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subsuelo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 08:51 AM
Original message
Obama's deafening silence on Honduras
Seven weeks after the Honduran military overthrew the democratically elected president of Honduras, the divide between the United States and Latin America continues to grow.

The strategy of the coup regime is obviously to run out the clock on President Manuel Zelaya's remaining months in office. A presidential election, in which Zelaya is not eligible to run because of Honduras' one-term limit, is scheduled for 29 November.

...
The millions of Americans who gave their votes, contributions or energy to Barack Obama's presidential campaign in the hope that he would change US foreign policy probably didn't expect to see this administration fishing around for rightwing allies to help block Latin America from trying to reverse a military coup. But that appears to be the reality.

In fact, the US state department has still not even determined that a military coup has taken place. It's not clear what else you would call it when the military storms the home of the elected president and forces him at gunpoint, in his pajamas, to board a plane out of the country.

...Meanwhile, on Wednesday, Amnesty International issued a report documenting widespread police beatings and brutality against peaceful demonstrations, mass arbitrary arrests and other human rights abuses under the dictatorship. The Obama administration has remained silent about these abuses – as well as the killings of activists and press censorship and intimidation. To date, no major media outlet has bothered to pursue them for an on-the-record comment.


http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/cifamerica/2009/aug/21/honduras-coup-us-foreign-policy">Guardian - read more
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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 02:01 PM
Response to Original message
1. My working hypothesis is that Obama made a deal with the Clintons/DLC
to give Hillary Clinton a free hand in Latin America, and she in turn has given a free hand to all of the bad Bushwhack ambassadors she has left in place in Latin America, to Bushwhack moles in the Pentagon, State, the spy agencies and elsewhere, and Bushwhacks who are ostensibly outside of the Obama government, such as John McCain, to continue war preparations begun by the Bush Junta, for Oil War II-South America, including acquiring or securing war assets--such as the US military base in Honduras, and the seven new US military bases for Colombia. It is a working hypothesis that I don't want to believe, but one for which there is increasing--and getting to be almost overwhelming--evidence.

I think it's also probable that Obama was vetted by an insider group (including Bush Sr) who offered Bush/Cheney a deal for immunity for the Bush Junta principles, in exchange for their not nuking Iran, and also to get them to leave the White House when the time came--around the same time that Rumsfeld resigned (late 2006)--and that Obama agreed to this deal as well, in order not to be Diebolded in 2008. The control of our vote counting system by a handful of far rightwing corporations, with 'TRADE SECRET,' PROPRIETARY programming code and virtually no audit/recount controls, which was engineered during the 2002 to 2004 period, should not be underestimated as the final blockade to reform in the US, and as the ultimate tool by which to thwart the "will of the People" on everything from big bonuses to the "bailed out" financial criminals, to insurance-corps-controlled health care, to the hijacking of the US military for corporate resource wars.

If this hypothesis, or something close to it, is true, then Obama's power is severely limited on certain issues. Undoing the Honduras coup would be one of them. The war profiteers and oil warriors had looked with increasing dismay as the leftist democracy revolution that has swept most of South America began winning elections in Central America--Nicaragua, El Salvador, Guatemala--and as Honduras' president took a somewhat surprising turn toward leftist democratic policy--such as raising the minimum wage (an affront to "free trade for the rich"), but, most importantly (I think), proposing the conversion of the US military base at Soto Cano to a commercial airport, a) because Honduras needs a good airport, and b) as an assertion of national sovereignty (i.e., Ecuador, which is kicking the US military out of its base in Manta, Ecuador, this month, and concerning which the president of Ecuador said that he would agree to a US military base in Ecuador when we agree to a Ecuadoran military base in Miami.) The US military and its corrupt, failed, murderous "war on drugs" is increasingly unwelcome in Latin America, and, since the "war on drugs" is nothing of the kind--it is an oil war plan--panic no doubt seized the war planners, as their "lily pad" countries have begun to evaporate. They had to hold onto Honduras, a strategically located country, vis a vis Venezuela's main oil reserves on Venezuela's Caribbean coast, with a history as a launching pad for US aggression in the region. And they had to insure that a "friendly" government would in place there, when they manufactured their war with Venezuela, using proxy armies such as Colombia's and Honduras' as the front.

Obama's hands seem to be tied, as to preventing these war preparations, and enacting his own stated policy of peace, respect and cooperation in Latin America. Either he himself has suffered a coup, or he is in agreement with these aims, or he is hamstrung by the above-described deal. There is a lot of evidence--including the 'TRADE SECRET' voting machines--for the latter. (I DO think Obama was elected, on the strength of his early opposition to the Iraq War, but I also think that he was "permitted to be" elected and had to make deals for that permission; I also think that he won the 2008 election by a bigger margin than we know--about 5% more--and that his mandate was shaved in order to curb his reformist tendencies.) With 'TRADE SECRET' voting machines, the far right and the warmongers can go to town in our corpo/fascist press, controlling America's illusion of a political dialogue, and proceeding with intense disinformation and psyops, for instance, their demonization of Hugo Chavez. They can create WMDs in Iraq, or phantom "dictators" in Latin America, at will, and the 'TRADE SECRET' voting system then fulfills their fantasy narratives with phony and entirely unverifiable numbers.

The key to turning this around--and restoring democracy and the rule of law in the US--is a citizen movement at the local level to get rid of the 'TRADE SECRET' voting machines. This is not the only thing wrong with our political system, but it is the main mechanism of control that is preventing us from making any headway at all toward reform.
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Downwinder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 02:41 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Do you think the Honduran coup was as much a warning to obama
as to any other progressive government in the Americas?
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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 09:17 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. Yes, I think that is a possibility. But there are other possibilities that I can't rule out yet.
One is that Obama is two-faced and hypocritical, and approves of these war preparations--but puts on a "change we can believe in" face. I am not prepared to make that call yet. I can't tell. But I have seen enough of two-faced bullshit from US politicians--especially regarding war--that it cannot be ruled out until we know more about Obama. Another possibility is that he is sincere about wanting a peaceful, respectful, cooperative policy in Latin America, but others are undermining and sabotaging that policy, and he is too busy to pay much attention. He does have serious crises on his hands on a number of fronts--it is quite a load for someone only seven months into his term. Two war fronts. The Great Depression. A government that has been looted and plundered, and the rule of law destroyed in many agencies. It may just be happenstance--that others are taking advantage of the many crises he is trying to manage, to continue hostility toward Latin America, and continue Bushwhack war plans. Incompetence/inexperience?--he's not what he seemed to be at first--a brilliant politician, who "plays chess not checkers"??

I really, really don't know. One thing is certain, though: The Obama administration has been giving VERY mixed signals--very contradictory signals--from Day One. During inauguration week, Obama gave an interview on one of the big corpo/fascist TV corps in Latin America, saying something like Chavez is a menace to the region. Chavez was really offended, after he's said kind words about Obama. But within a few months they were shaking hands at a regional conference. Then the Honduran coup hit. Then the announcement of the seven new US military bases in Colombia. Then Obama says no, they are not really bases--just "advisers" and "private contractors." Etc. Etc. A see-saw. But, the military preparations are going forward.

I don't think Honduras was merely a "warning" to Obama not to interfere--if indeed it was such warning. Honduras is an important strategic asset for the war plan against Venezuela. The war planners needed to do it, regardless of its political "message." Clearly, it was a warning to the many leftist democracies in South and Central America. Some State Dept guy said so. "Let this be a warning to you...". But I warning to Obama to stay out of it? I just don't know.
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Downwinder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 10:35 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. I was thinking along the lines of "The samething could happen to you" n/t
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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-22-09 04:14 AM
Response to Reply #6
7. Ah! Well, I hadn't thought of that one. Geez. You think...?
Naw, won't happen here. Why would they have to do that when they have Diebold? Easy as pie. Totally non-transparent, unverifiable vote counting system, owned and controlled by a handful of rightwing corporations. They put this system in place to maintain the illusion of democracy and make it all seem legal and proper. I suppose they could drop that illusion, drop all pretense, shoot up the White House, kidnap Obama at gunpoint, fly him to--I don't know--Canada?--and just crush us with the Boot. But why do it when 'TRADE SECRET' code is working well to prevent any real reform or to prevent any curtailment of the Forever War?

Thinking this through. You mean if Obama "goes off the reservation"--don't you? Like Zelaya--starts advocating for the poor, and acting on the "will of the people"? Or starts ignoring the deals he made not to get Diebolded? Takes charge in Latin America, and actually starts pursuing a peaceful policy, and curtailing the war planners? Comes down on the banksters? Decides to go after the Bush Junta main criminals?

In that unlikely case, I see your point. But I still think that Diebold beats all, as a coup mechanism. It keeps people guessing, and helps foil organized civil resistance. This is a big country to control, if and when our people decide they have had enough. Best to keep them in a brainwashed state, in this corpo/fascist illusion of a democracy in which the supposed sovereign people of this land cannot even verify who won any given election. The only circumstance in which they might resort to a Honduran-type coup is if Obama goes way off the reservation, way fast--and an emergency measure is needed. Say he starts investigating what really happened on 9/11. That could probably do it. Even if he seriously went after the war profiteers or the insurance corps, they have so many blockades in place--the "Blue Dogs" in Congress, the corpo/fascist press, Bushwhack moles throughout the government, massive spying/blackmail capabilities (including entrapment)--they would likely be able to slow him down enough and slander him enough to wait it out til 2010, pack Congress tighter with anti-reformers, and 2012, and get him out and get their Hitler in place. Why stir the waters--and wake people up--by crude methods, when you can so easily have your way with 'TRADE SECRET' code?

So I think it would take some kind of fascist emergency--Obama swiftly beginning to seriously damage their claws on power--for them to resort to a violent coup. And I just don't see that happening. Obama is obviously in office by consent of our Corporate Rulers. He is not at all likely to shake anything up, they have so many ways to destroy him without seeming to. And I think he knows what's what. I think he has agreed to their conditions. He's showing every sign that he has. And he probably thinks he can do some good within those limits, and maybe he can. It would take quite a change of conscience, on his part--which is not unthinkable (it happened to JFK*)--but just not at all likely.

------------------

*(A vitally important read: "JFK and the Unspeakable: Why He Died and Why It Matters," by James Douglass.)
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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 03:20 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. Speaking of diebolding democrats, the whole issue of reforming our system
has fallen away because they allowed us, after the nightmare of the past 8 years, to "win" one. All thoughts, concerns about 2000, 2004 simply flew away when we were able to get a Democratic President, and "Democratic" majorities in the Congress. So it's most likely all that rage about Florida, etc., then about Ohio has dissipated once it appeared Democrats were back in play again.

What a horrendous idea, letting this issue of the completely programmable machinery involved in U.S. elections to be controlled by private businesses whose ONLY interest has always been to make the most money possible. No oversight, no way to demand open, verifiable auditing. Simply evil.
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Downwinder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-21-09 03:32 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. If computers can be "secure," why do we need so many virus checkers
and other add ons? How about a virus checker you can run on your voting machine?
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Downwinder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-22-09 05:45 AM
Response to Original message
8. Isn't it great to have a Free Press? They are free not to print what they don't want to.
Why buy a paper if there is no news? You don't have to have an MBA to know why they are going bankrupt. I guess the worship of Mammon is not so good for the news business but it saves a lot of trees.
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