Are Republican voters insane, or just plain stupid?

And before you answer that, ask the same about us Dem voters.

The ideology between the Repubs and us may be different, but at election time, we've all been had.

A politician has two functions. (1)Raise money. (2)Tell us whatever we want to hear.

Dear Brain Dead People: WAKE UP.

Our local congressperson or senator may throw us a bone from time to time, but don't expect much more. They don't work for us. They work for the corporations that bought them, paid for them and own them.

Think I'm uninformed? Crazy? Full of crap? Cynical? Then take a look around you. Is this the country you thought you lived in? Is this the country where your Social Security and Medicare should be up for grabs? Is this the country where everyone can find a job (if you're a nuclear scientist)? Is this the country that has a "safety net" to catch those who fall on bad times?

We've been fucked over. Mostly by Republicans,but with the help of far too many Democrats.

How do we fix it? Well, my real question is "Is it fixable?"

The destruction started the day St.Ronnie took office and has had only occasional pauses. But anyone who doesn't see the downhill slide in their lifestyle is either tremendously wealthy, or in a coma.

So what do we do about it? Beats me. What's your answer?

and callous as that may sound, I've found it to be sadly true.

They are gone to reality due to a belief system. It is an absolute belief system requiring no proof, therefore it qualifies as a religion.

even propaganda that is very badly done

Reagan was wrong, smaller government allows the people to be robbed by the powerful. They will not admit they we're wrong.

Look who we elect to represent US, over and over again. Humans are self destructive creatures in voting, politics and government. Quit looking for answers, it's been like this for thousands of years.

Ringo.

I got that advice as a young man and it helped explain a lot of what I see today. There are those who enjoy free thinking and questioning authority...many tend to be Democrats. On the other hand, there are those who need certainty...simple answers to even the most complicated question. They find comfort in soundbites and slogans that are spoken yet rarely understood. It's living in a word of "order"...thus the appeal of perceived "good old days" where the evils were hidden away. It's conforming to what one's heard constantly for years and never questioning...never complicating one's life.

Is it fixable? Doubtful. Can it be controlled or altered? That seems to be a more realistic answer and one that will take a long time to happen. In short, those who are brainwashed with the right wing memes...especially those who claim piety to St. Raygun, are set in their ways. The best can be to keep them in a box, fighting among themselves and use truth and fact to ridicule and contain. It's breaking their spirit and putting doubts in all those slogans that have been proven not only to have failed but have been self destructive to most who are still too frustrated and brainwashed to think clearly.

The salvation is the wave of Raygunuts are in two groups...those in their 60s and beyond...the so-called "Raygun Deomcrats" and those who came up in the 80s and are now in their 40s...the real core of the dittoheads and teabaggers. I see a big change once you get below the age of 35...as well as the overall demographic change in this country. The GOOP is hanging onto "ideals" that become more and more obsolete each day.

Cheers...

Millions of young people believed in Obama, and saw a better world because of him.

He's one year into his administration and many/most? of us are becoming disillusioned.

We may be dense, but Obama and his "advisers" are even denser and here's why. We won't contribute on line the next time around. We won't show up to vote. We'll stay home. (Do you "get it yet" Rahm Emanuel and all you other thugs that are surrounding our president and paving his path to destruction?)

Does this mean the Republicans will once again take over?

Perhaps. But here's my question. Aside from the degree of how badly we get fucked by Dems or Repubs, what's the difference? And I'd really like to hear some answers here aside from the "He's better than Bush" bullshit.

Your dilemma is one I faced in the post-Watergate era. For all the good things he stood for, Jimmy Carter wasn't Jerry Brown or Mo Udall...and was a bit to "centrist" for my tastes on some issues. He brought in Volker who began the real "era of deregulation" and seemed more embroiled in the beltway games than in enacting a Progressive agenda. The disillusion went to many in my generation who either became appathetic and didn't vote or disillusioned and became rushpublicans (the neo-cons). Political purity lead to infighting and losing elections...and then the momentum of the 60s...totally trumped by the "Raygun" revolution and the corporate domination of the past 30 years.

I can understand the disappointment, but also it's a lesson on how our government really works...or doesn't. It's one that some prefer to ignore and stand on principals but also one that doesn't work in the current beltway culture. Politics has become a bloodsport and its turned off many in the past year...or pissed them off. The result is a nation that is polarizing further and the politicians in the middle perfer to do nothing than to ruffle feathers.

It also can be said that this first year was one that has been a learning experience. It happens to all administrations. Look at how the GOOPers give boooshie a pass on 9/11...as if his real reign of terror didn't begin until 9/12/01. Clinton had a real crappy first year...it's how an administration adjusts that is to be determined. I think President Obama, being from the legislature and being against the exeuctive abuses by the previous regime, tried to let the legislative take the lead. His big mistake was a "Majority Leader" in the Senate who couldn't lead and an opposition that has a singular focus to destroy this administration at any and every turn. Let's see how things play out now that the rose colored glasses of the first year are off.

Cheers...

Hence, they are, by definition, evil and self-serving (the definition admittedly being mine).

Being uneducated gives them a big head start toward swallowing bowlfuls of foul crap from Beckannity and then begging for more. In general, these are people who lack the mental skills to differentiate truth from lies. (Their absolute, total inability to recognize or respond to irony is a big clue. So is their open contempt for smart people.)

A few of these wingers are smart enough to be normal if they had the facts - true facts, not made-up Beckannity crap - but with no education and poor thinking skills they are left defenseless before demagogues. Most, though, are just plain butt stupid in addition to being uneducated - I don't think there is any way to reach these people. You might as well talk to the cat.

A casual observer could reasonably come to that conclusion.

But I think their source of information is so misleading that it makes them appear as if they are insane. Republicans mostly rely on Fox News and AM right wing talk radio for information. These information sources have a single theme, that is Obama is ruining their nation and every problem they are having stems from this foreigner-Obama the president.

Right now I'm listening to C-Span's Washington Journal. Right wing callers seem to have no grasp of reality. The question is about the effectiveness of the "stimulus". They mostly grade Obama's stimulus as a "D" or "F".

Obviously they have been told by their information source the ONLY path to recovery is through massive tax cuts and spending cuts. They completely ignore the fact that middle and lower income households are no longer in the market for goods and services. It wouldn't matter a lick how many products and services the wealthy created, the middle and lower income Americans no longer have buying power.

This is what America has mutated into since the New RIght took over the country first with Proposition 13 and then with Pruneface Reagan getting into the Presidency.

America is now the biggest Phonyland on Earth.

The nation that bullshits endlessly about Jesus but follows Ayn Rand.

The nation whose first commandment is "Get Yours and Fuck Everyone Else".

The nation that worships people who get to the top by lying, stealing and backstabbing.

The nation that has seen the rise of Idiotcracy where millions vote for the next American Idol while they ignore the American Idles who are unemployed, disabled, destitute and cast out.

The nation that bullshits about Democracy but fails to practice it at home.

The nation who bullshits about freedom yet has a corrupted and bought off Whore Court open the door for corporate tyranny.

The nation that roots for Freddy and Freida Fetus as long as they are in the womb, but once they leave it, looks the other way when Freddy or Freida are molested, malnourished, miseducated, and thrown away.

The nation that says it's YOUR fault if you get sick or disabled.

The nation that craves materialism, that believes whomever dies with the most toys wins.

The nation that craves anything that celebrities do, but ignores the needs of the many who just get by.

The nation addicted to listening to junkies like Rush, dry drunks like Beck and convicted felons like Liddy on their radios.

The nation brainwashed by 19th Century Fox to believe that Freedom is Slavery, War is Peace and Ignorance is Stregnth.

The nation that bullshits about a "City on the Hill" when in reality it is nothing but an immoral sewer polluting the rest of the planet with its narcissistic garbage.

The nation that is brainwashed by TV Preachers to believe that JC and his Sonshine Band are heading back to earth in a week or 2, and when they approach, Jesus will turn on his Holy Hoover Vacuum Cleaner and suck up all his rich white Republican Christian followers and leave earth to the godless homo-loving atheistic Marx loving Democrats.

Yes, it's about America, the nation that says in God We Trust, but All Others Pay Cash, especially when you have no health insurance.

How far this nation has fallen, how far...

There's no problem in doing it. I've done it myself.

While it's on the subject I started, it can open up a whole new aspect of the discussion I started here.

I wish that more DUers were as aware and up-to-date as you. However, be ready for the crap you'll catch for knocking "established truth."

Nonetheless, I think it will make for an interesting thread. Thanks for posting it here. And please post it as a new thread. It will carry on the concepts about which we are both speaking.

Maybe the system liked what I wrote so much it duplicated it :-)

absent a tremendously traumatic event,e.g. complete colapse of the economy. Even then I think the reaction might be in the wrong direction, say to a facist state.

... when the entire system of governance here is grounded in that manufacture of consent 100%

It is not fixable so long as fear sells (look, another snake in your toilet pot! It was on the news)

It is not fixable as long as fear thrives (fearfull people want simple solutions)

It is not fixable so long as laws are being made that encourage fear (e.g. everyone has a gun, so I'm protecting your right to have one too)

Need I go on?

for most rank-and-file republicans, it's not about better governance or helping others or even taxes per se. nor is it about truth or lies.

it's about identity. they want to be part of the "in" crowd. they have been presented with a choice of one group, celebrated as "patriotic", "god-fearing", "christian", "pro-family", "fiscally responsible", "strong on defense", "anti-terrorism" and so on; and the other group, derided as "elitist", "socialist", "pro-europe", "beholden to special interests", "anti-business", "anti-family", "america-hating" etc.

so they choose to identify with the club that seems the obvious choice. and membership in a club comes with a secret handshake and members-only greeting. in the case of the republican party, the members identify themselves to each other by parroting back rush's slander of the day, or that tax cuts solve everything, or that obama should go back to africa or whatever.

the truth is not relevant, any more than saying that the cool color for bandanas is yellow from their point of view, for them, it's not a true/false statement. it's just a sign of membership and identity. either you're with us or against us.


there is plenty of ignorance and stupidity that thrives in this environment, but there is great strength in this approach, and the republican powers-that-be have capitalized on it.


democrats, by contrast, tend to be more thoughtful on an individual basis, and less willing to come together as a party. there is greater wisdom in this approach from a policy standpoints, but much less strength in practice.

Actually, since the cynical manipulators are the uberrich, mayby that number should be a bit smaller, and there should be more classified as stupid.

nt

attention quicker than some third party successes.