He emphasizes this point by noting the extreme outrage manifested in excessively nationalistic people when they witness disrespect to the symbols of their country, such as their country’s flag.


Sense of identity

Fromm’s discussion of the human need to develop a sense of identity sounds to me very similar to his discussion of man’s need for rootedness. He says:

In the development of the human race the degree to which man is aware of himself as a separate self depends on the extent to which he has emerged from the clan and the extent to which the process of individuation has developed. The member of a primitive clan might express his sense of identity in the formula “I am we”; he cannot yet conceive of himself as an individual, existing apart from his group… When the feudal system broke down, this sense of identity was shaken and the acute question “Who am I?” arose…

Many substitutes for a truly individual sense of identity were sought for, and found. Nation, religion, class and occupation serve to furnish a sense of identity… In the United States… the sense of identity is shifted more and more to the experience of conformity.

Inasmuch as I am not different, inasmuch as I am like the others, and recognized by them as “a regular fellow,” I can sense myself… Instead of the clan identity, a new herd identity develops, in which the sense of identity rests on the sense of an unquestionable belonging to the crowd. That this uniformity and conformity are often not recognized as such, and are covered by the illusion of individuality, does not alter the facts.

In the last paragraph of this section, Fromm sums up the problem with present day sheeple:

(Humans) are driven to do almost anything to acquire this sense (of identity). Behind the intense passion for status and conformity is this very need, and it is sometimes even stronger than the need for physical survival. What could be more obvious than the fact that people are willing to risk their lives, to give up their love, to surrender their freedom, to sacrifice their own thoughts, for the sake of being one of the herd… and thus of acquiring a sense of identity, even though it is an illusory one.


Relatedness

The need for relatedness to other human beings is as great as the two needs discussed above. Fromm discusses two unhealthy means by which humans seek to establish relatedness and one healthy one. The two sick means of establishing relatedness are domination and submission. The one healthy one is love – not necessarily in the sexual sense, but rather:

Love in this sense is never restricted to one person. If I can love only one person, and nobody else, if my love for one person makes me more alienated and distant from my fellow man…I do not love….

Some form of relatedness is the condition for any kind of sane living. But among the various forms of relatedness, only the productive one, love, fulfills the condition of allowing one to retain one’s freedom and integrity while being, at the same time, united with one’s fellow man.


CONCLUSION – THE EXPLANATION FOR THE BIRHTER MOVEMENT

There is a certain segment of the American population that tends to put security above all else. These are the people who are willing to hand over to government the power to spy on American citizens; they are the people who are willing to allow their government to spend any amount of money to build up an impregnable military machine and go to war against any country that their (white) president claims poses a danger to them, no matter how flimsy the evidence.

These are the ultra-nationalists and the racists. They feel safe only when they have a “strong” leader to lead them. They are always willing to believe that it is necessary for their “strong” leader to protect them against the hordes of humanity living in distant lands who have different color skin, speak strange languages, and practice religions other than their own – or no religion at all. They consider such people expendable. They don’t care how many of them have to die or be bombed into submission in order that their own security is assured. Jurgen Todenhofer, in his book, “Why Do you Kill?”, describes what this has meant in terms of how the Western powers have treated Muslims over the past two centuries:

Over the past 200 years no Muslim state has ever attacked the West. European powers and the United States have always been the aggressors… Since the beginning of the colonial era, millions of Muslim civilians have been killed. When it comes to killing, the West is leading by a ratio of more than ten to one.

The legacy of slavery in the United States has not ended. Not by a long shot. The racist and the ultranationalist – who are usually one and the same person – are very much alive and kicking in our country. Their whole identity is tied up in their country and in their race because they have never developed an individual identity. Without those crutches they feel insecure and lack a sense of identity to the point of insanity.

So what are they to do when the President of their country is a member of a race whom their ancestors brutally abused with the rationalization that that race is sub-human? They can’t reject their country. That would be “unpatriotic” and a sacrilege and deprive them of their security blanket. And yet, it would be unthinkable to accept a non-white person as the leader of their country. They are left with only a single alternative – to find a way to delegitimize their non-white leader as a fraud. And since they couldn’t think of an honest way to do that, they had to make up something. Add to that toxic brew the tendency to submit to authority and follow the herd, and you get the Birther Movement.

In the last paragraph of his section on humanity’s need for rootedness, Dr. Fromm summarizes the cure for the problem that gives rise to the kind of desperate hatred that characterizes the Birther Movement and its corollaries:

Nationalism and state worship became the symptoms of a regression… Only when man succeeds in developing his reason and love further than he has done so far, only when he can build a world based on human solidarity and justice, only when he can feel rooted in the experience of universal brotherliness, will he have found a new, human form of rootedness, will he have transformed his world into a truly human home.

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Historic NY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-19-09 10:09 PM
Response to Original message
1. I think the gun thing fits in here too...its definitely related to the birthers.
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-20-09 02:15 AM
Response to Reply #1
4. No doubt about it
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bvar22 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-19-09 10:55 PM
Response to Original message
2. Happy to put this on The Greatest.
:patriot:
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glitch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-19-09 11:20 PM
Response to Original message
3. Wow. Out of the park! K & R nt
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hfojvt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-20-09 03:32 AM
Response to Original message
5. if it's so much about racism
then why were there all the crazy tales about Clinton? The drug dealer, rapist and murderer. And Gore? the serial liar who invented the internets, discovered Love Canal and inspired Love Story while wearing earth tones as directed by Naomi Wolf.

I am surprised by some of these numbers. They do not seem to add up.

Democrats: 93%
Independents: 83%
Republicans: 42%

Northeasterners: 93%
Midwesterners: 90%
Westerners: 87%
Southerners: 47%

Blacks: 97%
Latinos: 87%
Whites: 71%


For one thing, are there not large numbers of blacks living in Southern states? Mississippi is at least 36% black. Georgia over 28%. Those racial demographics should push the numbers higher.

The west and the midwest, however, are largely white, and also largely Republican. So how does 71% and 42% become 87%? It seems to me that the Pac-3 must be skewing the stats for the 'west', leading one to a negative conclusion about 'southerners'.

I read Fromm's book way back in the late 1980s on my own while I was going to graduate school. It brings to mind another psychologist Paul Wachtel, who thought individualism was more of a problem than conformity.

"The idea that each individual should pursue his own private interests without regard to the needs of the community, that community needs will be taken care of automatically if that occurs; the idea that people's wants are self-generated and autonomous, not shaped by social forces; the idea that people have a right to keep what is 'theirs' and the denial that differentials in wealth are a function of particular social arrangements rather than a simple matter of hard work, initiative or capacity; the effort to solve social problems by an accumulation of separate individual choices and a suspicion of collective efforts; the failure to recognize how much individual well-being or individual commitments depend on a social matrix and on feedback from others - it is these kinds of individualistic thinking that I find troublesome, not a concern with individual liberty, fulfillment, uniqueness or intrinsic worth. In some respects it might be best if the same word were not even used for the two clusters, if perhaps the first were designated as a concern with individuality and the second as atomism.' Wachtel p. 139

http://www.amazon.com/Poverty-Affluence-Psychological-Portrait-American/dp/0865711518/ref=ntt_at_ep_dpt_4


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Solomon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-20-09 07:44 AM
Response to Reply #5
11. Did they bring guns to Clinton and Gore speeches?
Racism deniers kill me. "Naw, it's not racism at all". Sheesh.
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hfojvt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-20-09 01:45 PM
Response to Reply #11
23. you cannot see a middle ground?
5 - it's all about racism
4 - it's mostly about racism
3 - it's partly about racism
2 - it's barely about racism
1 - it's not at all about racism

The racism is an unknown factor, and I don't think it is accurate to claim 4 or 5 based on scant evidence or based on superficial 'evidence'. How do you know those protestors are racist? 'Duh, they've got white skin.' or 'Duh, they're from the South."
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noiretextatique Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-20-09 05:18 PM
Response to Reply #23
29. it's not an "unknown factor"
it is a known problem that's plagued this nation for centuries. it was on display during the campaign, and it's on display now. the birther movement is racist to the core. it's central premise is that obama cannot be a citizen because he is black. the birthers and the deathers, believe:
they (and people like them) are the only "real americans"
they (and people like them) are the only deserving americans.
they say it all the time, if you listen.
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hfojvt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 12:20 AM
Response to Reply #29
38. of course it is a known problem. that is not the issue
The issue is that you have a group of people
a. protesting Obama's policies
b. expressing fear about said policies
c. expressing hatred of the President
d. expressing doubts about whether he was born in this country (or certainty that he was not)

How do you know how much of their actions or speeches have anything to do with Obama's race? It does not seem legitimate to jump from America's race problem to a charge of racism especially when a, b, and c are normal to American politics. And so is d if it was generalized from birther conspiracy to crazy conspiracy theories in general.

I think you are wrong about the central premise too. The birther claim is that Obama is not a citizen because a. his father is from Kenya and b. his mother supposedly was not in America when he was born and c. because she was under 18 American citizenship is not automatically conferred on him.

You might believe that they only have that theory because Obama is black but you only have circumstantial evidence to support your belief. There was no racism behind other attacks on Democrats from the Swift-boating to the war on Gore to Clinton derangement syndrome. If it wasn't the birther theory it would be something else, perhaps involving William Ayers or Jeremiah Wright or Rod Blagojevich. It's always something.
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-20-09 08:01 AM
Response to Reply #5
12. The fact that other examples of Republican idiocy are related to things other than racism
doesn't mean that racism hasn't played a big part in the birther movement. The fact that racism has played a big part in the movement is indicated among other things by the many racially tinged insults directed at our president.

The numbers in the poll that I quoted are not inconsistent. The fact that there are large numbers of blacks living in southern states means that the percentage of whites who don't believe that Obama was born in the U.S. is much lower than the 47% indicated for all southerners combined.

You ask how does 71% and 42% become 87%. It doesn't. One cannot predict from the fact that 71% of whites and 42% of Republicans believe that Obama was born in the U.S. what percent of westerners will believe that -- notwithstanding the fact that the west tilts Republican and is largely white. The West also contains a very large number of Democrats and independents. And it is also highly likely that Western Republican whites are much less likely to be birthers than are southern Republican whites.

The very high percent of southern whites who don't believe that Obama was born in the U.S. parallels the very high percent of southern whites who voted for McCain in 2008. As I noted in the OP, the white population of 19 U.S. states voted for Obama in 2008, while the white population of every state of the old Confederacy voted for McCain -- by margins of more than 70% in some cases (i.e. 85-15). The major exception was Florida, with a margin for McCain of only 14% -- but a lot of white Floridians are transplanted northerners, whose ancestors did therefore did not own slaves.

I basically agree with what you quoted from Wachtel -- and I believe that Fromm does as well. Fromm does not advocate radical individualism. As noted in the OP, one of the five human psychological needs that he discusses in detail is "relatedness". But it is how relatedness is achieved that is important. It is particularly unhealthy to achieve it through domination or submission -- of which "following the herd" is a part. The right wing view of "rugged individualism", especially as espoused by many powerful corporations, is particularly hypocritical. On the one hand they deride social programs that are meant to provide a safety net for the poor and to ensure that the essential needs of American citizens are met. But on the other hand, they have no problem with advocating the use of the U.S. military to secure the resources of foreign nations for their own private use.
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hfojvt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-20-09 01:16 PM
Response to Reply #12
21. let me use 2000 figures for the west
California - 33.87 million
Oregon - 3.4 million
Washington - 5.89

Wyoming - .49
Montana - .9
Idaho - 1.29
Utah - 2.23
Nevada - 2.0
Arizona - 5.13
New Mexico - 1.82
Colorado - 4.3
Kansas - 2.69
Nebraska - 1.711
SD - .76
ND - .64

It seems to me that if you looked at the stats for the last 12 states, which would be the west minus the PAC 3, that the numbers would be quite similar to the south. Those twelve are part of the solid Republican West which are just as solid red as the south. Whereas the PAC-3 are more like the northeast. With 64% of the population of the "west" in the PAC-3 that seems to skew the results.
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-20-09 02:55 PM
Response to Reply #21
24. I doubt that
Consider the McCain margin among whites in the 08 election in the Western states compared to the Southern states. I already noted the range of margins in the Southern states in the OP. Here's some data for western states:

AK: McCain +32
AZ: McCain + 19
CO: Obama + 2
ID: McCain + 32
MT: McCain + 7
NV: McCain + 8
NM: McCain + 14
ND: McCain + 13
SD: McCain + 15
UT: McCain + 35
WY: McCain + 34

http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2008/results/polls/#val=WYP00p1

Those are pretty good margins for McCain in many Western states, but not at all comparable to the deep South. And keep in mind that people in Western states have a different reason for being Republican than Southern states do. Southerners were primarily Democrats until the passage of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, and following that they underwent a radical switch.
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unpossibles Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-20-09 09:28 AM
Response to Reply #5
14. Clinton was an "other" for them as well
Clinton, although white was often called "the first black President" because he was well-received in many black communities. I would imagine that racism could be behind part of their attacks on him even, although the attacks on Obama are far more extreme than they were on Clinton.

If nothing else, was Clinton ever doubted to be an American or a Christian? Obama was/is, and simply because of his name and the color of his skin. Were he a white guy named Fred, this issue would not have existed.

The right sees all of us as evil, godless, commie pinkos who want to destroy America, thanks in no small part to their rabble rousers on TV and radio. That is "other" enough to be bad in their minds. Add in a difference in skin color or religion or some other more obvious difference and they can't take it.
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hfojvt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-20-09 01:29 PM
Response to Reply #14
22. were he a white guy named Fred
then some other crazy conspiracy issue would exist and be promoted by Limbaugh, Beck, et. al. And if Fred's father was born in Kahzakstan or the Ukraine from a mother under age 18, then it could also be a birth certificate issue.

Yes, Clinton was doubted to be a Christian, although the comments here are about Hillary

http://christianblogs.christianet.com/1147804428.htm
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mrfocus Donating Member (151 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-20-09 09:33 AM
Response to Reply #5
15. Also highly recommended: "Conservatism as Motivated Social Cognition"
Excellent meta-analysis of what drives conservatives
Download paper here
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-20-09 12:52 PM
Response to Reply #15
17. Thank you for the reference
It looks very interesting.
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Liquorice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-20-09 01:13 PM
Response to Reply #5
20. Yep, I read there were 'birthers' regarding President Chester Arthur as well! I
think this kind of stupid allegation is just the way politics has always been and always will be.
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Nostalgic Donating Member (293 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-20-09 04:09 AM
Response to Original message
6. Thanks for posting this.
Edited on Thu Aug-20-09 04:10 AM by Nostalgic
Very informative. I have bookmarked it. K&R. :headbang:
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WeDidIt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-20-09 04:32 AM
Response to Original message
7. August 13, 1961, not 1962
Sorry, but I had to point it out.

That little discrepency proves to the Birthers that Barack Obama isn't a citizen and you're in om the conspiracy.
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-20-09 07:27 AM
Response to Reply #7
10. Thank you for pointing that out
It's too late to correct my typo, but the link that I provided has the correct date and year.
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StClone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-20-09 06:37 AM
Response to Original message
8. "Silent Majority"
Now is the "Incited Minority" manipulated by those whom have a vested interests in furthering Birther Racism.
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-20-09 11:48 AM
Response to Reply #8
16. The way I see it
the racism part is manipulated by corporate interests in order to further their economic aims. The racists, as I see it, are the manipulated, not the manipulators. They are actually manipulated, using their racial hatred, into acting against their own interests.
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H2O Man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-20-09 06:43 AM
Response to Original message
9. Definitely recommended!
Very well done.
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-20-09 09:28 AM
Response to Reply #9
13. Thank you for your recommendation of Fromm's book
There's a lot of very good stuff in that book. I think it's very important to understand the root causes of our society's problems, and Fromm provides a lot of excellent information on that.
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Overseas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-20-09 12:53 PM
Response to Original message
18. K&R for highlighting the vulnerabilities exploited by the strong right wing PR firms--
Conservatives without conscience, to borrow John Dean's title.

It has been really disturbing to see the reckless right wing PR firms gin up dangerous anger and fear, exploiting these vulnerabilities among their "grass roots" groups that have "been around for years" (just coincidentally silent during the reckless war profiteering and huge increase in government agencies of the Bush Cheney Regime).

Very sad to see the deliberate, for profit (funded with millions from Pay-to-Play health industries), right wing PR firms exploiting these characteristics relentlessly, but only being exposed on the few token liberal cable TV shows. Not exposed on regular TV reporting.

And the same kind of right wing PR firms are already pumping up the hate and fear to storm town halls to defeat any attempts to get the wasteful USA to curb its carbon emissions.



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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-20-09 03:57 PM
Response to Reply #18
25. Conservatives without conscience
There are an awful lot of them around these days, and in very high positions. There are way too many people without consciences who have way too much influence over the decisions our government makes. We need to find a way to deal with that.
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Overseas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-20-09 05:47 PM
Response to Reply #25
30. More frankness at the outset of the healthcare discussion might have helped.
I think more frankness and courage by our Democratic leaders at the outset might have been more effective than the morass they've created with their multi-capitulations and retractions.

Wish President Obama had come out right off the bat to "level with the American people" that the private sector told us over ten years ago that they could do things better but they had failed.

We spent many decades focusing on how to make things easy for a heavily privatized health care system to succeed. We gave in to their sincere speeches about how they could do better. That approach has failed utterly and many of you are feeling that pain right now.

So we need to start from a new angle: how do we best serve the patients? And how do we help those who are desperate for care, like the thousands who waited over 8 hours for free healthcare in LA recently? Well, we studied other healthcare systems. What healthcare delivery systems have the highest patient satisfaction? Is there a system that combines public benefits and accountability but allows some private rewards? Is there a system like that that has been tried and tested for decades already? Yes. It is called Single Payer by the Canadians. We call our version Medicare. Expanding Medicare by opening it up to anyone who chooses it as a public option is the Democratic plan. The Medicare infrastructure is there, so it would be cheaper letting people choose to join that rather than building a whole new system.

Single Payer covers everyone. It is a mixture of public and private sectors. Doctors and medical services are privately delivered; payments and cost controls are publicly administered and accountable to us all.

That's the model the alternatives are going to have to beat: Cover everyone and control costs in an accountable manner that doesn't bankrupt your patients.

To help the private sector compete, we will introduce regulations so they can explain to their shareholders why they need to spend more to cover everyone; they will be having to follow the same rules as their competitors, so none will have an unfair advantage.


The right wing PR firms would still be boiling up their trouble-to-order "grass roots" shout-downs. They are already ginning up groups to shout down the concept of reducing US carbon emissions, even as we watch large ice sheets melt and ocean temperatures rising to accelerate that process.

So, while I dearly wish an honest discussion had been bravely made at the outset, I have been glad to see President Obama meeting with religious leaders to remind them about that "how you care for the least among you..." stuff and doing more town halls. Wish he would also let people know that even though Canadian Single Payer isn't perfect, it still covers everyone at a much lower cost than our system does. And patient satisfaction is much higher. Even without counting our 47,000,000 fellow citizens who are uninsured and desperate for the chance to choose a public option like Medicare.

He could even close his talks by scaling back up-- health security is an important part of our national security. It will help millions of people survive a turbulent economy more easily. How can we serve as a model Democracy if we don't take care of our own? How can a government of the people, by the people and for the people treat health care as a privilege for those who have the money to pay, rather than as part of our basic human rights?
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-20-09 08:05 PM
Response to Reply #30
34. Excellent speech -- the ones in intalics
Are those Obama's words, or words that you wish he would say?
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Overseas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-20-09 09:11 PM
Response to Reply #34
37. My wish script. Thank you.
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Overseas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-20-09 06:02 PM
Response to Reply #25
31. Rootedness. Sense of identity. Relatedness.
My amateur speechwriting for our president would have indeed worked those angles.

Here's where we all are. You me and our fellow Americans. We tried to save that privatized service and they robbed us blind. It is time for a change. We can do it. We're ingenious Americans. We can use what works without panicking about labels-- unless we listen to too much righty talk.
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guruoo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-20-09 01:07 PM
Response to Original message
19. K&R
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Dramarama Donating Member (544 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-20-09 04:02 PM
Response to Original message
26. How many think McCain
Edited on Thu Aug-20-09 04:02 PM by Dramarama
was born IN the lower 48 states?
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-20-09 08:28 PM
Response to Reply #26
36. He was born in the Panama Canal Zone
At a U.S. Naval Base, I believe.

I wonder how they would have reacted to President Obama had he been born in Panama?
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windoe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-20-09 04:33 PM
Response to Original message
27. A national identity crisis
Edited on Thu Aug-20-09 04:34 PM by windoe
has been invoked. Dis-ease is separation, physically by some tissue from others, psychologically by consciousness from shadow(simplistically), and socially by a feeling of isolation and rejection. As within so without. Our society has been broken, and I see this as both being a great turning point, and a point of highest vulnerability if enough of us are not vigilant enough to stay unified on crucial levels of understanding.

Do we collectively identify ourselves by our destructiveness or our creativity, our humanity or our ideals? We have a choice to do both or either, since we are both separate beings and interconnected, which is the paradox.
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gaspee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-20-09 05:03 PM
Response to Original message
28. I honestly didn't think
He could get elected. The only good thing BUsh did was fuck things up so badly that the slightly racist would rather vote for a biracial man than another republican. Unfortunately, the widespread racism I believed wouldn't allow him to be elected is now coming out in very unpleasant ways.
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fascisthunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-20-09 06:41 PM
Response to Original message
32. I am Impressed
well done.

This snippet I find poignant:

"Over the past 200 years no Muslim state has ever attacked the West. European powers and the United States have always been the aggressors… Since the beginning of the colonial era, millions of Muslim civilians have been killed. When it comes to killing, the West is leading by a ratio of more than ten to one."
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Time for change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-20-09 08:07 PM
Response to Reply #32
35. Thank you -- That quote from Todenhofer is one that Americans should think long and hard about.
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DU GrovelBot  Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-20-09 06:41 PM
Response to Original message
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