Microsoft Stuns With New Windows That Works

It isn’t often one feels the need to praise the Almighty over a computer operating system, particularly one from Microsoft Corp. Then again, Windows 7 is polished, stable and smooth -- in short, everything its unlamented predecessor, Windows Vista, wasn’t.

Personal computers preloaded with Windows 7, along with boxed and upgrade versions of the new software, go on sale Oct. 22. While the global economic turmoil makes predictions chancy, Windows 7 deserves to be a hit, and a stimulus to PC sales worldwide.

When I first began using Windows 7, my reaction was: This is just like Vista, except that it works. The user interface, called Aero, carries over from Vista, meaning that a computer running Win 7 more or less does things the same way.

The more I’ve used the new software, though, the more I’ve concluded my initial reaction was unfair. Windows 7 incorporates enough new features and improvements to be something you’ll want on its own merits, not just because it fixes old problems.

An example is what Microsoft calls Aero Peek. In Windows Vista, hovering the cursor over an item in the task bar -- the strip across the bottom of the screen that lets you keep track of what’s open -- would generate a small image of the window’s contents. In Windows 7, resting your cursor on the small image opens a full-sized one; click your mouse, and the larger window instantly becomes live.


How good is Windows 7? It still isn’t nearly as elegant or intuitive as Snow Leopard, the current version of Apple Inc.’s Mac operating system. The upgrade path for XP users is ugly, and any endorsement must be tempered by the knowledge that even Vista didn’t seem so bad when it was first released

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601093&sid=aOPDkFraCDYY


For those who think I'm cheer leading for Microsoft, cheer leading for Linux is no better, and being an Apple fanboy is worse. the MAJORITY of DU members use WINDOZE operating systems and are NOT geeks like many of us. It behooves them to upgrade.

I've been using various pre-release versions for nearly a year now, it is genuinely better than Vista. Some are saying that it's little more than a Vista service pack packaged (and priced) as a new OS but, even if that were true, it's still worth making the move. You can't put a price on your sanity.

Doesn't have the horsepower for Vista or 7.

...and I've heard talk about it appearing in some form on netbooks, so don't give up on getting it running on your machine at some point. You'll lose much of the eyecandy, but the actual OS might work fine.

The first was a basic socket 775 2.8 Intel single core with a gig of memory (I did a whole thread on the install this spring). Did a Athlon 64 dual core with a couple of gig and a nice Nvidia video card, and then a Core2Duo with 4 gig of memory and an ATI kick ass video card.


Smooth and flawless no matter what flavor.

I guess I'm just used to the concept of "if your PC is running Windows X and you want X+1 (let alone X+2), your PC is too slow."

I think M$ learned their lesson from that and spent a bit more time optimizing 7 for less-uber machines.

They will need more memory, but that's cheap money, we've already tested them on Windows 7 and they run as well, maybe even a little faster than XP. They were originally decommissioned because they couldn't run Vista. These are Dell GX260 desktops of 2000-2001 vintage, 2GHz processors and 256-512MB installed memory. We will boost them up to at least 1Gb and use them until they fall apart :)

Almost all of them are equipped with half a gig of RAM and only a few of them are hyperthreaded and they all run unbearably slow, even on XP. Since then, we've upgraded to IBM/Lenovo M51 and M52 desktops and T400 laptops, but we've still got 100+ of the old Dells. I don't think many of them will return to production, but it sure is convenient having them around to cannibalize. The FDA will make the jump directly to Windows 7, but I'm not sure exactly when that will be.

Too true. I call them iZombies.

I've been through a series of netbooks, a used ThinkPad (best keyboard in the universe) and cheap-o laptops over the past few years, all of which failed in one way or another. It's the first Mac I've owned, though I've used Macs at work and for programming before. It's not a bad computer. My only complaint so far is that the application installation process was designed by a masochist. Probably a masochist running Next or something. But on the whole it's pretty good.

Apparently my expectations of a working computer for $1300 are unreasonable, my iBook never worked and multiple logicboard replacements and a refurbished replacement and I still never had a working machine and every time I went to the Apple Store I was in a sea of my fellow disgruntled iBook owners who compared notes on which logicboard or iBook replacement they were on while waiting for our audience with the supposed "Mac Genius"

My iBook NEVER worked, Apple couldn't fix it and I am the asshole for not holding Apple as a corporate deity.

My old POS laptop that I was getting ready to give to charity was stolen yesterday in a burglary.

I'll be able to replace it sooner than later, now that I can bypass Vista entirely.

:cry:

and chased them a couple of blocks. A person on the next street doing yard work saw what was happening and got the license number of the getaway car.

So far, nothing has happened, but I feel hopeful that something will. Well, besides the two of them having to change their clothing after soiling themselves.

:hug:

Why should I upgrade from XP unless I am replacing all the hardware too? Someone please explain. Drivers for all your hardware doesn't magically appear like manna from heaven ya know?

And Xp is a good stable operating system and ain't much you can't do with it.

XP will be supported till 2015, so that tells you about the stability. WIN7 is an attempt to get corporate America OFF of XP and start spending IT budgets again.

...there's no reason to change. At some point, however, hardware makers will stop making drivers for XP, so you might find your choice limited when it comes to replacing a printer/scanner/monitor etc. That's still some way off, however.

I have yet to plug in anything that wasn't auto-recognized and running within 2 minutes, the only exception being my soundcard (but that's a pro studio card, not consumer ware - I expect to install the drivers manually for that one...worked first time though).

Lexmark Trio printer/scanner/copier for example.

http://support.lexmark.com/index?page=answers&startover=y&question=P3150&locale=en&productCode=LEXMARK_PHOTO_P3150&segment=DOWNLOAD&userlocale=EN_US#2

whatever you say. :eyes:

The driver model is the exact same, so a driver that works under Vista will work under 7. Only thing to be careful about is whether you use the 32 or 64 bit version. Manufacturers won't claim Win 7 support for old products because they don't want to go to the bother of resubmitting a discontinued product for certification.

It so happens several months ago I recall seeing people with Vista could not get it to work with this printer. Where are you getting this information on the driver?

http://www.techspot.com/blog/354/no-windows-7-drivers-yet-try-using-vistas/

Vista & Windows7 have same driver stack.

Most VISTA drivers you can just run and they work. Some will fail because the Driver is checking for Vista (to avoid installing on say Win98) and doesn't recognize Win7.
Using the trick above can be used to trick the driver into thinking it is being installed on Vista box.

Older hardware likely will never get Win7 drivers unless it is already part of Win7 driver library.

There never has been a Vista driver for the model printer I have, and the lexmark doc about Win7 drivers does not list my printer. Thats just the facts. There is no need to discuss it but I was amazed when the previous poster was trying to tell me they knew something that was clearly not the case.

I stayed with W2k until support stopped. I'll stay with XP till support stops.

I've been using XP since '05.

what I have heard. It runs quite well and it is for the taking.

http://www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu/download

now with Vista.... that you can get a Windows 7 voucher for. Wallyworld has them, Tigerdirect has them, Beast Buy has them... you really can't go wrong if the price is right.

Before Vista came out, a number of vendors sold "Vista ready" computers, which turned out to be not quite as ready for Vista as they should have been. I believe there was even a class-action suit about it.

I'd recommend waiting until new machines start appearing with Win 7 preinstalled, just in case.

Vista was a resource hog. It really doesn't run well with anything under 3 gigs of memory and the standard mid range computer at the time was being built with 1 gig. Win 7 actually runs better on less hardware by far than vista, so virtually any new machine out there right now should run well with it.

I think you will be hard pressed to find a machine in a retail store that cant run it well.

Having said that the versions of it I have worked with so far still have some quirks but they are not the production version and the quirks are minor. I will probably switch all my machines over to win seven when the retail version hits the shelves.

with my Mac, thanks. Bill Gates is the anti-christ in our house.

At least anybody trying to write drivers for the bloody catastrophe thought so.

no way, no how I am upgrading until at least SP 1, preferably SP 2...

And if Apple gets their act together with the games hubby plays.... mac for us.

I still get shivers just thinking of the issues that vista gave us.

And yes, I am a geek.

I like a computer that works... why I am posting this from a Macbook running Snow Leopard.

Windows 7 is Vista SP2. They are just charging an arm and a leg for releasing what Vista was supposed to have been in the first place. We have been simply beta testing for MS the last few years while they finally got Vista code solid.

Windows 7 is a good solid well performing OS. It is how ever the actual RTM version of Vista and the prices they are charging are nothing short of robbery.

Win7 is cheaper than Vista. Any XP user is getting a substantial upgrade for moderate price. OEM copy is $99. Figure 7 years mainstream support = 96 months. That works out to about a $1 per month. Likely your computer costs more in electricity.

He shouldn't have to pay again for what he purchased in the first place.

People who have purchased Vista shouldn't have to pay more than 20 to 50 bucks for Win7.

Thank the netgodz for bittorrent.

SJ says Karma will come back to bite you!

been running 7 since fathers day. one needs to upgrade the bits and pieces in the box to make 7 run properly

He fell down a staircase at M$ HQ. Repeatedly.

An auditorium hall full of Windows developers witnessed an execution at the Professional Developers Conference here Wednesday, as Microsoft product managers coolly and deliberately killed the Microsoft Office Assistant.


The assistant, a paper clip with expressive eyes and hyperactive eyebrows that offers user tips, has been the source of wide scorn among developers, who have little use for its cuteness and intrusiveness. The assistant's demise triggered a hearty round of applause.

Brian Valentine, general manager of the Application and Tools Group at Microsoft, and product manager Tom Rizzo showed developers how to get rid of the agent with a line of Visual Basic code that Microsoft will post to its Web site for downloading.

In the demonstration, Rizzo clicked on a menu that offered the option "kill the assistant." After choosing that option, the paper clip said, "I'm melting, I'm melting," and then disappeared.

"Good riddance," one unidentified developer commented to a colleague after the deed was done.

http://www.cnn.com/TECH/computing/9810/16/clipdeath.idg/

http://www.cracked.com/blog/clippy-finally-messes-with-the-wrong-word-doc/

:rofl:

I was hoping for direct inhalation to the cranium! :-)

And when I finally figured out how to turn it off entirely (which took awhile for an old lady late to the PC party), the damn thing had the audacity to get on its little bike and LOOK AT ME BALEFULLY OVER ITS SHOULDER before it pedaled into oblivion!

Made me furious.

"Would you like me to help with that?"

please restart your computer for your new settings to take effect.

I was stuck on Win98 for many years longer than most. One day I was given a laptop with WinXP on it. I kind of liked it, though some of the registry restrictions were difficult for me to deal with. I noted that the OS seemed to be a music and video computer, mostly, or at least one that made those uses trivial. Anyway, I found myself wondering what it would cost to upgrade all my computers to WinXP. So, I started searching, and found a few new disks that weren't terribly expensive, but these "deals" in turn led me to licensing questions. So I went to Microsoft's site, and tried to figure it out. After looking it over for at least 10 minutes, I realized I would need to spend a considerable amount of time, perhaps a day or two to read through and understand their licensing schemes. I'm not talking about their legalese, I'm talking about their webpages. At some point I decided that their pages had probably been designed to appeal to corporate lawyer types.

I wiped the drive and installed Linux. It does what I need it to do. I'm still not terribly familiar with it, and may not ever be, but it works well enough.

DU, purity where none is needed.

The author might well have been paid a pittance, it's not like it's great prose. It was more the prostitutional aspect of it that lead me to wish the author was well compensated.

I use lots of operating systems, presently WinXP, Win98SE, Ubuntu, FreeBSD. In the past I have used, and coded for, and in, quite a few others.

or a prostitute, and we can't post articles without SOMEONE pissing on the thread.


I am so happy you coded for and in, I haven't coded yet in my life but when I do, I hope it's in a hospital where I can get decent care. :sarcasm:

the poor suffering bastards condemned to wander the earth, begging for alms, and using Windows.

They've deserved a break for a long, long time.

We Mac users can afford to be generous, and we should wish the Windows crowd well in their hoped for entry into OS nirvana.

Peace be upon you all. May Windows 7 be all that you hope it will be. And may you use it in good health.

O8)

:rofl:

But things have been going better for me lately than they have for a long time, so I'm basically mellowed out. Hell, I can even feel sympathy for Windows users.

At least, according to the article's author and many on this thread. I can't simply enjoy using my computer. I must be a "fanboy." Except, when a hundred people chime in to say "APPLE SUCKS! YOU'RE ALL FANBOYS!", that's not being a Windows "fanboy" for some reason. Hmmm.

You know, sometimes a product just works well. It's designed well, it does what it promises, it isn't a burden to own. If deciding upon that product (and posting that I like it) makes me a "fanboy," well...fine. Fanboy here. But what idiotic nickname do we have to come up with for all the Windows "fanboys?" Winboys? Douchebags? There's got to be a similar pejorative.

.

Kind of like fundamentalists. You are evil and will be chewed apart by daemons if you don't go to my windows church.

"The Apple Fanboy" thing is just like what Limpballs does. They pull it out of their asses and claim that every mac user is a rat-fucking commie and aborted baby eater.

It's a fucking computer, not your religion.

"Fuck the Windows Borg."

:rofl:

;)

Can't call me an Apple Fanboy cuz I's a girl!

Plus them thar iPods and iPhones made some believers out of even Windoze users!

hell, does Flight Simulator 11 do what was heavily advertised for Flight Simulator X with DirectX 10?

Effin' fraudsters, microsoft... I don't care if people are out there being fanbois of the Timex Sinclair XZ80. It's hard to be even more dilettante-and-get-away-with-it than microsoft.

:cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry:


:cry:

no headaches, to my surprise

(it was free, but will stop working in a few months so I'll have to either buy the retail version or use something else then)

... but if you think that gets you mileage...

problems.

i refused vista forever and he finally put it on. kept shutting my computer down and a pain in ass

i havent had any issues with window 7. works for me

Your PC will run faster than ever, and it's FREE. :)

www.ubuntu.com

I'm linux counter user # 36,5XX registered in 1996.......

:hi:

2.6.31.4 :D :hi:

Because if it doesn't, it isn't worth the hassle. Setting up wireless for quite a few cards is about the same amount of hassle as setting up X in Slackware about 15 years ago. I still can't get my television dongle to work, because there's no documentation on supporting that particular model.

XP -> some flavor of UNIX

Not one more damn dime to Microsoft and their H1-B indentured servitude factory

but I guess these days pretty trumps practical.

:shrug:

because I was so tired of being disappointed by Windows. One month into it it, I am wondering WHY I didn't do this long ago. My MacBook came with Leopard installed, but guess what I found in the box? A FREE upgrade to Snow Leopard. You think MS will do that? NOT My Mac works like a champ, has had not ONE failure or glitch, and seems to be hands down, more advanced and reliable than windows ever could be. Thats my $.02

And all PC still on the market with Vista will NOT be given a free upgrade to 7. Nonetheless, My Mac rocks. I have been an apple skeptic for years, but I have seen the light!

So it would be like buying a PC AFTER Oct 22nd which still has Vista on it. On Oct 2nd PC will be sold with Windows 7 ALREADY installed.

Glad you like your Mac but it is a false comparison.

The equivalent would be buying a PC after Oct 2nd and it still having Vista and not having Windows 7 upgrade.

Go to any store to buy a PC and you will find many PC's with windows on it. Whats your point, anyway? Apple provided me with a FREE upgrade. Will MS do that? It IS a direct comparison.

So no Microsoft won't get you a "free" Windows 7 upgrade disc.... the machine will ALREADY have Windows 7 installed.
What part of that concept do you not understand?

It would be the same as if the Mac had instead had SL already installed.

Had you bought the Mac BEFORE SL launched and somehow it came w/ free upgrade that might mean something.
Instead you bought it AFTER SL launched and instead of Apple upgrading the machine for you they drop an upgrade disc in the box and somehow you equate that as better?

just like XP PC's were. What part of that concept do you not understand?

Let me rephrase: Will MS be including a free 7 upgrade with all pc's sold with Vista? I think not.

Why are we arguing about this, anyway? Its a stupid computer. I switched to Mac and I am happy. If you choose to go with 7, I hope you are as happy as I am. Good luck. See you in the next thread.

Ever windows PC sold after June 26th (4 months before Windows 7 launch) has free upgrade to Windows 7.

http://www.microsoft.com/windows/buy/offers/upgrade-option.aspx

Computer manufacturers have stopped shipping Vista machines in an attempt to outsell Win7 boxes on Oct22nd. Quickly now Win7 machines will go back to the manufacturer because given the choice:
a) machine with win7 installed natively
b) machine with Vista & ability to upgrade to win7

which do you think consumer will pick? Within a week other than the occasional clearance item everything will be Windows7.

We are arguing because you are wrong. If you want to make a claim like you like your Mac more, or you feel Mac is better value, or you recommend a Mac to anyone that is fine.
You want to start making claims not based on the fact well expect to get called out on them.

Apple included an upgrade DVD to SL AFTER the launch of SL because it is cheaper than sending it back and having it upgraded. Apparently despite the highest profit margins in the industry they can't "afford" the cost. Actually they can but they know many Mac consumers will gladly do the work for them and then turn around and call it a "free upgrade".

The site does say "The upgrade fulfillment method may vary by PC manufacturer. When you buy a qualifying PC from a PC manufacturer that has chosen to participate in the Windows 7 Upgrade Option Program" so not ALL pc's will get a free upgrade. I have read some blogs where folks are mad they have to buy 7. Anyway, you are right.

Windows really IS awesome!!! :sarcasm:

You don't understand what the poster is saying. Packed into every Apple box is a set of coupons could for the next OS upgrade. Makes sense, or else no one would bother to buy a new Mac in the months before a new release. Apple makes sure your new Mac will have the newest OS no matter when you buy it. It's good business strategy that MS doesn't generally follow, afaik, because Microsoft doesn't make computers. It would probably be up to the OEM to include the Windows upgrade, since there are licensing fees and issues. But I don't think any flavor of Windows comes with a free upgrade to the next version, as Apple computers do.

.

But I don't think any flavor of Windows comes with a free upgrade to the next version, as Apple computers do.
Well you might think that but it doesn't make it true.

http://www.microsoft.com/windows/buy/offers/upgrade-option.aspx

Also based on the time line that was provided by the poster Snow Leapord had already launched. Apple could have installed SL and then there would be no need for an "upgrade" DVD. To save cost the included a DVD in the box to let user upgrade themselves. That isn't exactly an upgrade in my book. After Oct 2nd virtually all PC will have Win7 installed (no need for a "Free" upgraded DVD). Those that don't won't sell because consumer will pick the one with Win7 installed and will get returned to OEM where they will installed Win7 and sell them.

...your response still misses some fundamental issues of retailing and packaging. Apple made a bunch of Macs with Leopard installed. They didn't all sell by the time Snow Leopard was released. But the Leopard machines were already shipped, packaged, boxed, inventoried, etc, etc, etc. It makes no economic sense for Apple to pay employees to rip open sealed cartons and upgrade the OS's of every unsold computer. Just doesn't make sense on so many levels (even down to many consumers' unease at purchasing a big-ticket item which has obviously been opened and resealed). So Apple includes a coupon you redeem for a DVD. Insert the DVD, click the button. Doesn't really sound like a big deal to me. Maybe you've never upgraded a Mac...it's pretty damned simple, and usually fairly quick.

Also, getting back to the retailing angle: you assume that consumers would simply refuse to buy a computer without Win7 already installed. Not in the America I know, not with the economy the way it is, not with places like Wal Mart and other big discount stores looking for a cheap price point with which to draw in customers (who might be upsold). Plenty of people would be happy to buy an outdated model at a big markdown. Especially if the price difference means new computer or going without.

:rofl:

http://www.eiass.com/E-NewsOffshoring157.html

Maybe they'll realize that if even the good workers don't make enough money to buy the aforementioned products, all will lose in the end. And it's not about being good since everything going on is about cost lowering and not rewarding good work ethics.

And given MS product quality, I sure as flying hell won't buy them.

You guys trying to convert regular people who just try to get by everyday, to way too expensive Apple products or Linux which ISN'T an easy install under any circumstance for the non-geeks among us, unfairly pound Windows threads. I will not do to you folks what you are doing here.



Just my two cents (adjusted for inflation)


:hug:

because of this, I'm not planning on switching until it gets fixed.

There is a command line option (so 99% of user will never even know how to find it) in chkdsk that allows you to use all available memory to speed chkdsk.
The problem is on some (<10% of intel machines) an issue in the hardware of computer fails when all memory is used.

So it is more the aggressive nature of the chkdsk option that exposes a flaw in *some* hardware. The issue got blown way out of proportion.
If anything it exposes a flaw in hardware design (likely requires a BIOS update). Also given the scope (an optional parameter of a command line option on chkdsk utility) what % of users will be affected? If they are affected they can either have their computer hardware fixed (via bios update) or not run that *optional* parameter.

I ran chkdsk on two different machines (one intel, one amd) and it had no problems.

Tell 99% of users to open command prompt and execute the following command chkdsk /r but only on a non-system drive and they likely couldn't find the bug.

so I doubt most users would even notice said rumored issue.

we're a Volume License/Software Assurace shop so we get the newest Microsoft software a few months before the retail channels. Windows 7 Enterprise has been really solid so far. I've let a couple regular users have it, and so far no panicked phone calls. :) I even have it running under Parallels on the advertising director's new 24" iMac with Snow Leopard as the host OS. I gave the Windows 7 virtual machine one processor core and allocated 1GB of RAM. It still feels quite snappy and runs Office, Outlook, and the business system like a champ.

Todd in Cheesecurdistan

fool me twenty two times in a row and I'm an idiot begging for abuse.

http://www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu">Get Ubuntu. Faster, more stable, more secure, doesn't require a bleeding-edge gaming system to browse the web and send email, oh, and it works.

Compare that to 6% of Vista machines at launch.

http://www.dailytech.com/Majority+of+Corporate+PCs+are+Ready+for+Windows+7/article16531.htm

Win7 runs just fine on 3, 5, even 7 year old hardware.

The one thing I would recommend if you have a machine with <= 1 GB of ram go ahead and upgrade the ram.

2GB of DDR2 (pair of 1GB dimms) runs about $40. It isn't required but Win7 seems "snapper" running 2GB.

and will still never match the free Ubuntu for machine speed and capacity, nor for security and (probably, we'll see) stability.

Windoze is reality and I occasionally (and very reluctantly) work with it, at one time it made me what I called rich, but I think people deserve to know they are able to choose something better, that will do all they need and won't cost them money or their privacy.

About all I use Win7 for is gaming and oh yeah I incidentally need to get online for this or that RIGHT FUCKING NOW!!1!111!. Since everything I do online works in Ubuntu, there's really no sense comparing them; the experience is identical regardless of the OS (although, for some reason, Ubuntu doesn't like to run flash movies such as on YouTube fullscreen on my system- I'm still fixing that bug).

However, linux still will not run many games as they are intended to be run. I'm a PC gamer for several good reasons, and I am forced to depend upon Windows as my gaming platform. While it is true that I have been able to get games working with WINE that I truly thought simply would not work (such as "Command & Conquer 3", "Civilization 4", "Children of the Nile", "Doom3", and others), none of them function precisely as they would within Windows, always to the detriment of the experience as a whole. This is true for many 3D applications in general running in linux using WINE.

If developers were coding for OpenGL as well as DirectX, and making linux binaries of their executables, linux gaming would be just as robust as Windows gaming. That is Micro$oft's death knell as a company that makes an operating system; if linux ran all games (and applications) as well as Windows, Windows would die a very swift death among the end user public. Micro$oft knows this, balls to bones, which is why they FUD linux so mercilessly. It may also be why they're continuing the 360 line even though they're aware of the high failure rate.

I think they're trying to get ready.

I truly believe DirectX is about the only thing holding up the Windows brand as a public commercial product at this point. Ubuntu is so easy to set up, so stable, and so free (as in 'free beer') that the public would not be able to resist it if major titles started coming out for it as well as Windows and 360.

I know I could have a dual-boot system, and maybe I will in the meantime, to better familiarize myself with it.

I'm really hoping W7 will be the last operating system I buy.

You can run Windows 7 using Ubuntu as a host OS. You need an app called VirtualBox. It's part of one of the official Ubuntu repositories; I'm pretty sure you can apt-get install it or grab it in the Add/Remove Programs dialog. I'm in 7 right now, so I can't check without rebooting.

VirtualBox lets you install Ubuntu as the primary OS and run Windows 7 (among other operating systems) on a virtual disk. I wasn't able to really push it, as my Ubuntu install doesn't have enough space to install a really modern game of any sort (I only learned about VirtualBox after I installed everything). I haven't read any negative reviews for non-gaming usage, though. You just need a lot of RAM for it to work as well as it should- I'd recommend not less than 6GB for Win7 atop Ubuntu (and keep in mind, RAM is cheap). Still, it's worth trying out if you're trying to migrate from Windows to linux.

I really do have to say, all my Ubuntu experiences have been great. I did have one abnormal install issue with my motherboard- my BIOS doesn't support APIC (whatever that is) so I have to force linux to emulate it- but I was actually able to solve that here at DU, and it runs flawlessly now.

Why you (or anyone else for that matter) bothers with two systems is beyond me. If You can't do everything you want to on your Umberto the flying pizza system,




why bother? I just don't get it. You folks piss on Windows, but all you've done here is complain about the issues you have with Umberto. And the point about gaming is simply silly. Wasted time, wasted effort to NOT use a system suited for your game experience.


I have a suggestion, start a thread praising Umberto and then you can try to convert as many people as you like, sort of like the Christians trying to convert the heathens, then I am sure you'll be happy.

There was one single issue that wasn't Ubuntu's; it's an issue with my SATA controller because the people who programmed it were lazy and didn't bother to include power-saving features into the chipset (probably because those features are mainly used for laptops). It's not even something I can flash my BIOS for, but a simple command added to the line that loads the kernel fixed it for good. I had to tell it to emulate AHIP support; the OS tells me to "complain to (my) hardware vendor". RoyGBiv in Computer Help & Support kindly tossed me the answer.

I'm not "pissing on Windows" at all; in fact, if you care to look at my posts on the subject, I've repeatedly stated that Windows 7 is probably the best Microsoft OS to date. It's fast, doesn't make sure you're making sure about making sure that you really in fact definitely without a doubt and most surely want to run that program the way Vista did, 3D applications run like melted butter (I had a truly impressive performance boost in gaming vs WinXP), and it's in general just a good, solid OS. I've also said, repeatedly, that even the Windows 7 beta runs better than Vista did on release. Windows 7 gets a glowing review from me. Other Windows OSes, not so much. XP was decent, but I bought the x64 Pro edition, and some older Windows programs don't like that at all. Thankfully, most of those run under WINE in linux, so I'm golden no matter what track I follow.

But there's also something to be said for an OS that is free and just works, that has all development tools built in, isn't even vulnerable to the sorts of viruses and trojans that affect Windows users (being a totally different OS), etc. My one complaint about linux in general relates to gaming, because (most) game developers write for DirectX and not OpenGL as well- one exception to that would be id Software (sic). Since I can install 7 using Ubuntu as a host, the next time I reformat, I'll give Ubuntu a little more space so I can test gaming in 7 with Ubuntu in the background. It should be interesting to see what sort of performance I can achieve, and if it's acceptable, I'll just drop Ubuntu on the whole drive, slap Windows 7 on top of it using VirtualBox, and thus not have to reboot to get into another OS. PC joy will ensue.

That's what I want most; to only use Windows when I have to, and to not have to reboot to do it. I don't want to have to rely on Microsoft, and I want a lot more control over the system than Windows provides. I don't have a lot of cash to spend on an operating system or 3D modeling software or photo editing or burning DVDs; Ubuntu either comes with all of it in place or you can get it by typing sudo apt-get <application_Name> or via Add/Remove Applications.

I give glowing praise to both Windows and linux, but I'm more *impressed* with the linux community because the community drives the development of the various linux distros. If that's "pissing on Windows", then facts bother Microsoft... and some of its users.

Where I am sitting, there are NINE computers, from a Win98 system for old DOS games I STILL love to play, four WIN XP Pro systems, two Vista, two Win 7 test mules on the floor waiting for various components to be plugged in and tested. Two XP are test mules, period, for hardware and software for work. One Vista is a game mule (soon to become Win7 since it is my most powerful system) for playing Warhammer on line and beta testing new games (yup I do that too). The other Vista system I will be giving away to someone needy on DU (I do that too, in spite of what some think). One XP Pro is a very serious AMD quad-core ATI HD 4770 gaming system (this one I am posting from), and will ABSOLUTELY get upgraded to Win 7 and one XP system is for business applications and remote access to my office. One final XP system is ONLY for plugging infected hard drives into for cleaning and for repairing corrupted files. Oh, and there is my Netbook too. There are four monitors in here, all hooked up with KVM switches to the various systems.

I work in Windows, always have, and that's where my expertise lies. I really have no interest in any flavor of Linux since this is a business and not a hobby purpose, and we have no interest in Ubuntu at work for any reason, and NO ONE we deal with writes software for it. As a matter of fact, GM still only recognizes WIN XP Pro for all of their applications, and only limited Vista business (for notebook based re-programing software for the new Camaros. Equinox and Cadillacs).


I appreciate your taking the time to explain your position. Too often (as is apparent in this thread) people 'drive by' splatter shit in the thread, and keep going. But many of them do that in other threads.

Thanks, be well.

About the only thing I take mild exception to in what you said is your referring to Ubuntu and other linux distros as 'hobby' OSes; they're really not- they're based on UNIX, which (as I'm certain you know) is used commercially, or at least was the last time I bothered to ask someone. I don't know of commercial use of linux outside server use, but I'm sure there are POS systems (that's point-of-sale, all ye snarkers) out there somewhere that utilize a simple linux kernel attached to a touchscreen display. The Postal plant I work in used to use QNX for all their machines; they all use Windows now (although all functions excepting the machine's application are locked out). The application is identical in form and function, though, so someone rewrote it from the ground up.

That probably wasn't a very fun job. Incidentally, I tried QNX once and found it to be so much utter crap, so I'm almost violently unsurprised that they switched to Windows.

Now, RedHat 3 was a hobby OS, as in, it was my hobby to get RedHat 3 with X running. *snort* It's come a long, long way since then, even for gaming (Left 4 Dead is platinum rated at the Wine AppDB for Ubuntu). I'm pretty sure we'll never see large companies using any flavor of linux as their standard OS because of Microsoft's support packages and contract obligations, though.

LOL... check out what you would have to do to get Warhammer Online running in Ubuntu (as quoted from the Wine Application Database, but I omitted the links). Thankfully, I don't need to do this, as I don't play Warhammer, in linux or not:



:rofl: But clearly, people do want to be able to do this. Well, if they want to game online in linux (always a dicey proposition, even today), this is what they have to do, and that's sort of a shame. A linux Warhammer client could be programmed, but I understand the hesitation from a technical standpoint. The only way it would work is if the community understood very clearly that no tech support would be offered for the linux versions. Since people are paying for Warhammer Online, I doubt the user base would accept that.

Someday, linux will be able to deliver a Windows experience (it already can with VirtualBox, but that's still Win-on-lin sex), but until then, we'll all be stuck with the whole multiple-OS thing. Nirvana would be "every OS can run every application, with perfect of stability and performance", but right now we're stuck with "perfect" being replaced with "varying degrees".

In short, whatever works, works.

And those of you who INSIST on pissing on these threads because you have an axe to grind (sorry you don't understand workarounds) maybe the next time you sing the praises of Buntoo take one, you should ask yourself why it isn't used in schools and MAJOR CORPORATIONS, or is it because it simply is made for miscreants who think Microsoft personally fucked with their lives?

I am a developer......

try opening Monster or DICE or Careerbuilder and type in

".NET"
"Sharepoint"
"C#"
"VB.NET"
"MS SQL"

to not have those skills in my field is utter lunacy. I am going to reduce my job qualifications, get paid less over my lifetime, and retire poorer because Microsoft is "ebil" and Apple is "leet"? I think not.
As long as Microsoft skills are in demand I am going to stay in demand by having those skills.

It ensures super long hours and perpetual crisis, not to mention the entire "continual education" scam that has sprung up around the profession to continually tax your output.

have yet another thread to hijack for their own personal agenda. But you already knew you are what you hate..........


Two words, and they aren't Merry Christmas.

National governments, school systems, banking and financial institutions,, universities, children, old people, stupid people and smart people use Linux variants all over the world. It is only in America that M$ has been allowed to lie, cheat, and steal for decades to create it's monopoly.

It doesn't make it good.

If you want to pay $150 to beta test their OS, feel free, I'm just letting folks know they don't have to put up with their crap.

Scare me.

Miscreants? Really?

Perhaps you and your Windoze drones should look outside the US as to what is actually necessary. Of course, that's what you should do, not what you actually will do.

lots and lots of tombstones on it, getting a little sparse so I figure one more Buntoo Beetle on it won't hurt.

cheers

Damn.

I love the little flirty way you suggest I'm going to be tombstoned soon while you sing the praise of a super-corporation and how much if loves us all.

Smooches.

I went from XP to Win 7, never even tried Vista.

hearing their OS is just the same as Shitdoze. Whatever, I use both and not impressed with the new Mac hoopla. Windows has no right to even act like Win7 is the shit, took em long fucking enough. :eyes:

I'm surprised.

I experienced a massive performance increase in my games and other 3D apps. Traditional uses function flawlessly.

Windows 7 is to Vi$ta as Window$ XP is to Window$ ME. Except better.

I still like Ubuntu the most, but I need Window$ for games.

I may end up buying this, skipped Vista entirely, and never regretted that.

I'd shuck out the clams to buy the whole OS, personally. It really does work, and it really is a whole lot better than Vista was- and it takes less to run it. And the performance increase in DX11* is leaps and bounds better than DX9 in XP.

I can actually play Crysis now, instead of looking at a bunch of pretty screenies. :)

*DXDiag reports the Windows 7 version of DirectX as DX11

But I still buy the upgrade version of the OS(cheaper), you just tell it to do a clean install, and it does an "upgrade check" and that's when I insert my WinXP install CD for it to scan really quick, then it'll be done with that, no mess(hopefully).

a complete dog (no offense to actual dogs!) but it was followed by Windows 2000, which was pretty good for its time. Then Windows XP, which as I recall, had many problems until they brought out Service Pack 2. (I still haven't installed SP3 - afraid to)

I know some people who were pretty happy with Vista but I'm glad I skipped it.

had little or nothing to do with the windows that ran on top of DOS like win 98 and windows ME.

Windows NT was also a good operating system.

Windows ME which succeeded Win98 was a disaster, trying to build more and more stuff on top of such a flawed OS just wasn't a good idea.

Window NT -> Windows NT 4.0 -> Windows 2000 -> windows XP

Windows 3.11 -> Windows 95 -> Windows 98 -> windows XP

Ironically Windows 7 is actually NT 6.0 if that makes any sense.

Windows 2000 = NT 5.0
Windows XP = NT 5.1
Windows Vista = NT 6.0
Windows 7 = NT 6.1

I guess you could sort of say they were merged, more accurate is to say that the win9x OS was killed off entirely and the other was continued.

A single OS (with multiple versions) for home, small/medium business, enterprise.

A unified product. However under the hood you are right the 9x codebase was scrapped.

And then cry and punch out a dozen posts on us pissing on your thread.:rofl:

You're in a public forum. You are going to get posts you don't want. You don't want flames, then don't post flamebait.

Lick it up, Baby!

Most workplace computers have XP and you must wipe out XP completely to install Windows 7. That is an IT nightmare and will kill quick adoption.

Even if the could install one OS over another they will wipe the thing out and install from an image using a system like Ghost.

Most businesses won't upgrade quickly simply because PC are aging. Most enterprise PC are 5-7 years old. Had the recession not hit 2008-2009 was likely going to be a big replacement year as the business tends to be cylical, however the economy put hardware refresh for most companies on hold for a year or two. Most businesses wait for at least SP1 so that ages the PC another year (6-8). Most lifecycle guarantee PC parts & service for only 5 years meaning the hardware is reaching (or will soon reach) end of life. ISV will stop providing XP support & drivers likely by 2012 if previous OS are any guide. XP support from Microsoft ends in 2014.

So most business know they have to upgrade because of ending support and lack of parts for existing machines.


Rather than do an software upgrade and a year or two later do it again with new hardware most companies will adopt to do it all at once. Even then enterprises will strip the machines clean and install from an image.

Nobody and I mean nobody in the enterprise space does an OS upgrade they simply do a clean install of the OS on a test machine and then build an image which can be deployed via the network or DVD.

I've been using MS operating systems for most of my life, and the only two I've actually been that impressed by were Dos 6.22 and XP.

(9x looked pretty the first time I saw it and it was interesting to navigate...But still had so many problems that it pissed me off to know end. I actually had an easier time running DOS games like Betrayal at Krondor on XP than on 9x).

I like XP. It's stable and does everything I want it to do. Never even touched Vista. Running SuSe Linux on the server for that extra security but can't use it on my main machine since I can't get most of my games collection to run on it.

I'll probably upgrade to Win7 about six months after release. The initial release will have dozens of bugs (as the initial release of virtually all software does), most of which will be patched in the first couple of months and it'll allow some time to see if the nasty rumours I'm hearing about incredibly intrusive DRM are true or scaremongering.

:sarcasm:

Lindsay Lohan is slightly more interesting than Windows 7, but not by much.