CNN: Secret Service Interviewed Pastor Who Prays For Obama's Death

CNN has picked up our story from yesterday on Steven Anderson, the Arizona pastor who prayed for Barack Obama's death the day before one of his parishioners, who attended the sermon, brought an AR-15 rifle to an Obama event.

And they've advanced the story a bit: CNN analyst Mike Brooks reports that the Secret Service has interviewed Anderson, who told TPMmuckraker yesterday: "To be honest with you, I have prayed for Obama to die. I'm not the only one, I'm just the only one with the spine to say it."

Here's the relevant bit of the segment, in which Rich Sanchez interviews Brooks and former Secret Service agent Scott Alswang:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bMEgohWzUds&feature=player_embedded

http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/08/cnn_secret_service_paid_death-praying_pastor_a_vis.php?ref=fpb

Clearly, the guy isn't going to settle down. I wonder what the Secret Service does now.

:shrug:

Maybe you make the strech he's telling (preaching) to others to do it... which is probably against the law to be ordering people to assasinate someone.
Otherwise, it's just some guy hoping for something to happen... not a crime, really. I'm not even sure he's really a threat.

but my query is that is he to be reprimanded for simply "thinking"?
Now if he's actually "planning/conspiring" - then yes, lock his ass up.

But ya can't do much about someone thinking or wanting something.
Besides, regardless of the ideal, I could never support somthing like the policing of thoughts.

An old law designed to suppress Communism, but phrased very usefully....

Sec. 2. (a) It shall be unlawful for any person--

(1) to knowingly or willfully advocate, abet, advise, or teach the duty, necessity, desirability, or propriety of overthrowing or destroying any government in the United States by force or violence, or by the assassination of any officer of any such government;

(2) with the intent to cause the overthrow or destruction of any government in the United States, to print, publish, edit, issue, circulate, sell, distribute, or publicly display any written or printed matter advocating, advising, or teaching the duty, necessity, desirability, or propriety of overthrowing or destroying any government in the United States by force or violence;

(3) to organize or help to organize any society, group, or assembly of persons who teach, advocate, or encourage the overthrow or destruction of any government in the United States by force or violence; or to be or become a member of, or affiliate with, any such society, group, or assembly of persons, knowing the purposes thereof.

The controlling Supreme Court decisions hold this is to be interpreted on this line:

'...indoctrination of a group in preparation for future violent action, as well as exhortation to immediate action, by advocacy found to be directed to "action for the accomplishment" of forcible overthrow, to violence as "a rule or principle of action," and employing "language of incitement," id. at 341 U. S. 511-512, is not constitutionally protected when the group is of sufficient size and cohesiveness, is sufficiently oriented towards action, and other circumstances are such as reasonably to justify apprehension that action will occur.'

Since this 'pastor' has already moved one congregant to bear arms in the vicinity of the President, he would seem on very shakly ground, along with his whole congregation....

I thank you for your on time response.

.... that a government that was founded on force and violence has laws against them.

I guess revolution is only good against other governments.

The claim to a monopoly on the legitimate exercise of violence for political purposes is the distinguishing characteristic of state authority.

that kind of thing would like.

"The object of opening the mind, like opening the mouth, is to close it again on something solid."

There is some sense to the attitude; it is possible to keep one's mind so open the brains fall out....

while Chesterton was clearly a bloody clever bloke, I have always found him to be more than a bit of a conservative twat, Sir.

But by praying - or announcing he is praying - at church, he is basically saying he wants Obama dead. That creeps toward threats and/or incitement of violence.

Secret Service & a court could well interpret it as a threat.

As it turns out, Pastor Steven Anderson of Faithful Word Baptist Church in Arizona is calling for kind of Fatwa of his own. In a sermon delivered on Sunday, August 16th, Pastor Anderson claimed to “hate Barack Obama.” He clarified that he doesn’t just hate his politics, or what he stands for, but that he hates the man himself and that “God hates Barack Obama” too. He goes on to say that because Obama is pro-choice, he deserves the death penalty. He claimed that Obama needs to be “punished.” Pastor Anderson even went as far to say that “Obama ought to be aborted.”

Now some people may claim that this is just hate speech and not actually a call to violence, but Pastor Steven Anderson would disagree. According to him, the purpose of his sermon was not to just “tickle your ears but to give you a swift kick in the pants.” He goes on to say that “God is a god of wrath and vengeance” and that he, Steven Anderson, is going to “pray for Barack Obama to die and go to Hell.”

http://www.examiner.com/x-8928-Philadelphia-Atheism-Examiner~y2009m8d27-Christian-Pastor-calls-for-the-Presidents-death

And there is audio of this sermon on the net. Thom Hartmann played it on his show today.

It will be an interesting case to follow and see what the SS determines.
Thank you for the good info!

And he could well be arrested next time. For now it looks like there are arrests for threats and at least one conviction I found tonight - looks like the stories are flying under the radar which may be the intention of the Secret Service for now on the arrests & convictions.

as long as he makes it clear that he is PRAYING for it, the SS will not arrest him, and no court would convict him.

it doesn't meet the "true threats" definition, it doesn't meet the incitement standard under brandenberg either.

even though he has not (apparently) broken the law, this doesn't stop the SS from interviewing him,as they did. the SS, or law enforcement in general, does not have to wait until clear PC of a crime develops before they can TALK to somebody, which is what the SS did.

but, in brief, it is entirely legal to pray for the president's (or anybody's ) death, in public or private.

he has to be careful in that if his prayer advises OTHERS to take up the cause, THEN he will be breaking the law.

praying to GOD to do it, does not. the courts have not taken judicial notice that god even exists.

these RRReligious nutjob leaders have over their flock.

And I repeat--it proves intent if it goes to trial. The Secrets were correct to do this.

at least, it was in the eyes of the Repugs ... but of course, you only heard the full context of THAT preacher's statement on the rare liberal media outlets ...

and tell me ... if a man, whom you see quite often as a "voice of God", tells you to go out and do God's will, and you are not good in God's eyes unless you do, and you are a "God fearing man", then what do you do?

I also remember hearing quite a few influential people in the media flat out saying that anybody who opposed Bush's fill-in-the-blank was almost handing a terrorist a dirty nuke and a plane ticket to the World Trade Center ...

if the guy is a Christian he should know that. Shame on him, God will get him for that (I hope). :-(

Publicly "praying" for the death of a president, any president (even the former pResident) is worth a Secret Service visit. Especially since growing right-wing violence is not a figment of anyone's imagination.

Man Found Guilty For Death Threats Against President

A La Mesa, California man was found guilty in a San Deigo federal court Tuesday for making death threats against President Barack Obama.

United States District Judge Marilyn L. Huff found 47 year-old Walter Edward Bagdasarian guilty of two counts of making threats against a presidential candidate. These threats are in violation of Title 18, United States Code, Section 879(a)(3).

Thirteen days before the presidential election, Bagdasarian posted two racist comments and threatened gun violence against Obama on a public Yahoo! forum. Bagdasarian used the n-word and said that Obama would be shot soon - "He will have a 50 cal in the head soon." Both messages were said to have been posted on 22 October 2008.

Judge Huff rejected the plea from Bagdasarian's lawyer, who claimed that his client was under the influence when the posts were made.

Evidence presented at the trial established that Obama was officially declared a major candidate and was already assigned Secret Service protection in 2007 before Bagdasarian posted the comments. The Secret Service was notified of the messages, and agents were then able to quickly trace the messages back to Bagdasarian.

http://www.anairhoads.org/criminaljustice/deaththreatspres.shtml

A federal judge found a La Mesa man guilty Tuesday of making Internet threats against Barack Obama during the presidential campaign.

Walter Edward Bagdasarian, 47, was indicted in January after Secret Service agents traced the alleged threats -- filled with racial invectives and profanity -- to his wife's computer and later found a small arsenal of weapons in the couple's La Mesa home.

Judge Marilyn Huff ruled that two World Wide Web postings on Oct. 22, 2008, could reasonably be taken as serious threats and were intended as such despite Bagdasarian's later explanation that he was drunk on wine at the time they were written.

Bagdasarian had admitted writing the postings on a Yahoo! message board, saying "f---the n-----, he will have a 50 cal in the head soon," and "shoot the n--."

-----

Bagdasarian wept briefly as the judge's findings were announced and hugged his tearful wife, Regina, as he left the courtroom with other family members and friends.

http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local-beat/Obama-Threat-Trial-Starts-Today.html

Here's the case filing: http://www.wired.com/images_blogs/threatlevel/files/complaint.pdf

DU thread on the clown from back in January: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x3682774

So if you run across any of this crap on the internet - send if off to the Secret Service.

He used Californiaradial as his name on a couple of aviation forums and the Yahoo finance forum where he got caught. You know Rimjob would've scrubbed him as soon as he got busted if he was a Freeper.

He was a pilot and a warbird enthusiast. California radial was a type of plane engine.

Poor dumb freeper.

It is our job to stay aware and to promptly inform government officials as needed.

Lakeland man pleads guilty in Obama threat case

TAMPA, Fla. - A 21-year-old Lakeland man with a history of mental illness has pleaded guilty to threatening to kill President Barack Obama in a racist letter to military recruiters.

Nathan Wine faces up to five years in prison, a $250,000 fine and three years supervised release after entering the plea Wednesday.

Wine admitted sending a badly misspelled email the day after Obama's election, and told investigators ways he'd execute the threat. Agents found a hand-written note in his pocket promising to attack "tyrents of coler" and "gun down their leader Obama and let his blood spill on the streets of D.C."

Wine's lawyer has said his client was off his medication for two months before making the threat. A judge noted he'd been involuntarily held 10 times for mental health observation.

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/breakingnews/orl-bk-lakeland-man-pleads-obama-threat-082009,0,4330889.story

Camp LeJeune Marine Indicted For Threatening President Obama

WNCT-TV
Published: February 26, 2009

UNDATED—United States Attorney George E.B. Holding announced that on February 25, 2009, a Federal Grand Jury returned a single count indictment charging Kody Ray Brittingham, 20, of Camp Lejeune, North Carolina, with threatening the President-Elect of the United States, in violation of Title 18, United States Code, Section 871, which has a maximum penalty of 5 years imprisonment followed by up to three years of supervised release and a fine of up to $250,000.

The Indictment charges that in November, 2008, Brittingham threatened the life of then-President-Elect Barack Obama. He stated, among other things, that he intended to shoot the President-Elect.

Mr. Holding stated: “We take all threats against the President and other high officials of the United States very seriously. The threat itself represents a disruption of the United States Government, even if no actual attempt is made to carry out the threat.“

http://www2.wjbf.com/jbf/news/national/article/camp_lejeune_marine_indicted_for_threatening_president_obama/11331/

Probation for threats to Obama, mall

DENVER -- A Texas man who pleaded guilty to threatening President Obama and the Mall of America near Minneapolis was sentenced Friday to four years of probation and home detention.

U.S. District Judge Christine Arguello sentenced Timothy Ryan Gutierrez, 21, to serve the first 10 months of his probation under house arrest and pay nearly $1,500 to Mall of America security.

Gutierrez pleaded guilty May 4 to a charge of making threats by e-mail.

In January, he sent two e-mails to the FBI's Washington office, threatening Obama eight days before the presidential inauguration and saying he had planted explosives outside the Mall of America.

Authorities said one e-mail threatened: "I'm going to assassinate the new president of the United States of America. P.S., you have 48 hours to stop it from happening." AP

http://www.suntimes.com/news/politics/obama/1696154,CST-NWS-obama02.article

challenged and therein lies the inherent danger.

As much as it should make all of us feel better (even slightly) that some of these nutjobs are taken seriously, I can't help but think for every 1 of them caught there may be 10, 20, 100 more waiting to take their place.

Some peeps get a helluva lot of grief for reporting every threat (you can see it even on DU at times) but I feel that it is the absolutely right action to take when confronted with madmen.

I don't hesitate to forward a link and I sure wouldn't hesitate to take down a tag number or some other identifying information on any one who threatens an elected official and neither should any one else. I just believe that it's our duty to do so.

"Wine admitted sending a badly misspelled email"
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: even when they're writing threats, they can't spell! :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Now *that's* an accomplishment! :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

..it pushes independents to the left.

brainlessness.

NEW YORK (ABP) -- A former Southern Baptist Convention officer who on June 2 called the death of abortion provider George Tiller an answer to prayer said later in the day he is also praying "imprecatory prayer" against President Obama.

Wiley Drake, pastor of First Southern Baptist Church in Buena Park, Calif., and former running mate of American Independent Party presidential candidate Alan Keyes, said June 2 on Fox News Radio he didn't understand why people were upset with his comments quoted by Associated Baptist Press from a webcast of his daily radio talk show.

"Imprecatory prayer is agreeing with God, and if people don't like that, they need to talk to God," Drake told syndicated talk-show host Alan Colmes. "God said it, I didn't. I was just agreeing with God."

Asked if there are others for whom Drake is praying "imprecatory prayer," Drake hesitated before answering that there are several. "The usurper that is in the White House is one, B. Hussein Obama," he said.

(Colmes): "So you're praying for the death of the president of the United States?"

(Drake): "Yes."

http://www.abpnews.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=4126&Itemid=53

No person should be allowed to hide behind a pulpit and preach about their personal hatred for a sitting president and his political beliefs. Taking it so far as to even say they wish him dead. There's no denying a line has been crossed by this man.

What really bothers me is that he, or any other person for that matter, would ever be permitted to say to an audience how they want to see any person dead. How can something like that be legal?

is he going to lie and say that the recordings are fakes, from the agents of Satan?

moran. :grr:

The fucker thinks his reward is in heaven for hating the Prez

I suspect he is a cowardly hypocrite who peed in his pants at the first knock at his door. I think they all got really full of themselves over the past 8 years. They don't realize just yet how much times have changed. :) And that they can't just get away with spewing hate and inciting violence any more.

btw, I *love* that pic you have of Teddy and child :)

But that's what happens - they get drunk on power and start believing their own lies.

Same thing happened to Jim Jones and L. Ron Hubbard.

Same shit, different asshole.

And I love that pic too!

he rails against blacks, homosexuals, and other sinners to his small or non-existent congregation and can be viewed in videos of his sermons that he has uploaded to youtube.
most here, including me, would be as repulsed by his preaching as we are by his prayers for the death of the president.
yet, he also has recorded himself in disputes with border patrol officers. i believe that many of us on DU would be more sympathetic with the "crazy right wing minister" in these films.
he is a complex character and highlights the reality that the left and right in america share many common concerns. the problem is we can't agree what the cause of our problems are.
here's links to a couple of his videos. i'm not sure if they are good Representatives.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YUzd7G875Hc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GXC1zS2ZzM8