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dennis4868 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 12:56 PM
Original message
The Daily Dish: Why Obama Won
http://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/the_daily_dish/2010/12/why-obama-won.html

Just do the math:

Of estimated $900 billion-plus cost over two years, roughly $120 billion covers the high-end tax cuts and the estate tax cut, $450 billion covers Mr. Obama’s wish list and $360 billion covers the tax cut extensions both parties favored.

The core reason to be angry at this deal is fury that the richest will keep their tax rates. I agree that, given the need for revenue, this is irresponsible. But, unlike some liberals, I'd prefer no income tax rises at all for anyone, and tackling the debt through ending tax breaks, reforming the code, and cutting entitlements and defense. I'd be open to a consumption tax if necessary (and I'm sure some revenue increase is necessary). But the core fact of the post-election deal is the following: Obama gave the GOP their symbol while grabbing a huge amount of substance - substance that Democrats should like and substance that will likely help him win re-election.

I KNOW THE NARRATIVE HERE IS - BAD OBAMA, GO TO HELL OBAMA, but this article does make sense to me....so go ahead and attack....thta's what we do here now at DU!

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jemsan Donating Member (245 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 12:59 PM
Response to Original message
1. He lost because he's begun the dismantling of Social Security
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rurallib Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 01:08 PM
Response to Reply #1
6. right you are. Most are overlooking this.
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stopbush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 01:08 PM
Response to Reply #1
7. Bull.
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stopbush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 01:02 PM
Response to Original message
2. Many Ds and commentators who I respect like this deal, and I can't ignore that.
Lawrence O'Donnell, Ezra Klein and many others have pointed out that BO actually gave up very little to get what amounts to a new backdoor stimulus package. He was able to do that because the Rs are so obsessive about tax cuts for the rich that they were blinded to everything else Obama got in the package.

And I disagree with Rachel Maddow who last night tried to portray all of those progressive goodies that were included (child tax credit, college tax credit, UI extension, etc) like things that were just going to happen anyway, or things that Rs were OK with. That's not true.
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BlueCaliDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 01:06 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. Exactly! Much like the R's, some Liberals/Progressives were fixated on tax cuts for the rich
too, but from the other side, and that's why they're angry. Both miss how the President did a savvy move, and when you have the likes of Palin and LIEberman hating this bill, you know the President's gotten something significant through.
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dennis4868 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 01:20 PM
Response to Reply #2
9. Last night Rachel Maddow...
also ignored her previous reporting regarding the fillubuster....the past few weeks she has been talking about how the repubs have abused the fillubuster and that never has it been used ALL THE TIME for every piece of legislation and that is why its is almost impossible for Obama to get anything done the past 2 years or his proposed legislation has to be diluted down. But then last night she attacks Obama saying that hey Obama you have majorities in the house and senate and you cant get through a tac cut for the middle class only? WTF? One night she defends Obama by saying its the repubs fault things dont get done because of the repub 24/7 fillubuster and then last night where she had a clear agenda decided to scrap the fillubuster explanation and solely blame Obama for everything....she was awful last night...makes me wonder how much I can trust her if she cherry picks her facts to reach her narrative.
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BlueCaliDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 01:02 PM
Response to Original message
3. Except for cutting any entitlements, I agree with Sullivan.
This isn't such a bad deal. It isn't perfect, but it isn't bad, either.

The President should use some of that Stimulus money to pay out the 99ers and other unemployed who have fallen off the radar in the past months, though. They were NOT included in this deal.

Rec'd for the piece, clarity, and having the cojones to post it.
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ProudDad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 01:06 PM
Response to Original message
5. "Consumption tax" = another fucking regressive tax
that disproportionately hits the poor...

How Democratic of you... :puke:

Now we know where you're coming from...the libertarian wing of the near right-wing of the Corporate War Party it seems...
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stopbush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 01:13 PM
Response to Reply #5
8. Not always true. A consumption tax can be a luxury tax or surcharge
that is charged on luxury purchases made by rich people. Such taxes don't impact poor people.

Why assume that a consumption tax is applied to bread and butter items?
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ProudDad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 01:28 PM
Response to Reply #8
10. Then they are called "Excise" or "Luxury" taxes
Edited on Wed Dec-08-10 01:29 PM by ProudDad
Those are currently all but nonexistent -- Clinton/bush/now Obama are taking care of that...

The vast majority of taxes that we are subjected to are Regressive...

That's one of the ways that the rich get richer...

We pay for their infrastructure and the damage they do, they reap the profits...
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stopbush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 03:05 PM
Response to Reply #10
13. I'm just giving a fellow DUer the benefit of the doubt that the
wording he used wasn't as precise as it might have been.
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ProudDad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 01:50 PM
Response to Original message
11. An unattributed defense of Obama the Appeaser?
:wtf: :eyes:
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Pisces Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-08-10 01:59 PM
Response to Original message
12. People here want to be mad and outraged. They don't want anything that is common sense, just purist
ideology. I know people on unemployment and they are not happy about a game of chicken with the electric bills and food.
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