they are talking about how things are going to change come November "We are going to take our country back". I just had to butt in, I asked him who are you going to take your country back from? Then he starts about Acorn stealing the election and nobody voted for Obama except people on welfare and illegal aliens. I said listen here buddy I voted for him and I served in the Army and worked all my life and it is my country too. His wife shut him up. I asked are you on SS and he yes I paid into it and deserve it. I said go ahead a vote a Republican in and don't complain when they cut your SS and do away with Medicare..

It's funny how their tone changes when they are actually challenged,isn't it?

I would have been hard pressed not to end the conversation, "And turn off Fox News; they're lying to you."

That isn't even possible, they don't make up enough votes even if they could vote.

What an idiocrat

"White people didn't vote for that -----." I know exactly who he thinks took his country.

In freeperland, they use a different organ. Where you see a small, disorganized group of illegal immigrants and people on welfare, they see a massive army of islamofascist commie terrorists.

You see? It's all a matter of perspective. :crazy:

Not saying anything to these public blatherers is the same as enabling them and it lets them get away with their lies and platitudes. Thanks for asking him what 'taking the country back' means. If what you say he said is true every word out of his mouth showed his total ignorance of facts.

It's hilarious to see the confidence drain from their bodies when you set them straight.

I always tell them to go home, get on the Internet, and check the facts for themselves. I tell them not to go to Rush's site, but to go to a non-partisan site and look for themselves. I tell them how mad they're going to be when they discover their radio and TV personalities have been lying to them all along.

Good for you, it takes guts to do that because you never know what to expect from them.

Just sitting here thinking about how I've never seen anyone say they've done the same thing with their boss...whatever level boss we're talking about. Immediate boss...boss's boss...the company owner or President...

And I'm not talking about within the normal workplace environment. I'm talking about something outside of work. Christmas party...company outing...etc. What if one ran into his or her boss standing in line somewhere talking to his or her spouse? Would anyone actually confront the boss the same way some here confront unknown persons out in public?

Are there different rules for educating and confronting someone who has some power over us?

But I seriously doubt that they would. And if they did, it would be (like I have) by pointing the boss to a specific fact-checking site and leave it at that. Truth is depending on the boss and his/her level maturity and/or reasonableness, even doing that can be really, really risky.

every day about Democrats. They were lazy, welfare queens just living to get HIS money for drugs, wanting free health care, food stamps...all the usual bullshit. "But, freeper" I'd say, "I'm a Democrat and I've been here with you 40 hours a week for years" He never saw the hypocrisy in what he was saying to me.

He also wasn't shy about telling me that his step-daughter was on food stamps, CHIPS, and SSD. He was also not married to her mother (sanctity of marriage and all that).

After 6 years...he still spewed the same old Faux talking points, and thought Glenn Beck was the second coming.

these people are blind. I mean it - BLIND!

Just met my future sister in law last week. Oh Lord, she calls herself a 'Conservative Republican'. I miss my card carrying ACLU, liberal former sister in law so much. Can't pick your relatives :(

There are various times I talked to people who spewed crap. I really talked nicely to them and I was assuming that if they would see the facts they'd change their minds. They would end up agreeing with me and even responding intelligently. Yet the next time I saw them they would spew their original crap all over again. They would even forget we had had a conversation in which they actively participated and seemed to change their minds.

It's amazing, but maybe others who listened in saw the light. If not then I don't know what to do. Do I stop trying to inform people who are obviously misinformed or do I not bother? I've opted for the former when it's someone I work with or know. For the latter with strangers.

that Beck is a Mormon. I wonder if he wears those funny undies. I rather surprised that fundies are into a Mormon.

:yourock:

What are you? DLC?

:thumbsup:

I thought they had a natural right to go right to the front of everything. ;-)

My family and I were standing in the line to show our boarding passes when he barged in front of us.

"There's a line here buddy!" I said to him

"I'm first class!" he answered.

"Well, so am I," I said, "so get in line!"

And we were flying first class after years of saving miles. No way was he getting in front of me.

That's when he started cursing and calling me an 'asshole,' and such. The airline people at the gate told him to get in line and shut up or he would get on at all.

It was sweet!

Sorry, but I don't think intruding on the conversations of others is any way to get a message across.

I'm surprised the both of them didn't turn around and tell you to STFU.


I would, and I don't care what topic I'm discussing with another person.



People who do this think they're changing someone else's opinion.

They're not. They're trying to make someone else look foolish.

these two assholes were purposely talking loud enough so at least a dozen people could hear them.
Getting their Repug talking points out. I wouldn't have stood in line and shot my mouth off in public about Bush so everyone within ear shot could hear me and if I did I wouldn't have been surprised if someone said something to me. Fucking asshole talking about taking "our" country back. I served this country and worked all my life and voted for Obama fuck them it's my country just as much as it is his.

and yeah...that's always the justification anyway...

they were talking loud enough....

it's a cafeteria.

Noise, maybe. Maybe they were hard of hearing. Whatever.

No excuses for intruding on a conversation between two people unless one is invited or it's a cocktail party where people expect others to join in.

try and work with them. Are you one of Obama's advisors?

To "make them mad"?


That's going to change things, right?

I can tell you exactly what happened there.

First, you intruded on a private conversation, no matter how loud it was. You were not invited into it.

Then you disrespected this man in front of his wife. We may not agree with someone's politics, but that doesn't give us the right to disrespect people in front of their families.

You didn't change his opinion. He went home believing exactly what he believed before.


So, really, it's not even about "change".

It's really about "making them mad". Pushing their buttons. Pissing them off and trying to make them look or feel like fools.


OK...got it.

God forbid the foolish be made to look like fools by virtue of their own foolishness.

for fools to look foolish by virtue of their own foolishness?

Now people have to "help" them.


Sort of like kicking someone when he's down. Or twisting the knife.


Takes an awful lot of hatred to do something like that.

so what are we to do, sit there and take it?

Sorry, but our rights are being taken away on a virtually daily basis, corporations run roughshod over peoples rights, sweetheart deals are cut daily at the expense of the people, so when some uninformed moron trots along spewing bullshit, I will call them on it.

No conversation is private in a public place, especially if everyone can hear it.

You may take the high road, but I'm tired of it. The road has gotten so high that can no longer see the ground.

I will refer you to the question I just asked at the bottom of this thread.

Exactly how far do people take their "principles"?

that us standing up to for ourselves in contrast to their attacks still puts us head and shoulders above them.

I will not back down anymore, I will respond to their ridiculous accusations and I will always call them on their bullshit no matter where I am.

really I do. But what I'm stating next will be in direct opposition to them.

We need to "twist the knife". We need to "kick 'em when there're down".

We are at war now, a war for us and our country, principles are off the table.

We are not fighting a principled war with the Repubs. They lie, they lie, they lie.

They cheat, envision that 3 or more times. Where are their principles?

We have been bent over, exposing our private parts for their pleasure for far too long.
It has gotten us nowhere. We "compromise". We try to be "partisan" , to what end?

The time to fight as dirty as they do has come. If you cannot stomach the fight, please just donate money.

I truly do not wish to piss you off. In the past I would have stood by your side and taken all the flack for you.

But times change. We must also. Our tactics must change to reflect the war we are in.

:kick:

overstating it JUST a bit?

..Good grief".:eyes:

And btw, get over yourself....You don't hold the copyright on "correct behavior"

while salivating on the radio yesterday morning. When we take control of Congress next year first thing we can hold hearings on Acorn, The Black Panthers, the AIG bailout and the auto bailout. Democrats took the House and Pelosi says impeachment is off the table. Instead of going after real health care reform they try this bipartisan crap and end up letting the insurance industry write the bill. The Democrats show up at a gunfight with a white flag. God forbid you embarrass some racist loud mouth jackass in front of his wife. I voted for Obama I served in the Army and worked for a living and he is not going to infer that everyone that voted for Obama is un-American on welfare and took his county away.

until we stop with the "I'm not lowering myself to their level" bullshit, nothing is going to change.

I confront these assholes any chance I get.

A conversation is no longer private if I can hear it. And when in any line, whether the check or cafeteria, they are in a public place.

We lose as Dems because we don't stand up for ourselves enough and want to play nice.

they make an asinine comment, I call them on their bullshit right away.

We are better informed and better armed yet we never ever use our power.

Remember nancy pelosi's bullshit of "keeping our power dry"? Well, it appears as if it dried and blew away.

But not for me. While congress might want to acquiesce to the repukes stupid ass demands and roll over when they are confronted, I will not.

No more.

Democrats run around ranting and shouting at Republicans.

Eureka!!! The world has changed!!! Now we all live in peace and harmony and everybody is happy.

Except for the Republicans, who are now cringing in dark corners, frightened to death of the mad dog Democrats who really gave 'em the business!!!111!!


Uhhh...yeah.

I stopped believing in fairy tales 50 years ago.

:eyes:

How about just calling the repukes on their bullshit anytime it comes up?

No ranting or raving needs to be done. Just a informed blunt response with facts.

Instead we get people fired over rumors and unfounded BS because the dems don't do a little fact checking or actually, gasp, talk to the person involved.

What ever happened to Nancy Pelosi's now infamous "Keeping our powder dry" BS? It vanished into the wind of compliance with the repuke whims.

no matter how many facts/"facts" are thrown at them.

And the truth of it is, the more facts/"facts" that get thrown at them, the more convinced they are that they are right.

Some people are going to learn on their own, without anyone else's help. Believe me, this is something I know after trying and trying for over 20 years to get certain family members to see some certain facts.

I eventually gave up trying, and, wonder of wonders, they came to believe what I had been telling them right along because of other things that happened.

giving up is how we got here.

...that all those years you tried to convince them didn't have ANY impact on there eventually coming around? I got to believe you had an impact...Maybe they wouldn't have come around if you had not laid the foundation.

-P

...having THEM cringe in dark corners for once.

Everyone has different levels of passion in what they believe. Many here, by virtue of the fact that they ARE here, are very passionate.

-P

but your wrong.

One, if a conversation is private-it has to be private. If you can hear it, your part of it. If the includes views vastly different from your own, you have to be involved. Failure to do so signals complaints with the views.

Two, disagreement is different from disrespect.

Three, probably didn't change anyone mind. But unless you try you never know.


P.S.-He never claimed that its about "making them mad", I believe what he was talking about was the reluctant some Democrats have toward doing what we should, because we don't want to angrier any one.O8)

:kick:

Stop being an enabler.

:eyes:

Why don't YOU mind your own business and stop telling people how YOU think they should behave.

God help us with these people.

INCLUDING EVEN YOU.

the irony of your directive above is not lost on all of us.

he's always there, but today he had to bring up Obamacare and how much it's gonna cost him and how bad things are since President Obama let all the jobs go to China because we Americans want more out of life than $7.00 a day.

I told him I couldn't talk to him anymore. He was just pissin me off and believe it or not, my job kinda rides on what the condo residents think of me.

The funny thing is, he's semi self employed but in real life he's living off a woman that he hooked up with, moved in with (from what I understand he just took over) and lives off the money she inherited from her folks. The guy ain't got anything, nada, zip. One day he told me his dad and mom disowned him cause he was a slouch. Gaud, I wanna smack him.

thankfully, I got this place to rant

:banghead:

It just leaves you so dumbfounded you can't speak. The only response I can think of would be a two fingered 3 Stooges style poke in the eyes.

Lord knows, how weary I get hearing these alpha male blowhards on a daily basis as they shoot their mouth off. I love stories where Dems finally grow a pair and fight them back.

husband of one of my colleagues (been unemployed for over two years, screwed bigtime out of unemployment payments by his bosses' perjurious sgtatements regarding his layoff process) commented on a very interesting signpost outside the school at which we had our meeting

the sign was about four inches by four inches by about eight feet tall.
On each side was an inscription written in a different language: one in chinese, another in japanese, another in arabic, and the fourth in english, which said something about diversity (our elementary/jr. high district is extremely diverse ethnically, with more than 25 languages spoken in two of our five jr. highs)

anyway, after walking around the sign and complaining that there wasn't anything in english (before he spotted the last one), he asked me, "how do you spell inclusion?"

I didn't get a chance to ask him what the catch was before he started spelling out "c-o-m-m-u-n-i-s-m"

to which I replied "jesus was a COMMUNIST! he was also a JEW!"

his nineteen year old daughter started jumping up and down, laughing her ass off, giving the razz to pops

:toast:

And I personally think it's fine to respond to a loud and obnoxious conversation in public, especially when it's insulting to you.

(PS Hope all is going well in the old hood. :hi:)

and remaining silent is what fuels these assholes into thinking everyone that can hear, agrees.
Oh no, not I, if they are spewing that crap in public, they are fair game to be called on it!

out of his league.

Ya done good, doc.

With all the attacks on Democrats here lately, a 'rubber meets the road' post like this is nice to read.

my question above.

Does "educate and confront" also apply to people who have some measure of power over us?

Like perhaps a boss spouting RW propaganda at a company Christmas party or outing...

Or maybe the boss is in line with his wife somewhere away from the workplace and he's spouting RW shit.

Do people "educate and confront" in that case, or pull back on their "principles" because, after all, it's better to be hypocritical than immensely stupid (especially in today's lousy economy)...

They MAY just be ignoring you're scolding self-righteousness.

You sound VERY rigid and moralistic...Good luck with that.

If you're asking merely because you're curious as to how far people will go, that's one thing. If you're doing it to bait people, that's something entirely different. I suspect many wouldn't "educate and confront" their bosses because they want to hold onto their jobs. Getting on a boss' shit list isn't a smart thing to do and it pays to do what one can to avoid being on that list. There are some adult bosses out there who could take it and there are many infantile assholes who might start looking for reasons to get rid of you. In this kind of economic environment, do you really expect most people do confront their bosses about politics?

Edited to add that not confronting your boss doesn't mean you'll only pick on people who aren't in power. It may very well mean you're smart enough not to piss off the boss about issues that have nothing to do with your work.

I was a union stewart in a union job, I said wnything I wanted. now retired

afraid of what? That nicety,nicety,bullshit isn't getting us no where some of these people don't know what in the hell they are talking about or what they believe in. They need to be set straight because their ignorant asses are spreading this shit and people believe it. This is war time to KICK SOME REPUBLICON ASS!!!

You sound like some of these mealy mouth so called Dems who show up on tv claiming to be speaking for us. This reminds me of the bush years when every Dem would show up on tv say they told a untruth,they misled us,they were misinformed.they told us a falsehood,but they would never say LIE. Then Slannity,O'lielly and limburger would and still do get on the radio and call Dems LIARS.

:shrug: You didn't ask him if he deserved SS. Why did he feel the need to say that? :eyes:

You, you, you.... liberal.
:yourock:

That's, in reality, what they ALL want to say. And they do. It's when they're in public that their "code words" come out. Like, for instance, "ACORN, welfare, illegal".

If these idiots are gonna run on dissolving SS and MC, they're not gonna have such an easy path to office.

Only Nixon can go to China, so to speak. Only a Democrat can cut Social Security. If Bush had attempted it (which he did), it would've been a perfect rallying cry for his political opposition and a no-lose battle (which it was). But let a corporate shill Democrat do it, and the machine doesn't know how to respond.

:eyes:

The more we talk to the repubs, and gently show them the error of their ways, the more we win.

Long live our TEE party

Talk, Encounter, Educate.

the Democrats. Too many clueless, uninformed people in this country. Just saw a CNN report in which the talking head was educating the audience about the history of Israel - including a map showing where it is. Honest to God, we're a nation of morons.

We as liberals need to be able to express our opinion in public without fear. The time is now. We should not be afraid of their reaction, we need to stand up and FIGHT!
:yourock:

I tell you, I am so sick of them marginalizing us, and have been calling people out on it more regularly and reminding them that according to the Constitution they are always bringing up but don't seem to have read, America is meant to be a nation with a broad diversity of ideas, cultures, religions, races, and philosophies among other things, and that I am damn sick of hearing the right call progressives traitors and anti-American, of them trying to co-opt the language of the Revolution which implies we are on the wrong side of history, of them throwing tantrums because they lost an election, and am sick of them trying to intimidate us. They call me names, then they call me angry when I call them out on it.

Angry? Damn skippy I am angry, and I am not going to put up with childish bully tactics any longer from people who are hypocrites and willfully ignorant on about every issue.

Damn. He put up this outrageous post, pretending to ask if more liberals than conservatives were fat, citing Michael Moore and Slimebaugh as examples. Who else, he asks?
(This guy's handle is fat_lawyer.) It was astonishingly full of blame for budget deficit on liberals,
war, excesses, whatever, and his inference was that liberals can't say 'no'. I responded to his post that if he wanted to insult liberals he should find another blog; put up a link to a Forbes (yeah that liberal rag)article showing that more red cities have high rates of obesity than blue cities
http://www.forbes.com/2007/11/14/health-obesity-cities-forbeslife-cx_rr_1114obese.html; and finally suggested to him that maybe we could leave politics out of our weight loss issues and all try to support each other on that site.

Within minutes, his post was gone! Disappeared! I'm sure a moderator took it down. Then, the guy has the audacity to put up another post speculating that he must have pushed the wrong button on his computer.
:sarcasm:

Damn. I posted that probably a moderator took it down...and here's his answer to me:

mnhtnbb: No way! Censorship is such an oppressive, conservative thing to do. Liberals love free speech, and defend the right of anyone to say anything at any place at any time. After all, they're always defending the right of *** and Islamofascists to talk and march. So even if my last post offended liberals, the last thing they'd do is act like a bunch of whiny crybabies and have it deleted.


I rather doubt the people who run NS are liberals.

:rofl:

been asked.

It is quite common in these 'confront and educate' threads for the target of the confrontation to be elderly.

One never reads "I really slapped down two burly guys with tattoos in the checkout line today."

I'm waiting on a post about inserting oneself into a conversation and getting a resounding "Screw you" as a response.

This 'intrusion' was asked for. You are a citizen, the cafeteria was a public place. We should be able to talk to other people -politely- in public places.

Doc03, from your description this fellow was trying to be heard. "Who are you going to take your country back from?"was a good way to open the conversation.

It sounds like those people listen to Fox News all the time. *roll eyes*