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LoZoccolo (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 08:09 PM Original message |
Poll question: Should teacher pay be tied to performance? |
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Skittles (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 08:09 PM Response to Original message |
1. question way too simplistic |
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Electric Monk (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 08:25 PM Response to Reply #1 |
6. Considering the OP, it's totally par for the course..... |
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ibegurpard (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 09:15 PM Response to Reply #6 |
26. no shit |
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msongs (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 08:10 PM Response to Original message |
2. only if teachers can dump underperforming students first nt |
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yurbud (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 08:18 PM Response to Reply #2 |
4. which is exactly what happened in Texas under W. |
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proud2BlibKansan (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 08:30 PM Response to Reply #4 |
9. It was Houston |
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Warren Stupidity (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 08:10 PM Response to Original message |
3. as measured how? |
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mwooldri (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 04:37 PM Response to Reply #3 |
94. Exactly... how can a teachers' performance be measured? |
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miscsoc (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Sep-07-10 02:38 AM Response to Reply #94 |
103. Seconded |
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Kurt_and_Hunter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 08:18 PM Response to Original message |
5. Yes, it should be tied to performance. |
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miscsoc (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Sep-07-10 02:40 AM Response to Reply #5 |
104. Well, that's the problem, it's pretty hard to measure. |
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outerSanctum (154 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 08:26 PM Response to Original message |
7. Of course - |
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rurallib (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 08:45 PM Response to Reply #7 |
12. What are your criteria? Grades? |
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outerSanctum (154 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 08:57 PM Response to Reply #12 |
20. Yes, grades (or at least grade improvements) should be a factor. |
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rurallib (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 09:02 PM Response to Reply #20 |
21. eventually it defaults to grades and teachers become like college coaches |
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WinkyDink (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 09:13 PM Response to Reply #21 |
24. What does "recruiting" mean here? |
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WinkyDink (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 09:12 PM Response to Reply #20 |
23. Brilliant suggestion! Awesome how it HAS BEEN DONE SINCE FOREVER ALREADY. |
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outerSanctum (154 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 09:19 PM Response to Reply #23 |
27. Even more brilliant. |
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Catshrink (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 09:22 PM Response to Reply #27 |
30. Putting words in people's mouths now? |
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WinkyDink (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 12:10 PM Response to Reply #27 |
81. Your lack of reading comprehension is ironic. |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 12:43 AM Response to Reply #20 |
54. gee, what a fresh idea! i wonder why no one ever thought of *that* before. |
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proud2BlibKansan (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 08:27 PM Response to Original message |
8. Define performance |
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TBF (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 08:40 PM Response to Reply #8 |
11. +1000 nt |
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yurbud (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 11:46 PM Response to Reply #8 |
48. blindly accepting whatever crap the chamber of commerce forces on the schools |
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tammywammy (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 08:37 PM Response to Original message |
10. Yes, but determining how to measure performance is the difficult part n/t |
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david13 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 08:47 PM Response to Original message |
13. When I was in school, the school had a motto, Publish or Perish. |
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WinkyDink (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 08:51 PM Response to Reply #13 |
16. The OP subject is not University professors, given the Board context. |
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david13 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 09:21 PM Response to Reply #16 |
29. So the point is there are too many teachers? Well that means |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 12:45 AM Response to Reply #29 |
55. i think neolibs are brainless greedy selfish fools, myself. |
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WinkyDink (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 12:08 PM Response to Reply #29 |
80. Again: The topic is not university staff. And YOU are the one whose relatives were "lousy" teachers, |
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girl gone mad (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 05:42 AM Response to Reply #13 |
69. The last part is non sequitur. |
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WinkyDink (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 08:49 PM Response to Original message |
14. That means Phys Ed students need to run a marathon, right? And Home Ec kids win the Pillsbury Bake- |
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exboyfil (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 12:21 AM Response to Reply #14 |
50. How about an English teacher who gives no feedback |
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mwooldri (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 04:42 PM Response to Reply #50 |
95. Oh dear... |
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exboyfil (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Sep-07-10 03:51 AM Response to Reply #95 |
105. The involvement of parents is probably the greatest |
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cleanhippie (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 08:51 PM Response to Original message |
15. As long as what parents pay in schools fees is tied to their involvement. |
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Morning Dew (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 09:24 PM Response to Reply #15 |
33. Damned lazy ass parents - sending their urchins off to school just so they can laze around all day. |
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cleanhippie (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 10:12 AM Response to Reply #33 |
74. You are right, and I agree. |
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Morning Dew (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 06:51 PM Response to Reply #74 |
96. That would be great if parents were more involved. |
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USArmyParatrooper (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 08:52 PM Response to Original message |
17. Your question is a bit vague |
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LiberalFighter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 08:56 PM Response to Original message |
18. How about businesses sponsor a teacher and if the teacher doesn't meet expectations |
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proud2BlibKansan (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 08:57 PM Response to Reply #18 |
19. LOL!! |
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slackmaster (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 09:06 PM Response to Original message |
22. Yes, of course it should, just as in every other occupation. |
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WinkyDink (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 09:14 PM Response to Reply #22 |
25. I wonder why no-one has ever thought of this before. |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 12:46 AM Response to Reply #22 |
56. my, now there's a novel idea. 200 years & you said it first. |
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slackmaster (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 03:41 AM Response to Reply #56 |
63. Would you feel better if I had replied with something like "That's a stupid fucking question"? |
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WinkyDink (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 12:06 PM Response to Reply #63 |
79. I think that's the perfect answer! |
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slackmaster (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 02:10 PM Response to Reply #79 |
87. Thanks WinkyDink. I hereby commit to make my answers more honest and straightforward. |
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boppers (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 09:21 PM Response to Original message |
28. Tied to, yes. As one of *many* factors. |
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azureblue (412 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 09:23 PM Response to Original message |
31. Yes, it should be |
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azureblue (412 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 09:30 PM Response to Reply #31 |
36. Really, though |
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dkf (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 09:49 PM Response to Reply #36 |
37. Should you double the salary of a teacher who can't keep their students interest, can't keep an |
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Catshrink (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 09:58 PM Response to Reply #37 |
38. We should definitely punish good teachers because of the very small percentage that |
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dkf (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 10:28 PM Response to Reply #38 |
40. If the vast majority of teachers are excellent and the tiny minority are insufficient why are we |
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dsc (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 11:37 PM Response to Reply #40 |
45. we really aren't falling behind the rest of the world |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 12:47 AM Response to Reply #40 |
57. i heard that story in the 60s. somehow we muddled through & produced you. |
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dkf (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 01:18 AM Response to Reply #57 |
59. I'm not worried about me. |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 01:21 AM Response to Reply #59 |
60. more graduate from hs today than in the 60s. the schools were "failing" in the 60s, 70s, 80s, 90s & |
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dkf (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 03:22 AM Response to Reply #60 |
61. Before you could be okay with no education but now there is a race to the bottom of the wage scale |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 12:18 PM Response to Reply #61 |
83. so that's the *real* problem, isn't it? because lord knows those people we're |
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WinkyDink (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 12:04 PM Response to Reply #59 |
78. So go become a teacher and rescue them. |
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boppers (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 03:59 AM Response to Reply #57 |
64. "In spite of you" is not the same as "Because of you". |
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Catshrink (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 12:11 PM Response to Reply #64 |
82. IQ is not the same as EQ |
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boppers (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Sep-07-10 01:56 AM Response to Reply #82 |
98. Indeed. |
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woo me with science (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 11:18 PM Response to Reply #38 |
42. ... |
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Bjorn Against (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 09:24 PM Response to Original message |
32. Yes, but it depends on how you define performance... |
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Smarmie Doofus (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 09:24 PM Response to Original message |
34. Performance as measured by what? |
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slackmaster (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 11:21 AM Response to Reply #34 |
77. The OP doesn't say anything abou t how to measure a teacher's performance |
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Riley18 (883 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 09:30 PM Response to Original message |
35. Teachers are not circus monkeys. This crap about "performance" pay is just |
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Scruffy1 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 10:38 PM Response to Reply #35 |
41. Right On |
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exboyfil (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 12:38 AM Response to Reply #35 |
52. You don't think a professionals pay is tied to performance? |
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donheld (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 10:11 PM Response to Original message |
39. Sorry, I can't vote and am proud to unrecommend |
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madinmaryland (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 11:23 PM Response to Original message |
43. Un-reccommended. There is no way to answer such a simplisticly phrased question. |
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Nye Bevan (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 11:29 PM Response to Reply #43 |
44. How about with a "yes" or a "no"? |
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madinmaryland (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 12:07 AM Response to Reply #44 |
49. What would be the parameters of the assessment? And who would develop |
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yurbud (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 11:40 PM Response to Original message |
46. if it is on the same basis as Wall Street, yes: |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 12:48 AM Response to Reply #46 |
58. +100. excellent system. |
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demmiblue (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Sep-05-10 11:41 PM Response to Original message |
47. I think GDP invaded! |
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Fumesucker (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 12:22 AM Response to Original message |
51. Is a shit question.. |
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gophates (245 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 06:15 AM Response to Reply #51 |
71. There you go. |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 12:42 AM Response to Original message |
53. well, there you go. DU = neolib. |
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boppers (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 03:32 AM Response to Reply #53 |
62. Science: the new evil. |
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wickerwoman (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 04:19 AM Response to Reply #62 |
65. Show me a proposal for teacher evaluations |
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boppers (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 04:30 AM Response to Reply #65 |
67. "remotely"? |
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aikoaiko (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 04:22 AM Response to Original message |
66. I vote yes, but the devil is in the details. |
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eridani (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 05:24 AM Response to Original message |
68. If all schools are not like the ones in Lake Wobegon, fire the teachers |
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JCMach1 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 06:06 AM Response to Original message |
70. When we do it for other licensed professionals! |
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craigmatic (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 06:16 AM Response to Original message |
72. No it should be left like it is tied to their continued professional development. |
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slackmaster (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 11:19 AM Response to Reply #72 |
75. One criterion used to evaluate my performance is appropriate pursuit of professional development |
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proud2BlibKansan (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 01:52 PM Response to Reply #75 |
86. Teachers have to have professional development to keep their certification |
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slackmaster (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 02:12 PM Response to Reply #86 |
88. Perfect example of an objective measure that has nothing to do with student performance |
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proud2BlibKansan (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 02:53 PM Response to Reply #88 |
91. Not directly but I'm a believer in PD |
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DailyGrind51 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 06:27 AM Response to Original message |
73. However, "performance" should include multiple measures, not merely test scores. |
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slackmaster (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 11:20 AM Response to Reply #73 |
76. Getting stuck with lazy or dumb students should not hold back a teacher's performance reviews |
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DailyGrind51 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 01:14 PM Response to Reply #76 |
85. I also believe we have to get back to tracking students and provide self-contained classrooms for |
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RedCloud (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 12:52 PM Response to Original message |
84. Fuck no! Pigs want to take over education. |
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slackmaster (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 02:18 PM Response to Reply #84 |
90. Education as it stands is a government-run monopoly. There is no competition or choice. |
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wickerwoman (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 04:21 PM Response to Reply #90 |
93. There are private schools, home schools, religious schools |
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slackmaster (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Sep-07-10 09:55 AM Response to Reply #93 |
108. Firemen should be evaluated by how well they perform on the tasks that they actually do |
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Dream Girl (153 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 02:13 PM Response to Original message |
89. No, they should just collect a paycheck |
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lumberjack_jeff (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Sep-06-10 03:03 PM Response to Original message |
92. Absolutely. But the devil is in the details. |
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fortyfeetunder (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Sep-07-10 01:15 AM Response to Original message |
97. What is the definition of teacher performance? |
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last_texas_dem (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Sep-07-10 02:05 AM Response to Original message |
99. Whose performance? |
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Name removed (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Sep-07-10 02:05 AM Response to Original message |
100. Deleted message |
Douglas Carpenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Sep-07-10 02:29 AM Response to Original message |
101. in that performance would almost certainly be defined by standarized test scores |
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Lucian (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Sep-07-10 02:30 AM Response to Original message |
102. Why should a teacher be punished if a kid is too goddamn stupid to pass tests? |
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BoneDaddy (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Sep-07-10 04:10 AM Response to Original message |
106. It is impossible to do. |
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YankmeCrankme (576 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Sep-07-10 06:01 AM Response to Original message |
107. You notice the OP doesn't have one comment on his own topic. Its just meant as flamebait. nt |
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