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Is th US looking at it's own "Lost Decade?"

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MadHound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-10 10:07 AM
Original message
Is th US looking at it's own "Lost Decade?"
Watching the economy over the past few months, this was question that I had posed myself. Paul Krugman was apparently doing the same and came to the same conclusion that I did: Yes, we're heading towards a lost decade unless strong, decisive action is taken now to further stimulate the economy and reduce unemployment.

"Despite a chorus of voices claiming otherwise, we aren’t Greece. We are, however, looking more and more like Japan.

For the past few months, much commentary on the economy — some of it posing as reporting — has had one central theme: policy makers are doing too much. Governments need to stop spending, we’re told. Greece is held up as a cautionary tale, and every uptick in the interest rate on U.S. government bonds is treated as an indication that markets are turning on America over its deficits. Meanwhile, there are continual warnings that inflation is just around the corner, and that the Fed needs to pull back from its efforts to support the economy and get started on its “exit strategy,” tightening credit by selling off assets and raising interest rates.

And what about near-record unemployment, with long-term unemployment worse than at any time since the 1930s? What about the fact that the employment gains of the past few months, although welcome, have, so far, brought back fewer than 500,000 of the more than 8 million jobs lost in the wake of the financial crisis? Hey, worrying about the unemployed is just so 2009.

But the truth is that policy makers aren’t doing too much; they’re doing too little. Recent data don’t suggest that America is heading for a Greece-style collapse of investor confidence. Instead, they suggest that we may be heading for a Japan-style lost decade, trapped in a prolonged era of high unemployment and slow growth. "

<http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/21/opinion/21krugman.html>

Worse yet, the boom-bust cycle that our country goes through is contracting, one down cycle coming so close on the heels of the last that we simply don't have time to recover, time to fully re-employ those who are long term unemployed. If you track the history of these cycles, you will notice that they have gone from a once in a generation phenomenon, to once a decade, and now the last one, which started seven years after the tech bubble burst.

More bad news, our recoveries are getting weaker

"The real struggle that we have is not with the next year, it's with the next decade, as Paul suggests, because our trend growth and expansions is getting softer and softer. The last expansion was the weakest expansion in the post-World War II period."

<http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=127059439>

We need to stop engaging in this short term economic thinking, bolstering the economy for long enough to get through the next election cycle. We need another stimulus in this country in order to start re-employing as many people as possible, now. We can't afford to let the market take care of unemployment, because it simply won't, and worse, in another six-seven years we'll have another bust period that will leave even more millions of long term unemployed on top of what we already have.

Obama and the Congressional Dems need to take charge on this one, they need to introduce another stimulus bill, one devoted to creating more jobs, not more tax cuts. Obama needs to fulfill his promise of creating a green energy industry in order to help with both our energy needs and environment, along with helping our unemployed.

Otherwise, this country will collapse in relatively short order. If people are worried about racking up our debt for these programs, well then end the wars, cut the defense budget and start taking care of our own people. We are headed for major problems, let's solve them now, while we can, rather than simply going off the cliff.
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MadHound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-10 10:22 AM
Response to Original message
1. kick n/t
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lunatica Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-10 10:28 AM
Response to Original message
2. How many people have to go off the cliff before we 'go off the cliff'?
The problem is now, not in some vague future. Count the unemployed and the underemployed now. We're already drowning

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MadHound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-10 10:32 AM
Response to Reply #2
6. I hear you, I'm currently unemployed myself
And given that I gave up my employment four years ago to go back to school, I have to get along without any unemployment insurance.
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mynameiswhat Donating Member (95 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-10 10:29 AM
Response to Original message
3. I thought the stimulus' there that led to their lost decade?
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MadHound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-10 10:30 AM
Response to Reply #3
4. Their stimulus was to prop up the banks,
Not to actually create jobs. Our stimulus here, while creating jobs, also consisted of further tax cuts and propping up the banks.

We need another stimulus package that would do nothing but create jobs.
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laughingliberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-10 10:35 AM
Response to Reply #4
8. Oh, but we have limited resources for that...
as the President informed us at the jobs' forum. :(
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MadHound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-10 10:37 AM
Response to Reply #8
9. Yep, gotta keep those wars going,
Sucking ever more money from the working class, middle class and poor, depositing it in the coffers of the rich and elite.
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mynameiswhat Donating Member (95 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-10 10:39 AM
Response to Reply #4
10. But wasn't it all the debt they had that hurt them?
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MadHound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-10 11:08 AM
Response to Reply #10
13. It wasn't national debt that did them in,
But much like us, it was the speculative debt. Here's a brief article on it that might help.
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lost_Decade_%28Japan%29>

Fascinating how similar our economic crisis is to theirs.
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mynameiswhat Donating Member (95 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-10 11:42 AM
Response to Reply #13
17. Thanks for the help/info!
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Greyhound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-10 01:39 PM
Response to Reply #13
20. Why? It's the same people that sunk the global economy.
And where's the call to make the architects and beneficiaries of this disaster pay?

The Corporation is our friend, the corporation feeds, clothes, educates and heals us, give us this day our daily processed food-stuff and maketh us to toil in the divine quest for more. Amen.


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laughingliberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-10 10:32 AM
Response to Original message
5. If we're really, really lucky...
We'll only lose 1 decade
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MadHound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-10 10:33 AM
Response to Reply #5
7. Yep, if we're lucky,
Personally I think that we're in the beginning of the downward spiral that is going to suck this country under.
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scarletwoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-10 10:56 AM
Response to Original message
11. I don't see how there's any way to really fix this situation unless we somehow unwind the entire
parasitic capitalist system.

As Bob Herbert put it so well in his NYT column about the oil disaster yesterday:

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/22/opinion/22herbert.html?adxnnl=1&ref=opinion&adxnnlx=1274533244-kLjlGhLXBDNhblqXsWh93g

This is the bitter reality of the American present, a period in which big business has cemented an unholy alliance with big government against the interests of ordinary Americans, who, of course, are the great majority of Americans. The great majority of Americans no longer matter.


He was referring to the unolding environmental catastrophe, but this statement applies equally as well to our unfolding economic catastrophe.

In short, we are fucked.

sw
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glitch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-10 11:03 AM
Response to Reply #11
12. We can come up with something much better than the system we have now.
But we are still fucked until we do.
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MadHound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-10 11:10 AM
Response to Reply #11
14. What needs to be done is reinstate the regulations we had post WWII
FDR instituted these regulations to rein in the excesses of the capitalist system. These regulatory measures led to decades of prosperity in this country. We started going to hell economically when Reagan, followed by Bush, Clinton and Bush started undoing these regulations.

Obama's current attempts at regulation are a start, but nowhere near enough.
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laughingliberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-10 11:12 AM
Response to Reply #14
15. Yes, we have a road map out of this but it is not in favor of our corporate overlords. nt
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chill_wind Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-10 11:30 AM
Response to Original message
16. K & R.
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ThoughtCriminal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-10 11:44 AM
Response to Original message
18. We Already Lost a Decade
The question is: Can we save the century?
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MadHound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-10 12:35 PM
Response to Reply #18
19. Better yet,
Can we save this country?

With the cycle between boom and bust becoming shorter and shorter, more and more unemployed are piling up. Our debt continues to rise, our standard of living shrinks, and sooner or later the people in this country will revolt.

Obama needs to take strong action now to shrink the unemployment rolls, otherwise we're simply going to spiral right down the drain.
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troubledamerican Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-10 08:41 PM
Response to Reply #18
25. + 1
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krabigirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-10 01:43 PM
Response to Original message
21. We have been since 9/11 imo..some would probably say much longer than that.
But I think since that day everything has been going backward.
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MadHound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-10 01:58 PM
Response to Reply #21
22. I agree to a certain point,
But the real kicker that we have right now is the massive unemployment. After 911 we didn't have that sort of unemployment.

As Krugman says however, this last recovery, the one that encompasses the period you're talking about, was the weakest recovery in our history. So weak that for many areas it didn't seem like a recovery at all.
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scheming daemons Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-10 02:02 PM
Response to Original message
23. We already had a lost decade.... 2000 to 2009


...
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MadHound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-10 02:06 PM
Response to Reply #23
24. Actually we were technically in a recovery period, or boom period up until '07
Unemployment figures were much lower than they are now. What was happening was a bubble was being inflated and we were living high. Grant you, much of it was fueled by credit and debt, but living high nonetheless.

But as I said earlier, this last recovery or boom period was the weakest in our history, and for many people it didn't seem like a recovery at all.
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