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KurtNYC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 12:16 PM
Original message
Sarcasm is the least efficient form of written communication
since it spends its verbiage telling the reader only what the writer does NOT believe (while espousing contempt).

Popularized by adolescent-targeted TV shows, sarcasm is increasing. Often called "the lowest form of wit," sarcasm belittles others' viewpoints and attacks them personally while advancing no counter-argument. It is a highly judgmental form of bullying.

Further, sarcasm in the written word lacks the auditory clues that are key to understanding it as such. It is passive aggressive behavior which can actually stifle productive debate.
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supernova Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 12:20 PM
Response to Original message
1. It can be better as performance art
rather than written.

Since you can see the person's facial expressions and hear their tone of voice, their meaning is pretty clear.
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stray cat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 12:20 PM
Response to Original message
2. Is it ever productive - such as answering right wing liars or idiots?
Edited on Sat Jun-19-10 12:21 PM by stray cat
some comments don't deserve anything but laughter or ridicule....TO do anything else gives them credibility they in no way deserve.
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Smarmie Doofus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 12:20 PM
Response to Original message
3. Yeah. Right. nt
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TalkingDog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 12:23 PM
Response to Original message
4. If someone writes sarcastically and the reader doesn't "get" it
The author has done a piss poor job of communicating intent.

It's all about word choice and phrasing.


But as a way to further debate...there I'm in agreement.
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IDemo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 12:23 PM
Response to Original message
5. Disagree
Edited on Sat Jun-19-10 12:28 PM by IDemo
Sarcasm can serve to expose the absurdity of ideas and beliefs that simply aren't worthy of normal debate.
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KurtNYC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 04:34 PM
Response to Reply #5
25. Isn't the absurdity of an idea self-evident?
if your opponent puts up a flawed or absurd idea, then it would seem the way to win is to simply advance a better one. If swaying an audience is the goal then the rudeness of sarcasm may work against the one employing it.
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sufrommich Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 12:27 PM
Response to Original message
6. Americans have a tin ear when it comes to sarcasm, the
Brits ,on the other hand are slap down masters of it.It's as easy to pick up in the written word as it is verbally. I don't know who you're quoting as it being "the lowest form of wit", but it is far from it.
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KurtNYC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 04:37 PM
Response to Reply #6
27. a common phrase
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Dorian Gray Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 05:41 PM
Response to Reply #6
40. Agree
Sarcasm is my favorite form of humor.

Or am I being sarcastic?

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Brickbat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 12:29 PM
Response to Original message
7. You forgot your sarcasm tag.
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Starry Messenger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 12:30 PM
Response to Original message
8. So *you* say.
:sarcasm:

















:hide:
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ChairmanAgnostic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 12:32 PM
Response to Original message
9. "Riiiight."
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Cresent City Kid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 12:34 PM
Response to Original message
10. Couldn't that be reversed?
Couldn't it be said that the written word is the least efficient form of sarcasm? I'm not being sarcastic here. The fact that I have to state that is what I'm talking about. Does this make sense?
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branders seine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 12:35 PM
Response to Original message
11. No.
Edited on Sat Jun-19-10 12:36 PM by branders seine
Ignorance is the least efficient form of written communication.
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Johonny Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 12:53 PM
Response to Original message
12. I don't get sarcasm or your post
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TexasObserver Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 01:02 PM
Response to Original message
13. Thanks. That is sooooo helpful.
Edited on Sat Jun-19-10 01:03 PM by TexasObserver
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htuttle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 01:07 PM
Response to Original message
14. "He used... sarcasm. "
"He knew all the tricks, dramatic irony, metaphor, bathos, puns, parody, litotes and... satire. He was vicious."
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jp11 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 01:07 PM
Response to Original message
15. I'm passive aggressive but I don't think it could be the least efficient form of written
communication, something has to be worse.
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treestar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 01:09 PM
Response to Original message
16. It's just a method of expression
Adding color to something - if no one ever used it, and you got all literal means of saying the same thing - it would just be repetitive.
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lumberjack_jeff Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 01:11 PM
Response to Original message
17. Disagree
Sarcasm can be an effective technique to highlight absurdity and illogic.

i.e. "Of course men are the most highly valued members of society. That's why the chauvinist creator of the Vietnam Memorial only put mens names on it."
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Fumesucker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 01:13 PM
Response to Original message
18. There is no idea so stupid and/or ignorant that it does not deserve the utmost respect..
When I go to Free Republic I always give full respect to all their ideas.

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struggle4progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 01:18 PM
Response to Original message
19. A labor organizer once told me never to be sarcastic, since it is guaranteed to be misunderstood
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KurtNYC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 04:41 PM
Response to Reply #19
29. about 25% of the population have literal minds which don't get
sarcasm (and sometimes humor in general). I've met plenty.

My neighbor used sarcasm with her 4 year-old and it just confused him.
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struggle4progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 04:57 PM
Response to Reply #29
32. His point was something like that
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Scuba Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 01:21 PM
Response to Original message
20. But the most fun...
...and certainly more efficient than 'legalese'.
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smoogatz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 01:24 PM
Response to Original message
21. Sarcasm is just another verbal tool.
I find it useful at times as a means of expressing contempt for ideas and arguments that are so stupid that they don't merit a thoughtful response.
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noise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 01:30 PM
Response to Original message
22. Fantastic thread! n/t
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branders seine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 01:32 PM
Response to Reply #22
23. LOL
:rofl:
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Iggo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 01:40 PM
Response to Original message
24. But it's fun.
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 04:36 PM
Response to Original message
26. Well what WOULD we have done without this post?
:sarcasm:
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hobbit709 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 04:40 PM
Response to Original message
28. Those most easily offended by irony and sarcasm are those least likely to understand it.
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kenny blankenship Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 04:56 PM
Response to Original message
30. So you like Efficiency. You know who else liked to be known for efficiency?
Hitler. That's right. You heard me: Hitler. The Fuhrer and his Nazis valorized efficiency, modeling their regime on the streamlined command structure of the military. They pointed to the national trait of German efficiency as proof of their Master Race status. The Blitzkrieg was the most efficient decapitating stroke that modern maneuver, mechanized hardware, and the logistics of the day could combine to produce. And look what came of it. Look what came of all that Nazi worship of efficiency. Maybe efficiency is just a little bit overrated?

You can do something efficient and fast, or you can do it right.
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Iggo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 05:32 PM
Response to Reply #30
34. Right you are, Ken.
:rofl:
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KonaKane Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 05:37 PM
Response to Reply #30
36. Ladies and Gentlemen, today's Godwin's Law!
.
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KurtNYC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 05:38 PM
Response to Reply #30
37. Mother Teresa had a mustache....
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kenny blankenship Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 05:45 PM
Response to Reply #37
41. ...And in her case, it was completely superfluous
Edited on Sat Jun-19-10 06:05 PM by kenny blankenship
amounting to a "Defense in depth" and, in combination with her other womanly charms, far more than any occasion would have required to maintain her celibacy. So you see how efficiency is a false virtue, eschewed by the righteous.
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ManiacJoe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 04:56 PM
Response to Original message
31. Right on the money!
While sarcasm works quite well verbally, it tends to fail miserably in written communication unless the reader personally knows the author or is otherwise knowledgeable of the author's beliefs. Otherwise it tends to be taken literally due to there being no verbal clues to indicate that it was not meant to be taken literally.
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RadiationTherapy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 05:22 PM
Response to Original message
33. You made this up based on your own beliefs and are espousing contempt for it.
And it is puns that are the least of wit.
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KurtNYC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 05:51 PM
Response to Reply #33
42. Discouraging sarcasm is part of many "best practices"
I wouldn't post something I didn't believe. It is not an original thought but one that I agree with.

Puns are light-hearted and creative.
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RadiationTherapy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 05:54 PM
Response to Reply #42
44. I meant 'belief' as in 'lacking evidence as proof'.
I disagree about puns, but, of course, there are a lot of puns, so there must be some worthwhile ones. Sarcasm is similar.
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KurtNYC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-20-10 08:41 AM
Response to Reply #44
51. Written sarcasm uses 100% of its verbiage to tell what the writer
does NOT believe. That is low efficiency. And it also engenders confusion for some readers which moves the efficiency score even lower.
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Mojeoux Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 06:07 PM
Response to Reply #33
45. Yes, that is common knowledge.
People who "get" sarcasm appreciate the "bait and switch," of the play of words.

While the same people who don't get sarcasm totally don't get puns.

A bad pun can add a smell to the cerebellum.

Sarcasm with little kids is futile. You have to explain.
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KonaKane Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 05:35 PM
Response to Original message
35. Almost no one here uses sarcasm well.
And no, that stupid little blood dripping emoticon doesn't help.
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Fumesucker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 05:40 PM
Response to Reply #35
39. Sarcasm, like satire has become remarkably difficult in the last thirty years..
Edited on Sat Jun-19-10 05:40 PM by Fumesucker
At least when dealing with politics..

It's a corollary of Poe's Law..

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Poe's_Law

Edited for phrasing..
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Lucian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 05:39 PM
Response to Original message
38. The great thing about sarcasm is...
that most people are too stupid to pick up on it.
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grahamhgreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 05:52 PM
Response to Original message
43. Snarky is what their calling it. Being snarky. I see it as a form of violence.
Edited on Sat Jun-19-10 05:53 PM by grahamhgreen
All of the problems in the country are met by violence as a solution - it's an adolescent answer for every problem.

Crime is met with more violent police.

Islamic fanaticism is met with wars that kill innocents.

Everyone is continually thrown into a state of attack and defend - fight or flight.

It is because when people are in this mode, they can not find the reasonable solutions to their problems that the power-brokers like to escalate it through the support for violent media nad pundits like Beck and Limbaugh.

What make humans survive - our violence or our ability to come together and share with and love one another. Obviously it is the latter or we would have long since killed each-other off.


That said, if done properly it can be humorous instead of hurtful.
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backscatter712 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 06:13 PM
Response to Original message
46. I'm always respectful of the Internet Writing Style Police. Why would I ever be sarcastic?
Edited on Sat Jun-19-10 06:20 PM by backscatter712
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A-Schwarzenegger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 06:16 PM
Response to Original message
47. Sarcasm should be outlawed, arrested, tried, convicted, executed, buried, dug up & arrested again.
Parody, on the other hand, should be made king.
Sarcasm is making mean fun of the other man's dirty stinking socks.
Parody is putting the other man's dirty stinking socks on
& going for a nice long walk around the neighborhood in them. :*
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Mojeoux Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 06:16 PM
Response to Original message
48. There is a BIG difference between Sarcasm and Ridicule.
When I went back to University in my 40's and I worked on the school paper, we had a section of reporting the latest police blotter reports on campus.

Most items were ripe for mockery, but there is a BIG difference between ridicule and sarcasm.
Mockery of the victims was off limits, but all pomposity was fair game.

The right wing practices a lot of ridiculing of victims.

The left wing loves delicious sarcasm that pops the bubble of rich, greedy people.

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zorahopkins Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 06:22 PM
Response to Original message
49. Well This Is Just Great
I so enjoy it when someone gives advice about sarcasm.

It is ALWAYS so very welcome.

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underpants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-19-10 06:23 PM
Response to Original message
50. Wow like that post was like so convincing
not
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Vincent441 Donating Member (35 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-20-10 08:56 AM
Response to Original message
52. good
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slackmaster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-20-10 08:59 AM
Response to Original message
53. I regard fart noises as the lowest form of wit, followed closely by puns
Then comes hyperbole. Writers who abuse that deserve to be taken out and shot.
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