What would you have done differently?

If everyone hates the "cave" should we just followed the tea party off the cliff? Because no amount of bully pulpit or change in messaging would get them to budge. It became pretty clear they hate government more than anything in this world. And before you say just use the 14th, remember it's a completely untested maneuver that is legally questionable and that doesn't guarantee the market won't collapse while the courts sorted out the matter. I think too many of pro 14th crowd believes if it's invoked that it would be the end of the matter, but that's not the case the GOP certainly would've taken it to court. The uncertainty over the country's default status IMO wouldn't be much better than really defaulting. Also remember if the courts rule against you will have been found to be in default and if the market didn't collapse before it will afterward. So what do you do invoke the 14th, hope it staves off collapse and the courts rule in your favor? Or do take the certainty of the current, albeit crappy deal?

ticket. I mean get real. If you owed more than you were making what would happen? Some time what you want won't come easy. But hey, the only way is easy right? Let's not stop the wars and military spending and not start paying off our debt.

I just wanted be sure you understand the consquence the market isn't losing just a few hundred points we're probably talking thousands.

in either in the last minute or shortly after. This whole thing was about more trillion of dollars to pay for scam derivatives. They are still trying to pay for all of those. To foreign investors. That is what this is all about and why other countries are also defaulting. The MARKET got us into this crap. The same thing that happened before. Insanity: Doing the same thing over and over again expecting different results. F**k the markets. A terrible thing for the average Joe to invest in. Invest in land.

The 14th amendment route would have led to more drama than we already have.

They blinked.

Obama didn't take the bait.

SS and Medicare intact.

Default averted, and any agreements are frangible.

I'm pleased.

Now if we stay united we might get congress back and might end the Bush tax cuts and we might raise revenues.

K/R

Unity would go a long way toward improving what comes out of congress.

I'm ok with it too.

The roots of this "crisis" over raising the debt ceiling reach all the way back to January of 2009, at least, when the notion of bipartisanship seemingly was placed above all else.

majority of Democrats in all branches.

Some of the GOOD things regarding tonight's deal:

No default.

Debt Ceiling lifted till 2013.

Up front cuts to the Defense Budget.

Did not touch Social Security. Medicare and Medicaid are still intact!

The Bush tax cuts are being left untouched, meaning they WILL expire December 31, 2012!

There is NO Balanced Budget Amendment stipulation in the new agreement.

Regarding the 'trigger':
IF the committee's recommendations are not acted upon, the trigger mechanism's mandatory spending cuts will be cuts will be split 50/50 between domestic and defense spending, and will kick in January 2013.
Social Security and Medicare beneficiaries and "low-income programs" would be exempted from those cuts.
Note: Since the GOP will not want to see defense cuts then they will make sure that there is no chance the trigger will go off!

AND the teabaggers did NOT get all the things they wanted and they are very ticked off tonight :)

But, the worst proposed "cuts" so far are not a lot of risk to me if we do, in fact, improve SS/Medicare and give the economy a little breathing room. I think the proposals I've seen include protections (maybe some increases) for those at the lower end of the scales -- that's good. Of course, the final legislation has to be along those lines and implemented accordingly.

If the Republicans didn't like that, I would have gone to the American people and pointed out that I was trying to save SS and Medicare while they were trying to gut it. And I would never have used the term "entitlements" to describe them.

Two, I would have low balled the Republicans instead of starting from a position in the middle where they already liked half of the proposals offered. If they had said they wanted 5 things I would have offered them 1 to start. Obama started at 3. Every athlete in country is probably glad that Obama is not their agent.

Third, I would have invoked the 14th and taken my chances if it had come to that. Let the people know I'm being impeached for standing up for SS and Medicare. Clinton left office with over 70% approval rating after they tried to impeach him, and that was for a blowjob. I bet standing up firmly for SS and Medicare would have netted even more support for Obama than he's going to get for this deal.

Jump off the starting block on January 21st 2009. THE DAY AFTER INAUGURATION and the morning after all those nice inaugural balls.

I'd get in there with my resounding victory from the previous November's election, and run roughshod over EVERYONE with MY agenda and MY mandate that I just got from the voters. I'd be reminding everyone everywhere that elections DO have consequences. Um, how did YOUR side do last time, GOP? Okay, this joint is Under NEW Management, there's a NEW sheriff in town, and we're doing it MY way.

I'd be operating on the "you may not agree with me but you know where I stand" approach that served duhbya well enough in 2004 thankyouverymuch. And I'd have everybody on my staff who was capable - look over ALL the EXTREME presidential powers that bush used as often as he damn well pleased, and see how many of them I could take full advantage of to force MY agenda down the enemy's throats. The time to strike, and to kick 'em when they were down and keep them down while I was busy cleaning up their mess - was IMMEDIATELY. While the iron was hot, when the editing hadn't even been finished on all the inaugural soundbites for the news specials about it.

The time to strike, and to force some of this into place, was IMMEDIATELY. WHILE you're still in the afterglow of victory and you just got sworn in, and your historic win is still fresh in everybody's minds and still getting amazing press, and the enemy is left smarting and licking its wounds from coast-to-coast, and the GOP establishment in DC is still reeling from the hosing they just got, and they haven't yet had enough time to regroup and start trouble. And I'd apply EXTRA pressure to any ASSHOLE Blue Dog Dems who wanted to whimper and snivel and get in my way.

I'd operate under the "better to ask for forgiveness later than ask for permission now." STFU and MOVE the Fuck OVER. BOOM. It's DONE. Next? And I would fix as many things as I could, unilaterally, before anyone in town could fully realize what had happened. And by the time they did realize what had happened, it'd be too late. The deeds would all have been DONE.

I'd get as much done as quickly as possible so I'd have a shitload to brag about from my proverbial First 100 Days, not interested in agonizing it to death or talking it out again and again and again with people hell-bent on NOT helping me. Obama was WAY too naive and gave the enemy WAY too much time and patience and understanding. You DON'T DO THAT WITH THESE ASSHOLES!!!! You give them a big-ass kick in the teeth and then grind your track shoes into their necks on their way down. What you DON'T do with these assholes is give them time and room to regroup!!! Get the job done before they can even get up and realize what just hit 'em.

And I'd go for MORE than I really wanted and be really stinky and asshole-y and pig-headed as hell, so that if I eventually had to bargain with them, I'd be coming down to meet them in the middle from a FAR higher starting place. For example, health care debate? I'd stake my position at the top of the nose-bleed level of the issue - and insist on single-payer, and MAYBE be willing to bargain downward from THAT height. My objective would be to do everything in my extreme presidential powers to push the "middle" back toward the LEFT. The fucking "pendulum" just isn't swinging back as far as it should without help. And I would have recognized that fact and used every bit of my presidential power to help it along.

And I wouldn't have kidded myself about expecting the enemy to accept being vanquished and to play along and try to compromise with me. You do that and politically you're marked as a freakin' pigeon. I would have regarded the mitch mcconnell statements that the main objective would be to make sure I didn't get a second term - as an ACT OF WAR. And I would have characterized it as such in interviews and press conferences and speeches. I would have used EVERY opportunity available, at EVERY moment, to jam down their throats - "elections have consequences! The American people SPOKE in November 2008 (and they DIDN'T speak up for YOU)" - MY version of everything they've been shoving down OUR throats since November 2010. I would have gone at it MERCILESSLY and RELENTLESSLY, reminding people of that fact every time somebody stuck a mic in my face.

I would have denied Pox Noise a seat in the White House Press Corps because I would have stated that those seats are precious and few, and really need to go to bona fide News operations rather than slanted propaganda outfits. I would have given that seat to HuffPo or somebody else back then. I would have put the entire force of my presidency behind REREGULATING broadcasting and restoring the ownership restrictions - because one solid way to ruin your enemy's day is to disrupt their lines of communication.

I would take charge unilaterally as often and as forcefully as I could. I'd order an immediate resurrection of the WPA-type jobs programs from coast-to-coast, to get JOBS back to people.

AND: I would also be reminding everyone ESPECIALLY including my adversaries that "uh, guys, we're STILL AT WAR, okay? Like it or not, I'm a WAR PRESIDENT TOO, and any efforts to beat me back or defeat me on the issues I think are critically important to get us out of the bUSH Recession (and that's what I'd call it - being as in-yer-face as possible to the bad guys) and this bUSH unemployment crisis - I will regard as damn near TREASONOUS to try to interfere with the Commander-in-Chief at a Time of War."

EVERY talking point that the bushies/cheneys used to force their will on people - I would use, for myself. After all, the conditions would be (and certainly were) the same. We were at war then. We still had Iraq and Afghanistan both raging away and flushing billions every week down the toilet' party of that FACT (as unfortunately we still are, and do). I would manage the talking points such that this was Topic A - and its corollary would be that throwing roadblocks up in front of the COMMANDER-IN-CHIEF AT A TIME OF WAR would be tantamount to frickin' TREASON.

AND, I would make an issue of the fact that we are called the Democratic Party. NOT the Democrat Party. It's NOT the Democrat bill or the Democrat Congress. The proper term, and I would issue a directive to ALL reporters wanting White House Press credentials that THIS is the proper way to refer to the President's political party, allies, and legislative activities. And NO ALTERNATIVES will be tolerated.

I think you have to come at them from a position of strength, or at least perceived strength. Obama had that going in, and with all the electoral numbers and approval numbers WAY HIGH in his favor. And I think he squandered it all, trying to be nice and conciliatory and "can't we all just get along-ish." And a president should NOT act that way when there's this much to fix and clean up and this much of an oppositional machine against you. No. You don't ask - "can't we all just get along?" Not after an historic victory like Barack Obama's! No. You don't ask. You TELL. You TELL them how it's gonna be. PERIOD. And it's THEIR job to try to figure out how to get along with YOU, and compromise with YOU, and meet YOU halfway - at the halfway point YOU - not they - designate.

I would show the opposition NO MERCY WHATSOEVER. And I'd use my presidential bully pulpit whenever I could.

Then I would have sat back and enjoyed watching their heads spin. And I'd task everyone on my staff with the responsibility of KEEPING those heads spinning, on the defensive, and OFF their game.

If it's good enough for bush/cheney/rove, it would be good enough for ME as president, only it'd be applied toward doing good for the have nots as opposed to further advantaging the haves. That whole outrage about "we determine our own reality. And we will act based on that. And you'll react to OUR reality - and while you're reacting and trying to figure out what we've done, we will act again. And you'll be left to study what we do." That whole crap. I'd turn it around so it advantaged ME and MY agenda for America. And I would take calimary's advice, and keep everyone on my staff focused full-time on whatever it takes to DESTABILIZE The Enemy and KEEP him/her that way.

Aw crap - sorry this is so long...

One point of disagreement, though:

I don't think he had to mimic Bush/Cheney to accomplish what you've described in your post.

I think he had some powerful truths and plain facts on his side (not to mention an urgent, unfolding economic crisis).

He just had to get bold. Instead he put "bipartisanship" above all else, not realizing he was putting the cart before the horse.

As someone who had supported Obama because, basically, he was rumored to have been a community organizer, and he wasn't Hilary, this seemed like the obvious safe tack I expected any mainstream Democrat, not just Obama, to have taken at that point in time.

It was already accepted by the public that the president would use those powers, and with that decisiveness. I think that's what a lot of people hoped for - there was nothing difficult or complicated about what needed to be done, it just took someone who cared to do it.