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Dutch continue to offer assistance re: Gulf catastrophe: "the process seems to be rather slow."

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Karmadillo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-14-10 08:50 PM
Original message
Dutch continue to offer assistance re: Gulf catastrophe: "the process seems to be rather slow."
http://www1.voanews.com/english/news/usa/Dutch-say-They-Could-Speed-Gulf-Oil-Recovery-with-US-Permission-96341579.html

Dutch say They Could Speed Gulf Oil Recovery with US Permission
14 June 2010

In Louisiana and other states on the Gulf of Mexico there is frustration over what many residents see as a slow response by the U.S. government to protecting coastal areas. Some critics of the Obama administration cite offers by the Netherlands in April to supply sophisticated skimmers and dredging devices, and the administration's failure to accept the offer. The issue is as murky as the oil slick now threatening regional beaches.

A Houston-based company is now cleaning oil off surface water in the Gulf of Mexico using sweeping arms that attach to a boat and help gather large amounts of oil. These sophisticated devices were provided by a Dutch company with years of experience in such operations, but instead of using the Dutch ships and crews immediately, when The Netherlands offered help in April, the operation was delayed until U.S. crews could be trained.

The Obama administration declined the Dutch offer partly because of the Jones Act, which restricts foreign ships from certain activities in U.S. waters. During the Hurricane Katrina crisis five years ago, the Bush administration waived the Jones Act in order to facilitate some foreign assistance, but such a waiver was not given in this case.

The Dutch also offered assistance with building sand berms (barriers) along the coast of Louisiana to protect sensitive marshlands, but that offer was also rejected, even though Louisiana Governor Bobby Jindal had been requesting such protective barriers.

<edit>

"We see the oil coming in, we see that there is Dutch capacity," said Floris Van Hovell. "We do not want to change the rules here. We do not want to come in and tell everybody how to do it, but we do see that we have something that is very helpful. We have been saying this for a number of weeks, but the process seems to be rather slow."

more...
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theoldman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-14-10 08:53 PM
Response to Original message
1. If the Dutch were so smart, BP would have hired them and Obama would have approved.
What you are reading about the Dutch is misinformation passed around by Republicans.
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Karmadillo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-14-10 08:58 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. Republican misinformation? Interesting. Do you have a link?
Thanks.
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cwydro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-14-10 09:07 PM
Response to Reply #1
6. and you sir,
are a misinformed, um, person.

(Self edited to avoid deletion)
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Webster Green Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-14-10 09:18 PM
Response to Reply #1
8. Are you claiming these ships don't exist?
What are you talking about?
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Cresent City Kid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-14-10 11:01 PM
Response to Reply #1
19. My right wing cousin got this story from fox news
That doesn't mean it's not true, they don't discriminate between true and false stories that reflect poorly on Obama, they just go with them. I personally don't know.
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chill_wind Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-14-10 11:39 PM
Response to Reply #1
20. To Hell with BP. The Dutch have been very politely pointed in their remarks
Edited on Tue Jun-15-10 12:03 AM by chill_wind
about the process on this end.



U.S. and BP slow to accept Dutch expertise
By LOREN STEFFY Copyright 2010 Houston Chronicle
June 8, 2010, 10:13PM


Three days after the explosion of the Deepwater Horizon in the Gulf of Mexico, the Dutch government offered to help.

It was willing to provide ships outfitted with oil-skimming booms, and it proposed a plan for building sand barriers to protect sensitive marshlands.

The response from the Obama administration and BP, which are coordinating the cleanup: “The embassy got a nice letter from the administration that said, ‘Thanks, but no thanks,'” said Geert Visser, consul general for the Netherlands in Houston.



Their process isn't anything like it, because their government owns the cleanup equipment:



Many in the U.S., including the president, have expressed frustration with the handling of the cleanup. In the Netherlands, the response would have been different, Visser said.

There, the government owns the cleanup equipment, including the skimmers now being deployed in the Gulf.

“If there's a spill in the Netherlands, we give the oil companies 12 hours to react,” he said.

If the response is inadequate or the companies are unprepared, the government takes over and sends the companies the bill.




http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/business/steffy/7043272.html

So who has the smarter plan, right out of the gate?

But that aside, Weird Koops (one of the Dutch system's engineers) says that while recovered oil can be reused as fuel for larger tankers, the cost of its recovery exceeds the benefits of its reuse. Think that might have been one possible factor in BP's lack of interest, at least, in the system.

They (BPUSCG) had to be pushed, and the Dutch said they finally had to go thru the State Dept. USCG finally ordered them on May 18.



Dutch companies that manufacture the sweeping arm system first contacted BP officials April 23, three days after the Deepwater Horizon explosion, according to Mr. Huisman, who spoke by phone from his office in The Hague Tuesday. After receiving little reply, the companies turned to his department for help in reaching out to the US State Department, Huisman says.

“We specifically asked those companies that if you have a firm order from BP or the US government, then we can make the arrangements available,” he says. The US Coast Guard made a formal request for the systems May 18, according to Huisman.



Sjon Huisman is an adviser with the Netherlands’s Ministry of Transport, Public Works and Water Management. More about the Dutch system and their own comments about it here:

http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/2010/0601/BP-oil-spill-Will-the-sweeping-arm-system-from-the-Dutch-help

and here:



In many cases, this equipment is being provided by private companies -- at BP's expense. And like other elements of the joint response, decision-making has been complicated because federal officials must consult with the oil giant before signing off on any offer.

"The coordination on this side of the ocean was not completely clear," said Floris van Hovell, press counselor for the Dutch Embassy in Washington, adding that when a Dutch official was seeking to broker an aid agreement last month, "it was for a long time unclear on where he should go to and who should take the decision."

According to government sources who spoke on the condition of anonymity because they are not authorized to discuss the matter, Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton appealed to the White House several weeks ago, suggesting that it needed some foreign aid for practical and diplomatic reasons.

BP declined to comment.



http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/06/13/AR2010061304232_2.html


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Betty Karlson Donating Member (902 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-15-10 02:24 AM
Response to Reply #1
22. Stop being ethnocentrist Americans.
It's enough the Republicans are. Get help where you can get it. And that goes for Obama as well.
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UTUSN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-14-10 08:55 PM
Response to Original message
2. Why didn't the Dutch catch VAN DER SLOOT on the first try?!1 n/t
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elehhhhna Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-14-10 09:02 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. Uh, that was Aruba. Why didn't we catch Ted Bundy on the first try?
If you have a point, what is it?
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-14-10 09:19 PM
Response to Reply #2
9. Why didn't we catch Osama bin Laden at all? nt
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UTUSN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-14-10 09:22 PM
Response to Reply #9
11. I luerve your avatar, have saved it for future use!1 Thanks!1 n/t
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-14-10 09:27 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. =)
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Betty Karlson Donating Member (902 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-15-10 02:30 AM
Response to Reply #2
23. While I agree that both oil and Van der Sloot are slick,...
Edited on Tue Jun-15-10 02:33 AM by Betty Karlson
please note that Aruba has a rather large internal autonomy, and that the Dutch could not interfere without an Aruban request to do so. By the time the Dutch were involved, there was not enough evidence to convict Van der Sloot.

All this, by the way, doesn't change the fact that the Dutch offered assistance from the start - as they have done in the case of the Gulf spill. And that the U.S is well on its way of being stupid and stubborn, Aruba-style.

What is so shamefull about getting help? If your house is on fire, do you tell all neighbours to stay away because, no really, you still think you can put it out on your own, thanks very much?
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panader0 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-14-10 08:58 PM
Response to Original message
3. The Dutch know that the oil will follow the Gulf Stream
and hit their shores eventually.
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cwydro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-14-10 09:08 PM
Response to Original message
7. K and R
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Ilsa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-14-10 09:19 PM
Response to Original message
10. I'm having a hard time accepting that Obama seems reluctant to color outside the lines.
I'm wondering why he didn't waive the Jones Act, and why he didn't sign an executive order to bypass the Army Corp of Engineers impact study so they could begin building the sand birns that Louisiana was asking for. Yeah, do the impact study so they'll know what the limitations and effect are, but start building the barriers.
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MisterP Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-14-10 09:58 PM
Response to Original message
13. "but then the WH'd be liiiiable" the BP-WH chorus will answer
yeah, but the beaches would be cleaner

"there's nothing that can be dooooooooone! you hate humaaaaaaanity" they'll say...
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FarCenter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-14-10 10:34 PM
Response to Original message
14. They were not built in the US, and they are not crewed by US sailors
So it would be contrary to the Jones act for them to skim up oil in US waters and then unload it at a US port.

Maybe they could unload in Cuba?
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Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-14-10 10:43 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. Fla. Republicans ask Obama to waive Jones Act/napolitano says dutch skimmers on their way
PENSACOLA, Fla. -- U.S. Sen. George LeMieux and U.S. Rep. Jeff Miller want President Barack Obama to waive a law they say is keeping foreign oil skimmers out of the Gulf of Mexico.

The Florida Republicans sent a letter to Obama on Monday and plan to discuss the issue with him Tuesday during the president's visit to Pensacola to assess the BP oil spill in the gulf.

The federal maritime administrator in emergencies can waive the Jones Act that bars foreign ships from carrying cargo and passengers between U.S. ports.

U.S. Sen. Bill Nelson, a Florida Democrat, who also was in Pensacola on Monday, said Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano has assured him skimmers from the Netherlands and other European counties are on their way.



Read more: http://www.miamiherald.com/2010/06/14/1680503/fla-republicans-ask-obama-to-waive.html#ixzz0qtE69AxL
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amborin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-14-10 10:47 PM
Response to Reply #15
16. the Dutch skimmer ships that were told "NO" on May 9?
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Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-14-10 10:50 PM
Response to Reply #16
17. no idea, just ran across the article.
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chill_wind Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-15-10 12:44 AM
Response to Reply #14
21. They are in operation now
according to the OP. So if there was any issue with the Jones Act, it appears to have been dealt with.

I've been following the time line and stories about this a little bit, and while the Dutch make it clear they were put off in the very earliest days in, it just sounds to me that Thad Allen, working a little too closely perhaps with BP, just didn't make up his mind that he wanted them until much further along-- or that maybe he was finally told by WH as a matter of fact we do and you will request them- which he finally did on May 18. They got shipped air freight here the weekend of May 28, but there was to be additional time and training getting them operational.

Here are some older links with the May 28 press release from the Dutch and a couple other media links:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x8474818
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nashville_brook Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-14-10 10:59 PM
Response to Original message
18. k n r
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