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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-09-09 08:25 AM
Original message
That anti-choice amendment is illegal
It violates Roe v Wade. It's going nowhere.

Discuss.
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geek tragedy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-09-09 08:26 AM
Response to Original message
1. Nope. It's an awful amendment, but banning a procedure and prohibiting
federal funds from subsidizing it are two different things.
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GreenEyedLefty Donating Member (708 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-09-09 08:26 AM
Response to Original message
2. I'm sure it will be challenged...
and by the way... I swore I woke up this morning in a theocracy. Since when do bishops run the show?
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-09-09 08:33 AM
Response to Reply #2
4. They haven't run my show for decades
I'm an atheist.
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emulatorloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-09-09 08:33 AM
Response to Original message
3. It is awful and ridiculous, but it doesnt violate Roe v Wade. However I think it is DOA as well
I expect arguments are going to be made in conference that it is "redundant" as the Hyde Amendment already prohibits fed fund being used for "elective abortions"

I understand that Stupak may go farther than Hyde, but I think that is the argument that will be made when they sit down to reconcile these bills.
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Freddie Stubbs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-09-09 08:43 AM
Response to Reply #3
6. If it removed in conference, the overall bill will be DOA
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emulatorloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-09-09 08:56 AM
Response to Reply #6
9. What if there is no "Stupak-type" amendment in the Senate version
Would that make a difference?
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Freddie Stubbs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-09-09 10:40 AM
Response to Reply #9
12. Then it won't pass the House
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emulatorloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-09-09 12:02 PM
Response to Reply #12
20. I am not so sure -- Stupak and his ilk can save face with his fundies - "Well I tried"
It is my opinion that at least 50% of this was Boehner-style posturing.
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Freddie Stubbs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-10-09 03:35 PM
Response to Reply #20
25. The pro-abortion House members have already voted for the bill with the Stupak amendment in it
If anyone is posturing, it is them.
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mopinko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-09-09 09:31 AM
Response to Reply #6
10. if it is removed in conference the overall bill only needs a simple majority
i know it barely had one in the house, but i think it will get one again. the senate? i still think we have 51.
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Freddie Stubbs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-09-09 10:44 AM
Response to Reply #10
14. Even if it could pass the Seante it certaily won't pass the House without the Stupak Amendment
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mopinko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-09-09 10:47 AM
Response to Reply #14
15. maybe, maybe not.
some votes might change, but best believe arms will be twisted.
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emulatorloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-09-09 12:04 PM
Response to Reply #15
21. after all, Stupak and his blue-dog ilk can tell their fundy base "Oh we tried our best"
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mopinko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-09-09 06:12 PM
Response to Reply #21
24. which is the point. all the better
to make it seem like they are battling insurmountable obstacles. they don't seem to be held account for actually accomplishing anything.
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Hepburn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-09-09 09:35 AM
Response to Reply #3
11. IMO, I think your statement is a very good argument for grounds to strike that POS.
Since Hyde is around, there is no need to have the Stupid-pecker Amendment ~~ maybe there is a conflict between the terms or something, also.

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Freddie Stubbs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-09-09 08:42 AM
Response to Original message
5. If that were true, why hasn't the Hyde Amendment been challenged in court?
:shrug:
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-09-09 08:49 AM
Response to Reply #5
8. Good question n/t
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Jamastiene Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-09-09 10:48 AM
Response to Reply #5
16. Sad, but true. n/t
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TwilightGardener Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-09-09 10:53 AM
Response to Reply #5
19. What is the legal foundation of Roe v Wade? It's privacy.
Edited on Mon Nov-09-09 10:53 AM by TwilightGardener
An abortion is between a woman and her health care provider and no one else. Hyde Amendment prohibits federal funds for abortion, correct? Federal funds = public. Can't have public money for privacy matter, because it wouldn't be a privacy matter anymore. At least that's what I would assume the pro-Hyde argument would be in court, and may in fact put Roe v Wade in peril--we don't want that.
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tonysam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-09-09 12:07 PM
Response to Reply #5
23. It has. The USSC upheld it in 1980. n/t
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Odin2005 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-09-09 08:48 AM
Response to Original message
7. Unfortunately it doesn't.
RvW says nothing about federal funds paying for abortions as far as I know.
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Dreamer Tatum Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-09-09 10:42 AM
Response to Original message
13. No,it isn't. Discuss. nt
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Jamastiene Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-09-09 10:49 AM
Response to Original message
17. The Hyde Amendment should have been considered illegal too, but
apparently, repealing either is off the table. :(
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Are_grits_groceries Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-09-09 10:49 AM
Response to Original message
18. They better discuss this.
Rachel pointed out that this would cause a lot of Dem women to sit on their hands. I believe that. Anybody who tells someone they can't pay for a legal procedure with their own money through some convoluted law can go to hell!

In addition, I'm not sure how much more the Dem women will take.

Although House liberals voted for the bill with the amendment to keep the process moving forward, Rep. Diana DeGette (Colo.) said she has collected more than 40 signatures from House Democrats vowing to oppose any final bill that includes the amendment -- enough to block passage.

"There's going to be a firestorm here," DeGette said. "Women are going to realize that a Democratic-controlled House has passed legislation that would prohibit women paying for abortions with their own funds. . . . We're not going to let this into law."
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/11/08/AR2009110818453.html

They have talked big before, but I think it is past time for NARAL and some other big players to put some muscle into calling those Reps. Not all of them are in horrible trouble in 2010.
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tonysam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-09-09 12:05 PM
Response to Original message
22. No, it isn't.
It's nothing more than reworking of the Hyde Amendment of 1976. The USSC upheld it in 1980.

Congress would have to overturn it. It's not going to happen.
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