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Why voter IDs are a waste of time and a suppression tactic

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dragonlady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-18-07 11:57 AM
Original message
Why voter IDs are a waste of time and a suppression tactic
Republicans are almost frantic in trying to prove there is vast voter fraud that makes it necessary to require photo IDs to vote. But is that the main problem facing our election system?

Here's a quote from a federal government report on voter fraud and intimidation, reported in the New York Times:

There is virtually universal agreement that absentee ballot frud is the biggest problem, with vote buying and registration fraud coming after that. The vote buying often comes in the form of payment for absentee ballots, though not always. Some absentee ballot fraud is part of an organized effort; some is by individuals, who sometimes are not even aware that what they are doing is illegal. Voter registration fraud seems to take the form of people siging up with false names. Registration fraud seems to be most common where people people doing the registration were paid by the signature. <. . .> Most people believe that false registration forms have not resulted in polling place fraud, although it may create the perception that vote fraud is possible.


Yes, there are problems, says the report, but individual voter fraud is not among the important ones. There must be some reason for wanting voter IDs:

So if Voter ID won't stop what we know to be the biggest causes of vote fraud--absentee ballot shenanigans, vote buying, and bad registrations--what will it stop? Oh, that's right, minority voters:

The study, prepared by scholars at Rutgers and Ohio State Universities for the federal Election Assistance Commission, supports concerns among voting-rights advocates that blacks and Hispanics could be disproportionately affected by ID requirements. < . . I>n the states where voters were required to sign their names or present identifying documents like utility bills, blacks were 5.7 percent less likely to vote than in states where voters simply had to say their names. <. . .> Hispanics appeared to be 10 percent less likely to vote under those requirements, while the combined rate for people of all races was 2.7 percent.

A drop of 2.7% overall would have been nearly 60,000 Wisconsin voters last Novemeber--60,000 legal, legitimate votes prevented from being cast by a measure intended (though almost certainly not able) to stop 82 felons, or two double-voters, or a couple hundred bought absentee votes. Yes, every illegally cast vote cancels out a legal one. But even if voter ID would stop all the illegal votes--and it might not even stop a single one!--the balance of tens of thousands of stifled legal votes far outweighs the benefits of requiring ID. It would be "silly" not to see that.


For the links to the reports quoted above and an interesting exploration of this Republican obsession, see the April 18 post at http://folkbum.blogspot.com/
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jus_the_facts Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-18-07 12:08 PM
Response to Original message
1. I've ALWAYS been required to show a photo ID to be allowed to vote....
....but now there are computer voting machines here...it still won't assure my vote will remain what I intended as there aren't any verified ballots nor any count after the fact...doesn't have a damn thing to do with showing ID.
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Captain Hilts Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-18-07 12:08 PM
Response to Original message
2. We are asked for photo I.D.s to...
make credit card purchases, withdraw money from a teller, sign mortgages, get a driver's license, pick up fellowship checks, pick up WIC checks, Social Security checks, you name it.

In fact, the more interactions one has with government, the MORE likely they are to have an I.D.

What's the problem? An I.D. system might have made it possible for more people to vote in Florida. It works both ways.

Why would someone not have a valid, photo I.D. these days?
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dragonlady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-18-07 03:09 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. Why wouldn't you have a valid photo ID?
A lot of senior citizens don't drive and don't have a driver's license. Ditto many in the minority community who have their licenses suspended for unpaid traffic tickets and then get into worse trouble for driving anyway to get to work. Changing the address on your ID is a hassle for people who have to move often because of eviction, domestic troubles, etc., or are just plain homeless. In Wisconsin there is such a thing as a state nondriving ID, but you have to go to one of the few and understaffed DMV offices and maybe spend a couple of hours. That is also a hassle if you don't drive or have many other responsibilities (three jobs, picking up kids at daycare, health problems, etc.), and especially for those in the rural areas.

All of these situations hit Democrats harder. That's why the Karl Rove types are so eager to make photo IDs mandatory. It's easier than convincing another 5 to 10 percent of people to vote Republican.
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SoCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-18-07 03:28 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. Voting is a right guaranteed by citizenship. A country..ANY country
Edited on Wed Apr-18-07 03:30 PM by SoCalDem
should be required to furnish each citizen, the documentation required to "use" their citizenship. It's just that simple.. If it costs money..SO WHAT!! wars cost money too, and the government always "finds" that money.

Every US citizen should be issued a US passport....first one free of charge.. people who already have one, would get their first renewal free..and after every US citizen HAS one, the renewal should be made CHEAP..

Costco seems to be able to take your picture and issue a card on the spot, with little fanfare or fuss...surely the "biggest-bestest" country on the planet could come up with a way to issue passports to us, and provide us with a slide-able card for our day to day ID needs..

Does anyone really think they are "under the radar" these days anyway?.

Old people seem to find the necessary ID when they apply for their social secutiry benefits or other state benefits they are eligible to receive...this is no different.

There may be isolated cases where people cannot locate their birth certificate, but I'm sure there are ways to get around that..

If you have an elderly poor relative , help them gt the ID they need..

and to the Dem leadership... Instead of wasting millions in court, just GET THE PEOPLE IDs with that money.. wasting money in court after people have been denied the right to vote is foolish.

we all know that republicans are "challengers"..It's what they DO.. Cut them off at the pass and have our people prepared with documentation, instead of excuses.

Imagine the loook on the face of some thin-lipped, no-chinned, tight-ass republican at a voting place when he/she questions someone about their citizenship, and they whip out a passport:)
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Captain Hilts Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-18-07 04:01 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. To get their Social Security they needed an I.D. nt
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dragonlady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-18-07 05:19 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. Not so
From the book Complete Idiot's Guide to Social Security and Medicare, here's what's required: social security number, birth certificate, W-2 forms for last year, military discharge papers if applicable, social security number and birth certificates for spouse or children if applying on your record, proof of citizenship or lawful alien status, bank info if getting direct deposit. None of these need be photo ID.
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Captain Hilts Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-18-07 05:25 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. It's our tax money, it should require a photo I.D. I got my SSN with a parent and birth certificate
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JustABozoOnThisBus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-18-07 04:03 PM
Response to Original message
6. I can't remember being asked to show ID
I just go to the poll, tell them my name, they look it up and put a mark next to it. Then I vote. No ID needed.
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