Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Welcome To Peak Oil - The Deeper You Drill, The More You Might Spill

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010) Donate to DU
 
kpete Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 01:33 PM
Original message
Welcome To Peak Oil - The Deeper You Drill, The More You Might Spill
Edited on Tue May-25-10 01:34 PM by kpete
'Forward, the Light Brigade!'
Was there a man dismay'd ?
Not tho' the soldier knew
Some one had blunder'd:
Theirs not to make reply,
Theirs not to reason why,
Theirs but to do & die,
Into the valley of Death
Rode the six hundred.


*******************************

Welcome To Peak Oil - The Deeper You Drill, The More You Might Spill
by John Laumer, Philadelphia on 05.25.10

A British-owned company has failed publicly and massively in sovereign US waters, having outsourced an ill prepared charge into dangerous underwater territory. Hence the reference to Lord Tennyson's "Charge of the Light Brigade" - Light Crude Brigade...get it?

While it is hard to imagine how exactly they got process safety so wrong - drilling a mile below sea level without frequently testing and certifying that the system would actually shut the flow off when needed? - we should not miss the larger point, that this failed charge signifies the arrival of Peak Oil.

Everyone was expecting a steep and sustained run-up in oil price would mark the onset of Peak Oil. Not happening because of the economic downturn. Instead we get a Gulf-wide gusher.

...............

Aside from what specifics an Obama-appointed investigatory commission may eventually uncover, I submit that a major impetus for the failed charge - and this covers those at the Minerals Management Service - was the outlook encouraged by politicians of both US political parties who, over the preceding two years, cheer-led this offshore drilling imprudence with cries of "Drill Here, Drill Now." It was amplified by US broadcast media replays, and by print media which featured it without mentioning the risks. No critical thinking on display anywhere. Citizenry are immersed in talking points instead of real information and thoughtful questioning.

more:
http://www.treehugger.com/files/2010/05/welcome-peak-oil-deeper-you-drill-the-more-you-might-spill.php



Consider this picture of an "oilbird."


Now, think of seeing this picture every day,
over and over and over and over and over again.
For years, maybe.
http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2010/5/25/869666/-BPs-Accidental-Terrorism-Brings-Silent-Spring-To-America


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 01:46 PM
Response to Original message
1. Peak Oil & Global Warming are flip sides of the same coin.
They are both symptoms of the same disease that afflicts the entire civilized world: http://americanjudas.blogspot.com/2010/02/primal-forces-of-nature-vs-real-primal.html">Infinite Growth Paradigm.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
blindpig Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 01:52 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Infinite growth is part and parcel of Capitalism
Replacing Capitalism with a rational alternative seems like a pretty good idea....
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 07:15 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. Relocalization will not be a one-size-fits-all paradigm.
But once world oil production has passed the peak and is in a state of permanent decline, Capitalism in its current incarnation, Globalization, will cease to exist. Relocalization will be the name of the game, which means that our political and economic infrastructure will be restructured in a devolutionary manner dependent on the needs of that locality. In some localities, that will necessitate socialistic methods to meet the basic needs of the working class. In others, as illustrated by Cuba's http://www.energybulletin.net/node/13171">Special Period, it necessitates capitalistic methods to meet the basic needs of the working class.

As I put it in my previous link you replied to,
http://americanjudas.blogspot.com/2010/02/primal-forces-of-nature-vs-real-primal.html">The Primal Forces of Nature vs. The Real Primal Forces of Nature :


The disease is the Infinite Growth paradigm. This disease afflicts all operating economic systems in the world today; capitalism, socialism and communism all operate within this paradigm. Why do I consider it a disease? Well, let's take this "one holistic system of systems" at it's word. What do you call "primal forces of nature" that attempt to grow infinitely within a finite organic system? I call it cancer! The difference that makes this an imperfect analogy is that our planet is much stronger than the human body. Or as George Carlin put it, "The planet is fine! The people are fucked!" Whether we fuck ourselves through Peak Oil or Global Climate Change, it is the inevitable result of the Infinite Growth paradigm colliding with The Real Primal Forces of Nature: Earth!

The arrogance that fuels the mindset that we humans are the primal forces of nature is what must be addressed if we are going to have the revolution we need as opposed to the revolution that stimulates our ideological persuasion. We need genuine balance, not the ebb and flow from "one vast and ecumenical holding company". That means as people, we must live in harmony within the natural physical limits of our planet. That means our economy must be based on sustainability, not growth. That means our money is no longer tied to wealth creation but is representative of energy, both the human energy we produce and the planet's energy that we utilize. I'm not sure what that civilization will look like, but I think it will be a hell of lot more civilized than the one we have now where our Supreme Court takes what is satire in Network and makes it reality in this century.


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
blindpig Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-26-10 06:58 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. Special Period, NEP....

The road to communism is rocky, the internalized bourgeois paradigm, often erroneously referred to as 'human nature' is not something that you can snap your fingers and make it go away. And in the meantime the society must survive, function. This is an entirely new thing and a lot of trial and error is involved. The development of the Cuban Revolution is very illustrative, very much a work in progress, but they have not lost sight of the goal. We learn from the mistakes of those who have gone before but we should not derogate their efforts when they have not gone as we should like, we were not there and they were in very new territory.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-26-10 03:24 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. I don't derogate the Special Period, I applaud it.
The difference between how two communist countries, Cuba and North Korea, responded to their own premature resource peaks due to the collapse of the Soviet Union is like an illustration between night and day:

Peak oil preview: North Korea & Cuba
A tale of two countries: How North Korea and Cuba reacted differently to a suddenly diminished oil supply


by Dale Jiajun Wen

That peak oil is coming is no longer a question. It’s only a matter of when. The global food system we are familiar with depends crucially on cheap energy and long-distance transportation—food consumed in the United States travels an average of 1,400 miles. Does peak oil mean inevitable starvation? Two countries provide a preview. Their divergent stories, one of famine, one of sufficiency, stand as a warning and a model. North Korea and Cuba experienced the peak-oil scenario prematurely and abruptly due to the collapse of the former Soviet bloc and the intensified trade embargo against Cuba. The quite different outcomes are partly due to luck: the Cuban climate allows people to survive on food rations that would be fatal in North Korea’s harsh winters. But the more fundamental reason is policy. North Korea tried to carry on business as usual as long as possible, while Cuba implemented a proactive policy to move toward sustainable agriculture and self-sufficiency.

The 1990s famine in North Korea is one of the least-understood disasters in recent years. It is generally attributed to the failure of Kim Il Jung’s regime. The argument is simple: if the government controls everything, it must be responsible for crop failure. But this ideological blame game hides a more fundamental problem: the failure of industrial chemical farming. With the coming of peak oil, many other countries may experience similar disasters.

snip

North Korea failed to change in response to the crisis. Devotion to the status quo precipitated the food shortages that continue to this day. Cuba faced similar problems. In some respects, the challenge was even bigger in Cuba. Before 1989, North Korea was self-sufficient in grain production, while Cuba imported an estimated 57 percent of its food1, because its agriculture, especially the state farm sector, was geared towards production of sugar for export.

After the Soviet collapse and the tightening of the U.S. embargo, Cuba lost 85 percent of its trade, and its fossil fuel-based agricultural inputs were reduced by more than 50 percent. At the height of the resulting food crisis, the daily ration was one banana and two slices of bread per person in some places. Cuba responded with a national effort to restructure agriculture.

http://www.yesmagazine.org/issues/5000-years-of-empire/peak-oil-preview-north-korea-cuba



My point is, the countries (or more precisely localities; the sacred cow concept of nation-state may in some cases be an impediment to survival)that survive Peak Oil will be the ones who flush their sacred cows down the toilet. Those who ask "What Would Karl Marx Do?" or "What Would Adam Smith Do?" as a prerequisite for reform within the context of their prior economic infrastructure are less likely to survive than those who set aside their preconceptions of how things should be. Those more likely to survive are those who are able to throw everything out that isn't working and start with a completely fresh piece of paper and say, "OK, how do we solve this problem?"

That's really the only goal a rational government should have: allowing the greatest amount of good for the greatest amount of people. Because if the goal is conformity with some idealized economic preconception such as "free market" libertarianism on the right or Marxist/Leninist/Maoist/Whatever communism on the right, the goal is destined for failure unless such economic methods address the needs of the people in that particular locale. That's what I mean by Relocalization not being a one-size-fits-all paradigm. Doctrinaire rigidity in the face of common sense is to uphold an Infinite Death Paradigm.

I'm not sure what you meant when you said We learn from the mistakes of those who have gone before but we should not derogate their efforts when they have not gone as we should like, we were not there and they were in very new territory. Are you saying you consider the Special Period a mistake?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
blindpig Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-26-10 04:37 PM
Response to Reply #6
9. No, not the Special Period

As you say, ya do what ya gotta do to keep the society afloat during times of stress. But you keep your goal firmly on target. I think that could be said of Cuba today.

The passage which you quoted was a reference to the Soviet Union.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Mika Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-28-10 08:26 AM
Response to Reply #9
18. Cuba has now become a world leader in organic local farming systems.
There oil was cut off almost instantly. The "special period" was very difficult. During that entire decade that Cuba was transforming, the government and people never stopped building-out their critical social infrastructures. Farming, education, health care.

Not one school closed - in fact school building increased.
Not one Cuban lost their health care - in fact Cubans increased local clinics and hospital construction and the training of Drs and ancillaries.
Not one Cuban lost their home due to foreclosure.


I could go on.

I was there many times during this time frame.


:hi:




Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Subdivisions Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-27-10 10:43 AM
Response to Reply #4
14. Hi Robert. I am working on an effort to re-localize my town here in the
heart of red Texas. I happen to live in a blue district (Rep. Chet Edwards) but it's going to be a TOUGH go of it here. I'm going to give it a go anyway. My effort is in the fetal stage but I expect things to move fast once I submit a LTE and have a prepared proposal for the city and the Chamber of Commerce. I'm conducting the necessary preliminary studies myself, including things like local food production and transportation. Despite it's red nature, this town is absolutely perfect for such an effort. My goal is to qualify my town for the Transition Town network.

If you have any advice, resources, or just well-wishes, I would be greatly appreciative.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-27-10 12:52 PM
Response to Reply #14
17. That's great! Good luck to you!
I think you're heading on the right track in seeking to qualify your town for the Transition Town network. I don't have any personal experience in that regard; I basically live a hop, skip and jump away from Michael Ruppert in Los Angeles. We're not as advanced as the San Francisco-Oakland area as far as organizing relocalization, but there is some meager comfort I take in my close proximity to the major shipping port of San Pedro. Are you close to a port town by the Gulf of Mexico? If not, that might be a consideration in the future, coordinating your Transition Town resources needs by establishing a relationship with a port town. But that's down the road; I really wish you the best in establishing your town as a Transition Town. I can't think of any resources that you aren't already on top of in that regard, but if I do I'll PM you.

Did you send me this site? I can't remember, but I have to say I like it:

http://www.postpeakliving.com/preparing-post-peak-life

Best of luck!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DCBob Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-10 01:54 PM
Response to Original message
3. Yep, the "easy" oil is gone, at least in this part of the world..
It going to more complicated and more dangerous and more expensive.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Subdivisions Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-26-10 03:29 PM
Response to Original message
7. I've got posts going back 3 years on this very topic. For the most part, no one wanted to hear it.
It was already too late then. It's even later now. And we will pay dearly for ignoring the problem.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Subdivisions Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-26-10 05:09 PM
Response to Reply #7
10. Annnnd in the midst of oily devestation choking the GoM to death, this is still ignored. As usual...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Subdivisions Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-26-10 03:32 PM
Response to Original message
8. Deepwater Horizon: This is what the end of the Oil Age looks like
by Richard Heinberg

Lately I’ve been reading the excellent coverage of the Deepwater Horizon Gulf oil spill at www.TheOilDrum.com, a site frequented by veteran oil geologists and engineers. A couple of adages from the old-timers are worth quoting: “Cut corners all you want, but never downhole,” and, “There’s fast, there’s cheap, and there’s right, and you get to pick two.”

There will be plenty of blame to go around, as events leading up to the fatal rig explosion are sorted out. Even if efforts to plug the gushing leak succeed sooner rather than later, the damage to the Gulf environment and to the economy of the region will be incalculable and will linger for years if not decades. The deadly stench from oil-oaked marshes—as spring turns to hot, fetid summer—will by itself ruin tens or hundreds of thousands of lives and livelihoods. Then there’s the loss of the seafood industry: we’re talking about more than the crippling of the economic backbone of the region; anyone who’s spent time in New Orleans (my wife’s family all live there) knows that the people and culture of southern Louisiana are literally as well as figuratively composed of digested crawfish, shrimp, and speckled trout. Given the historic political support from this part of the country for offshore drilling, and for the petroleum industry in general, this really amounts to sacrificing the faithful on the altar of oil.

But the following should be an even clearer conclusion from all that has happened, and that is still unfolding: This is what the end of the oil age looks like. The cheap, easy petroleum is gone; from now on, we will pay steadily more and more for what we put in our gas tanks—more not just in dollars, but in lives and health, in a failed foreign policy that spawns foreign wars and military occupations, and in the lost integrity of the biological systems that sustain life on this planet.

The only solution is to do proactively, and sooner, what we will end up doing anyway as a result of resource depletion and economic, environmental, and military ruin: end our dependence on the stuff. Everybody knows we must do this. Even a recent American president (an oil man, it should be noted) admitted that “America is addicted to oil.” Will we let this addiction destroy us, or will we overcome it? Good intentions are not enough. Now is the moment for the President, other elected officials at all levels of government, and ordinary citizens to make this our central priority as a nation. We have hard choices to make, and an enormous amount of work to do.

http://energybulletin.net/node/52914


" END OUR DEPENDENCE ON THE STUFF "

Any questions?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
robertpaulsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-27-10 11:52 AM
Response to Reply #8
15. No, no questions from me.
But thanks for the link, Subdivisions. I wish more people would see this and understand the future we face.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Subdivisions Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-27-10 12:09 PM
Response to Reply #15
16. You're welcome, Robert. I've been trying so hard
to get this message across in the general DU community but, alas, there's never much interest in discussing it despite this being the most pivotal issue of our times. I suspect that the natural progression of Peak Oil will have to do my talking for me. This oil spill is just the first major catastrophe of what I call the "Age of Descent" - or what can also be illustrated as the right-hand side of Hubbert's Curve.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
NNN0LHI Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-26-10 05:18 PM
Response to Original message
11. I admit the propaganda was working on me
They had me believing they could do it safely.

I had no idea that they were drilling a mile and more beneath the ocean though. And to top it off without the kind of equipment already available to fix a blowout at that depth quickly. Be like going to the moon before figuring out how you are going to get back.

Doesn't make sense.

Don
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
meow mix Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-26-10 05:53 PM
Response to Reply #11
13. i was in the same situation
i feel extremely complacent and foolish
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
neverforget Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-26-10 05:52 PM
Response to Original message
12. Katrina woke me up to Peak Oil.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Sun May 05th 2024, 05:47 AM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC