Should we really be shocked that the Dems are about to go down?

After all, many of the people here and on other so called liberal blogs have spent time and energy telling everyone how big of a disappointment Obama and the Dems are. If liberals see them as disappointments, should you really expect independents to vote for them?

I think some of you are about to get what you deserve. It's just a shame that people who appreciate the job that Obama has done is about to get shafted too w/ a republican ran house and senate.

Do try to keep that in mind.

yes you will really suffer under the corporate pigs. DO you think you will get anything from the GOP? No!

...can't we wait until after the election before we start blaming each other for why we lost?

We haven't lost yet.

I catch enough grief here for being willing to recognize that we're 14-point underdogs in this superbowl... but 14-pt dogs sometimes win.

The HCR bill has resulted in my health insurance premium jumping
over 30%. It has never jumped that high ever in one year.

Lack of public option to compete with the private corporations has
done it for me. I am not voting for senator Murray in November.

Not at all happy with the HCR bill which is all for the private
corporations. That was a classic sellout for campaign donations.
I have no other way to protest the HCR.

:shrug:

But I gotta do some protest about the 30% hike in my
health insurance premium starting Jan 1st 2011, the highest
ever by far.

Saw that figure in a Republican party ad just this morning.


I don't care if you vote or not.

HCR is designed to restrict those rate hikes. Your insurance company is trying to squeeze you for every penny BEFORE the law passed and BEFORE it fully takes effect.

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2010/2/18/838287/-Sebelius:-Anthem-Rate-Hikes-in-CA-Just-the-Beginning

Oh, and a DEMOCRATIC governor announced a moratorium on rate hikes in Iowa. I'm sure a Republican governor would have put a brake on the increasing premiums too, right?

http://www.iowapolitics.com/index.iml?Article=188062

Right?

>crickets<

http://www.governor.wa.gov/

But no body is putting the clamps on the private
insurers here.

Which is my biggest beef against the HCR bill. There is
absolutely zero restrictions on year over year premium hikes
by for profit private corporations.

And there is no public option to compete with those blood
suckers.

Working for Dino Rossi, then???

:puke:

demand that we follow along behind our leader in a stupor. People are going to vote for the Democrats even tho they are disappointed with them and we have a right to be. We have a party that allows you to Cristie the leaders. To tell them we are disappointed. Even tho we vote for them to be re-elected we don't vote against them and for republicans or stay home so republicans can win. We know if the Democrats do not win what this county will revert to. Thank God we do belong to a party that allows us our own opinions. Not like republicans. And we should not be chastised because we do at times disagree.

successfully trashed the thing and by the time it passed the public was against it.

The democrats have made it easy for the repubs to demonize HCR because well lets face it..it has some nice things but without cost control you are seeing the obvious flaw of the reform...insurers can still jack up rates since there is no competition. They are already finding loopholes in the system. If the democrats were genuinely doing it for the people and not partially making deals with insurers then this wouldnt be a hard sell right now during this campaign season...it would actually be a easy selling point to people to re-elect democrats because they fight for the people...nope. This HCR will clearly need another overhaul...and hopefully this time someone will fight for the people and at the very least insist on cost control via a Public Option or better yet, a Single Payer (which is virtually impossible). ANd for the love of gawd change that new law for Pharma patents back down to 5 years and not this appalling 12 year, and allow importing of drugs from Canada....these new laws actually hurt americans...yes there are a few nice spots but there are a lot of bad ones...it needs to be updated.

they plan on dismantling the bill piece buy piece. By 2014 the law will be totally gutted forget about any overhaul it's back to square one.

stop drinking the damn coolaid and vote

:rofl:

Thanks a lot.

The media, for the last 2 years, takes INSANE right wing opposition to Obama and the Dems (roughly 40% of the US), and then to that, they ADD, the 10-12% from the left (on any given issue) who oppose Obama and the dems, for doing "too little".

They then state that the OPPOSITION to Obama is 50-55% because our "center-right country" thinks Obama is "going to far".

The people (sheep) in the middle, who do not follow politics, hear this, and they also conclude Obama is "going too far".

And if Dems stay home in this election, the Dems in Congress will learn the key lesson ... they have no "base", and they will move to the RIGHT.

POUTING is not an effective political strategy. We should have learned this in 2000. Clearly, we did not.

A lot lot of Democrats also supported his big spending. Why do some of you think it is unusual for some Democrats not supporting Obama?

So what percentage of the voting public do you think has been brainwashed in this way? How many of them actually spend time "here and on other so called liberal blogs"? How evil of us to trick them into believing that they still don't have a job, can't afford health insurance, and struggle to feed their children and pay for housing!


People are hurting and desperate and out of work. Corporations continue to suck their wallets every single day. Yes, when the country is CONTINUING to bleed them two years after promises of hope and change, some of them will go for the worse alternative out of pure frustration. If Dems had spent more time on the economy, job creation, and making things like health care more AFFORDABLE, and less time on corporate bailouts, you would be seeing Democratic landslides right now.

But actually, if you think about it, Keith and Rachel have repeatedly amplified the voices of the liberal blogs by discussing them on their shows. Then Fox uses such to talk-down/laugh at the liberals who don't even support their own President, then CNN and other copycat outlets repeat the meme as fact.

The "common knowledge" that the left isn't firmly behind Obama has to be coming from somewhere, because polls certainly don't show this. So, this theory is not nearly as far-fetched as it seems on its face.

that Obama has done a pretty good job of pushing it himself. :)

Most people I associate with every day have no idea that liberal blogs even exist. There are 900 cable channels. Most of them aren't watching MSNBC, either.

Effect of liberal blogs versus effect of the economy and what people are actually experiencing and observing after two years of this Presidency?

No contest.

The more I think about it, the more I am convinced that the MSM amplified what a few people on the internet were saying, now local little stations are repeating this bullshit to people who would never visit a blog. The more I think about it, the more I think the O/P has a point.

I couldn't disagree more strongly. I would argue that they are parroting the Wall Street Journal and the Washington Times. The meme out there in Middle America is that Obama is a stealth Marxist/socialist who has gone too far LEFT, not right. Oh my god, he took over auto companies! Oh my god, he is nationalizing health care! Oh my god, he hates America and sides with terrorists!

That is why Obama is out there repeatedly and publicly scolding his base. He wants to reassure independents that he isn't the extreme Leftist that the media repeatedly makes him out to be.

MSNBC is the ONLY place I can see that is pushing a view from the other side...and most people don't watch it.

Have brought what we discuss here and at places like FDL, Huffpo, DK and others to the mainstream.

You may not like what I'm saying, but you know how lazy the copycat media is and how they can't resist a juicy story. The fact that you aren't addressing the totality of what I've said and are focusing on minutiae makes me think I've really hit on something here.

I have no emotional investment in what you were saying, trust me. I just thought it was an interesting debate. We will have to agree to disagree here, but the snark is really unnecessary.

Good luck to you.

I was genuinely pointing out that you chose to answer what suited you as you didn't like that my point is not as farfetched as it seems on it's face. Perhaps you're reacting negatively to the strength of my argument? :shrug:

Excuse me while I find someone capable of an adult argument.

Sheesh.

Thanks.

You can feel very, very proud of yourself now for "winning" a conversation.

You gave up because my argument was true and you didn't want to admit it.

And you figured out my embarrassment and discomfort when I realized you defeated me, too!

Here is a star for you:

Glad I did it first :hi:

You were first!

Not sure what good can possibly come of this but perhaps they are smarter than the rest of us. I sincerely hope so.

Looking for handy scapegoats before the election has even happened seems like a destructive way to run the home stretch.

Just go through the archives.

:shrug:

If McCain would have won the economy would still suck and it would have been the Republicans who got spanked. Let's pray the economy improves by 2012.

Want to know how important a good economy is. Bill Clinton had a near seventy point approval rating at the peak of impeachment.

Nailed it.

And the voters are shallowly informed and already forget that the Rs will not help them with the economy.

:thumbsup:

wait and what happens, and maybe then you can put the blame right where it belongs. You don't have to look for a scapegoat before the election. Look to the politicians,IMO that is where the problem is.


edited for sp

Here, many of them are boosting Crist over the Democrat, but those are the only people I know who claim to be Democrats who are not voting for Democrats, those 'Reagan Dem' sort of moderate folkken who often vote for various Republicans, and also Republican Rejects such as Crist.
Liberals always vote, and always vote Democratic. What the 'Independents' and 'moderate centrists' do is always sketchy, they are skittish, fence sitting, distance measuring types.

If the race between Crist and Rubio was tied with Meek a distant third I would not hesitate to vote for Crist. It would be my first vote for someone other than a Democrat* since I cast my first vote for Bob Graham when he ran in the 1978 Democratic gubernatorial primary against Robert Shevin. There are loyal Democrats like my friend Nate whose home is literally decorated with photos of Hillary Clinton, Bill Clinton, Barack Obama, Nancy Pelosi, Al Gore, John Kennedy, Dr. King, and Rosa Parks who is voting for Crist in a well intentioned but doomed to fail effort to stop Marco Rubio. That's how much he scares progressives who know him best. Voting For Crist to stop Rubio is not fundamentally different than FDR forming an alliance with Stalin to stop Hitler. I'm not suggesting Rubio is Hitler but sometimes the enemy of my enemy id my friend.

In short there are well intentioned Democrats who are trying to stop Rubio at all costs. They don't love Charlie but they dislike and fear Rubio




* I lived in Seminole County, Florida where the Democratic party was so weak that they weren't able to field candidates for every position. In those situations I voted for the Liberterian.

If you really think bloggers have an influence what they are seeing at this point is you.

So no. Find another scapegoat. Blogosphere liberals have too little power to convince millions not to vote for their Democratic candidate in their district or state.

it's the fault of the people they disappointed

Get a grip. I just spent the afternoon on the phone making calls to get the vote out. EVERY democrat I talked to said they were voting democrat. I had a few republicans, but we know how they vote anyway. The polls are biased and do not account for our new world technology of cell phones and smart phones. You people are going to be surprised at how the polls got it wrong. I am not predicting a win, although I hope that is the case. But I am predicting that the polls are off. United we stand, divided we fall. Your enthusiasm alone can make those polls go up. I agree with Bill Maher. It is better to have a disappointing friend than a deadly enemy.

successful, progressive and one of the best best presidents in the last 100 years, yet people from YOUR side creates a narrative of failure - why would others think any differently? The left worked hard to bring this president down - mission almost accomplished.

:popcorn: :popcorn: :popcorn: :popcorn:

that people like you have been here for less than a year but still feel the need to preach about why "we" are "going down"?

I also donate and do limited work for Democratic and liberal causes and I have voted for Democrats since 1968. Why do people imagine that those of us who are not satisfied with the current crop of Democrats would ever want the republicans to win...That seems to be the MSM position, and it's just fucking stupid.


mark

It's the old 'you're with us or you're with the enemy' meme.

to choose betweent he two parties probably doesen't even know about any "infighting". Besides, Democrats are always like this.


mark

I understand you comments, but your entire post just says defeated and no one have counted any votes yet.

But, I guess that's not a topic open to discussion.

But those who perceive DU to be obamaestablishment.com won't have any of it.

fuck 'em. I'm sick of pandering to people who can't form an opinion or make a a damn decision.

DLC rejects were picked for the top positions in this White House while the progressives that worked on Obama's campaign were fired and shown no respect. However, Rahm is gone, so maybe we have a chance to reduce the damage they caused.

:sarcasm:

and


+1

would criticize the "professional left" for their incessant whining after hearing this bozo telling us we're about to get what we deserve.

Nuff said. Case closed.

We wouldn't be in this dismal place if more Dems had listened to principled Democrats, who encouraged them to be "lefty and proud" all along.

liberals. They're far more likely to be swayed by tv. In short they don't know what they want. Dems are losing because the Obama coalition isn't stimulated because they disbanded it once the president got in.