Do you stand with Dr. Dean?

I do, and that's why the avatar is back. :patriot:

If Howard Dean still speaks for you, consider doing the same.

Dr. Dean seems to be one of the very few that have the everyman's back....well, I'd like him to know that we've got his.
I know he was too liberal when he ran in 04 but I think the political climate is MUCH different now and he would get a much bette reception this go round.
Howard Dean 2012!

Thom will no doubt be willing to talk to him about things that the whore media won't touch, so this should be good.

or single payer, when the proposed bills clearly showed that was not true.

He wasn't talking about the watered down Senate version.

though it had been watered down substantially. It does not matter what he wrote about in his book, he was pushing the HC reform that was outlined in proposed legislation. It was not 'like Medicare' or was not the single payer system that advocates wanting to be a part of the discussion.

I wonder how many people would have abandoned their support for a not for profit system if Dean did not come out in favor of the public option idea early this year.

:shrug:

During this process not only have we wasted time in adopting a HC system, but we have allowed the opposition time to organize and distort other HC systems where the government plays a larger role. It will now be harder to combat the lies once they have been planted in people's brains.


Posted this several times so FWIW ...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=8606842&mesg_id=8608167

Interview on the Ed Show was during the time that SP advocates were trying to get a seat at the Senate round tables - Baucus had excluded them from participating. Ed asked Dean what he thought about SP being off the table, Dean said SP is Not off the table. Dean knows what the physicians were advocating for when they talk about SP, Medicare for All.

Why would he confuse the issue and lead people to believe that the public option is the same as SP or just like SP???

In addition he keeps referring to the public option as being like Medicare, but Medicare does not have to compete for the basic coverage with private insurance plans and started with millions of people in the plan which could then bargain for lower prices...


http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=6901201&mesg_id=6902492

My post last night - I did not sleep very well that night in May when I heard Dean state on the Ed Show that single payer was not off the table. I posted a poll shortly afterwards asking if people thought the public option was the same as single payer.

After that appearance I've listened more closely to what Dean said, there was a constant confusion of terms and selling the Obama plan of a public option as "being like Medicare."

Then there was the speech at the AHIP Convention in June telling the insurance companies the public option would not be that bad for them and the push for longer data exclusivity period on biologics.

In sum all very disappointing.

I've used the Dean avatar pretty much since the get-go.

Kill it. Kill it now.

he's all about himself

Howard Dean, who really would have it a lot easier to just disappear and do his own thing, is putting himself on the line for doing this right and not half-assed. It would be a hell of a lot easier to just say 'yea, it's okay' but he is telling the truth and that is important. Folks need to listen.

I stand with Howard Dean.

Dean is not speaking truth to power, he's throwing bombs at the Office of the President. I would far rather he define the bill away from it being PRESIDENT OBAMA's bill towards reflecting whose bill it really is, the democratic senate's bill ... and then, bomb away.

Actually, I haven't heard him refer to it as "Obama's Bill" and have only heard him criticize the Senate mostly. He has worried about the Prez's obvious lack of clout in the Senate...but that's another point.

Please give us some links to where Dean has "thrown bombs at the office of the president". Not Obama's lack of leadership....but the "OFFICE OF THE PRESIDENT"...y'know, whoever occupies it? Please show us where he refers to the bill as "Obama's Bill". I haven't heard any....but I haven't heard everything he's said so....examples please.

On the other hand, Sen. Burris might be able to stem the current tide -- depending on whether he means he won't vote for a bill without a PO or won't vote for cloture on such a bill.

Yes, I do.

K&R

Howard Dean speaks for me on HCR.

:patriot:

I always will.

He is the real deal, as opposed to those who pretend they know what they're talking about re: health care reform, or those who are stalling true reform because of their conflict of interest. Yep, I said it.

:eyes:

when their Vermont headquarters had exactly 12 people in it. I was the first to organize for him in California in 2003. I'm ALWAYS with Dr. Dean. May he run for president in 2012 and run THIRD PARTY.

Of course I say YES!

:bounce:

Howard!

Dean and Feingold and Jan Schakowsky.

We're gonna need a few other lifters.

How would he get Health Care Reform with a Public Option thru the Senate with four democrats who will oppose it? He says kill the bill and start again in 2011--we will have fewer dems in 2011 and my guess is it will be fewer progressives than anything else.

we've seen from th Democrats no matter what the issue. 'We don't have the votes'. Well, GET THEM. Republicans manage to do it.

Don't waste people's time with that excuse anymore. If Obama had really wanted Health Care reform and had gone straight off the bat for a Universal Healthcare system, then used his bully pulpit to get the American People on board, explaining it the way Kucinich did, and FIGHTING for it, slamming Republicans rather than his base, if he had done all that, no Democratic Senator would have dared to vote against it, and even a few Republicans might have been shamed into it. Especially since the American People were FOR a Universal Healthcare system even without anyone explaining to them what it would mean, in terms of saving money, in terms of putting their lives above profits.

I'm not a president, but I was able to persuade people, Repubs, Independents etc. that America must have a humanitarian NOT-FOR-PROFIT Health Care system like every other civilized country in the world. It wasn't hard, people are NOT stupid, they know what is important in this world.

Obama's silence and his catering to the Private Insurance Industry, Rahm Emmanuel's attacks on the base of the party, the exclusion of any discussion even, of real reform, was the writing on the wall.

If this disastrous give-away to the Insurance Industry passes, I would be really surprised if Obama will win in 2012, and for sure he has handed over a Democratic majority to Republicans in 2010.

I don't know who advising, does he really think people will forget this? I thought he was way smarter than this. Or maybe his job was to be a one-term president to geta few things done, war escalation and a bail-out of Wall St. and the Private Insurance business. I don't know, but if he wants to win a second term, he better start working for the people.

n/t

Call him and tell him we've got his back. I just did!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x7243416

Howard Dean never stopped speaking for me.

:kick:

I just made it but I couldn't upload it as my avatar because I'm not a donor at this time. But if anyone wants to use it, just copy it to your desktop then upload it to your profile.

it just wouldn't take. I'll keep trying and maybe can it on ... it's a great avatar :thumbsup: ... THANKS! :hi:

Feel free to use it yourself ;)

the time is ripe.

I trust Howard Dean. :patriot:

nt

Because I've had a cracked ankle since after Katrina and no healthcare insurance, but I stand with him in spirit. :D

:patriot:

that if the bill has little for Democrats, there is no fixing it by Democrats. Democrats will stay home in November. Republicans will use every dirty trick possible to reverse any remaining positive changes in the bill. Republicans and Joe Lieberman should NOT be courted. They should make Republicans filibuster. They should call Lieberman an obstructionist and remove his committee.

mmmmmmmmmm

for the suggestion! :thumbsup: :hi:

The good Doctor speaks for me!

:bounce:

to the peace sign(I added some blood). Now I have to change it again? If the avatar size wasn't a measly 3k I'd make a nice one for Dean.

Firmly and proudly! Thank god Dean speaks for us - no one else does.

:loveya:

He speaks for me on the current HCR Bill

If it passes, the Republicans, not Democrats, should declare victory.

He doesn't think before he speaks and he has zero power.

taking the doctor's advice

:patriot:

:toast:

I mean, McGovern at least GOT a Democratic Presidential Nomination.

And be sure to tell Rahm I said

Always have. He is always right in the end.

My analogy is unemployed people in countries with slave-like wages. Sure they're better off with jobs but....come on.

Slave-like wages suck & the for-profit health care industry sucks.

In both analogies the individual is at the mercy of the for profit machine. Is it really better to be working with the machine than not?

Krugman says yes, but to me it seems that we are at the point where we say....."come on, we've had it working WITH the for profit scum & we're tired of it."

AND!!!!! Listening to "experts" is also out. We The People want our voice for a CHANGE!!!!

The American public IS PROGRESSIVE (check the polls) & we DEMAND the government take notice.

Also, if Krugman's candidate for President, Hillary Clinton, had won the election I firmly believe we'd be exactly in the same health care place we are today.

Party politics doesn't enable the people.

Hillary drove that point home over and over again. No one knows more about health care than Hillary Clinton, who studied it minutely for many years. Please don't forget her work for CHIP and, unfortunately, she is never given enough credit for the first serious attempt at health care for every citizen in this country.

A huge majority of the American people favored a strong public option. We should have it, if this is a representative government.

A strong public option was not too much to expect. Real health care reform was not too much to expect. We only get the government we expect.

What does that mean?

This is the government we "expect"????

Nonsense.

and insist that these expectations are met. Better?

I will stand for that, before I will ever stand for Barack Obama or his Shit Bill, that he is trying to pass off as reform.

I have seen enough... 'Hope' & 'Change' mean NOTHING without the deeds.

(Then again, in the '04 primary, I was still registered Green... wonder who many other votes Kerry got in the Green primary ;) ...)

I'm a convert. After seeing him take on Matthews and Landrieu both on Hardball today... on obviously hostile ground... Dean's the man.

thing.

Since we're being nostalgic for washed up politicians and all.

Or so said Paul Krugman, back in the day. Krugman also complained that Obama was running "Harry and Louise" ads against Edwards in the Wisconsin Primary.
Funny what little things stick with you.

And Olbermann put into words the real problem with what is happening at the end of the process in Washington DC -

who knew the Democratic 'big tent' was really set up for this Circus they call our legislature.

is such a thorn in their side and galvanizing We The People--the same way he did in 2004--this time they won't succeed with "the scream"--I will bust my ass for Dr. Dean. DFA all the way, baby!

Since I just recently switched my avatar, I'll keep it a bit longer but will switch again pretty soon.

:patriot:

:patriot: :applause:

So sure, we're in the same ballpark so to speak.

obama was the best choice over palin, and if palin or someone worse is around again, I'll vote AGAIBT THEM AGAIN - not "for" obama...that's for sure!

I just hope we get someone really good to RUN AGAINST HIM NEXT TIME AROUND!!!

I stand by him and behind him. IF this health bill passes, people will be fined and go to prison if they don't pay into it. If people refuse to pay and in fact go to prison... prisons which are ALREADY OVERCROWDED... it will break this country, and there might even be civil war again.

The representative of the Democratic wing of the Democratic Party.

and I am thinking Dean/Kucinich for next election....:)

He would have been president if the Democratic party establishment hadn't destroyed his candidacy (Kennedy and Kerry)

their ratings would go way up, and which would give Howard the platform he deserves.

I thought we kicked his ass out for s*** like this.

Dean 2012!

I still have my "Meet Up" T-shirt from 2004. Long ago stopped wearing it in public when it became faded and stretched out. But still occasionally sleep in it....can't seem to quit it.

Dean is our voice in the wilderness that has become bizzaro world.

I follow truth and this man speaks it.

I'm sick of these weaklings

He is the second biggest joke in the Democratic Party that liberals don't understand. The biggest joke is Dennis Kucinich.

i mean, dean, kucinich, and sheehan are three completely different animals, yet you seem to be lumping them together. another reflex centrist, i presume.

I mean you're basically for the same fucking things. Well maybe not abortion but the reality of that issue is besides the point.

What fucking values do you stand for?

I like... BARACK OBAMA.

What the fuck is Obama doing that you like so much that the Republicans wouldn't be doing?

Creating clear goals and time-tables for Afghanistan; reforming healthcare; rebuilding American prestige abroad; ending the War in Iraq, that we started, responsibly; closing Guantanamo Bay; enacting real energy reform for America's future - if you can't see the difference between President Obama and President Bush, well then friend, you are a moron.

Not Bush dipshit. Bush couldn't be president after two terms. McCain was their man. Remember him? The one many REpublicans were crowing "wasn't conservative enough" so he grabbed the nearest fundie in politics with the correct gender to upset the Democratic base not realizing her potential as a charlatan. You don't think McCAin would do any of those things?

Really? You don't.

What about those of us who think:

Afghanistan is a colossal fucking waste of time spending tons of money on nation building in a nation that, if it cannot stand on it's own after 7 years BELONGS TO THE RELIGIOUS NUTCASES and can never really be "won" if anyone has the colossal fucking balls to define that "win", put a real date on it and then put some money on it.

That not only does Gitmo need to be closed but there needs to be prosecutions to those who enabled it as it is the ultimate insult to the constitution.

Speaking of constitution: how about that Patriot Act? Getting renewed...by a president who is specialized in Constitutional law.

Energy reform...well duh...but we haven't seen anything yet. We won't until a few years.

and the only moron I see is you. Republican lite. The kind of guy who calls Single Payer Health Care: Far Left Fringe.

Rahm's on line three.

here agree with him. We are done taking shit, Naturalist.

for someone who isn't "relevent". Thanks for kicking the thread.

I hope some way, in some office, I have the chance to vote for him. I stand with and support Dr. Dean.:)

I've always been with Dr. Dean...My avatar never changed.

He's right.

how the administration is attacking him! I think I better not say much more because I could go on for quite some time!

YES, YES, YES... Thank you HOWARD DEAN... A Democrat for "We The People!" Thank you so much for standing up when so many others have not!!
:kick: :dem: :loveya:

root the fucks out!

:patriot:

K&R

Dean/Grayson 2012

No question

Wish I could vote for him for President. President Obama should have picked him for Surgeon General or should have selected him to lead health care reform. Dr. Dean got shafted.

:patriot:

And that's why I still donate to Democracy For America every month. Go Dean! Tell truth to power. (I actually mistyped that as "tell truth to poser" which would also be true about that "progressive" poser Barack Obama.)

ALWAYS did. :)

single payer now

Howard Dean speaks for me. And I spoke for him when I e-mailed the White House to tell them what I thought of Robert Gibbs' comments about Dr.Dean.

As far as I'm concerned, the White House just told the Democratic wing of the Democratic party to fuck off. Let Lieberman phone bank and knock on doors for Obama in 2012...Oh, wait....

Because Obama has sold us out.

America needs a government run health care system. Expand the VA to cover all Americans!

But I never change my avatar, not for any reason.

Dean speaks for me on this. Ironic that so many of us are conflicted as to whether to change our avatars to Dean or Peace. I'll never vote Republican, but after 40 years of voting for the Dems, I am utterly disgusted. As disgusted as I am, I am still holding out some kind of hope, but I am thinking more and more that Obama's game is not so much chess as three card monte.

from the get go. my dream ticket: dean/kucinich

with respect to trade and labor. I still have a Dean bumper sticker left from supporting him before -somewhere...

I'm digging our my old "Dean for America" sign!

Actually been doing both for a long while.

n/t

I never liked him in 2004, seeing as how he was nothing more and nothing less than an Upper-East-Side-via-Vermont latte liberal.

A lot of us thought Obama was just a latte creature himself, but then he actually WON the nomination, and then the White House himself. Obama's a little broader than Urban Outfittters and/or Anthropologie. :shrug:

He is undoubtedly the architect of our current majority. We didn't get to where are now by playing nice with the Republicans. If it isn't broke you don't fix it.

He definitely speaks for me.

I must've watched the special comment about 12 times.

We need Howard Dean and Bernie Sanders to lead the way toward real progressive reform in this country. Not just a Single Payer health care system but so much more.

with the contributions of the health care industry seeming to play a big part in this debate, I suggest we borrow a line from Dante to post over voting booths:
"Abandon hope all ye who enter here."

the media conspired to get Dean out of the race with that phoney baloney "Dean Scream".

What a bunch of Losers the MSM were, and are.

so he can tell the truth about the welfare for the insurance racketeers bill. Give 'em Hell Howard!

They want to finish the bill/heist in time to give their bosses a big Christmas present.

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

Hilary is the same as Obama-a corporate Democrat. Or do you forget Bill Clinton's betrayal of the American people?

... I stand with him still.

the Democratic leadership that scuttled Dean's presidential aspirations.
What a country: Whenever a public figure speaks the truth they are marginalized or the corporate media demands an apology.
We're doomed.
Dean wouldn't have put up with Rove's dirty tactics like Kerry did in 04.
In treating Bush like a gentleman Kerry appeared weak.
I still stand with Howard Dean.

and always have. He is a real democrat and he created the fifty state strategy and the internet community that fund raised and worked to get Obama elected. Obama has given him zero thanks for that help. But Dean just keeps on working and speaking for real people. Now once again he is proposing a strategy that would work. He is NOT saying give up - he is not really saying kill the bill, he is saying get some backbone and go to reconciliation. Chris Matthews ( the same media whore who destroyed Dean's chances for the presidential nomination by playing the so called scream over and over and over and over ) is a lying creep who deliberately distorted what Dean was saying last night on his show and wouldn't even let him finish a sentence. Keith on the other hand spoke the truth and spoke for us. I am with Dean and I am with Keith and we need to let them both know that we are with them.

:patriot:

And I have never regretted it for a day since then.

Howard did not present his public critique of the HCR mess with any kind of joy.

He has been a loyal and consistent supporter of the president, despite his marginalization and mistreatment at the hands of this White House.

Why? Because Dr. Dean puts the public good above personal ambition.

He is one of my very few true political heroes.

Dean is absolutely right.
This so-called reform package is now just a big Xmas gift to the insurance company.

And Joe Lieberman is nothing more than a 'ho for the insurance industry. As the NY Times said in an editorial yesterday, Lieberman is the Million Dollar Man for accepting more than $1 million from the insurance industry during his Senate career.

I wish Dr. Dean was wrong, but he isn't.

and he's one of them.

:dem:

-Laelth

Dr. Dean out in 2004?