Small towns and conservatism

I'm trying to figure out why small town thinking is so constricted and am not making much headway. Is it because people aren't allowed to think for themselves? Is it because exposure is so narrow? Is it because you grow up thinking like the people around you and if you stay, you still think that way? Is it because the people who think for themselves leave? Is it because fundamentalism flourishes in small-town and rural America? Is it all of these?

I see a parallel between the small-town thinking and Muslim fundamentalism, and the root seems to lie in not thinking for yourself, in accepting the party line, i.e. the ideas you are taught.

I know whereof I speak. I grew up in a small town on the High Plains - population 4,407 when I left in 1953, die-hard conservative then, brags on their website now that in 2004 they gave a higher percentage of votes to Bush than any county in the country. We now live in a small town in the southwestern corner of New Mexico. We found a rarity, a small town that votes Democratic. We are only now realizing that the Democratic votes are mostly from the 52% of the population that is Hispanic, that the Anglo attitudes are pretty much what they were in the Texas Panhandle in 1953.

I'd very much like to hear your ideas on why small town America is so conservative. It can't all be because of Rush and his ilk. These people were conservative before he/they started poisoning the airwaves.

Edited for grammar

in cities who have "closed minds".

I lived in cities - Dallas, New Orleans, D.C., Atlanta - for 49 years, but never encountered quite the kind of narrow thinking I grew up with and am seeing again. Of course, most of the time we lived in a liberal neighborhood in Atlanta, which means the people I knew weren't closed.

conservative in what? A lot of these same people are liars,cheats,pedohiles,adulterers,fornicators and much more but they think that they have the right to tell the rest of the country what to do, when they are doing what they usually are criticizing the rest of the country for. A bunch of damn hypocrites!!

cheats, pedophiles (sic), etc. What web site am I on?

I am not going to sit here and pretend what is, is not. Yes, they are everywhere else but these high and mighty hypocrites think the rest of the country needs to be purged as though they are in la,la land. Look, at a news report when something happens " Oh my god I didn't think this could happen here" why not because your town is so precious and sweet and defined by old movies and right wing bullshit...

I must be surrounded by pedophiles, liars, cheats, adulterers, etc.
Too bad all the cops are employed in the cities, they aren't even needed there.

I think that there are some key categories/impacts in which this can be considered - educational initiative (since universities in general tend to tilt strongly toward progressive, hence liberal/Democrat), religion (impact on the small community churches - which I suspect in many cases tilts toward conservative),and desire to keep things as they are - "conserving" things, hence by nature conservative. But generalizations are dangerous and often inaccurate. I grew up in Pawtucket RI - blue collar, but also quite strongly Democrat (union type jobs). I remember a friend telling me that once I got older, got a good job and started making money, I would "get more conservative". So there is also this tinge of greed that comes in - "if I could do it, why can't you....so don't look for help from me". Which, of course, runs counter to Christian doctrine (as taught by Jesus, anyway). I am sure fear comes in somewhere as well - perhaps in fear of change - as in all change is by definition bad.

I guess in general, I can't figure it out. If the Bush disaster years taught me anything, it is that I just don't understand people at all (I thought I did). I don't get greed, I don't get fear. I don't get how so many so-called religious people appear to be so full of hatred and loathing. My wife and I just continue to pull back and do what we can to make things better, but really don't interact with people nearly as much as we used to. I red tinged North Raleigh, that sort of thing just makes things feel worse.

I've often wondered if the harshness of life on the plains is part of the conservatism - "we survived the Dust Bowl, we got though the drouth of the 50s, we made it in spite of dirt and blizzards, you can do the same." At a class reunion in 1968 I ended up on one side and the rest of the class on the other. One woman, very wealthy, said she'd let a three-year-old starve to death before she'd give the child welfare. Of course, the wealthy woman was getting welfare herself - an oil depletion allowance, money from the government for not planting wheat, etc.

And so the small town people aren't so much thinking "Okay, we're small town, we should be conservative" but if they've lived there always, their world-view is so narrow, and they have no experience with other worldviews, that they tend to distrust it all.

Much like a small child has no other option but to think that whatever their family situation is is "normal" (I grew up assuming all my classmates hung out in bars with their dads and uncles for hours on end on the weekends) until they experience families outside their own, the small town mindset assumes that whatever they have is "normal" and that, since they are normal, everything else must be "abnormal".

A small town has a much greater chance to be homogeneous than a larger town.

And then along with that is the self-selective nature of much of small town life - that is, that it tends to attract people with narrow views and little world experience because it's a nice, safe place where one doesn't need to be confronted with that which is "different".

Of course, there are very liberal small towners, and those who choose small towns because they don't want to be crowded, love the outdoors, or want to live in a place that doesn't cost an arm and a leg.

Much of the small town attitude really stems from ignorance than intentional conservatism; but compounded by the peoples' ignorance that they should also try to be critical in their thinking.


And it's not just the US - this is typical of any small town anywhere in the world.

Such narrow-mindedness is with us across the ages. In medieval times it was not uncommon to live your whole life within 5 square miles. Not much in the way of fresh ideas or change.

Julie

If you are a church going person you spend 1/7 of your life being indoctrinated into that belief system. People are sheep.

Everything about their lives orbits around their friends and social life all of which is provided by their churches.

Religious people are so frequently blinded by their faith. There are so many nut-cases in politics today invoking religion as giving them this special throne to pontificate from... and sadly the US has many sheep ready to listen to practically anything they say as the truth of truths. Many can't even begin to think on their own. They are fodder in the hands of politicians exploiting them.

... you are far less likely to question its "teachings". People who grow up in cities are exposed to others with different beliefs, which can broaden their perspective.

thinking, to the point that they assume that their "salvation" means never ever ever adapting what they think is "right and wrong" AND being willing to force what they think on others directly or indirectly, at any and all costs, "for their own good."

Personally, I believe Religion is a HUGE failure. It has NOT resulted in anything like the average religious person following in the footsteps of Jesus. What it has become is mini-country-clubs, mutual admiration societies defined by EXCLUSION, and offering a salad of "spiritual" entertainment and social activities that reinforce self-righteousness, including what is apparently the hottest religious experience going right now: theatrical spiritual exhibitions/performances of various types, in which one can well imagine the coals of vanity being stoked and labeled "the Holy Spirit." Simply put, religion is a business that sells self-satisfaction, which makes people intellectually, emotionally, psychologically, and socially lazy and ir-responsible.

for those who are at the top. Hence, huge failure for what its intended outcomes are.

The human biological response mechanism is all one, folks, no walls or partitions between things. The response that is labeled Fear happens in the same places and with the same effects as the response labled Joy, or Love, or Hate, or . . . . This fact makes humans HIGHLY susceptible to conditioning by those who stroke the S/R biology and create and reinforce associations.

I remember once, reading in Newsweek, some special issue story about the rise of churches, some years ago. Anecdotal stuff about Sunday Schools running on M & Ms, pizza, pop, and ski-trips got this old Conservative Catholic with a 60s-style-Social-Justice upbringing to watching for more information about the differences between what I know Christianity to be and what some other folks think it is.

are susceptible to advertising. Perhaps this accounts for much of smoking as well. We want to think we have free will, but for the most part, are so easily fooled and easily led.

:puke:

Make mine Boulevard Porter! or there's this REALLY good "chocolate-bar" stout made in St. Louis now that I can't remember the actual name of, mmmmmmmmmm . . . . :beer: :beer: :beer: !

Now you are talking!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

All Good things in moderation, of course, but oh soooooo refreshing! I guess it's all of those B vitamins from the yeast and such. Oh no! That reminded me of hefeweizen, now I AM going to have to go out!

Religions of today are tax exempt corporations raking in the profits! Many of these churches are huge corporate empires. What a racket! I think many have their own own Bernie Madoff types working the finances. They are given special pedestals because they invoke the god word.

in Religious Studies recently remarked to me, "Religion is about power." Not just power among church leaders but power for church members. For many people, the church is the only taste of power they get (there are other sources of power but they don't recognize them). I suspect that's especially true about people in small towns. Excluding people from their church is powerful. Excluding people from their circle of friends because they don't belong to their church is powerful. Believing that their faith is the only right and true faith is powerful.

She's at Goddard so I don't see her often and I don't think she has her thesis yet, but that's the direction she is headed.

I think Max Blumenthal's thesis regarding "the politics of crisis" (There's a Democracy Now interview with him about his new book Republican Gomorrah - posted in DU videos) supports what you friend is saying. Damage/crisis probably elicits power seeking and acquisition in/with self and others.

The Church.

but I bet there aren't any of them telling their congregations that these days.

Of course we are only about 15 miles from a major PAC-10 University. (Go Ducks!)

No one told me I couldn't think for myself.

In fact I recall the Democratic party was quite big there.

control of the locals.
The "decision makers" (political and church figures) have a great deal of control through such tactics as blacklisting businesses and employment opportunities. A form of "shunning" in the social sense can also be used.
Most people are followers and consider acquiescence a positive move to have a safer life.

Everyone is a big fish in a small pond in a small town.

Usually their view of the world evolves around a tight knit community with similar thinking, religious leaders often thinking for them and probably a propensity to listen to similar conservative thinking and manipulation on radio and shows like Fox News, for example.

There is also a sense of pride now in being ignorant. In short, when you add all of this up, it leads to filtering the world through ones narrow view. I also don't believe many of these people have traveled much in the states let alone in other countries. And, individuals wanting that environment probably move there and contribute to the conservative thinking and reinforcement. The likes of the republican party are more than happy to exploit these environments.

PS: I grew up in a small town. When I've been back decades later it's still the same, stuck in decades past. I felt it was so conservative as a kid and I still feel that way. I also see a lot of the same family names there, so now there is generational conservatism.

... that were "in control" of things. Due to longevity, affluence, or whatever, it seems there's always been a very definite and clear "pecking order" ... whether it be determined by the amount of land, the size of some business, elected political positions, or church "leadership." At the same time, each of these small towns has had its designated "symptom bearers" ... folks who serve as the "bad examples." Perhaps due to criminal behavior, drunkenness, poverty, or whatever, the sanctions of "blood" seem to be common. What exacerbates such sociopolitical conservatism is the overwhelming tendency of those who get college educations to go for greener pastures -- and not opt to continue bagging groceries or mowing lawns. Where there's a "big foot" business, the "company town" syndrome takes hold. The only exceptions (and it's only a slight exception) are college towns ... but even there "the townies vs. the collegians" becomes a very strong de facto partitioning.

Autocrats and authoritarians are inherently conservative.

Ulen, MN, population 532. My mom is fully qualified to work at the local bank, but she will never be able to get a job there because her family are outsiders from a larger town (Fergus Falls, MN) and so doesn't have the family connections. The town was ruled by the iron fist of an old Republican ass for something like 40 years.

I was VERY surprised at all the Barack Obama bumper stickers I saw as well as the Creigh Deeds signs I saw. Deeds is the Democratic candidate for governor of Virginia.

Maybe things are changing.

I feel uniquely qualified to answer this.
There are several factors. The first one is that church is not considered a religious activity, it is considered a social activity.
Walk into any place of business as a newcomer, and the first thing they ask is "What church do you go to?" The churches spend so much time trying to be the BEST church in town--ie where all of the "important" people go, that they entirely forget their mission.
This is why it is sooo easy to poison the wells through churches in small towns. If the wannabe's see the "elders" (who are never poor or never underclass socially or economically)promoting agendas, then they are more likely to follow (whether or not they agree or disagree)because they are aspiring to climb socially themselves. Many people that you would NEVER see in church in a larger town attend just to be seen.
The second one is incestuously tied to the first. The social pecking order is closely related to the church pecking order. It is not a secret that the worst kids are always the preachers kids--this is because the clergy is isolated unto themselves in these small towns. Nobody wants the minister watching them closely or knowing that they are actually committing sins away from church. That would diminish their standing. This falls down the generational lines. The kids are told NOT to associate themselves with the preachers kids. Kids need social peers, and more often than not, the only ones willing to hang out with the preachers kids are kids whose families aren't considered to have social standing in the town anyway.
I live in a "dry" community. It is amazing when I venture to the towns where there is alcohol, I see many of the "elders". The same holds true with gambling. I always see these hypocrites tucked away in the corner at the casino hoping that nobody sees them.
The political lines again follow the social lines. There is no room for diversion. The same people that "lead" your churches lead your communities. They are the "in" crowd.
I could go on and on with the perils of small town conservatism, but the one true fact is that it is linked to what I have written above.
FWIW, I live on the fringe. I got caught up in the game several years ago (left because of intolerance) and it is amazing the fruits that these people get--they call them blessings...however, most of it is just plain bribery by those aspiring to be "one of them".

Living in Raleigh, when asked "which church do we go to", when we respond "we spend our Sundays contemplating the wonders of nature, kayaking, etc" we are quickly shunned!

I grew up in a small town...

Even a-political people have commented to me how much the churches RUN everything here.

You just described the town I live in.

Right down to the pastor with the nasty kids.

They have very limited exposure to anyone who is different from them, with new ideas, or different culture. They fear their "way of life" is threatened by anything that is different. Small towns are stagnant, with everyone knowing each other and the same people holding the same social positions generation after generation, anything from outside is perceived as not from their group and a threat.

I grew up in a town of 5,300 people in Kentucky btw. Never made it out of this totally damned red state, which I am regretting right now, but at least I live in a city of 260,000 that has a university and offers a small measure of diversity and freedom.

I believe that a large cause of small town narrow-mindedness is the narrowness of economic opportunity.

Generally speaking, small towns are dependant upon a single large business, or else are marketplaces which must cater to the whims of local agriculture, which again is often a large enterprise. In such situations, the leaders of that business can exert an unwarranted amount of influence over how the town thinks (or at least professes to think).

Since those who dictate the proper attitude and philosophy own the business, their influence tends to be against any changes which might adversely affect their income and influence.

Quite often a single religious denomination, even a single church, dominates. When the church’s authority colludes with that of the town’s financial leaders, the result can become especially chilling to nonconformists and eccentrics.

Those who wish to rebel against the town’s dictates are ostracized socially and punished financially. Generally, the more gifted and/or rebellious leave town. Only the ones who can agree with, or don’t think to question, the town’s dominant outlook remains.

And this is how a narrow-minded town — and usually a conservative one — is built.

which is about 100 miles north of me and no where else. How did I get to be so liberal? Grew up poor and learned that I was supposed to care about others. I will admit that the Lone Ranger helped me with other cultures. :sarcasm:

In Arcata, which is a liberal college town with a population of 14,000, nobody cares where you grew up.

In the Bay Area, LA, and most of the other big cities, most people weren't born there, so it really doesn't matter at all.

In Redding, which is a conservative small city with a population of 90,000, when you meet someone they almost immediately ask you what high school you went to, and your answer will determine where you fit in their circle of friends, relatives, and acquaintances. Boasting multiple generations in the area is some serious street cred.

In Oakhurst, which is a conservative small town with a population of 12,000, the question is what church you go to. If you say you don't go to church, you're immediately not even in their sphere of consideration. Many people have moved to the area from somewhere else, so being born there isn't very important, but fitting in with the culture is important.

It is that way in every society, in every culture. The rural areas are very conservative. Superficially "progressive" radicalism is rural areas is in reality a kind of idealistic archaism. People who don't like the conservatism tend to move away, to the local urban center.

Television and the little dish, Direct TV or Dish TV, either one.

I'd agree that 20 years ago when the local TV channel or two and at best a state-wide news paper was about all rural areas had to go on, but today - and particularly with the 24 hour news channels, they are as up to date as any city dweller if they chose to be.

The people with brains and the eccentrics leave town, leaving the local stupids to wallow in their groupthink and delusions.