Vote for Gore, or die.

I posted what follows at the bottom of this post almost four years ago originally. The sarcasm and unbelief with which it was met were expected. But the enhanced effects of climate change and Obama acting like Neville Chamberlain may cause some to re-consider. I re-post it now in the hope that it is not too late for us collectively to save civilization from the doom toward which we are surely accelerating.

I feel that my original post has now been vindicated by history. Obama sold out the planet at Copenhagen in 2009, wasting perhaps our last chance to survive. This post is dedicated to the millions of climate change refugees in Africa, where rising temperatures have resulted in the evaporation of Africa's major lakes, thereby causing famine, civil war and incalculable human suffering. It is also dedicated to those living near sea level, in Alaska, the South Pacific and elsewhere, people who have lost their homes and their way of life due to rising ocean levels. It is dedicated to Americans in the west made homeless by increasingly strong wildfires, to Iowans and Minnesotans subjected to incredible floods, to Alabamans who lately have been subjected to powerful tornadoes, to those on the Atlantic seaboard who can no longer afford the rising cost of hurricane insurance and finally to those New Orleans refugees who have not found a way home, canaries all in this coal mine we once called Mother Earth.

Even on a website that purports to offer an alternative to Obama, even there you must write in Gore's name. Such is the state of so-called progressive thinking. I and others have tried unsuccessfully to get his name added to the list. Anyway, here is the website: StopHoping.org
I urge you to go there and write in his name.

Posted by Admiral Loinpresser in General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010)
Tue Oct 30th 2007, 01:57 AM
In one Sopranos episode, Carmella seeks out the advice of a psychiatrist because of her internal conflicts in enjoying a Mafia-funded lifestyle. The psychiatrist informs her that he will not accept her money and that she is morally tainted by association.

"You are on a morally fatal path," he tells her, or words to that effect. He concludes by advising her to take her children and flee without any money or tainted assets. "You can't say that you haven't been told," he concludes.

We, also, are on a fatal path. This is what the scientists are telling us. We have years, not decades to act, or we will soon find that it is too late. When the arctic icecap completely melts, when the Greenland and Antarctic ice shelves inject global proportions of freshwater into the oceans, it will be way too late. Those phenomena are rapidly moving to a point of no return. The nations of the world must come together and go on a war-footing to combat climate change or civilization will collapse and billions will die.

If you do not agree with this, I urge you to study the public pronouncements of Dr. James Hansen and others who are finally casting aside the naturally conservative inhibitions of physical scientists, to tell us the urgent and inconvenient truth. Study how the models are being constantly revised with more dire predictions and acceleratingly negative data of actual, dynamic conditions.

There are those who will say the title is hyperbole. I respond that they are not well informed with the current state of climatological science. Climate change has caused more death and destruction already than Islamic terrorism in the United States. We now have more refugees than at any time since the civil war, and it is due to climate change. Yet our declared candidates (other than Kucinich) continue to fiddle while America burns. They are simply not acceptable as leaders and their record of lies, inexperience and lack of commitment makes them unsuitable for trust in our hour of greatest need.

Humanity faces its greatest threat in history. Without Al Gore providing the necessary world leadership, laws and treaties to engage in full scale war against climate change, we stand little chance of survival. Vote for Al Gore, or die. You can't say you haven't been told.

:eyes: :crazy:

"Climate change has caused more death and destruction already than Islamic terrorism in the United States. We now have more refugees than at any time since the civil war, and it is due to climate change. Yet our declared candidates (other than Kucinich) continue to fiddle while America burns. They are simply not acceptable as leaders and their record of lies, inexperience and lack of commitment makes them unsuitable for trust in our hour of greatest need." - Chicken Little :shrug:

Wilson and FDR became world leaders because there was a great need. Our need for real leadership has never been greater.

do you know anything about climate change? Or is your sarcasm born of ignorance? I know which way I'm betting.

and wishful thinking. Good luck with your rhetoric.

I have been taught that the solution to a complex problem involves action. Who has provided action on this issue? I double-dare you to say "Obama."

Whether the human race will survive or not is a toss-up, but the odds aren't looking good.

Are you going to be the first in your neighborhood to stop contributing to the destruction of the planet by growing all your own food by hand, walking everywhere you go, and buying nothing produced by the polluting corporations? Of course not. Nobody wants to give up their modern creature comforts, (especially not their computer or Internet access) so since those comforts are not sustainable Mother Nature will eventually rip them from our cold, dead hands, whether we like it or not.

But there still may be a great deal of mitigation which can be undertaken. Individual action is great, but we must have systemic action. I don't think giving up is the right approach.

I don't think expecting enough others to join is is realistic. It's never happened, and it probably never will. I'm sure when the last tree was cut down on Easter Island it was not a case of anyone wondering what would happened after that last tree was cut. The only thing that probably mattered to them was WHO got to cut down that last tree. They probably fought over the rights to that last tree, beating each other off with sticks in order to be the winner that got to cut it down.

And right now corporations are spending millions on campaigns to insure that nothing done about global climate change. They are not fighting to save the planet, they are fighting for the right to be the one who sells the ax when the last tree is ready to be chopped down.

Will we be sheep who accept this BS or try to do something real about it? History and current events are replete with collective action against the ruling class taking us down the wrong path.

That tells the story pretty well as to why enough people just don't get it.

Very educational. I'd never seen Ross Gelbspan speak. He's been one of my heroes for a long time. Thanks for that.

But he has stepped up to do the right thing when it counted most and I can't think of another major American politician still living for which that is true. He simply exceeds them all.

BTW, characterizing his position on NAFTA as right wing is hyperbole.

"But he has stepped up to do the right thing when it counted most..."

I'm not sure what that's supposed to mean, but we haven't seen much of Al around Michigan, lately. It "counted" to us, too. :hi:

"BTW, characterizing his position on NAFTA as right wing is hyperbole."

Nonsense. Gore's position on NAFTA is the same as George H.W. and George W. Bush. Sorry for the "inconvenient truth". :silly:

by your definition are right-wingers, correct? And many, many more.

What I meant about Gore stepping up was his courageous action in producing the Kyoto Accord on climate change in 1997. It was the last time America led the world on this vital issue.

How would you characterize climate change?

political categories. So yes, to the extent that they embraced RW economics, all the DLCers you mentioned were, again by -SELF- definition, hewing to a "Third Way" which indeed very self-consciously embraced rightwing "Chicago School" ("trickle down") economics.

"How would you characterize climate change?"

I would characterize it as as large a priority for me as the economic wellbeing of the Rust Belt is to Al. Sorry. :shrug:

over a decade ago. And plenty of Dems who are not DLC supported Nafta at the time. Trickle down has nothing to do with Gore's economic philosophy.

And there is no hope for Michigan until 1) we have real health care reform, so that the cost of health care is removed from the price tag of American automobiles (about 24% currently); and 2) we have a real commitment to electric cars. Gore is in favor of both those things.

Perhaps you can offer a better candidate?

BTW, if you have kids, I recommend a little research on climate change.

:shrug:

My point is that big money and the major political parties do not give us any reasonable candidates. Until the people start picking the candidate we will keep heading for diaster. The website I linked to is supposed to be a way that people can attempt to pick their own candidate. As long as we keep supporting these scumbags offered up by big money, the political process is futile.

If 100,000 people voted for Gore online, I believe it would start a groundswell which would end with Gore accepting the nomination. Then we would have a real Democrat running against Perry or Romney or whoever. Gore is much more aligned with a majority of the people than anybody who wants to run right now. He could win the general. Obama might well lose to one of those creeps. Even if Obama, all we'll get is more Repulican-lite BS.

But you think that we can FORCE him (Al Gore) to run.

ok.

I don't think he can be forced to seek the nomination. But if he were nominated, I believe he would accept it and run vigorously in the general.

How and why would he refuse? It would be like 1968, where a sitting president had to step aside and let somebody else run.

The idea is that in the 21st century we no longer have to act like sheep and passively accept a menu of candidates determined by big money. I don't think that method is working so well. In fact, I think it's destroying the planet, not to mention screwing the American people economically.

do you think of it like this ...

"I was a college Freshman, and I was alone on a Friday night. I'm an A student, and so I was not too surprised when 2 beautiful cheerleaders knocked on my dorm room door and asked if I could tutor them. Little did I know that they were about to tutor this virgin on the most powerful sexual techniques you can imagine."

Gore is not running. Your fantasy is just that, a fantasy.

Enjoy it.

But, like the 2 cheerleaders ... its NOT GOING TO HAPPEN.

My *fantasy* is to have a Democrat in the White House.

My *belief* is that Gore has no intention of seeking the nomination, but that if tens of thousands indicated their desire for him to be president, something good would happen and we might end up with a Democrat running in 2012. You know, that party that invented and has always protected social security and does the right thing on climate change.

...but we can support his efforts and help him get the word out. In a sense he may be in a position to be even more effective without being hampered by the restraints of political office, with the entire Rethug party against him on anything he may want to do and say. As a private citizen, one with major name recognition, he can take more decisive action. I might modify your title a little to say, "Support Al Gore (and everyone working alongside him) or die." I don't think that's hyperbole at all.

As to where he can be most effective, that is certainly a reasonable debate. Doing the movie was a major contribution, as was the Nobel prize. But we now have our first Democratic president who acts like a Republican regarding climate change (and many other issues). Obama sold us out at Copenhagen in 2009, while Gore delivered in Kyoto in 1997. That (Kyoto)was the most significant thing any human being has ever done on climate change, as far as I know. Gore has demonstrated he would have done the right thing at Copenhagen. So until someone comes up with a candidate who won't just promise before the election to do the right thing (as Obama did in 2008), I believe the best place for Gore is the White House. There are a few others of comparable stature I would trust: Jerry Brown, Kucinich, Dean and maybe Kerry. If you can get one of them to run, I'm good with that. But in the mean time the climate betrayal and lies are rising almost as fast as CO2 concentrations.

And thanks for the courtesy of your response.

everything you have stated is correct. I am not sure Gore wants to lead the government tho. I am still hoping that Obama will turn this around... but there could certainly be more spine involved in his climate concerns.

There is not a day that goes by tho that I don't fear what will come of us in 5 or 10 years with all this inaction. I am meeting with my new congressman for 15 minutes next week. I hope to persuade him that climate change isn't about sun spots. I will keep it polite and will provide him with a couple pages of facts to peruse. I will ask him to be courageous and think of his family if not his faith. He's a far right republican of the tea party variety but he is polite so at least I have that going for me.

Say hello to your lovely wife! Last I remember you all were moving to the mid-Atlantic area. Hope you are all well. :hi:

Lori yelled a big hello when I showed her your post. We did the east coast thing and now are back home in the midwest and happy.

Good luck with your congressman. Ask him to serve coffee. ;-)

as a token of peace. Welcome back to the great fly-over!

Gawd what dumbness.

So the 2009 agreement was that bad, huh? Do you hope you are right?

I really appreciate a thoughtful rejoinder.

The Copenhagen agreement was planetary treason and grounds for impeachment in my view. It did nothing about climate change. The African delegation walked out in protest.

Do I hope I am right? Of course not. But I am able to believe in conclusions resulting from scientific consensus, even when the implications are disturbing. Hell, yeah. How about you?

then we won't be the first species to become extinct, even if we had a hand in it.

Al Gore, won't be able to stop the changes at this point.

Finally, whether one votes for Al Gore or not, one is going to die. It is supported by overwhelming statistics.