Do you own any stock?

401K? Mutual funds? Retirement plan? Anything?

457, some roth stuff.

If you want to retire you have to save, and saving and investing are one in the same in my book. I did it my entire working life, I continue to do it even in retirement. It allowed me to leave a pointless shit job at the ripe old age of 57, saved my sanity, and was the ticket to renewed good health.

with more but I guess I did Ok. I was laid off on my birthday last year at 61 and it looked like they would never start our plant up again so I just called it quits. I feel sorry for my Co-workers that are in their 50s all they can do is try to retrain for something else. Other than worn out legs from working on concrete floors for 40 years I feel better than I have for years.

457, some roth stuff.

the stock market is a con game.

your odds are better in vegas nowadays.

Damn it, they just make it so hard not to these days, with retirement plans that you have to do yourself, IRAs, etc. I always thought that it was a game and I was not being told the rules. I want a way out and there is no way with the retirement plans without making it a taxable event. I'm screwed.

If you don't want your money invested in the stock market, there is no reason why you can not simply place the funds you have in an IRA or a 401(k) into a money market fund, a "stable value' fund or some sort of cash option. If you have a 401(k), almost every single plan out there has low to no risk options available. If you have an IRA, be it traditional or Roth, there is nothing stopping you from buying CD's with those funds inside the IRA.

Just because you have tax deferred accounts doesn't mean you have to invest in a way that is more risky than you are willing to tolerate.

means that I worked for a few years for zero salary, since I have lost money IF I cash out now. LOL, I guess it does sound like Vegas---let it ride.

You don't have to sell out your positions if you don't want to, but you don't have to continue adding to those positions either.

If you cash out (i.e take money out of 401K in the form of cash disbursment) that is a taxable event.

However if you change your allocation INSIDE the 401K/IRA/Roth it is not.

For example you could sell some stock (or stock mutual fund) and buy some corporate bonds.

and changing that investment (still in the IRA) to cash or bonds (which also have not been a spendid investment). If I have invested $10,000 and sell now to convert to a cash IRA and the sell price is $7,500, that is what I mean by losing.

I do like the suggestion above that future investments could be going to something safer.

but we took it all out a couple of years ago when things started tanking and won't be reinvesting any time in the near future.

My sole involvement with the financial industries is a credit card for emergencies.

:shrug:

It's distributed in multiple locations for safety.

:hi:

i love it when people check out of the system or institutions AND THEN claim they're doing the safer thing.

righttt. :eyes:

Hence, putting it in multiple places, that's the safety angle.

If I was still in the system, I'd have it in multiple banks, under multiple identities.

then your hidden money will likewise be worthless also.

i don't know what people think they are saving themselves from when they do stuff like this.

Yeah I think most people don't think this through.

A person is insured up to $250K in FDIC accounts per account type per bank.

Even if you didn't want to spread it across multiple banks a couple could protect a cool million (person 1 individual account, person 2 account, joint account, trust account) in a single bank.
If you need more protection most brokerages have SIPC insurance for up to $500,000 in cash.

The idea that money "hidden" in house is safer than bank/credit union is simply not based on reality.

It's not pleasant.

Do you make it a habit of pay people/entities what you owe? If so then I guess the risk of losing cash in fire/theft might be worth it.

To each his own. I hope you don't have a significant amount of cash just lying around. Safety deposit box for cash and/or treausry (or savings) bonds would make more sense.

Identity/account theft, lawsuits, government seizure, etc. can empty/invalidate a bank account overnight. I'm not worried about systemic breakdown, though if I was, I'd have lots of toilet paper and fire kindling as a result of my paper hoarding.

:evilgrin:

or financial institutions.

if you're really afraid of all types of losses, you'd at least diversify your risk as much as possible by having some of your money in banks and the rest elsewhere.

but the one-eyed Willie approach to protecting your money has big weaknesses.

I'm not that paranoid, though. :D

but you are acting *that* paranoid.

:shrug:

Part of my career is being paranoid. :evilgrin:

but they are index funds, so the stocks aren't held directly, per se.

most of my newer holdings are in index funds. My older mutual funds are in overseas and high growth. I am beefing up cash now. As I get closer to retirement, I am getting more conservative. Now is not the time to bet the house or double down.

The 10 year T-bond is yielding 3%. Bank accounts are yielding less than 1%. PITIFUL!

2 year T-bond, 5 year T-bond, 99% of CD, and all bank/saving/money market accounts have a negative rate of return right now. Which means each year you are poorer because while nominal value of money may rise by say 1.5% the cost of goods rises by 2% meaning your purchasing power is worth less and less each year.

"real" (adjusted for inflation) returns is the only real measure of wealth, return, wages, or prosperity.

1% or 3%, at least it increases. Take it from me, the voice of experience.

The sad part is it is a 100% guaranteed loss.

So, give me a chance to go back and do it all over, and I guarantee you that I will be excited with 1% growth.

And that 1% today will not last forever. I lived through a time when my CDs were earning 14% or more. Having cash at a time like that was not a bad thing.

I put a stop loss on my stocks in the 80's, but I got caught in the dot com bubble when I had a mutual fund manage my money. I pulled my money out about 3-4 years before the 2008-9 decline. Yes, I missed the market peak but the market still hasn't reached the point that I pulled out. That was a good move. I have been shy to get back in and have preferred the index funds. My metals have done well during this time period though. I also like my overseas stocks.

Now I am very cautious-and still not crazy to get in as heavily as I once did.

or just about every financial person, and move toward safer investments. Don't blame you for being cautious. When you see the ups and downs and how there is no rationale for so many moves in the market, it is good to more careful. I have tried to diversify (you know, that is the advise you get), and it hasn't mattered.

But I figure I do not have a loss until I sell, so I am just hanging on to some of my losers. I was lucky not to panic at the bottom since I have gained back some loss.

Stay cautious. Getting rich probably isn't what it is cracked up to be. LOL.

The best way to double your money is to fold it in half and put it in your pocket.

Stocks had a positive return for all 20 year periods, that includes the 2 worst 20 year periods. 1909-1939 & 1988-2008.

When most people look at stock price chart they ignore the awesome power of compounded reinvested dividends.

The long term trend of equities is very clear. However nobody should be 100% equities. Corporate bonds have out performed equities in roughly 10% of the periods. Those 10% periods tended to be blood baths though so having bond exposure helped investor avoid a selling at bottom situation. In 20 year period ending March 2008 even treasuries out performed equities. Treasuries should make up at least a small percentage of everyone's portfolio.

You might not make it out of here alive.

Sounds to me like there's a "lost decade" in there somewhere.

1928 to 1948 was the worst 20 year period (I don't have accurate data on dividends & earnings for the DOW prior to 1927).

$1000 invested in DJIA in 1928 was worth only $1635 in 1948 (assuming annual reinvestment of all earned dividends) for a annualized rate of return of 2.49%.

A chunk of money automatically goes to several different places each month, with the fantasy that it will add up to something useful some day...

Then I thought, "This ain't gonna turn out well" and bailed. Still out because looking at the new bubbles my "This ain't gonna turn out well" dinger is still in operation.

I put money into a Sharebuilder (ING) account. I own five stocks - Disney, Tesla Motors, ARM (chips for cellphones), Costco, and Target. I'm probably going to sell the Target stock because they're supporting some RW asshole. Which is too bad, because I generally like the company.

And it's going very well. The good thing about today's market is that it's going up and down like a yo-yo. So the "buy low sell high" mantra is a literal pattern that is being repeated again and again.

but that's about it.

Mostly through my 401(k) but some independent holdings as well. Since I was 19 years old. A few shares here and there in DRIP funds have grown into a few hundred shares in those funds and gone from being worth 250 dollars to around 20,000.