Watching WWII In High Definition on the History Channel ....

The unity of purpose and importance of working together to accomplish a monumental task demonstrates clearly what is missing today.

The acquisition of $$ and material things was not first on their list....

If only we had the same resolve today in addressing the serious problems facing our country, it would be amazing what we could accomplish.

the sense of purpose that is. The final nail in the coffin was Reagan.

And I have no idea how we will recover it.

after WWII.

Many good people had their careers and lives destroyed by that cold-blooded, fear based, glory seeking witch-hunt.

I believe that's what formed the Zygote which birthed in to the demonization of "liberal" political philosophy and the unholy spawn of reich-wing politics from the 60s to today.

Even though Joseph McCarthy was disgraced, the poisonous seed was planted in the national subconscious mind and allowed to germinate.

Prior to that people had actually trusted their government and believed that it was our duty as citizens to serve in times of war. That all changed with Vietnam. I will always hate the elites for what they did to America by waging that war.

But we had a board for dealing with these scum, headed by Harry S. Truman beofre he became VP.

And Truman gave the crooks who sold bad food and the bureaucrats who gave us bad torpedos hell.

:-)

Didn't explode when they hit the target straight on, because the collision damaged the detonator.

well done sir!
:patriot:

That was before Ayn Rand and those like her came on the scene and convinced them that the wealthy were gods on earth and so should not be burdened by taxation.

This is a mind-blowing series; very well done.

Relevant to today I did feel a spark of hope a few episodes ago when the correspondent worried that the current generation wasn't up to the task - obviously they were, so perhaps we are too...

... the interests of businesses and the accumulation of wealth were far down the list.

Sure we could be 'up to the task' ... but it will take a massive change in attitudes.

People need to rediscover the power they wield in a democracy and stand up to those who have personal power and self-enrichment as their primary motives.

We didn't give enormous grief to inspectors who tried to prevent dangerous equipment from reaching our soldiers.

We didn't have constant prosecutions for blackmarketeering.

Please don't go all nostalgic for WAR.

All you have to do is talk to those who served in WWII, and their families and friends left behind, to appreciate the unity that existed and the maximum effort that was put forth in the face of a terrifying enemy.

Any time there is an opportunity to make a profit, there will always be those ready to step in and exploit that opportunity. However, there is no comparison between WWII warprofiteering and the corruption that has been inherent in the Iraqi and Afghanistan War efforts.

But the point I was making in the OP is that the entire country was unified and active in the war effort. The losses were massive and hit every city, town and community across the country. Everyone knew someone who was affected. And all historical evidence indicates that the country was primarily concerned with acquiring $$ or material things.

If acknowledging the foregoing is 'go(ing) all nostalgic' --so be it.

What it was was COLD because the skirts were short to save fabric and hungry because the food rations were tight. And this was in America where we didn't have to eat beets for a year as our only food. It was a constant gut crunching fight against every kind of bureaucrat. SNAFU: military term meaning Situation Normal All Fucked Up.

And we faced the possibility of losing. Yes, people fight together when they're fighting for their lives. "All the younger brothers died." That's my mom's comment. They rushed the younger ones in with quicker training and they died. My uncle's unit had a hushed-up mutiny and an officer was replaced. Not because he made my uncle fly tail end Charlie for 13 missions for being a Jew. For other reasons.

We lost thousands of young men in a single day every day. But it's all good because we fought together.

I know all about the unity. I was raised on stories of the lines out of the subway made by young men pouring into it on the way to the enlistment office, the morning after Pearl Harbor. It was the same unity I saw in Manhattan on 9/11. That's NORMAL. Not special. NORMAL.

And I know about the seasoned men who were trained fighting in Spain who were prevented from joining just because they were Lincoln Brigade. Who were hounded all thru World War II because they had been the first to declare the Fascists our enemy.

You see a TV show and you decide you know everything.

You twisted everything I posted in the OP to address some ridiculous idea you dreamed up.

It is still possible to admire people who act selflessly on behalf of others in the face of danger and destruction WITHOUT being enthralled with the danger and destruction itself.

If you cannot tell the difference, that is your problem.

I didn't have to twist anything. You're going thru a phase. Been there. Done that. When you find out a little more, you'll have another great revelation and nobody will be able to criticize that, either.

Me, I think firemen are gods. I also know they asked my stepdad how much he'd give them to save his merchandise. He handed them his wallet. They tossed it back with contempt. The business burned. More than one thing is true.

It sounds like you want to condemn people who act in service to others because there might be a few in the target group who are less than exemplary or corrupt(sometimes referred to as 'throwing the baby out with the bathwater' syndrome).

You have your opinion about something ... although I am not sure it applies to me or what I posted... and you have put it out there for public consumption.

I find your 'corrupt firemen' example a little hard to believe. Even so it does nothing to besmirch the fine reputation of all other firemen who do their jobs well with uncommon courage.

and just think of the potential for profit!

scattered about. There are still almost 79000 Americans. missing in action.

Seen other episodes but this one was heartbreaking as hell seeing the bodies of the japanese who commited suicide for fear of being captured by our soldiers.

Truly an awsome series and a real eye opener. I never thought much of the WWII films anymore cause I always see the same old black and white ones and very few colors.

It's from the '60s or '70s and was shot in color.

It uses a lot of the original color film taken of the battle in 1942.

There was very little in the History Channel documentary about the Battle of Midway because the film from that battle has been out for some time.

World War II was every bit about resources and money. It's what all wars are about. WWII gave us the MIC and the problems we have today. Sorry to rain on your nostalgia parade.

nothing at all to do with stopping facism...it was all about the money!!11!!
:sarcasm:

jesus h christ.

America's noble war. The greatest generation. Please, give it a rest.

facism throughout half the globe i'd have to conclude that you're an idiot. you take your hatred of your own country to a bizarre level.
:shrug:

+1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1. Can you tell I totally agree with you?

If Japan had decided to leave Hawaii alone, there is no telling how long the US would simply stay on the sidelines. The US, up until that point in time, was very isolationist in stance. It only entered World War One right towards the end of that war.

We never went to war to fight Hitler, per se. Germany went ahead and made the mistake of declaring war on the US after the US declared war on Japan. Had Germany not allied itself with Japan, it is a fair chance the US would not have entered the war in Europe, at least at a point that mattered, and if that's the case, a fair argument can be made that Joseph Stalin's Red Army probably would've defeated Hitler on the Eastern Front and overrun Nazi Occupied Europe. Stalin had a larger army and a much larger manufacturing base to wage war compared to Hitler's. Both the US and the USSR had far larger manufacturing capacities than Germany could muster.

If the US had gone to war to fight fascism as the primary purpose, then the Lincoln Brigade and the George Washington Brigade never would have existed. They were Americans who went to Spain to fight against the fascist Franco who was trying to overthrow Spain's democratically elected government. They went because the US didn't lift a finger to help when the civil war began in 1936, a full five years before Pearl Harbor. Thousands of these volunteers bled and died on the fields of Spain trying to fight the good fight against Franco, who was being supported by Hitler, and they had few weapons, little equipment, and no real standardized training.

None of this, though, detracts from what the US accomplished during WW2 and what all the veterans of that war accomplished. They did a hell of a job, and I also think the Lincoln/George Washington Brigade volunteers did an equally exceptional job.

We had a Lend-Lease Act going to support the British, but it wouldn't have helped them take back Europe at any rate. Given that most of the German army was bled to death fighting the Soviet Union before 1944, Stalin probably would've been there to meet Churchill on the shores of France when he finally could muster up enough strength to mount a successful campaign.

For example, a pre-mature attempt to test German defenses on mainland Europe in 1942, known as the Dieppe Raid against the French port of Dieppe then under German control, ended in total disaster. The main point was to capture and hold the port for a short time to collect information and intelligence. This was before the US was ever really able to send troops over to the British Isles in large enough numbers to impact the outcome of the war. Not a single objective of the attack was accomplished, and thousands of Canadian and British soldiers were mowed down on the beaches of France. Of the Allied soldiers who began the attack, less than half of the soldiers survived. The rest were killed or became prisoners of war.

One could then begin to realize just how difficult it would be to take back all of Europe without US manpower and production capacity. One thing is for sure: Nobody wanted to rely on the Red Army and Joseph Stalin to liberate Europe.

:puke:

These days, you can name a handful of people who are profiting MIGHTILY from the events of today.

Who was it in 1944 that profited beyond the dreams of avarice?

that sustained and ramped up the MIC and the MIC political influence.

for some folks here it sure seems that way.

:shrug:

and seeing it in color and HD makes it seem so much more real. What WW II had that our recent wars have lacked was a real, clear-cut, bad-guy enemy. I believe that's why everyone could be so focused and so sure of their mission. This has not been the case with the U.S.'s wars in my lifetime.

The stills, film and stories about that one really got people then.

They had seen the Japanese march since the invasion of Manchuria in '33.

Immediately after Pearl Harbor, the Japanese struck us in several other places, including the Philippines, and then annihilated the British at Singapore.

No wonder so many people on the West Coast totally freaked out. There was almost nothing between them and the Japanese Fleet after Pearl Harbor. Scary times.

It wasn't until we turned back the Japanese Fleet at Midway that people could breathe well again.

of West Coast civilian reaction to the Pearl Harbor attack see the movie 1941.





http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RmLAA2r4DlA












:rofl:

:rofl:

The War in the Aleutians is not covered as much as some other aspects of WWII, but it is a very interesting chapter.

Just curious.

And part of another episode. Besides Tarawa, there was some coverage of Northern Africa and Sicily.

Much of it was just stock footage.

Sure, there's new footage. Most of it pretty boring. Then they cut it together with some stock footage of, say, machine guns firing from a bunker to make it something it's not. Much of this was shown on the History Channel's "WWII in Color!" from a year or two ago (or whatever the called it) and now they just remarket it as "WWII in HD!" Then they have the usual fluffy History channel voiceovers by such talent as That Bald Guy From The Daily Show.

There's really little substance here. But then again, the History Channel has always sucked.

I liked those Peter and Dan Snow documentaries but those were BBC, IIRC.

the planet earth onethey showed recently was awesome.

But Weaver's narration drove me nuts.

you could hear them breathing as they ran.

it's not some shockingly new awesome material, but entertainign enough to semi-watch when you're making dinner.

Check your listings.

It absolutely an awesome series.

This former history major gives it five thumbs up.

Don't miss it.

Its meant to make you think of his role in Forreest Gump.And that means this is a propoganda series courtesy of the pentagon.
Where else do you think they got the footage used?

I do, however, remember reading quite a bit about the campaigns in the Pacific. I don't think that they have received sufficient attention over the years, but they are featured in this series. I for one have been grateful to see the previously unreleased film even though the Pentagon isn't exactly my favorite governmental location.

it's all a japanese plot to make us believe we won!!11!!!

paranoids make me laugh.

Do yourself a favor and educate yourself on the subject.It will do you a world of good.
A good introduction to the subject is the BBC's documentary Century of the Self
Here's a link http://www.bbc.co.uk/bbcfour/documentaries/features/century_of_the_self.shtml

if anything they will recognize him as the guy from CSI. enlighten me, if you would, to what the pentagon's purpose would be for a documentary covering 65 year old history?

Its about mind fucking them once they have tuned in.
Its a subtle little mind fuck but an effective one.They know that in the back of your mind you will get a feel good memory of what a good guy he was in F.G. That in turns relaxes your mind into transferring that good feeling into the bs wars going on now.
The fact that ww2 was considered a 'good' war also plays upon peoples minds.You know,the 'saving the world from tyranny' theme.They are hoping that that good feeling will carry over into how we look at the war to 'save us from terrorism'.

The reason I know this about their use of Sinese is I know a person who helped create and focus group test the Army commercials in which Sinese also does the voice over.They tried other actors also but Sinese had the best effect on the focus groups.
I have to imagine(Never seen the show myself) that his role in CSI also creates or feeds into the idea/mindset of us being the good guys.Every one trusts the cops,after all.They are the good guys that go after the bad guys.
Sorta like we are the good guys in Afghanistan and the taliban are the bad guys.This 'we are the good guys' meme is something that deeply embedded in the American psyche and the propagandists are playing on that for all its worth.
Another mind fuck the army uses in their commercials-Remember the Army of One theme? That plays on the 'rugged individualist' ideal that is also part of the American psyche.
And still another example of the propagandists work.Remember in the days after Sept 11 when that photo of the firemen raising the flag in the rubble was all over the place?While the flag raising by the fireman was most likely a spontaneous act the way that image was soon after splashed everywhere suggests to me that the propagandists seized upon it because it was reminiscent of the flag raising by the Marines on top of Mt Suribachi on Iwo Jima.They saw it as a way of linking in peoples minds a 'good war' with the current wars.
For that matter,Sept 11 was also a huge propaganda act.It was the Pearl harbor type event that galvanized the peoples unwitting support for the BFEE's plans to seize control of middle eastern and central asian oil and natural gas supply's.Pretty damned effective too, imo.

This reply may seem a little long winded but it is nothing compared to the efforts that propaganda,advertising and marketing people put into selling something.When it comes to big time money every trick in the book is fair game to them and they will use them without compunction.

:hi:

Group dynamics and social control issues are subjects that have fascinated me since I read R.H. Hienliens book The Man Who Sold the Moon.The more I learn about it the more fascinating it becomes.And in this day and age it ,imo,is important to recognize when someone is yanking your chains.
Thi Century link I posted-Watch it.Its very mind blowingly informative.

I haven't seen much that has been as immediately interesting as your link. Thanks for posting it.

Museums, archives, barns, attics, libraries, vaults, private collections, etc., over 2 years time. Yes, the History Channel had some in their archives as well, but most of the footage has never been seen on television before, was never in the possession of either the producers or the History Channel prior to this, and has been newly digitized and restored, so that is it compatible for the HD aspect ratio.

Sinise wasn't tapped because of his role in 'Forrest Gump', but because he is identified closely with veterans' causes.

I don't think you have evolved consciously enough.

i always thought the "liberals who hate america" was made up by the RW clowns, sadly they do exist.

everything and anything is some nefarious conspiracy controlled by the CIA and the DLC to them. it makes my brain hurt.

:P

I think that's really cool. It's rare to see anyone from TDS tackle a serious role like this.

Lots of name actors were used to voice the people highlighted in this series.

Anyone who thinks they were all a bunch of Establishment "squares" need to read up on the stuff they did in the Depression.

:rofl: how'd i do?

:hi:

Those 3rd World countries are too sneaky, and we think some day in some way, there might be a remote chance they could hurt us, so we will just have to assume that they already have all the weapons and technology that we do, so we need something better to beat them. Now, if we could only get them to stop faking checkers and play multidimensional chess, we can win this thing, with our multi-billion (cost over-runs) dollar weapon systems.

Missed most of it last night as I was helping my friends move. I've really enjoyed watching.

and his friends. They all went to war and so had a stake in the country. The war messed up a lot of them. I also think that the history channel sucks. Bible history, new Nostradamus, Atlantis, & all of that is bullshit. The worse ever was 'The Lost Army". One hour of people bitching at each other. I haven't seen that much gore since seeing US Army's film of '73 Yom Kippur War. When the Imperial Japanese Empire attacked Pearl Harbor the old man was in a horse cavalry unit at Ft. Riley. Did not take long to change to tanks. I respect the men & women of The Greatest Generation and thank them. One more thing, The Flying Tigers were Incorporated into the Army Air Corps. The Spanish thing was handled poorly. Peace, Richard