Single payer was always dead in the water. Get over it.

Sorry to start a new thread about an existing cartoon thread, but the cartoon posted by n2doc explains exactly why single payer was dead in the water: it's because single payer would require taking away something from some people -- namely their private insurance, which for whatever reason, they are happy with.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x6544001



You may want single payer. I may want single payer. But as long as some significant number of voters don't want it, it is politically impossible to institute it. As long as teabaggers would consider it to be Democrats taking away their health insurance and forcing them to get gubmint insurance, it isn't and never was, going to happen. You can rail about how stupid the people are who don't want it, but you can't make them go away.

So, the next best option is the public option -- a kind of single payer for those of us who want it.

There is no point beating the dead horse of single payer. It was never even remotely a political possibility.

can you trust them to perfect mandated and subsidized private insurance in the interest of the people?



BTW, single-payer wouldn't "take away" anything. It replaces expensive and inferior insurance for affordable and superior coverage. But I admit, it might not have as cool of a logo or a little Gecko in the commercials

But maybe it just wont be an option for most people, nor viable enough long term. I think you are giving them a huge pass on that front.

Or just "some significant number"?

Many intransigent voters don't think the majority can vote to take away private contractual arrangements from the minority who want to keep their private insurance.

but not when the result is likely to be my early death because I can no longer afford healthcare.

Sure single payer would be a shock to the system. And tens of thousands of medical billing clerks (in doctor's offices and insurance companies) would be rendered redundant (along with a handful of really expensive insurance company CEOs). With the money saved we could retrain 'em all to be brain surgeons.

And you can get around the "no cancelling private contracts" (which the government is *not* barred from doing, I believe) by not making such contracts illegal but by making them uneconomic.

The government certainly can change private contracts -- although my point is, many people won't like it. That's the point. If you think the rw is going crazy now, what do you think would happen if the administration and Congress mandated everyone in Medicare plus?

Also, if done properly, the public option will eventually make private plans uneconomic, which is a much more "voluntary" way of getting to the same place.

Now you are citing "many intransigent voters". Why exactly is our republic held hostage by this group? What proportion of the voting public do they represent? Provide numbers to back up your claim.

I think your explanation is bullshit. Extending medicare to everyone is simple, easy to understand, does not require anyone to change doctors or healthcare providers, and would save businesses and individuals who currently provide or have employer based healthcare money while improving health care services. There is a much simpler explanation: our system of government is hopelessly corrupt and represents corporate interests over the people. We are not held hostage by your 'many' or your 'significant number', we are held hostage by the kleptocracy.

When the debate started, a majority were in favor of SP. Obviously it was not unanimous.

Then the RW got hold of the issue, and the gullible have swung against it, and maybe even against PO. "This group" isn't a fixed group, but the RW media, and the people who can be influenced by them.

Also, you are right that SP does not require anyone to change doctors or health care providers -- but the gullible are now defending their insurance companies.

Do you have any comment at all on what the cartoon means?

And this fabrication has convinced you and others that what is happening here is an expression of democracy and not a blatant manifestation of corruption. You have been hornswoggled.

The so called public option will be so cumbersome and inefficient that there will be a demand for change yet again.

That's why the rw is so terrified of it, not because of what it will do on its own.

The right wing is terrified of anything the black man proposes

...if only to get the best possible public option.

Just because the political reality is such that we can't have single payer today, there's no reason to stop pressing for it even if the weak, pale little substitute called a public option passes.

I think SP is dead in the water now, but believe that PO will evolve into SP.

unless there is unrelenting pressure to do so. That's why telling SP supporters to get over it now rubs me the wrong way.

:eyes:

Sadly, we will still not be getting a true public option under Obama's plan. It would be nice if a Democratic president could care more about the people who put him into office instead of pandering to big business once again. Change I can believe it and all that...does he even fucking remember that?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?

insurance system such as Medicare for All, instead of building on those numbers our Party has once again told us it is not possible.