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rabs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-03-09 01:50 PM
Original message
FARC found to have weapons from at least 20 countries


Read this article last night in El Tiempo of Bogota and it reminded me of the big, heated discussion on LBN a few days ago over the three rocket launchers allegedly from Venezuela.

Was somewhat surprised that El Tiempo, a pro-Uribe, pro-Juan Manuel Santos newspaper would undermine the original thesis that Chavez is the main culprit. No named source in the article, but it had to come from either the government or the military.

Article says, among other things:

-- So far in 2009, the Colombian government has sent through INTERPOL 209 inquiries to 27 nations concerning weapons confiscated from FARC camps. The majority of the inquiries have been to Eastern European nations and the UNITED STATES.

-- The weapons include rifles from Russia, Bulgaria, China and Korea. Pistols from Central Europe and Brazil. Also weapons and ammunition from Colombia itself.

-- Explosives from Ecuador, anti-tank rockets from the UNITED STATES, Romania, China and now Sweden. Ammunition from Brazil, Russia, Venezuela and North Korea.

-- At least 200 anti-tank rocket launchers have been captured. One of them was an M-72 A made in March 1977 by the Lone Star Army plant in Texas and sold to the Ecuadoran government of President Lucio Gutierrez (who was later ousted for corruption).

Full article with many other details (Spanish)

http://www.eltiempo.com/colombia/justicia/arsenal-incautado-a-las-farc-en-los-ultimos-10-anos-proviene-de-al-menos-20-paises_5753167-1

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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-03-09 04:20 PM
Response to Original message
1. Thanks, rabs. It is surprising to find this info in this this outlet. n/t
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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-03-09 06:18 PM
Response to Original message
2. Tremendous find, and of course so natural. I've bookmarked this already.
It's so utterly typical, isn't it?

We live on lies and half-truths, and the truth itself has often seemed so elusive because it is purposely avoided when it doesn't promote the racist/classist/predatory attitude toward Latin America and the Caribbean.

So glad you've spotted this and shared it.

Will be back later to reread it to make sure it sticks in my mind a long time.

Wow! :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo:
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Bacchus39 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-03-09 06:31 PM
Response to Original message
3. are all those countries going to break off relations with Colombia now?
the story doesn't surprise me at all. El Tiempo is no fan of the FARC. Not all news outlets make all their stories from a political perspective.

what is Telsur's take on the story?

p.s. you may want to have that story translated. some of those routes the weapons are coming from further implicate some of Colombia's neighbors.
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subsuelo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-03-09 10:17 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. why should they?
the crying was directed only towards Venezuela
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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-04-09 05:31 AM
Response to Original message
5. El Tiempo's owned by former Uribe's former Defense Secretary's family, isn't it?
Juan Manuel Santos.

This is really very interesting, thinking about it hours after seeing it the first time.

Thanks for letting DU'ers know about this. Shows even more how laughable these dishonest a-holes always are. ALWAYS.
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rabs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-04-09 12:51 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. Yes, the Santos clan owns not only El Tiempo




but uribitos's vice president is a Santos, and of course they are touting Juan Manuel Santos to replace Uribe.

Btw, the word Santos means "saints," which they are not, and the only thing saintly about the clan is the pursuit of power and money.

Another btw, keep on eye on alvarito's "mute" tour of South America beginning in Peru today.

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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-04-09 02:19 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. Wouldn't that be classy: Colombia's President's family owning their largest paper?
If Santos retained Uribe's vice president, you'd have the presidential succession being a Santos to step in, if President Santos became incapacitated, and the Santos' paper would inform the public about it.

Sweet.
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bemildred Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-04-09 03:23 PM
Response to Original message
8. "Also weapons and ammunition from Colombia itself."
Oh, my God, so Colombia supports FARC?
:wow:
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Bacchus39 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-04-09 03:33 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. captured on the battlefield from murdered soldiers maybe?
or just purchased through corrupt methods.

one thing is for sure though, unlike Chavez, Colombia does NOT support the FARC.
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bemildred Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-04-09 04:12 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. So, in Venezuela, nothing is ever purchased by "corrupt methods", but only with Chavez' consent?
Edited on Tue Aug-04-09 04:13 PM by bemildred
I am always amused by the sort of twits that will go on about how corrupt everything is in Venezuela, and then claim that nothing happens except by the Venezuelan government's consent. If Colombia cannot control where its weapons go, it has no standing to whine at anyone else about it. If Venezuela doesn't control where its weapons go, it's just like Colombia. The Colombian cocaine business generates boatloads of money, and there are always people willing to sell weapons, and that has nothing to do with Chavez, or Venezuela, or Ecuador, or anyone but the Colombia. Colombia is a failed state. Colombia needs to take "personal responsibility" for its problems and stop blaming everyone else.
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Bacchus39 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-04-09 05:47 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. oh, I am sure Venezuela is rife with corruption.
its clear to me though that Chavez supports the FARC or certainly has. Colombia is not a failed state. If Colombia is then Ecuador, Bolivia, Peru, Paraguay, most of Central America are,and Venezuela is not far behind.

Colombia has revealed that the weapons were from Venezuela. also, have revealed many other countries are sources. what is interesting is the Chavez administration did not deny the weapons were from Ven, they denied the story was even true in the first place. And then they go on to break relations with Colombia. WTF???

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bemildred Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-04-09 06:16 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. Colombia does not control its own territory.
It has one of the longest running and well-funded guerilla insurgencies in the world, if not the longest running, I'm not sure and I don't really care if it's number one or number three or whatever, this despite continuous and extravagant aid from the USA.

Help Needed For Colombian Displaced

Years of insurgency and narcoterrorism have placed Colombia among the countries with the highest numbers of Internally Displaced Persons, or IDPs. Threatened by the Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia terrorist group, other illegal armed groups, criminal gangs and drug traffickers, people continue to be driven from their homes and forced to abandon their lands and livelihoods.

According to the Consultancy for Human Rights and Displacement, a Colombian non-governmental organization, an estimated 4.6 million people have been forced to leave their homes since 1985. The Colombian government places the number at 3.1 million IDPs since its National Registry was launched in 2000.

While the Colombian government believes there is fraud in the registration system, it also acknowledges there is a high rate of under-registration. There are also over 400,000 Colombians who have fled across borders seeking refuge and asylum in Ecuador, Costa Rica, Panama, and Venezuela.

Many IDPs live below the poverty line, lack food security and dwell in homes that fall below minimum construction standards. The U.N. High Commissioner for Refugees reports that one of every two displaced persons in Colombia is unemployed.

http://www.voanews.com/uspolicy/2009-08-03-voa6.cfm

I do sympathize with Colombia's problems, but the first step is to get rid of the incompetent weasels that are running the place now.
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Bacchus39 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-04-09 06:19 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. that's where opinions differ
Colombia has a multitude of problems. you won't see me trying to cover them up.

on the other hand, Colombia feels fairly confident in their leadership at the moment. its their call who they choose.
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bemildred Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-04-09 06:36 PM
Response to Reply #13
14. Well, I wish them luck, and I think they will need it.
It certainly is their call and not mine, and their ass and not mine.
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Bacchus39 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-04-09 08:16 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. I wish them luck too. but they need more than that
they have an insurgent war, paras, narcos, crime, poverty, uncooperative neighbors. many profound problems. any "leftist" movement or candidate will be haunted by the FARC who Colombians aren't too fond of to put it mildly. an exception would be Ingrid Betancourt who has the legitamacy and first hand knowledge of the insurgency. however, I imagine she would like to live in freedom for awhile before risking her life running for office in Colombia.
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bemildred Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-04-09 08:28 PM
Response to Reply #15
17. No offense, but FARC are Colombians. Do you think they are invaders or immigrants? nt
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-04-09 08:23 PM
Response to Reply #8
16. LOL
:)
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