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The right wing is delusional when it comes to taxes..Time to push back HARD HARD HARD.

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Peacetrain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-10 12:30 PM
Original message
The right wing is delusional when it comes to taxes..Time to push back HARD HARD HARD.
Edited on Sat Jul-31-10 01:17 PM by Peacetrain
Everybody was booming in the 90's.. big bucks, etc.

Lets revisit what happened when Bush came into office..

Remember him literally talking down the economy. Anyone remember that.. They went after it 24/7 so they could get those huge tax cuts through that were not going to really tank the economy till years 9 and 10..

We have just lived through years 9 and 10 and they did tank us.

All those jobs the right yammered on that would be created with giving the big cuts to the rich, since they create the jobs.. yadda yadda yadda.

We had basically ZERO job growth during the Bush years.

Well let the tax breaks to the wealthy expire and maybe we will get back to the job growth of the 90's and banks will start lending again.

Their way did not work.. it just made the rich richer, and depleted the economy on funds and tax revenues and they just bankrupted the states with unfunded mandates.

If we do not stop the tax giveaway to the upper 1% their tax cuts are going to increase even more

EDIT TO ADD THIS LINK:
http://www.ctj.org/html/gwb0602.htm
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iamjoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-10 12:36 PM
Response to Original message
1. Tax Cuts Are Like Drugs
They may feel good at the time, but ultimately may not be good for you. They are addictive. You build up a tolerance to them, so you need "more" or "stronger" to get you the same good feeling you once had.
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Peacetrain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-10 01:08 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. this was 1000 percent predicted.. the massive tax cuts
that the bushies pushed through would effect the debt at a small rate when first institutional and the CBO said that the real pain in how if would effect the budget would hit in years 9 and 10.. Tax cuts for the the middle class and things like food stamps etc really do stimulate the budget.. what Bush did was what always did.. bankrupt everything he touched. I just wish the media would at least report what is happening with an even hand that this was what the CBO said would happen

Boy the uber wealthy are just stuck on not paying for anything.. they want everything for free without contributing one iota
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Qutzupalotl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-10 01:24 PM
Response to Original message
3. Some helpful links for discussions
Edited on Sat Jul-31-10 01:25 PM by Qutzupalotl
Before the Bush Recession: Supply Side Tax Cuts Failed to Deliver Jobs and Growth Between 2001 and 2007
http://www.americanprogress.org/issues/2009/02/bush_recession.html

Study: Bush Tax Cuts Cost More Than Twice As Much As Dems' Health-Care Bill
(tax cuts cost the treasury over 2 trillion across 10 years)
http://crooksandliars.com/susie-madrak/study-bush-tax-cuts-cost-more-twice-m

Tax Cuts Don't Boost Revenues
http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1692027,00.html#ixzz0vH3Kaggb

While we did have a net job growth of 3 million over Bush's 8 years, that's pitiful compared to other presidencies.

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Peacetrain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-10 01:34 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. The pitiful job growth in the Bush years was mainly goverment
Private sector job growth was abysmal.. that was what all those tax cuts were supposed to be for.. hmmmmm supply side gone amok

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/09/business/09charts.html

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TheKentuckian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-10 03:04 PM
Response to Original message
5. They not only are delusional but stupid liars as well.
The problem with making them shut up is to be able to succinctly relate that there is such a thing as diminishing returns.
Last cycle or two it seemed Democrats were attempting to push back on taxes but were hemmed in rhetorically between not wanting to be "anti-business" or "waging class warfare" and that coming down from a 90% top rate did free more money for investment.

I think someone is going to have to strongly, clearly, and relentlessly pound it that there is no magic and that there is some area between 0 and 100% that is optimal depending on other economic conditions.
That at 90% the rich would spend and save to the point it limited the money they'd sink back in but now we have reached a place where first, investment is not the premium profit center it was being replaced by speculation by the high rollers, doing so has not resulted in more investment but amazingly less (despite near zero prime rates as well), and that the money effectively does not circulate enough to impact the economy almost seeming to act to stagnate the larger system while the burden of a well functioning government is shifted to those with minimal surplus which means they can neither spend, save, nor invest which depresses the economy broadly.

As wages stagnate, costs rise, and the jobs go away the tax base declines, services get slashed, the system breaks down, the commons is sold to the rich, their prices go up, more debt is generated and/or taxes go up except not on the rich our we'll lose jobs, etc


The purpose of an economy is to distribute resources and at this point that isn't happening anymore. Ninety percent of us are fighting for literal crumbs.
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Peacetrain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-10 05:08 PM
Response to Reply #5
8. Too late for me to edit... You are absolutely correct..They are stupid also!!
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treestar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-10 03:11 PM
Response to Original message
6. The voters have to understand this
Rather than returning powers to the republicans to make things worse.
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Peacetrain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-10 05:08 PM
Response to Reply #6
9. My God I hope so..
People have the memories of gnats.. and the republicans are playing to that
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-10 03:15 PM
Response to Original message
7. You could have stopped the subject line after "delusional".
:)
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Peacetrain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-10 05:09 PM
Response to Reply #7
10. Well it is more than taxes.. that is for sure..
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Jeff In Milwaukee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-10 10:25 PM
Response to Original message
11. Watching this Kudlow guy while at the gym the other day
I'd never watched his show and I don't pick the channels, so I was pretty much stuck with him, but I think Lisa Kudrow could give more intelligent economic advice. So anyway, the Kudlow guy and his guest were having this simultaneous orgasm talking about how well Supply Side Economics did during the 80's and how Bill Clinton totally screwed it up in the 90's and it was until Bush II got in office that they set things right again.

And I thought, "How fucking delusional are these people?"
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KingFlorez Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-10 10:30 PM
Response to Original message
12. The economic policy of the Republicans was cut and spend
They want their tax cuts and their defense spending. In fact, I wouldn't even call that policy at all, it was a lack of policy and direction.
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applegrove Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-10 10:42 PM
Response to Original message
13. Thanks for posting. It cannot be said enough. Tax cuts for the rich don't work.
They don't create jobs.
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Alcibiades Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-10 11:05 PM
Response to Original message
14. Tax cuts were also supposed to increase revenue
The laughable Laffer curve. They don't even argue that one any more, but it was the original justification.
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golfguru Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-31-10 11:18 PM
Response to Original message
15. Problem is...people love their tax cuts
Most people love money. Tax cuts are extra money.
It is like showing a wino a bottle of Chardonay.
His eyes always will light up.
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ProgressOnTheMove Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-01-10 01:23 AM
Response to Original message
16. Darn right! The middle class cut will stay,only the top 2 percent will fade out and nothing trickled
Edited on Sun Aug-01-10 01:24 AM by ProgressOnTheMove
down under the previous administration.
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