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Dangerman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 10:34 PM
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The US War against Iraq - The Destruction of a Civilization
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patrice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 10:58 PM
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1. This is making me crazy. I'm having a hard time accepting that it means little or nothing to so many
It's hard to feel okay about a country that did this and is now trying to pretend that it isn't happening.

It is the very HEART of Darkness.

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Gregorian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-22-09 08:55 PM
Response to Reply #1
6. Yes. Some of us do understand. We're sane.
Edited on Sat Aug-22-09 09:44 PM by Gregorian
I understand. And I'm with you. Perhaps it is because my grandmother was an Armenian who stood there as a member of a royal family decided her fate. I know what it is like to see the marble palace that they left behind. Everything gone. Friends, family, wealth. To die in poverty. All because of the same shit that happened to Iraq.

I recently left a beautiful farm in Oregon because of several reasons. Primarily because of ignorance. Bush/Cheney bumper stickers. I had a cemetery on the property. One day the local minister showed up with someone to see if they could visit. He told me his feelings about the Iraq invasion. I was appalled. What was it about "thou shalt not kill" that he didn't get? Or do unto others as you would have them do unto you? Or love thy enemy? Or love they neighbor? Whenever I heard the church bells from that day on I wondered what kinds of idiots lived amongst me.

It's sickness. It's unconsciousness.

I just want to share a concept that I feel has truth to it. It may be helpful. And I apologize, as I don't mean to be preaching. I haven't found a way to really put it into proper words.

The worst things are caused by the best people. The nicest people. People who may not even know what they have done. There is individual evil, and collective evil. We can all identify with the individual evil. It's easier since it directs the responsibility away from our self. But, and especially in a modern society, our collective evil is responsible for most of what we are seeing. Iraq was about oil. Oil is used in our cars. We drive to the store. That is considered a relatively benign act. But when it is multiplied by millions, it becomes evil. I don't think more than a handful of people ever get this. Multiplicity is the way that relatively benign acts can amplify into horrible ones. I call it the "just me" syndrome. I'm just going to take that trip to Europe. I'm just going to go shopping. The result is 20 million barrels of oil PER DAY, just for the U.S.

What we've done is give big companies huge power. By virtue of multiplicity. Each person donates a tiny bit of money, and collectively we have grown these monsters. And we've given away our independence. The independence of going out to the chickens in the morning and grabbing an egg, instead of having chicken farms. It's all exactly like that. Making soap. Riding a horse, versus getting in a car. This is what happened.

It makes my head hurt. Because I too am responsible. I helped kill Iraqis. Now I know there is not a direct connection. I protested. I didn't vote for Bush. But I've given power to the huge companies that lobbied.

Even our apathy is multiplied. I dropped out when Reagan got in office. That was without a doubt my most serious contribution to the path that led to Iraq.


I also want to recognize that there is positive multiplicity. I often find myself in pain over the disgust I feel when I see a sea of cars. I get so angry I can hardly stand it. How could we be so stupid. Oh yeah, I was saying...places like DU are positive. And the potential for us to do good is there. It can happen. And to think that we could create a world of beauty and kindness. I know it does exist, but it seems to be overshadowed by evil. Maybe that's my problem, that I don't look at the positive more than the negative. I'm trying to grow here too.

Phew. OK, that's enough of my rant. '


Another edit- I still didn't get this right.

I have an aunt. Auntie Jay. Now my dad is a Democrat, but Auntie Jay is one of those people who loves my dad, thinks he's a genius, but won't listen to his arguments regarding politics because she was married to a conservative, and hangs out with conservatives. And so she voted. And as sweet as Auntie Jay is, she helped that war happen. This is what has been on my mind. I called her the other day, and she was worried that "Obama is going to ruin America". Huh? Where were you the last 8 years. Do you even know what Habeas Corpus is. No. No way. She is one of those people who is uneducated. Or unwilling to open her mind when she's being educated. That is how this happened. I guess it's no mystery. I'm not telling anyone anything new. Oh well, back to watching Catch-22. I give up. I can't solve the world's problems. Although they're easy to solve. Very easy. If only people would just look around.
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G_j Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-22-09 08:58 PM
Response to Reply #1
8. It's as if 'we' are trying to destroy our own history nt
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polly7 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 11:21 PM
Response to Original message
2. Not just a Civilization ........... the "cradle of civilization".
A country so rich in heritage and who contributed so much to modern day mankind, now a polluted, destroyed ........ pumpjack.

It makes me crazy too.

http://www.h-net.org/~museum/iraq.html

http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2008/03/20/iraq_roundtable/
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Raster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-22-09 08:40 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. ol' Dubya's rationalization: "he tried to kill my daddy."
Or some other ludicrous shit. Truth be told: The Texas Petroleum Mafia had their eye on all that lovely oil for quite some time.
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madmax Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-22-09 08:51 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. A tragedy.
The loss and historical artifacts and history. Beyond criminal.
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spanone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-22-09 08:53 PM
Response to Original message
5. we will pay a heavy price for this one day.....a heavy price
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abumbyanyothername Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-22-09 08:56 PM
Response to Original message
7. Don't forget that the destruction began
when the CIA installed their employee, Sadaam, in the first place.
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abumbyanyothername Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-22-09 08:58 PM
Response to Reply #7
9. Oh yeah, one other thing
Each one of us that drives a car, is part of the problem.

If we are sickened by the invasion of Iraq (and I am), we need to drastically cut our petroleum energy consumption (and I did).
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invictus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-22-09 09:07 PM
Response to Original message
10. K&R
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