DU Valentine's Day Roses for those with no tomorrows (Carol Lam and Molly Ivins)

I'd meant to get this out over the weekend, but I've been swamped with various things. I'm also trying to take some time to do some logistics work on this here in San Diego too, but I wanted to get this out to the DU community now so that we can have time to get some action going before Valentine's Day. I've also posted a more permanent copy of this note in the Activist HQ forum to keep it alive for others to post in the coming days and a reference point to other threads.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=106x30183

We're coming up on it in two weeks from today, and therefore don't have a lot of time. But I think there are two women that really deserve a timely treatment of roses now, and there likely won't be much of an opportunity after the very appropriate Valentine's Day date to do so.

Carol Lam as many know here has been one of the 93 U.S. prosecutors nationwide that heads up the San Diego office here. Though she was appointed as a Republican by Bush, she's certainly not avoided going after corporate criminals as well as one of the most serious tips of the Wahington corruption iceberg with her successful prosecution of Duke Cunningham. Now she's one of 11 of these 93 prosecutors that is mysteriously leaving through Bushco's orders. February 15th is her last day here, and rumor is that she may have an indictment for Brent Wilkes out by that time, who also is the cornerstone for many investigations going on now into other individuals in Washington (Hunter, Doolittle, Lewis, Pombo, Foggo, etc.)

Her last day is the day after Valentine's Day, and I felt that we could show support for the constitution and the rule of law and those that would try to protect and enforce that by showing our appreciation for her efforts then with the growing tradition of "roomful of roses" treatmsnts.

I'm here in San Diego, and I've already lined up the Progressive Post here and a few others who indicated that they want to help with this effort. I will be contacting a florist shortly and setting up a paypal or other contribution mechanism here in the coming day or two). If you're here in the San Diego, please send me a note here and I'll put together a list of folks to meet shortly on planning the details on this.

Also I'm noting that Molly Ivins is VERY sick with cancer now, and I wonder if she'll be here next year for Valentine's Day or not. I'm wondering if we shouldn't also try to get her flowers as well, as she CERTAINLY has been a strong leader for our cause too and deserves our thanks and support. I don't live in Austin, TX, but perhaps others out there who might want to try and help organize an effort could speak up here now on this thread and get that going as well. I don't want these efforts to "compete" with each other, but I do think that both of these women (as well as many of the other prosecutors being asked to leave now, deserve our thanks). With both Carol and Molly, the opportunity is on February 14th, but probably not much later, even though their "no tomorrows" are quite different in their nature.

(Note: I just read this other thread that just got posted while I was writing the earlier one in Activist Forum that sounds like Molly's condition is even more serious and perhaps might not even last through Valentine's Day, and that they are asking to no longer be sent flowers. Unlike Carol Lam too, I also want to respect Ms. Ivins privacy and not try to make any thing we do for her too public in a time that must be a very tough situation for them). Perhaps there are other ideas on how to do the Roses treatment here in a more creative and respectful way that follows her wishes not to be given roses directly. Perhaps roses to some Iraqi vets hospital in her name or something like that! Ideas)?

Rate this thread up so we can get a good idea how much of the DU community we can mobilize with this! I think an effort like this here in San Diego would do wonders in helping us attract many other Asian Americans into the progressive fold who have a large population near the military bases here and who normally are fairly apolitical, but my understanding are pretty PO'd about how Carol Lam has been treated with this. Another Asian American prosecutor in L.A. has also left earlier too, so, not trying to sound too opportunistic about this, I do think we can appeal to a broader part of the community with some well put forth action here.

Just passing along the message.

I don't think we can approach this the way we did for others in surrounding them with flowers, and if she's in this serious a condition, I'm sure she wouldn't want to be photographed now or anything public like that either. That's why I was thinking if there were some way to donate flowers in her honor someplace else or something like that. Then perhaps, just focus the DU flower ceremony for Carol Lam this time around and keep our way of honoring Molly a separate thing.

I hope I'm not touching any nerves with anyone here by what might be implicitly viewed as equivalencing these two things. I certainly don't want to do that. I just have been touched by hearing what has been happening to Molly while planning this other idea last week and thought I couldn't just avoid mentioning it at all. If she weren't in such serious condition as it sounds like it is now, then perhaps this would have been a good idea, but unless we can do it "differently" in a good constructive meaningful way, then perhaps we shouldn't (for Molly).

I think that's a good idea.

I personally love roses. I grow my own as the seasons permit. I am well aware of how much they cost, and also that a dozen gives the maximum pleasure one can get from roses at one time. After that, it's overspend and overkill. As to wounded vets, most of whom are guys, what would you guys in a VA facility rather get? A fifth of Jack? A gift certificate for $50 to Barnes and Noble? A gift certificate to be used on long distance calls to family members? If you gave a vet a $50 bill, how many of them would call up their local florist and order roses for themselves? I don't think they'd choose to spend that money on a bunch of flowers with a life span of a week (if the overworked hospital staff finds time to freshen the water) or less. Most of the vets are really strapped for cash. We know the reason most of them "volunteered" was that they were too poor and uneducated to find a job with a decent salary. Roses? Why not a magnum of champagne? Some beluga caviar? They have much more immediate and practical needs.

My family knows I love flowers, but for holidays/birthdays/Mother's Day they also know that I don't want short-lived, cut flowers -----I want them to donate a goose or a sheep or flock of chicks to some impoverished family. That's a gift of life which keeps giving for generations - and long after I'm dead and gone.

So my suggestion is, if you want to honor someone, send them a dozen roses along with a card stating "$xxx.00 has been donated to "xxxxxxxxxxxxx" (charity) in your name." Or in a case like Ms. Ivins who has specified "no flowers", just a card thanking her for her valiant efforts and telling her of some contribution to some cause that would mean something to her - like maybe cancer research. Unless your purpose is some great photo op with a roomful of beautiful flowers. Frankly, I don't agree with using someone else's tragedy for PR.

I originally wanted to have this DU treatment for Carol Lam. I only included Molly Ivins BEFORE I read the thread indicating her wishes for no flowers out of sympathy for her and not to make a thread for only Carol Lam sound insensitive to Ms. Ivins who's facing a lot more serious condition. I still do want to carry through with a Roses treatment for Ms. Lam (as well as add statements thanking other prosecutors as well), as I think that deserves consideration on its own. Perhaps by bringing in Molly I didn't respect either very much. I'm sorry. I wasn't trying to be disrespectful. Perhaps we need to have a separate thread for Ms. Ivins if there's any other ideas on how to honor her without flowers, etc. I'd certainly throw in for that.

But again, my purpose isn't to try and exploit Ms. Ivins' condition, only to acknowledge it. Maybe I'll start a separate Carol Lam only thread then. And if someone brings up me ignoring Molly Ivins there, I'll note this thread as a reason why I didn't want that confusion to lead to misplaced feelings. I'm sorry if I offended anyone. That wasn't my intent here.

If someone else agrees, I'll start a separate thread and request the mods to lock this one.

I just don't get the impression that you have thought through the details of what you're proposing.
What - you want to have thousands of dollars worth of flowers delivered to Atty. Lam's office? Then it's up to her to arrange distribution of them to hospitals or something? As an attorney who switched from one firm to another on two occasions, and then to teaching, and therefore had to on each occasion wrap up and reassign hundreds of cases to other lawyers, and review those cases with said replacement lawyers - as Ms. Lam will have to do, I am quite sure she will not have time to handle the "DU treatment". Plus, she works in a federal building with major security standards - all the delivery persons and flowers going through security on one day will truly screw up everyone else with business in that building.

And I think Ms. Lam deserves honesty - so call her up and say, "I belong to a group which would like to use your personal mistreatment to further our political aims." Then see what she suggests.

I HAVE sent notes to others on this forum about the very concerns you pose! I've also sent emails to those here locally who also want to help with this. We were just mentioning donating these flowers and taking them away to a local vets hospital here too, as was done with the flowers that were sent to Helen Thomas earlier.

Have you taken a vacation while we were sending roses to folks like Barbara Boxer or Helen Thomas? Do you think they treated us as an annoyance that just wanted publicity?

I think it's a bit unfair to say that we are trying to use this for "political aims". The primary purpose is to honor her service here and to elevate what I think she will agree privately is an unfair treatment given to her and her colleagues more into the public consciousness. There's a political aim to that, but heck, it could be said that there's a political aim for just about every post we put here and every action we take here on DU. There were political AND personal purposes for honoring folks like Barbara Boxer and Helen Thomas. Does that mean we shouldn't do these?

Sheesh! I'm glad I asked the mods to lock this thread. I think I'll ask them to actually delete it now!

the original poster.

Please see this thread: