POLL: What did you want Obama To Do?

It seems as though about 75% of this board is really upset with Obama, Reid & the Senate & Congressional Democrats tonight. My question is, what would have been a better option? If the GOP Controlled Congress won't agree to pass anything that even resembles a compromise - then what should Democrats do? Default, and let the poor suffer more?

I just don't think "Fight Harder" is a realistic response. I don't see how you force people to agree to something, when they really DO NOT CARE if we default - in fact I think the Tea Party was actually hoping for it. Crazies like Palin, Bachman, etc were HOPING for a Default. How do you compromise with those kind of people? You can't - but sadly they have a pretty large voice in 1/3 of the decision making process. So, you be President Obama.. what would you have done?

Be presidential. Prove we don't have to go to war over every thing, as opposed to the republicans who have declared war on anything not them.

so........... i went for the total unknown. 14th amendment

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/social/wmnorton/14th-amendment-congress_b_912776_99783573.html?ref=fb&src=sp#sb=668796,b=facebook

“Apparently Harry Truman invoked the 14th Amendment. If it was good enough for "the buck stops here" Harry it's good enough for me.”


The 14th Amendment was passed after the Constitution and its first 13 Amendments, so that it supersedes any provision of the earlier documents with which it might conflict, and modifies any related matter. That is what "amendment" means.

Because the 14th Amendment states, the "validity of the public debt of the United States, authorized by law....shall not be questioned", the country must pay its public debt. There is no discretion, no choice. Yes, it is Congress that has borrowing, taxing and spending powers, but the 14th Amendment's command that the country's obligations be paid makes it clear that those powers are not discretionary once an obligation has been authorized

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Paul Abrams
Paul Abrams

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Constitution Prohibits 'Deadbeat Nation'
Posted: 7/28/11 06:30 PM ET
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The 14th Amendment was passed after the Constitution and its first 13 Amendments, so that it supersedes any provision of the earlier documents with which it might conflict, and modifies any related matter. That is what "amendment" means.

Because the 14th Amendment states, the "validity of the public debt of the United States, authorized by law....shall not be questioned", the country must pay its public debt. There is no discretion, no choice. Yes, it is Congress that has borrowing, taxing and spending powers, but the 14th Amendment's command that the country's obligations be paid makes it clear that those powers are not discretionary once an obligation has been authorized by law.

<<<<SNIP>>>

Moreover, since the president has sworn an oath to "faithfully execute the laws" of the United States, he is also compelled by Constitutional language in the 14th Amendment to pay the country's duly-authorized obligations.

For starters, Truman never invoked the 14th Amendment in any way regarding the national debt.

Second, the idea that the 14th grants the President the power to raise the debt ceiling, instead of simply requiring states to honor the federal debt, is a misreading that has reached urban legend proportions lately.

Much harder. He would change the whole atmosphere from capitulation, to finding a way to succeed. Obama is incapable of that.

I think Biden probably already found one - he's white. Racist GOP / Tea Party members have decided that they will do ANYTHING to make sure Obama doesn't get re-elected. They can't stand that a "Black Man" is in "Their" house. I don't honestly think this is about Obama not "trying" hard enough. He's up against a group of TeaParty FREAKS that are so hell bent on making him fail, that they're willing to shove the entire economy off of a cliff. Tell me the last president who had to fight that kind of contingent?

But, back to your OP - would Biden be able to do better? Perhaps a little bit.. if only because his skin color is the same as most of the GOP's, and for that alone they'd give him more respect in negotiations.

Of course that just makes me want Obama to stay where he's at all that much more....

"hard decisions" he keeps talking about.

Yeah, it's great to talk about gays in the military but that just increases the pool of bodies available to fight in three illegal, illicit, unfunded wars.

Backing down from Clem, Cletus and Floyd is just one of the reasons I've lost "full faith and credit" in the present POTUS.

Maybe Biden wouldn't do much better but he wouldn't have been anything as much of a disappointment as his boss.

Hey, I'm already on Medicare and SocSec. None of these bozos have the balls to go after people in my situation but the under 55? We'll see what the State of the Nation is in November 2012 before I decide who, if anyone, gets my vote.

I totally agree---Biden might be more successful by virtue of his skin color. It is all about blocking Obama from succeeding and getting re-elected. The GOP are hell bent on that goal. So, everyone here who does not want Obama re-elected helps them that much more! I stand by Obama! I think he is doing the best he can do under the circumstances. But the GOP may reach their goal--hope everyone here is happy about that.

pick Bernie Sanders as his new VP. Then Biden can resign.

...and never wavered.

and he still doesn't have a clean bill (because the Teapublicans WANT a Default) - what does he do then? Default - or wish he would have 24 hours left on the clock to still get something done?

I'd heard that the GOP Puppet Masters would never let it get down to the night before August 1st before actually having a solution in hand.

I think the GOP Puppet Masters found out last week that they're not exactly in control of this spectacle anymore.. the Tea Party hi-jacked it, and they're now driving the crazy train.

And I think Obama has possibly realized that too. It's one thing when you're posturing.. it's another thing when a small (but powerful) group of the GOP is actually bat-shit crazy enough to default. I think Obama realized that he wasn't fighting the GOP - he was fighting a group that doesn't care if the country goes belly up.

What was the other option to "Giving them what they want". First - they wanted to do this all again in 5 months.. not gonna happen. Second - 1/2 of them WANTED to see us freaking Default.

So what do you do? Let the country default just to show 'em who's boss? How do you work with crazy? Seriously?

But they've watched him in action and know he won't stand up to them. Next time will be worse.

Not sure that would've worked, and I think it would've put more of the blame on Obama if Congress couldn't reach a deal by the deadline.

Palin, Bachman, et al were not not the arbiters here. Wall Street and the investor class were always
running this show. If Obama and the Dems had held firm, the monied interests would have had to
pressure the pukes to raise the debt ceiling regardless of what they got or lose their shirts.

Of course, it was setup so that the Dems can blame their cave on the crazies. If you think the
crazies are the problem, you are blaming the wrong crowd. Essentially, everyone in DC is working
for the same bosses.

were actually as in control as people seem to think they are.. I would think that this would have been resolved a couple of weeks ago. Before the market had the worst week of the year, and people (or more likely, hedge fund managers, corporations, and Millionaires) lost a few pennies.

You have to make it look really desperate, to get people to give up their rights.

You use a terrorist threat, real or exaggerated to scare people into accepting the loss of their constitutional rights.
You use a manufactured financial crisis to get folks to relinquish their financial rights and benefits.

Those poor millionaires et al will regain all those paper loses tomorrow. Don't you worry.

My disappointment in Obama occurred weeks ago when he
put SS Medicare and Medicaid on the table.

Once Reid and MCConnell devised a plan much earlier,
that gave the GOP what they wanted pretty much what
they were asking--the fix was in.

It would end up a variation on their plan. Boehner's
plan and Reid's plan were similar. That told me
where this thing was going.

All the way along, long before this "crisis" emerged, they knew it was coming. And Obama and the Democtratic leadership did nothing to proactively prevent things from getting to this point.

IMO if they had introduced a clean bill every day for the last six months -- and told people over and over what swas happening if the GOP refused -- this would either have been prevented or the GOP would have massive egg on its face if they tried to block it at the last minute.

move - but I think it would have been harmful to him.

Reason. So glad to see that still exists here. It seems as though people thought he just stood up and started dolling out concessions for no reason. He had a reason.. he's not bat-shit crazy, and wasn't willing to throw an economy off of a cliff...

2012 Budget due by September 30th, and the Shock Doctrine rolls on.

if congress won't pass one (TeaParty won't get enough votes to allow it to pass), and it never ends up on Obama's desk? Clearly that would have been preferred.. but how does Obama do it, when he doesn't write the bills.. he signs 'em?

it was a last resort and dared anyone to sue him. I think that would have been the bold move. I read the President's Fact Sheet just to be fair, and the only good thing in it is some defense cuts. It creates that ridiculously undemocratic sub-Congress in Congress with only 14 members. It also didn't convince me that the deal will not get even worse. See this point:

* To Meet This Target, the Committee Will Consider Responsible Entitlement and Tax Reform. This means putting all the priorities of both parties on the table – including both entitlement reform and revenue-raising tax reform.

The GOP is now threatening filibuster in the Senate... not sure if we'll get 60 votes to force a vote. I am in shock at what these idiots will do...

Now they are not going to pass it? This is going to be a historic 24-48 hrs.

That was his first and biggest mistake. The Republicans were holding the good faith and credit of the United States hostage to to their ideologically-driven desire to march the American people off a cliff for the benefit of a few treacherous right wing billionaires. Raising the debt ceiling had heretofore been a routine matter done with little fuss and fanfare, regardless of who was in the White House and which party controlled Congress. This should have been no different and the President should have insisted on a clean bill. It the teabaggers will still acting like spoiled brats and holding their collective breath while turning blue at the eleventh hour, he could have invoked the 14th Amendment in order to make sure bills continued to get paid.

This crisis was manufactured by the Republicans in order to prevent cleaning up the country's economic woes that are the fault of the fiscal irresponsibility of Republicans, in particular Ronald Reagan and George W. Bush, both of whom spent money like drunken sailors in a whore house. President Obama should not have sullied his hands negotiating with these crooks, like that fellow who was negotiating while standing to benefit if the negotiation collapsed. There was never anything to negotiate.

The bills that are added to the Debt Ceiling are passed by congress, some of them decades ago. So many legal minds suspect that because the bills were passed, and when passed they knew they would add to the debt, that putting a cap on fulfilling the bill would be illegal.

Easy as that.