I had a long talk with my brother who might or might not be in a militia.

I have no idea if he is. However, I'm sure there is something stirring down there. There always has been. I'll bet a lot of my relatives are.

My brother and I differ a great deal politically. I sat him down and told him I wanted him to LISTEN to me. I said there is something brewing that is scarier than the Dem or Rethug parties put together. There are a lot of moving pieces that have one thing in common as far as I was concerned - theocratic rule.

I told him there were 2 main groups with different agendas that I thought were out to disrupt the present government. There are the neocons redux and the theocrats. They are stirring up the Teapotters and every other wingnut group in existence. They are using each other, and I know who I'll bet on when the dust clears if something happens - The Cloven Hooves. Both groups have their tentacles everywhere. However, there is nothing on Earth scarier than a zealot.

I told him that if events got moving and everybody got het up, they were counting on a lot of people with no real dog in their fight to respond. The CH's and the neocons are after ultimate power. They will no more leave you and your little bands of merry men alone than they will me. You gots the guns. They count on you clearing the way and then taking over.

I told him that if the shit did hit, he and his compadres would be better off to hunker down and make sure they had positions in the swamps ready. It worked for Francis Marion, but I'm not sure how it would work if they had the whole array of military equipment available. Think about the cell towers and power grids.

I told him not to take the bait and go after whoever. Make whoever come to you, and don't trust a one of them. If there are religious zealots in your mix now, make a dungeon. If not, you may rue the day you turned your back.

I told him that I knew he thought I was crazy anyway, but I could bring him a lot of sourced material. I told him about a lot of what I have heard. Take it or leave it I told him. You have been warned.

get into his noggin or just dribble down his cheek?

What takes hold is another question.

I have a cousin when I try to talk some sense into him its like talking to a rock.

fucked up these days but you did good.

http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/html/uscode10/usc_sec_10_00000311----000-.html

Most states have similar definitions for their own militias.

I'm telling ya...the only way out of this mess is to join forces with the tea partiers.

I know that will get a lot of laughs and insults. However, the fact is--that the neocons--through
their mouthpieces in talk radio--created the teabaggers. They play with them, like little army men.
Have you ever listened to talk radio, and heard how they stoke them up and get them completely
batshit insane and angry--and then order them to go to healthcare town halls, etc.?

Like it or not, the tea partiers and the DUers have a lot in common. We all want this country
back. We all want democracy. We want the corporate influence out of our government and we
want the government to stop pilfering our tax dollars and sending them to Wall Street and
other corporations that have purchased influence.

We disagree on just about every other social issue out there.

The fact remains------if we don't get our democracy returned to us---both sides have NOTHING. The
neocons and the zealots win. Big time. If we don't get the corporations out of our government,
we don't even have a United States of America anymore. We have a corrupt government in which "We The
People" no longer have a say.

We need to lock hands with these people--just long enough to join forces and defeat this cancer. Then,
we can return to disagreeing politically. Wouldn't it be nice to have a legitimate, authentic and
robust debate about the real merits of healthcare issues? Wouldn't it be nice if these issues
were debated honestly and that people could make decisions based on FACTS? Now, we have the
corporations lying, instilling fear and deciding how our lives are lived.

If that makes you recoil--please remember than this "left/right" vitriol is a PR product of the
neocons and the corporatists. They need us divided. United we kick their asses.

They have already shown that they are corrupted by bigger groups and people using them. I don't think they all are, but I can't tell them apart. They are in the front lines too to go first. That's the way the big boys have set it up. They will be ready to pick up the pieces.

...because that's what will happen.

This can't be a left/right fight. We get no traction that way.

We're losing our democracy. We have to forget our political sides, and all come together
and save it. And not just the tea partiers---everyone.

Do you get that the neocon cabal that almost has the takeover complete---orchestrated
the divisiveness and hatred between left/right, Dem/Rep, conservative/liberal in order
to weaken "We The People"?

You get that right?

a third group. People who aren't neocons, Teapissers or Theocrats. I believe these are a majority of the people. They just have no clue and can be sheeple. However, once aroused, they can be a force.

I'll let the neocons and all the other loons fight it out, and then I'd pick off the pieces left.

Some are a fully owned subsidiary of the GOP -- others aren't. They've been squabbling about it for months, but it may have just gotten a whole lot nastier.

http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/12/majority_of_tea_party_groups_spending_went_to_gop.php

The political action committee behind the Tea Party Express (TPE) -- which already has been slammed as inauthentic and corporate-controlled by rival factions in the Tea Party movement -- directed almost two thirds of its spending during a recent reporting period back to the Republican consulting firm that created the PAC in the first place.

Our Country Deserves Better (OCDB) spent around $1.33 million from July through November, according to FEC filings examined by TPMmuckraker. Of that sum, a total of $857,122 went to Sacramento-based GOP political consulting firm Russo, Marsh, and Associates, or people associated with it. . . .

The services for which Russo, Marsh was paid appear to be legitimate campaign needs. For instance, it took in several hundred thousand for what OCDB listed in the FEC filings as "PAC Email Newsletter Costs - Generic Fun." That would appear to refer to the numerous fund-raising and activism emails sent to volunteers to promote and build the Tea Party Express -- a nationwide bus tour to build opposition to the Obama agenda -- many of them by Wierzbicki.

But one expert on political action committees told TPMmuckraker it was unusual for a PAC to direct so much spending back to the entity that created it. And the spending details raised hackles among members of the Tea Party Patriots, a rival faction of conservative activists who have denounced TPE as a creature of Republican political professionals that lacks grassroots authenticity. In an email to a Patriots group that was obtained by TPMmuckaker, one TPPer who had examined the filings asked, "What would the true grassroots people think if they knew their money is being spent in this manner?"

But I'm starting to shift my position. After talking to some more libertarian types, they also see the writing on the wall and feel its time to put down the left/right monikers and find a common purpose. Of course, I don't agree with the vast majority of their positions, but they at least see that we have to unite to stop what is happening in this country and then argue/work together on policy.

Most of the teabaggers are beyond hope. But there is a good portion of them that could be convinced, if they aren't already, to come together for the greater good and stop the corporatist /theocratic machine in this country.

the answer HELL NAW! DOUBLE HELL NAW!!!

Infiltrate the tea-bagger parties, and show them how corporations are destroying what is left of our democracy.

If we don't join 'em, they're OWNED by the wrong side.

We have to understand that there is a sizable portion of the teabaggers that are not going to be convinced regardless of what we prove to them. They are either brainwashed or in the pockets of the powers that be.

But there are many that really just don't like the direction of this country, just like many of us. They just happen to be more conservative than we are. Some are apathetic about politics but see their own lives being unraveled and want to do something about it. These are the people we have to reach and I believe that many of them could be receptive, since many of the things that we are against, they are too, just from a different angle.

They are very angry about the corporations taking over our government.

They hated the bank bailouts. They were mad at McCain for agreeing with it.

There is a large contingent that understands that we don't have a functioning
democracy. We have a corrupt political system, run by dirty money. Corps
donate to pol campaigns. Pols return the favor by writing favorable legislation
sought by the corps.

America gets screwed and shafted. We don't have a democracy. We have laws
being written--based on money that has changed hands.

Tea partiers agree on this, don't they?

with it thru checks and balances. we don't have to "join" the teabaggers in their ideological campaigns -- if we have similar aims for returning power to the people thru checks and balances, then great.

practical issues can and should remain separate from ideological battles. i agree with you -- they're not our "enemy." the point isn't to have enemies. the point is progress.

90% of them are operating as churches so I think that the brain washing goes deep. Once they get a perverted version of the Bible and a very white Jesus fed to them by the pastors and their own prejudices are appealed to, it's not that hard to make them cross the line into distrusting the government and convincing them that they don't have to be law abiding to that government, and that they should be armed and ready for a revolution when the time comes.

would be associated with. They stay as far away from religion as they can. I don't doubt there is racism galore, but these people aren't burning crosses. They are just ornery.

have done your part by warning him and letting him know your views on the subject. As for others the longer you fall into the prism of lies that are fed to you through sources with no credibility you will have people who go to where they think someone understands them. These teabaggers and the lot do not research their facts nor their people. Fruit Loops are not only in the cereal box they are in the Congress, Senate,Media and churches. So right or left doesn't make a difference. But finding common ground and principles do. People who talk about joining teabaggers make no sense. Especially since we know the things that they seem to stand for. They always say they want their country back,they believe our President was born in Kenya,they think immigration is a dirty word,there is no such thing as climate change or global warming,there are death panels in the health care bill,need i go further. Please don't listen to anyone suggesting that you lower your educated standards for stupidity under any circumstances, to do so would be surrender to the weakest.If i have a family member who is misguided i try and enlighten them with researchable knowledge.That was America's problem in the first place. We took what our political leaders said and counted it to the good.But most of them had corporate interest,kickbacks,government contracts and old fashioned payola.The American public didn't have a chance. But now that we know better it is time we do better.So you can tell your brother before he does something crazy he should check out his sources before he makes a commitment to something he may cannot withdraw from once it is done. Wishing you the best in your quest.

The PTB don't love any of us. I am not caste-impaired. I listen to people on all levels and I've had that feeling that since about '03.

:shrug:

never heard of them.

is this some kind of 'southern' thing? it sounds pretty wacky.

No, cloven hooves are traditionally associated with the Devil.

depending on how deep he is in a militia (if he is at all). Maybe questions surrounding that would be a better place to start and then depending on his answer.. well.. better just stick to the first part.

then he could also warn you with a lot of sourced material. Your zealots are his socialists. Your neo-cons are his UN. Your theocrats are his one worlders. Your Cloven Hooves are his Bilderbergs.
Would you heed his warning?

Am I on DU or Free Republic?

Clearly reason and good sense have left this place.

I have no idea what is going on in this country anymore. People here are stirred up all over the place. You have the fundie evangelicals plotting who knows what. And they are plotting.

I'm not sure about teabaggers. There are a lot of people hanging off the ends of the Earth who think Lindsey Graham is too moderate. There are a lot of people who I once thought had reasonable bones in their bodies who have turned into birthers and all sorts of things. They have taken leave of part of their senses.

Then you also have the people I know where I grew up who are rumbling around waaaaaay out in the country. They just want to be left alone. Except for the real criminal types, they don't mind the game wardens or law enforcement. If they have officially called themselves a militia or have some name, I don't know it.

There are those down there too who are mixed up in the militia movements that want to get out and mix things up. They are all gungho about titles and secret squirrel stuff. They run around training. The group my brother knows are too lazy to do all that. They know basically what they will do if somebody messes down there, but I don't think they have plans to travel.

My point was to tell him to watch his back and where the real danger may lie. My statement about 'you gots the guns' was in reference to the fact that while somebody may want me because of my beliefs, they may be after them because they could offer real resistance. As far as a dungeon, if push ever came to shove and there was a nutball fundie pushing their views, I'd leave them in the middle of a swamp with the rest of the snakes.

DU can be a paradise of reason compared to some of the people I know out in the world. They aren't just in the South either. I have lived with some level of this insanity all my life. I just got used to smacking them in the mouth rhetorically to keep them from getting a head of steam up. 'Onward Christian Soldiers' is taken a little too literally.

the only real tool I have to measure the pulse of this country is via the internet and
and friends living in other parts. There's a great deal of discontent and as the economy
worsens people tend to have a greater "what the fuck have I got to lose" attitude.

They're walking away or being removed from their homes, they live in fear of losing
their jobs, they feel disconnected and powerless. Not for me to judge what is in the
minds of people living in communities and cultures I know nothing about.

These are certainly scary times. I hope reason prevails.