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Note to freepers. there is really no "free market". It's all about who controls the market.

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MissMarple Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-12-09 12:14 PM
Original message
Note to freepers. there is really no "free market". It's all about who controls the market.
Can anyone name a human activity that is not regulated on some level? I'm sure there must be some. Carry on.
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Captain Hilts Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-12-09 12:16 PM
Response to Original message
1. And there is no 'free' market for health ins. either. Some states have very little competition. nt
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KansDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-12-09 12:17 PM
Response to Original message
2. This has certainly become evident during the bank and Wall Street bailouts...
I've seen the term "corporate communism" bandied about on DU of late. What exactly does it mean? :shrug:
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-12-09 12:18 PM
Response to Original message
3. Our government picks the winners and losers, *blames* it on the "invisible hand"
Edited on Mon Oct-12-09 12:18 PM by Romulox
When massive chunks of not only our economy, but the economies around the world are running on US taxpayer $$$. :wtf:
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tridim Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-12-09 12:28 PM
Response to Original message
4. Stupidity and ignorance are not regulated
That's about all I can come up with.
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MissMarple Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-12-09 12:39 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. Good point. Especially when they are purposefully cultivated.
But, those are qualities that result in unfortunate behaviors.
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Mist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-12-09 12:32 PM
Response to Original message
5. "Free market" = "free to pillage and plunder if you're a corporation." Of course, I
really wouldn't expect freeps to get it.
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dhpgetsit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-12-09 12:40 PM
Response to Original message
7. A functional market requires a Society and The Commons.
There must be laws and a justice department to enforce contracts and prevent people form stealing.
There must be means of efficiently transporting goods to markets and from markets to peoples' homes.
There must be a form of currency that all buyers and sellers can trust and agree upon.

All of these things cost money, normally and justly in the form of taxation.
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-12-09 12:43 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. Why should there be laws against stealing? Let the free market decide!
:shrug:
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MissMarple Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-12-09 12:46 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. Laws? We don't need any laws. Anarchy rules.
Edited on Mon Oct-12-09 12:47 PM by MissMarple
Did I detect a note of sarcasm? ;)
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-12-09 01:02 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. It's always useful to define the boundaries.
It's not at all obvious to me that the public should enforce a man's private property rights. In fact, basic economics suggests that the most "efficient" solution would be to let the robber and the property owner work it out amongst themselves--whoever derives the most "utility" from the potentially stolen property will invest the appropriate amount of energy into defending/obtaining the property, and thus the "free market" will determine the true market value of the property.

That's the theory, at least. But for some reason, this "clockwork universe" model of economics breaks down at this point: rich people simply cannot remain rich without a huge number of poor people defending their "right" to be rich. It's not easy to come up with a reason that the poor should defend this alleged right under a "free market" ideology. Like I said: Why not let the market decide? :shrug:
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dhpgetsit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-12-09 02:51 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. What freedoms are worth fighting for?
What freedoms are worth fighting for? The freedom of corporations to exploit workers and form monopolies? Or the freedom of We the People to define the playing field and rules under which corporations operate?
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-12-09 03:01 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. Your "freedom" to be rich is dozens of people's "freedom" to be poor.
If every man is free to act in his own best interest, why should I, a poor man, defend your property? Hire a private army; let the market decide. :hi:
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MissMarple Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-12-09 04:35 PM
Response to Reply #12
14. OK, I'll bite.
A private army would take or burn your crops, kill you, conscript your sons, rape and enslave your wife and daughters, if they didn't kill everyone outright. :)

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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-12-09 04:50 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. Serious question: aren't all of those "efficient" market transactions?
Edited on Mon Oct-12-09 04:51 PM by Romulox
Let the man who most values the property pay to either defend it or to capture it. Thus the market determines the "true value" of the property in question. That's the theory often cited. It appears it isn't a universal theory, however, as it breaks down without a lot of public support.

Why is it taken for granted that the peasantry will fight and die for the right of a few to be rich?
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MissMarple Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-12-09 06:07 PM
Response to Reply #15
18. Because it's a bait and switch and/or a protection racket.
Otherwise the "peasants" wouldn't. Insert patriotic propaganda or country of your choice " ______ uber alles".

People perennially suffer from a severe lack of critical thinking skills, basic knowledge of history and of human nature. Should I now go into a tearful funk lamenting the loss of the civilization as we know it? If I ever get to that point someone should put me in a nice "home" somewhere.
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Hawkowl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-12-09 03:10 PM
Response to Original message
13. Only free lunches for giant criminal corporations......nt
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Nikki Stone1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-12-09 05:10 PM
Response to Original message
16. If the market were REALLY free, Medicare would be able to get cheap Canadian drugs and not be forced
to buy expensive, Big Pharma meds at full price.
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DailyGrind51 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-12-09 05:14 PM
Response to Original message
17. Your employer is "free" to ship your job to Asia and your insurance company is "free" to dump you.
You are "free" to be poor, sick, and miserable!

"Freedom's just another word for nothing left to lose."

Kris Kristoferson for Janis Joplin
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