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Why do people confuse fear for respect?

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The Backlash Cometh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-29-11 07:09 AM
Original message
Why do people confuse fear for respect?
I just saw this Christie guy on t.v. say that his mother said if you had to pick between Love and Respect, pick respect.

Why do authoritative leaders think that it's respect that they inspire in people? What it looks like from our side of the formula is that these leaders will pull every string in the public and private sector to make your life miserable if you challenge them, so that silence they hear is not respect, but fear.
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OneGrassRoot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-29-11 07:14 AM
Response to Original message
1. Excellent point worthy of discussion, imho. K&R
Edited on Wed Jun-29-11 07:16 AM by OneGrassRoot
Edit to add (I initially thought I had to leave and had no time to reply further until later...lol)



I think those authoritarian leaders themselves are fearful. They live in fear, and thus inject the same in all interactions. Of course, they are usually chest-thumping types and would deny that to the hilt, but I believe THEY are terrified themselves.

Of many things, but especially "The Others." Anyone who doesn't see the world exactly as they do is The Other.



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RKP5637 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-29-11 07:15 AM
Response to Original message
2. I look/listen to Christie and I think incompetence. I think he's a failure as
a leader. It's easy to say cut this, cut that, typical corporate hatchet man approach, and most of those corps often end up out of business repackaged and sold off, and the employees thrown out with the trash. A state is a collection of people, not a collection of objects to be discarded.

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InkAddict Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-29-11 07:37 AM
Response to Original message
3. IMO, authoritarians think that way because they have a narrow
vision that holds that their way must necessarily be the correct way and their followers would necessarily come to the same conclusions regardless of how many of the criteria is shared; therefore respect would denote an equality of "fairness" in like minds.

Authoritarians do not even envision a dissenting position, and where dissent is evident, a need for force is required so the respect they have earned is more often the result of their superior ability to FORCE "fairness" as they see it; hence a fear of their failure to persuade is equal to their respect, even where their narrow vision precludes their ability to see compliance as an arena of fear of force.

FAIR IS FAIR (equal vision of what is true and right); LIFE IS NOT FAIR (there is more than one way to skin a cat (sorry); ACCEPT THIS SINGLE WAY OR DIE.

Did I explain that ok?
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The Backlash Cometh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-29-11 07:52 AM
Response to Reply #3
9. So the key is to break this denial they're working under.
How do we get them to see themselves as others see them? Or, at least, let them understand that we're not fooled by this Love vs Respect explanation that they're providing?
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-29-11 07:37 AM
Response to Original message
4. It has its roots in religion.
We are to fear deities, not respect them. That's a transferable concept.
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woo me with science Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-29-11 07:41 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. Interesting point. Thanks. nt
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RKP5637 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-29-11 07:45 AM
Response to Reply #4
7. I think you hit the nail square on the head! n/t
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-29-11 07:52 AM
Response to Reply #7
8. I wasn't just referring to Christianity, either.
Almost all religions are built around a deity or deities that must be feared and catered to. It's just part of the way humans design religions in order to control societies. Whether it's sacrificing virgins to the volcano god to appease it or tithing to the church, it's all the same thing. If you don't, the deity's gonna getcha for that.
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The Backlash Cometh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-29-11 07:55 AM
Response to Reply #8
12. Religion is the opiate of the people?
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-29-11 08:11 AM
Response to Reply #12
13. No, not at all. Religion is an invention of the people.
It has always served as a control mechanism for society. Rather than threaten earthly punishment for behavior, threatening punishment by an all-powerful deity is a lot scarier. It works very well. Please note that I am referring only to deity-based religions. Buddhism is an odd duck in the mix, at least in most sects of Buddhism.

If you can find a religion without an angry, vengeful deity, let me know.
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RKP5637 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-29-11 08:19 AM
Response to Reply #8
17. Yep!!! n/t
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The Backlash Cometh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-29-11 07:53 AM
Response to Reply #4
11. But we must worship only one God?
Are they acting as the anti-Christ, then?
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-29-11 08:14 AM
Response to Reply #11
15. No, not at all. Many religions have multiple deities.
Edited on Wed Jun-29-11 08:16 AM by MineralMan
In Judaism, Islam, and Christianity, there's just one, but it's one with many faces. The Punisher is one of the primary faces. In polytheistic religions, sometimes there are vengeful, punishing deities that coexist with more benevolent ones. Having just one deity is a lot simpler to manage, though. It was a great innovation. Religion is not just limited to Christianity, you know. There are many, many religions, both contemporary and historical. Christianity is a minority religion, on a worldwide basis. When I use the word "religion," I'm talking about the entire spectrum, not just the dominant religion of the United States.
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CrispyQ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-29-11 09:34 AM
Response to Reply #4
22. That's what I was taught in Sunday school . . .
that respect for God meant fear of God.

I remember thinking my seven year old version of WTF? Why would anyone want to be involved in a relationship like that? Turns out, that thought stuck.
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OneGrassRoot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-29-11 09:39 AM
Response to Reply #4
23. Absolutely, which is why I said those who try to invoke fear are themselves afraid...
Afraid of the Unknown and Unseen.

Not all religious people are like this, of course, but fear is often at the heart of religion.

:hi:

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Sarah Ibarruri Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-29-11 07:43 AM
Response to Original message
6. It's the Repukes. The Repukes can't respect anyone they can't fear.
If the person threatens their livelihood, you'd almost bet Repukes will vote for that person.
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Mist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-29-11 07:52 AM
Response to Original message
10. Fear give the *appearance* of respect. Some people confuse appearance with reality. nt
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deacon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-29-11 08:12 AM
Response to Original message
14. Bush ruled using fear. Look where that got us. n/t
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RadiationTherapy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-29-11 08:18 AM
Response to Original message
16. One generates fear through force; one generates respect through character.
One is much easier to accomplish than the other.
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The Backlash Cometh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-29-11 09:19 AM
Response to Reply #16
20. Well put.
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AngryAmish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-29-11 08:20 AM
Response to Original message
18. Machiavelli
One of his most famous maxims is that is better to be feared than loved if you can't have both.

He has a point.
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The Backlash Cometh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-29-11 09:20 AM
Response to Reply #18
21. But fear is not the same thing as respect.
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Bluenorthwest Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-29-11 08:36 AM
Response to Original message
19. But his mother also said if you had to pick between gravy and pie
pick both. So grain of salt for Mama Christie.
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applegrove Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-29-11 09:15 PM
Response to Original message
24. Why do so many weaklings like Ayn Rand's books? Because they show
someone showing no mercy to others and it makes them feel apelike respect and adoration for the main characters. Afterall for a few millions years humans and apes have followed the 'strongman'. They still do in ghettos and banana republics around the world.
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