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Colobo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-28-07 02:42 PM
Original message
Troops fire upon protesters in Venezuela
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070528/ap_en_tv/venezuela_chavez_vs_tv

University students blocked one lane of a major highway hours after Radio Caracas Television ceased broadcasting at midnight and was replaced with a new state-funded channel. Chavez had refused to renew RCTV's broadcast license, accusing it of "subversive" activities and of backing a 2002 coup against him.

Two students were injured by rubber bullets and a third was hit with a tear gas canister, said Ana Teresa Yepez, an administrator at Caracas' Metropolitan University. She said about 20 protesters were treated for inhaling tear gas.

The new public channel, TVES, launched its transmissions with artists singing pro-Chavez music, then carried an exercise program and a talk show, interspersed with government ads proclaiming, "Now Venezuela belongs to everyone."

Crowds of students demonstrated across Caracas, saying they fear for the future of free speech.

"I plan to keep protesting because we're Venezuelans and it's our right," said Valentina Ramos, 17, a Metropolitan University student who was hit in the head with a tear gas canister and received stitches.

She said the protest was peaceful, but National Guard troops said they acted after students hurled rocks and sticks. Police said 11 officers were injured in separate protests on Sunday that were broken up with water cannon and tear gas.

Thousands of government supporters reveled in the streets as they watched the midnight changeover on large TV screens, seeing RCTV's signal go black and then be replaced by a TVES logo. Others launched fireworks and danced in the streets.

Inside the studios of RCTV — the sole opposition-aligned TV station with nationwide reach — disheartened actors and comedians wept and embraced in the final minutes on the air.

They bowed their heads in prayer, and presenter Nelson Bustamante declared: "Long live Venezuela! We will return soon."

The socialist president says he is democratizing the airwaves by turning the network's signal over to public use.

Germany, which holds the European Union presidency, expressed concern that Venezuela let RCTV's license expire "without holding an open competition for the successor license." It said the EU expects that Venezuela will uphold freedom of speech and "support pluralism."

Founded in 1953, RCTV regularly topped viewer ratings with its talk shows, sports, soap operas and comedy programs. But Chavez accused the network of helping to incite a failed coup in 2002, violating broadcast laws and "poisoning" Venezuelans with programming that promoted capitalism. RCTV's managers deny wrongdoing.



Authoritarianism at its best... leftist style, the way some DUers like it.


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ck4829 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-28-07 02:46 PM
Response to Original message
1. If the Bush Administration liked Chavez...
Edited on Mon May-28-07 02:46 PM by ck4829
I doubt we'd be hearing about this at all.
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Laughing Mirror Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-28-07 03:06 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Bush was in on the coup against Chavez, right alongside RCTV
The idea that the public airwaves belong to the public is just anathema to them.

I've been tear gassed many a time over the decades and I've never heard of anybody being treated for it.
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-28-07 03:41 PM
Response to Reply #2
21. I'm all for free speech
but supporting a coup against the elected government is not about free speech.
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acmavm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-28-07 03:08 PM
Response to Original message
3. Damn, no one got killed? From the sounds of things I expected dead
bodies all over the landscape. Are we supposed to be disappointed that there were no fatal injuries or what? Two hit with rubber bullets and one hit with a tear gas cannister, twenty treated for breathing tear gas.

This story is pretty much garbage. While there may have been protesters injured, and I'm sure there damn well were, throwing rocks and bottles is not a sign of a peaceful demonstration either.
11 officers hurt? Hmmmm.

You neglect to comment on this little blip in the article:

<snip>

Thousands of government supporters reveled in the streets as they watched the midnight changeover on large TV screens, seeing RCTV's signal go black and then be replaced by a TVES logo. Others launched fireworks and danced in the streets.

<snip>

Wonder why.

Question: Who is Nelson Bustamante? The 14-year old soccer player?

Was the station subversive to a duly elected government? You damn betcha. Is the subversion CIA aided? Again, you bet. Was the station gulity of lies and propaganda in connection with the attempt to overthrow Chavez's government. Oh hell yes.

Shit, the kiddies will still get their soaps. What they need is a civics lesson. And someone to tell them if they throw rocks and bottles at police, they might get injured.
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Colobo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-28-07 03:09 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. Too bad a rock didn't hit Chavez in the head.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-28-07 03:11 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. Thank you for your dispassionate political analysis.
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acmavm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-28-07 03:14 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. What an intelligent response. Too bad you don't understand the
background of this story.

Did you think we wouldn't read the article and see how pathetically slanted it is?

Did you think that you're talking to people who haven't been following this story?

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Colobo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-28-07 03:16 PM
Response to Reply #7
9. We, Latin Americans, know the nature of our politics
much better than many idealistic Americans who think Fidel Castro, Che Guevara and Hugo Chavez are heroes.
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acmavm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-28-07 03:17 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. Are you living in Latin America? You feel qualified to comment on
Edited on Mon May-28-07 03:19 PM by acmavm
American politics. Are you a world scholar, and expert on everything everywhere?


edit: Oh look. You're a resident of Tampa. And an Obama supporter. So going by that info I ask again, why would anyone feel you're qualified to comment on American politics? Wouldn't we Americans be more qualified on that subject than you seeing as your a Latin American?


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Colobo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-28-07 03:24 PM
Response to Reply #10
13. Not really
I'm just finishing my M.A. on Hispanic American lit, with a minor on Latin American and Caribbean Studies (going to do my PhD next year), apart of being born and raised down there... just a bit of academic and anecdotal knowledge.

I know very little about American politics, but just enough to be much more informed than your average American.

So, no, I'm not an expert on anything anywhere... but I know a thing or two about the region of the world I was born and raised at.
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acmavm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-28-07 03:36 PM
Response to Reply #13
17. And some of us know enough about the CIA, the founding family and
the decendents who 'owned' RCTV, their its ties to the CIA and the shennanigans they've been pulling down in Venezuala, and the fact that it was a government elected by the people who put Chavez in power. And that the plight of the poor/lower/middle classes have greatly improved under Chavez' government. And that he has had to fight against the wealthy classes, their own predator class, to prevent more than one coup by CIA-School of the America's sponsered thugs. One that included his own imprisonment.

Why are you here? Why don't you get an education where you were born? Why, if you feel things are so bad where you come from, are you not down there doing something about it?

It's easy to support a policy, or condemn the actions of an elected official from thousands of miles away, isn't it?

And this remark makes you sound like an insufferable snob. Are you referring to me, to DUers who support the policies of Hugo Chavez, or Americans in general?

<snip>I know very little about American politics, but just enough to be much more informed than your average American.

<snip>

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Colobo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-28-07 03:38 PM
Response to Reply #17
19. DUers are informed Americans
Average joes out there are not; and no, I'm not a snob... in fact, people say I'm a very nice guy. :)

Look, I'll gladly share with you my reasons of moving over here and my extremely pessimistic view of Latin America as soon as I come back tonight.
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acmavm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-28-07 03:39 PM
Response to Reply #19
20. Fine. I'll check back.
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David__77 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-28-07 03:25 PM
Response to Reply #9
14. Venezuelans overwhelmingly chose CHAVEZ.
I am glad he is president there. We need statesmen like him in office all across the hemisphere. By the way, I support Obama as well. I believe he will do the best at respecting the sovereign right of other nations to select their own social system and leadership.
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Colobo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-28-07 03:28 PM
Response to Reply #14
16. I'm with you on Obama, disagree with you on Chavez
Latin America has constantly gone from extreme right wingers to extreme lefties like Hugo and the results have been detrimental to our societies.

Hugo is proving to be no different. You want an example of a good right wing government down there? El Salvador. A good left wing government? Chile. Why are they good? Because they are solid democratic governments that respect private property, respect the political opposition and encourage economic growth through free market practices. The results are there- two countries that went from sociopolitical disaster to stability.
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David__77 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-28-07 03:45 PM
Response to Reply #16
22. "Free markets?" "Private property?"
That's not a "left wing" political program, in Chile or anywhere else for that matter. FDR did not uphold that program. The New Deal, for instance, had strong components of state-guided markets and socialist elements as well. Why cannot Venezuela emulate the New Deal without being condemned? "Private property" needs to be redistributed when the current economic order is irrational and the masses dispossessed in perpetuity. Salvador Allende was a good Chilean leader, from the same party that today rules that country. What you are promoting is the consensus in DC of what is an "acceptable" political spectrum within which to operate. I disagree.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-28-07 06:32 PM
Response to Reply #16
26. LOL! Then I'm sure you'd get along fine with my RW nutcase uncle
in El Salvador who lives in a cage to protect his family from hungry poor people.

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mitchtv Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-28-07 04:16 PM
Response to Reply #9
23. Ay, por favor
Sorry I call bulshit.You are no more qualified than I am and I am Irish. Y entiendo como es el mundo, Latino y el resto.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-28-07 06:30 PM
Response to Reply #9
24. Hopefully you know them better than you know who you are talking to
hermanito.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-28-07 06:31 PM
Response to Reply #7
25. Were you addressing that to me?
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-28-07 03:10 PM
Response to Original message
5. I can't wait to hear what really happened. n/t
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acmavm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-28-07 03:15 PM
Response to Reply #5
8. Wonder what propaganda was broadcast during the last hours under
the old licensees? Possibly the same CIA-produced shit that they broadcast during the coup attempt?
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David__77 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-28-07 03:28 PM
Response to Reply #8
15. This will blow over.
It's a last gasp of the old order there. Privileged students and well-paid employees are all in an uproar over losing their special place in society.
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acmavm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-28-07 03:37 PM
Response to Reply #15
18. That's how I see it. A lecture from someone safe at his keyboard in
Tampa, Florida.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-28-07 06:38 PM
Response to Reply #18
28. Who thinks the RW government in El Salvador
which is starving the people is a good thing.

:puke:
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-28-07 06:33 PM
Response to Reply #15
27. I believe you are right. n/t
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-28-07 06:53 PM
Response to Reply #8
29. Maybe Amy will report it on DemocracyNow this week.
She's been doing a good job of covering Venezuela.
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Marie26 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-28-07 03:20 PM
Response to Original message
11. Yep
Edited on Mon May-28-07 03:21 PM by Marie26
Chavez is traveling a path that many Liberators/Dictators have traveled before him. I don't know why this should be a surprise to anyone, or why liberals would rise to defend it. LAPD fires rubber bullets = bad, Chavez fires rubber bullets = good. The hypocrisy is pretty clear.
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acmavm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-28-07 03:23 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. Peaceful demonstration = good
Throwing rocks and bottles at police (even in L.A.) = bad + stupid
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