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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 07:28 PM
Original message
Obama Acts Like Reagan 1981, the Union-Buster
Edited on Fri Mar-12-10 07:29 PM by proud2BlibKansan
A Black Agenda Radio commentary by Glen Ford



“Obama is is going after the teachers unions with a hatchet – just like Reagan went after the air traffic controllers.”

President Obama’s endorsement of the firing of the entire faculty and staff of a Rhode Island public school is reminiscent of Ronald Reagan’s crushing of the air traffic controllers union, nearly three decades ago. Back then, President Reagan made an example of a union that had supported his presidential candidacy, firing its members and ultimately decertifying the union when it went on strike. The move sent a signal to the bosses in all sectors of the U.S. economy: the president – the U.S. government – is on management’s side, and unions are a considered a threat to the general economic welfare.

Last week, President Obama sent the same kind of signal to teachers unions, when he cited the Central Falls, Rhode Island, school shutdown as an example of the “accountability” he is demanding of poorly performing schools – which invariably means poor, non-white schools. Teachers union leaders appeared to be shocked by Obama’s language and tone – but they shouldn’t have been. The Rhode Island mass firing was not substantively different than the wholesale sacking of teachers and abrogation of their union contracts elsewhere in the country. The fundamental logic of Obama’s so-called Race to the Top program – a multi-billion dollar competition to show which states are most willing to fire teachers, shut down classrooms and replace them with charter schools – is to break the teachers union. If the teachers want to save their union, their dignity, their contracts, and the institution of public education, they will have to break with Obama. Because he is going after them with a hatchet – just like Reagan went after the air traffic controllers, despite their having supported his 1980 candidacy.

“Obama takes Bush's No Child Left Behind scheme to its logical, blood on the floor conclusion.”
Obama's hatchet man and basketball buddy is Education Secretary Arne Duncan, who envisions waves of school closings, teacher firings and charter school openings for the next “five or six years.” That sounds like a kind of “final solution” for teachers unions – and for public education.

Obama's plans for America's classrooms are even more aggressive than George Bush's policies. Obama takes Bush's No Child Left Behind scheme to its logical, blood on the floor conclusion: corporate education without the encumbrances of organized teachers. Obama's anti-union vision is more ambitious than that of the old arch-reactionary, Ronald Reagan, who destroyed a union of only 13,000 members. The American Federation of Teachers and the National Education Association have combined memberships of over 4 million. They have the capacity to fight back, to make this president back off. But, like so many others who drank the Obama Kool Aid, they are in denial, refusing to believe that they backed a union-buster who is making teachers the scapegoat for America's historical failure to serve the educational needs of all its children.

more . . . http://blackagendareport.com/?q=content/obama-acts-reagan-1981-union-buster
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 07:30 PM
Response to Original message
1. Glen Ford is an asshole. He's probably just jealous he's not the President. n/t
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donco6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 07:56 PM
Response to Reply #1
10. Good to know.
Who are we allowed to like now? The list seems pretty small these days.
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SemiCharmedQuark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 01:50 AM
Response to Reply #10
49. glen ford claims obama is racist against african americans. he is a nutbag
I vehemently disagree with the education policy of this admin., but I will not resort to applauding the glenn beck of the left to do so. Especially when virtually every liberal disagrees with this decision and thoughtful criticism is not hard to come by.
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donco6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 10:08 AM
Response to Reply #49
61. Thanks for providing something a little more enlightening than-
"glen is an asshole." That was actually helpful.
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tekisui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 08:38 PM
Response to Reply #1
18. lol! You jumped on that one.
:rofl:
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msanthrope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-15-10 10:11 AM
Response to Reply #1
87. "Obama Resigns From the Black Nation." by Glen Ford-(nutbag)
Edited on Mon Mar-15-10 10:33 AM by msanthrope
this is who you pick--the guy who said:

"Barack Obama is true-blue to the slaveholding forefathers and heroic blond mothers of the storybook U.S. of A"

The full insanity at link
http://hiphopnews.yuku.com/topic/600
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Dinger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 07:34 PM
Response to Original message
2. Sums It Up Pretty Well
Politically risky? Ummmm, yeah.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 07:38 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. How hard is this to understand?
I said that to a kid just today. But he was 8. LOL
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 07:39 PM
Response to Original message
4. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Larkspur Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 09:19 PM
Response to Reply #4
20. Or Bill Clinton ver 2.0
Clinton called himself an Eisenhower Republican. So should not be surprised that Obama is following that same path but with Reagan.
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 07:44 PM
Response to Original message
5. Here is the AFT on Race to the Top
This program’s goal is a good one: to spark smart and sustainable improvements in public education, particularly for struggling schools and struggling students. We and our affiliates have consistently urged states to work collaboratively with teachers and their unions to ensure that educators were full partners in Race to the Top applications and in the process of developing and implementing solid programs designed to help improve teaching and learning. We know that real change can succeed only if teachers and school administrators work together.

link



NEA president applauds Duncan's renewed emphasis on civil rights enforcement

WASHINGTON - March 08, 2010 - U.S. Education Secretary Arne Duncan announced today that the number of high school dropouts in this country is the “civil rights issue of our generation.” To that end, he said that the department would enforce civil rights laws in education that have been overlooked in the last decade.

The following statement may be attributed to NEA President Dennis Van Roekel:

“NEA applauds the Department of Education’s decision to step up the enforcement of civil rights laws in education to ensure that school districts across the country know their responsibilities to fairness and equal opportunity.

“In 2008, NEA unveiled its plan to transform all public schools by 2020. A critical component of that plan included redefining the federal role in education. In particular, NEA stressed the importance of protecting and achieving equal access for students to services and supports they need to be successful.

“The federal government has a vital role to play in advancing the quality of America’s public schools. As such, we are pleased to see the federal government embracing its role as a supporter of district and state responsibilities by strengthening enforcement of civil rights laws in order to promote access and opportunity. Much more remains to be done, and we look forward to seeing an increased emphasis on equity of opportunity as Congress moves toward the reauthorization of ESEA.”



Glen Ford is an ass!



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donco6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 08:02 PM
Response to Reply #5
12. Here's the AFT and NEA on Central Falls:
American Federation of Teachers President Randi Weingarten gets into the fray with this statement:

"President Obama's comments today condoning the mass firing of the Central Falls High School teachers do not reflect the reality on the ground and completely ignore the teachers' significant commitment to working with others to transform this school. We know it is tempting for people in Washington to score political points by scapegoating teachers, but it does nothing to give our students and teachers the tools they need to succeed."

http://blogs.edweek.org/edweek/teacherbeat/2010/03/obama_gets_invovled_in_ri_teac.html

And the NEA:

UPDATED: National Education Association President Dennis Van Roekel gets in on the game:

"It's time for federal officials to get out of the blame game and into the classroom. One thing is certain: Firing the entire faculty of a school that is on the path to improvement is no recipe for turning around a struggling high school. And relying on a magical pool of 'excellent teachers' to spring forth and replace them is naïve at best and desperately misguided. ... In reality, we all know that the solution is not blame, it is collaboration...collaboration among school employees, management, parents and communities."

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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 08:07 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. Were you afraid to link
Edited on Fri Mar-12-10 08:08 PM by ProSense
to an actual AFT statement

WASHINGTON—We are pleased that Central Falls (R.I.) Schools Superintendent Frances Gallo has agreed to go back to the table and work with the Central Falls Teachers Union on implementing a comprehensive education plan focused on giving the students and teachers of Central Falls High School the tools they need to succeed. The dedicated teachers and staff want nothing more than to continue and improve upon the progress they have made. Real, sustainable change will only happen when all stakeholders work together.

The AFT is committed to supporting Central Falls Teachers Union President Jane Sessums, the students of Central Falls High School and our members, the educators of Central Falls, throughout the negotiations and process of transforming the school.




NEA president says it's time to renew our promise to children

WASHINGTON - March 03, 2010 - U.S. Secretary of Education Arne Duncan is scheduled to provide testimony before the House Education and Labor Committee on how strong and innovative education reforms can help rebuild the U.S. economy and restore America’s competitiveness. Secretary Duncan will discuss President Obama’s education agenda, including his budget proposal for Fiscal Year 2011, which calls for Congress to reauthorize the Elementary and Secondary Education Act.

NEA President Dennis Van Roekel issued the following statement prior to Secretary Duncan’s testimony:

“The 3.2 million members of the National Education Association are excited to hear Secretary Duncan’s proposals on how we can renew our promise to America’s children through the Elementary and Secondary Education Act.

“Educators must have a say in what it takes to improve low performing schools. It is important to examine the factors that contribute to low performing schools, like dated or ineffective curriculum, school safety or socio-economic challenges. When all education stakeholders are involved in the decision making process, it spells success for students. This combination of collective responsibility and collaborative thinking has a track record for yielding results that are positive for students and their schools.

“Great educators and education support professionals are the backbone of a great public school system. Any revision to our nation’s most important education law (ESEA) should renew our nation’s commitment to these professionals. NEA is committed to working with the Obama Administration and Congress to ensure that ESEA makes sense and works for America’s students. We look forward to Secretary Duncan’s testimony before the House Education and Labor Committee.”

<...>



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donco6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 08:08 PM
Response to Reply #13
14. My link works just fine. n/t
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 08:15 PM
Response to Reply #5
15. It helps to read the entire piece
From your link:

AFT:
Talking about reform and collaboration may make us all feel good but if it is not matched by action it does nothing to help students achieve or to provide them and their teachers with the supports they need to succeed. It’s long past time that we walk the walk—not just talk the talk. As the process moves forward, we hope that every state will work to ensure that teachers’ participation and input is not simply sought but actually incorporated as an integral part of every stage of this process.


NEA:
The details of the RTTT proposal do not seem to square with the Administration’s earlier philosophy. The Administration’s theory of success now seems to be tight on the goals and tight on the means, with prescriptions that are not well-grounded in knowledge from practice and are unlikely to meet the goals. We find this top-down approach disturbing; we have been down that road before with the failures of No Child Left Behind, and we cannot support yet another layer of federal mandates that have little or no research base of success and that usurp state and local government’s responsibilities for public education.

Instead of focusing on strengthening enforcement of civil rights laws to promote access and opportunity for students, the Administration has chosen the path of a series of top-down directives that may discourage rather than encourage productive innovation in classrooms and schools across the country. Despite growing evidence to the contrary, it appears that the Administration has decided that charter schools are the only answer to what ails America’s public schools—urban, suburban, exurban, and rural—and all must comply with that silver bullet, despite the fact that charters have often produced lower achievement gains than district-run public schools.

We urge the Administration to step outside of this narrow agenda and embrace the diversity of choices available to students, parents, school districts, and states across the country. Well-designed charters are not the only way to innovate, and we need to embrace and champion other models such as magnet schools.



And a joint statement on the Central Falls firings which Obama applauded: http://www.nea.org/home/38247.htm
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Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 10:06 PM
Response to Reply #5
25. AFL-CIO backs R.I. teachers against Obama
http://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/2010/03/03/AFL-CIO-backs-RI-teachers-against-Obama/UPI-16531267641673/


Angry students protest cuts to schools, colleges
Posted: Mar 04, 2010 9:36 AM PST

BERKELEY, Calif. (AP) - Anger over rising tuition and school budget cuts boiled over as students across the country staged rowdy demonstrations that led to clashes with police and the rush-hour shutdown of a major freeway in California.

Students, teachers, parents and school employees rallied and marched at college campuses, public parks and government buildings in several U.S. cities Thursday in what was called the March 4 Day of Action to Defend Public Education.

In Oakland, protesters evaded police and walked onto Interstate 880 near downtown Oakland just before 5 p.m., forcing the closure of the freeway in both directions for more than an hour and causing traffic to back up for miles.
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jefferson_dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 07:46 PM
Response to Original message
6. Glen Ford?
Is that dude still around? Still bitter about Green Cynthia McKinney not winning, I guess.
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 07:49 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. Yeah, attacking the unions to justify his Obama hate:
The American Federation of Teachers and the National Education Association have combined memberships of over 4 million. They have the capacity to fight back, to make this president back off. But, like so many others who drank the Obama Kool Aid, they are in denial, refusing to believe that they backed a union-buster who is making teachers the scapegoat for America's historical failure to serve the educational needs of all its children.



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jefferson_dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 07:54 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. Disgusting elitist smuggery.
Those teachers just don't know what's good for them. What an ass.

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donco6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 07:55 PM
Response to Original message
9. delete wrong place
Edited on Fri Mar-12-10 07:56 PM by donco6
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asdjrocky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 08:00 PM
Response to Original message
11. So sad. nt
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VMI Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 08:16 PM
Response to Original message
16. A center right Democrat with a very questionable civil rights view.
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dionysus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 08:36 PM
Response to Original message
17. figures you'd applaud this bitter asshole...
:eyes:
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donco6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 11:45 PM
Response to Reply #17
33. Figures you'd offer dismissive post with no evidence whatsoever.
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dionysus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 11:59 PM
Response to Reply #33
34. i need to post links because i'm stating my opinion? well excuse me.
:eyes:
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donco6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 10:03 AM
Response to Reply #34
59. delete
Edited on Sat Mar-13-10 10:03 AM by donco6
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 07:41 AM
Response to Reply #33
52. The only evidence would be a personal attack
I guess it's okay to do that when you don't post a link.
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Larkspur Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 09:18 PM
Response to Original message
19. During the campaign Obama gushed over Reagan
He kept trying to compare himself to Reagan.

That's why I refused to donate or become active in his Prez campaign. I voted for him in the CT primary because I despised Hillary more and he was the only one viable at the time to defeat her. I did have the feeling that Obama would become Bill Clinton ver 2.0 and I was right. It didn't take long for Obama to fill his Admin with leftover Clintonistas.
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Vidar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 09:34 PM
Response to Original message
21. Unfortunately, that's what he's looking like.
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Starry Messenger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 09:41 PM
Response to Original message
22. That pretty much sums it all up.
And if Bush were doing all this, people in here would be totally up in arms about it.
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stray cat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 10:01 PM
Response to Original message
23. Teachers are the only ones who should have jobs?
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Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 10:06 PM
Response to Reply #23
26. smells like straw to me....
& illogical, besides. firing teachers = more jobs? in which universe?
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 10:14 PM
Response to Reply #23
27. Yes
















:sarcasm:
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Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 10:01 PM
Response to Original message
24. Reagan Busted The Air Traffic Controllers Union, And Now Obama Seeks to Bust The Teachers' Unions
This isn't a pillow fight.

Wednesday, March 3, 2010

In recent decades in the U.S., businesses, the right-wing, and many politicians have been dedicated to destroying the unions...

The best way to destroy a union is to arrest, deport, or kill the leaders, something our country has done in the past during times of union struggle. The Palmer Raids around the turn of the last century symbolize that tactic.

Another good way to bust unions is to import workers from other countries who are willing to work for a lot less money, which has the effect of increasing unemployment among the locals, and decreasing wages and benefits... Of course the reverse of importing foreign workers is simply moving the jobs to third world countries, something which has been supported by our politicians passing laws to give special tax breaks to businesses that take American jobs out of this country. Hard to believe these politicians, working against the people of this country. But they receive kick-backs and bribes from the businesses.

Another tactic sometimes used to destroy unions and force millions into lower-paid work is to simply use the government to bust the union. Reagan did it in 1981 when he fired all the Patco (air traffic controllers) union workers. Reagan used to be a union man himself, but switched teams and became a rabid right-wing anti-union goon. So who else, what other president would stoop so low as to use the office of the White House to bust unions? How about Barack Obama?

Barack Obama has just issued a bounty offer to school districts around the country, encouraging them to fire all their teachers and turn their districts over to the for-profit Wal-Mart style private schools commonly called Charter Schools...The Charter Schools are private, for-profit businesses. They aim to eliminate public education entirely, and send our kids to Wal-Mart centers where they will watch videotapes, memorize test questions and answers, and learn to be sedantary non-thinking obedient little soldiers. Soldiers in the army of Wal-mart, or perhaps Blackwater will get into the education business.

Charter Schools don't hire union teachers. When a public school is closed, the contract with the teacher's union is terminated or breached. The students are sent to Charter Schools which hire non-union teachers, often pay them radically lower wages with poor benefits. This is an effort to eliminate teaching as a field in which people in this country have been able to make a decent living. It is also an effort to eliminate education as a goal, and substitute warehousing and control mechanisms for learning...

Obama's now offering $900 Million of taxpayer money to be given to any school district that fires their teachers and/or shuts down their nonperforming schools, and sends their kids over to a Wal-mart-style for-profit educational warehousing system otherwise known as a Charter School. Recent studies show that 17% of the students sent to Charter schools do better than they did in public school, which means that for 83% of the kids, it's either the same or worse. Somebody's making money off of this, but it is not helping the kids...

It will result in the elimination of one more field in which people in this country were allowed to earn a decent living. Give it some time, and teachers will be like all other Wal-mart workers: poorly paid, temporary, and hopeless. What a shame.

http://nabnyc.blogspot.com/2010/03/reagan-busted-air-traffic-controllers.html


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democracy1st Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 12:21 AM
Response to Reply #24
37. this guy is a complete corp shill .
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golfguru Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 10:20 PM
Response to Original message
28. Well...something needs to be done to improve student results...
if a particular school keeps failing the students, it needs to go.
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w4rma Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 10:48 PM
Response to Reply #28
29. It needs to be funded properly and the parents need more support. (nt)
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Starry Messenger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 10:52 PM
Response to Reply #28
31. My friendly advice?
Stick to the links.
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golfguru Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 12:34 AM
Response to Reply #31
43. You have any suggestions on how to improve failing schools?
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Starry Messenger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 12:42 AM
Response to Reply #43
46. Um, well not getting rid of them unilaterally would be a start.
Do you get rid of hospitals because they haven't eliminated sickness and death? Fire all the doctors?

Smaller classes, better funding not tied to bogus test scores. That would be where I'd begin.
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golfguru Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 12:59 AM
Response to Reply #46
47. Not talking about getting rid of all
just the bad apples.

And yes bad hospitals go out of business on their own.
And bad doctors are known to suffer due to bad reputation.
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Starry Messenger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 01:20 AM
Response to Reply #47
48. What constitutes a "bad apple"?
Do you have a working definition?

And while there might be a hospital closing here and there, you do not see the massive closings that we are currently being faced with in the schools. Also, doctors don't get fired "en masse" and have it be praised by the President of the United States as a solution to some "crisis" no one seems to be able to define.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 07:45 AM
Response to Reply #48
54. Arne fired the custodians and cafeteria workers in Chicago
Gotta wonder what impact they have on test scores. :crazy:
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Starry Messenger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 10:45 AM
Response to Reply #54
63. That's one part people keep missing in these firings
The massive amount of strange illogical firings. Arne and company have sold this magical narrative as the "practical" solution. Maybe the facilities workers don't count as people to some, and therefore can be disregarded in these slash and burn "solutions"
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donco6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 11:21 AM
Response to Reply #54
64. Did he privatize with ServiceMaster and Sodexho?
That's what they usually do.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 01:53 PM
Response to Reply #64
67. Been there done that here
Back to the district running the services. Privatization was a mess.
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donco6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 04:33 PM
Response to Reply #67
77. LOTS of stories about that.
My superintendent was pushing me to investigate it a few years back. I was able to avoid it by digging up lots of stories about the lies the privatizers told people. Close call.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 04:47 PM
Response to Reply #77
79. Management of facilities were employs of the privatizer
So the employees who worked for the school district were managed by the contractors. That alone was a HUGE mess.
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donco6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 05:07 PM
Response to Reply #79
80. Yes. Can you imagine not supervising your lead custodian?
It'd be a nightmare.
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mitchtv Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 10:54 PM
Response to Reply #28
32. maybe they should look to the parents
let's spread the resonsiblity around. Kids don't fail because of teachers, they fail when their parents don't value education
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golfguru Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 12:23 AM
Response to Reply #32
38. I agree....but...
why only certain schools fail more often than others?

I think the president is right on this.
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smalll Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 12:15 AM
Response to Reply #28
36. Maybe if particular parents keep failing their children, THEY need to go --
Edited on Sat Mar-13-10 12:21 AM by smalll
maybe if particular students keep failing to avoid being premature little douchebags, THEY need to go --

maybe if a particular CULTURE keeps transmogrifying its young people into over-entitled, self-absorbed, shallow little shits, --- well, maybe we should do something about that too. :shrug:
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Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 12:23 AM
Response to Reply #36
39. maybe if our political & corporate leaders keep selling us out, impoverishing us & creating ghettos,
they need to go as well.
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dana_b Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 02:50 PM
Response to Reply #39
71. that's the root of it
The schools doing the worst are in the poorest areas with the least support. So why not scapegoat ALL the teachers instead of digging deeper to look at what is really causing the problems for these kids and their families? It's expedient and then the politicians wouldn't have to look in the mirror. The parents and families won't have to look in the mirror - we won't either.

Reminds me of Katrina - those who had to fight to survive had the least $$ but they are easier to ignore and push to the side. Once the nation saw it on the tube, it was a little harder to deny.
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golfguru Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 12:24 AM
Response to Reply #36
41. True,...if parents are the cause let's fire them
and do like in China where the state takes over.
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smalll Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 12:30 AM
Response to Reply #41
42. Sorry, China doesn't do that. It just stops the parents from having more than one
Edited on Sat Mar-13-10 12:30 AM by smalll
in the first place. Nice try, Mr. 250-posts!

:hi:
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golfguru Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 12:37 AM
Response to Reply #42
44. may be they don't any more but they did in the past
Edited on Sat Mar-13-10 12:37 AM by golfguru
but the issue is not who does it, the point is it might
not be a bad idea to take bad parents out of the picture.
Such as drug addicts, felons, child abusers etc.
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Ildem09 Donating Member (472 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-12-10 10:50 PM
Response to Original message
30. Um if you don't support the Unions get the fuck out of the party they helped create
Solidarity all the way. You cannot be a Democrat without supporting Unions 100%
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Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 12:24 AM
Response to Reply #30
40. un who are you talking to?
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 07:39 AM
Response to Reply #30
51. Amen
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mitchtv Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 01:30 PM
Response to Reply #30
65. +1
I go for that Lots of scabs around
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jefferson_dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 01:58 PM
Response to Reply #30
68. Solidarity indeed.
Let's get four-square behind our brothers and sisters and push this health care reform package across the finish line.

http://theplumline.whorunsgov.com/labor/big-union-warns-dems-if-you-dont-back-reform-we-wont-back-you/

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l3mc-NTc4is
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Ishoutandscream2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 04:25 PM
Response to Reply #30
76. Damn right! Solidarity!!
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smalll Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 12:10 AM
Response to Original message
35. Is this about that 5-year old in the control tower?
/nt
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zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 12:41 AM
Response to Original message
45. It's about Merit Pay. This is a good resource on the debate...
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 08:35 AM
Response to Reply #45
55. Actually it's about destroying unions
Thanks for the link though.
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boppers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 02:34 AM
Response to Original message
50. 93% failure rate. $70,000 salary. They refused to work 1 hour more (7) a day without more pay.
Guess which group I'm describing.

Just guess which industry could be so incredibly corrupt, and have so much contempt for their customers that they could behave so atrociously.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 07:44 AM
Response to Reply #50
53. Massive bailout using our tax dollars and no accountability while bonuses are still awarded
Guess which group I am describing?
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ncteechur Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 09:18 AM
Response to Reply #53
56. unfortunately banks are private entities, schools are not.
While disgusting, banks can still pay out the bonuses. Nobody likes it but you can't stop it. And unfortunately, when the Bush administration put the tarp funds in place, they didn't put constraints on the money.

Teacher unions are definitely good things EXCEPT when they seek to protect teachers from doing what they should be doing for the kids. If you don't get it done between 8 and 3, you should have to stay afterschool and catch kids up.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 09:39 AM
Response to Reply #56
58. Actually banks are now funded with tax dollars
yet they aren't held accountable.

But schools are.

Interesting, eh?
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golfguru Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-14-10 01:28 AM
Response to Reply #58
82. I was in Bank of America yesterday
and my personal banker told me they have paid back all of the TARP
money, so they are no longer under government control.
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Fire1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 03:59 PM
Response to Reply #56
75. HA! I've got news for you! You have no idea how many times
I've tried that over the years and run into the parental brick wall!! The parents won't allow it!!!
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Dinger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 09:25 AM
Response to Reply #53
57. Touché
Damn, some people . . .
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donco6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 10:06 AM
Response to Reply #50
60. Banks? n/t
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 01:49 PM
Response to Reply #60
66. You win but I can't afford to give you a prize
Budget cuts :)
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dana_b Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 02:59 PM
Response to Reply #66
72. yeah, I didn't think you were on of those lazy, $70,000/yr.
Edited on Sat Mar-13-10 03:02 PM by dana_b
no-good teachers who refuses to work one more hour a day. Let's forget that most teachers don't make NEAR $70,000/yr, they work 10-12+ hours a day already, pay for school supplies out of their own pockets, and three months off a year?? Haha!! Right.

Here is California pay:
Average teacher salary: $63,640

Average beginning teacher salary: $35,506
http://www.teachersalaryinfo.com/average-teacher-salary-california.html

Kansas:
Average teacher salary: $49,506

Average beginning teacher salary: $33,580

So where this $70,000/yr comes from, I have no idea.

Oh! And how could I forget Rhode Island?:

Average teacher salary: $53,473

Average beginning teacher salary: $32,902
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 03:07 PM
Response to Reply #72
73. And don't forget they wanted $90 an hour!!
Those selfish, inconsiderate, greedy teachers.
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dana_b Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 03:30 PM
Response to Reply #73
74. oh yes!
Edited on Sat Mar-13-10 03:33 PM by dana_b
let's not forget that.

With the Rhode Island salary I figure it was approximately $35/hr. based on on 8-9 hour day for 40 weeks/yr. That doesn't include the time they put in planning and grading work at night, and planning in the summer, etc.
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donco6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 04:35 PM
Response to Reply #72
78. My district's average is $49,000.
I can't imagine somewhere where the average is $70K.
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boppers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-14-10 12:59 AM
Response to Reply #72
81. More numbers:
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dana_b Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-14-10 11:09 AM
Response to Reply #81
83. so THAT"S where he $70,000/yr came from!
If the teacher has a doctorate and has been there for 30-40 years they will get paid that. Who in the hell would begrudge them that? It's obviously way above the mean.
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cornermouse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 10:34 AM
Response to Original message
62. k & r
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warm regards Donating Member (350 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 01:58 PM
Response to Original message
69. Doing the right thing usually upsets entrenched special interests that prefer the status quo.
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craigmatic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-13-10 02:11 PM
Response to Original message
70. Yes he's changed. On his campaign website he just said that
he'd fund NCLB but now he wants to push charter schools and do other reforms and he doesn't neccessarily care about fighting unions to do it. This is really going to hurt teachers and make a bad job more miserable. There's nothing wrong with public schools other than they're underfunded and usually the first thing to get cut in bad economic times.
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cornermouse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-14-10 08:43 PM
Response to Original message
84. Kicking back to the top because it is fact-based truth.
And no amount of denial will change that.
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msanthrope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-15-10 10:02 AM
Response to Original message
85. I'm sorry, what union was busted? The new hires will be union, too.
I heard Frances Gallo on NPR and she said that all new hires would be teacher's union. And she's swamped with resumes.

In fact, the complaint with the state labor board filed by the teacher's union doesn't dispute that rehires will be union.
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Dinger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-15-10 10:10 AM
Response to Original message
86. Kickin' This Again, Because It's A Fact (nt)
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warm regards Donating Member (350 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-15-10 02:29 PM
Response to Reply #86
88. Really...? How can you be so sure?
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