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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-10-10 02:00 PM
Original message
Tips for Using Online Translators Effectively
Edited on Tue Aug-10-10 02:05 PM by MineralMan
The online language translators, like the one on Google, often produce comical results. In many cases, it's best to avoid them, especially if you know nothing of the target language. Still, there are times when it's the only option and, if used correctly, these online translators can work pretty well. So, here are some tips for getting the best results:

When you use machine translation, always:

1. Write in simple, declarative sentences in the language to be translated. The simpler your sentences, the more likely they are to be translated correctly. Avoid subordinate clauses and compound sentences at all costs. If your sentence includes a comma, you're probably not going to get a good translation. Never use contractions. Simple. Declarative. If you write a question, make that as simple as possible as well.

2. Use simple, unambiguous vocabulary. Consider whether the word you are using in your original language has more than one meaning. For example, the word "right" in English has multiple meanings. It can be a direction. It can mean correct. It can mean a political position. It can mean to properly orient the position of an object. Avoid words that might be mistranslated. The computer does not understand your sentence. Truly. Also, avoid any idiomatic or slang expressions. They never translate properly. For example, "That's cool!" will be translated to describe the temperature of something in the other language, where "cool" is only used for that purpose. Or, "I'm pissed." will end up describing yourself as being soaked in urine. You get the idea.

3. Always reverse translate the results from the target language back to the original language. This will expose most errors. If the reverse translation comes back with errors, alter your original language to correct the ambiguity. When the reverse translation says the same thing you originally wrote, or something that means the same thing, then the translation is probably OK to send. If not, don't send it until it reverse-translates correctly. This can take a few passes, so write your original in Notepad or something so you can quickly copy it and paste it back into the translator.

Now, for your amusement, I'll tell a funny story on myself that illustrates how things can go wrong in strange ways you may not anticipate:

When I was in Russian Language School in the USAF, we had to write an essay in Russian about what our life goals were. At one point, I wanted to say that I wanted to be a bum. The trouble was that the English-Russian dictionary I was using was printed in England, so the Russian came out to mean: "I want to be an arse." We had to read our essays aloud in class. The very lovely young native-speaker who was our instructor for that class almost peed her pants. After she stopped giggling, she explained the error, and the whole class almost fell out of their chairs.

I learned a very good lesson...one which has stood me in good stead ever since.
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Jim__ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-10-10 02:02 PM
Response to Original message
1. Good advice. Thanks! - n/t
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Igel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-10-10 02:23 PM
Response to Original message
2. Reverse translating is also the key to using the
two-way dictionary correctly.

"Bum --> zady, zhopa --> behind, arse" is a dead giveaway to try another of the words offered by the dictionary.

I watched a girl in 4th year college Russian hurriedly prep for being called on. She was looking up "negramotnyi" 'illiterate' and her finger slipped to "negritianin". The teacher was not amused when she translated something along the lines of "To the US's shame, it graduates upwards of 300,000 blacks per year from high school."
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Posteritatis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-10-10 02:35 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. LOL! Ouch. (nt)
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-10-10 03:17 PM
Response to Reply #2
6. Yes. that was the lesson I learned from that little essay.
I never made that mistake again.
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Tierra_y_Libertad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-10-10 02:26 PM
Response to Original message
3. Do they translate Bush/Palin Gibberish into English?
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-10-10 03:18 PM
Response to Reply #3
7. Nope. They can't even deal with Palin's run-on sentences that have
no beginning, no end, and nothing in the middle. As for Bush - did he say something?
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Vickers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-10-10 02:32 PM
Response to Original message
4. Ha! I love stories like that.
Edited on Tue Aug-10-10 02:33 PM by Vickers
I remember a cartoon that was in a book about German and English idioms, and it had a German guy in a restaurant telling the waiter in English, "I will become a bloody beefsteak!"

Those familiar with both (UK) English and German will get it.

:P

(BTW, I took the DLAB and got like 121 out of 125 , and the guys at the MEPS place got all excited. The school start date was too far off for me, so I went into Comm.)
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-10-10 03:21 PM
Response to Reply #4
9. What's funny is that before I enlisted, I had taken a psychology
class that focused on testing. One of the tests we took in that class was the DLAB. I think it gave me a little help when I too it in Basic. I aced it. But, then, I'd seen the key in that class. I did well on it the first time, too, though, so it wasn't a fluke. I did well at the Language School, too.
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apocalypsehow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-10-10 03:19 PM
Response to Original message
8. Good tips - I've already related my, umm, unfortunate translating snafu. K & R.
:thumbsup:
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-10-10 03:21 PM
Response to Reply #8
10. Yah, I thought I'd make an OP out of that reply, in case it might
help someone.
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JDPriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-10-10 03:37 PM
Response to Original message
11. Tip No. One: Learn the language you are seeking to translate into or from.
It's the only reliable alternative.

English words have many meanings. Some of the on-line translations I have seen were just hilariously funny and wrong. And that, from well-known languages like French and German. There are language programs on-line. Learn languages in your spare time if you have any. It's fun. It's easier than you think.

Just listen to the language like you would music. You will begin to hear patterns. Only then do you need to move to comparing written text to what you hear. The next step is to figure out what you think things might mean and then -- only then do you check your guess against a dictionary. It's fun. It engages your whole mind. Pictures along with the words are a big help too. Language is the tool with which most of us think and shape thought. You need to use your whole mind and as many senses as possible to help you connect words to meanings.
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-10-10 07:24 PM
Response to Reply #11
14. Yes, that's the very best tip, but not practical for everyone.
Edited on Tue Aug-10-10 07:29 PM by MineralMan
I'm competent in Russian, French, and Spanish. I developed the method I described while using the online translators with those languages. It works. As long as you're very careful and check the back-translations, you can rely on the translation to be at least competent and understandable. Testing it with the languages I know has demonstrated the technique's effectiveness.

All the same, I don't generally use it for non-European languages, since I have no way whatever to be more than half certain. If I must, I begin each email with: Please forgive me. I do not speak {language name}. I used a computer to write this.

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JDPriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-11-10 02:53 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. Very interesting. Knowing foreign languages increases your understanding
far beyond the language itself. When I read a story from an American source that seems inconsistent or impossible, I check foreign sources. It is best to do it in the actual original news source in the foreign language. Sometimes the English version of a foreign news source was written for English speakers and leaves out important facts due to the cultural references. Sometimes the English version is not an accurate or full translation.

Your use of the translation function on the computer is a better idea than say, reading a German newspaper's English edition.

Thanks.
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Scurrilous Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-10-10 03:42 PM
Response to Original message
12. Thanks.
K & R :thumbsup:
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LWolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-10-10 04:21 PM
Response to Original message
13. I use on-line translators to write notes to non-english speaking
parents of my students, and to write comments on report cards. I can get a district translator, but I have to type up what I want to say, send it off, and wait a few weeks before it comes back. When I want to write a note, it's because they need to know something NOW.

Their kids aren't always happy with that.

Your tips are good.
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