I may have saved a life today

I don't know, it may only be a temporary lift but sometimes what a person really needs is to know they're not alone.

There's a guy who comes in my place of work - he's a rep for another company we do business with. I've only met him a handful of times. He came in fairly regularly for a few weeks then seemed to drop off the face of the earth. Came in with his boss about a month ago looking worn down. I was concerned - I knew he was a vet - but wasn't able to really talk to him.

Then today he came in. I was just going on my lunch break and stopped to talk. He said his boss had told him to come in and make sure I took care of a particular issue, "...that I don't even give a shit about. Sorry I haven't been in much. I've mostly been sitting in my car contemplating suicide." He threw it out there like it was a normal part of conversation but he looked like hell. Hollow eyes, downcast, staring at the floor. Monotone voice. One leg shaking uncontrollably. Every now and then he'd reach down and physically stop it. Within minutes, it started up again.

I said, "Hey, you need to take care of yourself," and the floodgates opened. He began to talk, telling about how tough it's been since he got back from Iraq. How he'd started having nightmares when he was there, and drinking heavy, and behaving irrationally. And how he just kept getting sent back out.

How his wife left him while he was overseas, and he ended up with a dishonorable discharge because he got a DUI. He'd served 4 years and 10 months of a 5 year enlistment but because of that, he lost his GI Bill benefits. How his bosses make lip service to supporting him while he gets help for his PTSD from the VA but at the same time ride him mercilessly about stupid piddly crap like the errand he got sent on to me.

I walked him outside and let him vent for a good half hour. He finally told me, "I don't know why I'm talking about this," and I said, "Because you need to." Then I told him, "I understand. I spent a week in a nuthouse myself not that many years ago, for the same thing." Which I did. PTSD. Not combat related but whether or not I can relate to his triggers, I can sure relate to his feelings.

The look of hope and dawning realization that came over his face was painful to see. He told me he's been walking around looking at people thinking about how they're all normal and he's the only person who can't hack it, who's messed up. And I SO relate to that because that feeling of being alone and isolated is just awful. The feeling that no one else understands. I told him, "Hey, you are NOT alone."

So then we talked a lot about our experiences, about meds, about what helped me and what didn't. His therapist wanted him to try a mood stabilizer and he was leery - I told him I'd taken one and it had helped me. I let him know there can be a light at the end of the tunnel. And I gave him my email address and phone number and told him if he needs someone to talk to, I'm happy to be there.

He had a smile on his face when he left, and his leg had stopped shaking. I hope he stays in touch, and I hope he keeps going to the VA, and I hope to hell he makes it. But I can't help thinking about all the other kids - because so many of them are just kids - who are out there suffering the same shit. What the hell are we doing to our kids? Everyone pays lip service to this idea of "support the troops" but what does that mean? They don't need a bullshit ribbon on an SUV, they need someone to notice they're having trouble before it becomes full-blown PTSD and they're walking around with empty eyes and no hope.

thing is you took the time to LISTEN.

I hope he's okay.

How many people would have reached out like you did.

It makes what you went through yourself make more sense, doesn't it?

Good on ya.

I've never hidden any of that, or felt any shame or shyness about sharing it because I know how isolating it is to feel that way. I'm grateful as hell to be walking the earth and feeling good about it. And in a weird way I'm grateful to have had the experience because it sure makes you see your fellow human beings in a new and compassionate light.

Thanks.

for reaching out to him like that. I feel terrible about him losing his benefits. Is there any way they can be reinstated? Could a lawyer help him or a JAG? Sorry -- very ignorant about military matters.

I also had an incident way in the past in which I know I helped someone in the moment, and then I always wondered if she was OK long term. At least you know that you gave him some comfort now, and hopefully that was enough to lead him to get help and keep on keeping on.

Hope your friend is feeling better. Glad you are there for him.

Be ahead of the parting if it doesn't get better for him.

If you know what I'm saying.

Important post. K&R

for being you... Heart of gold...

PTSD is tragic.
I lived the horrors with my husband. Vietnam.
I couldn't save him. Things were different back then.
PTSD wasn't an issue.

Keep that smile in your thoughts.

Yes, you may have saved a life today.
Beautiful and inspiring post.
Thank you.


peace~

Sounds like an awesome organization. I'm sorry for your husband's suffering - and yours. PTSD sucks. :hug:

Thank you for checking the link...and for your kind words.:hug:
Life goes on....
It was so very long ago....

Hopefully this young vet will see the light...
Because you took the time.
You made my night.:hug:

peace~

+100. glad you were there for him.

but he needs more than just one hour to talk to an empathic soul. Next time try to find out if he has called the suicide line at the VA.

Also the VA should be able to help him vis a vis his place of employment, as PTSD is a real disability and no joking matter.

You did exactly what you needed to do, which is shut up and LISTEN. GOOD JOB.

I bet you did save someone today.
The most important thing is that you really connected with him with your own experience.
I hope he pursues help and he gets quality help.

That is really messed up that he has lost his benefits. A few of our local politicians have DUIs on their records - ones they got while in office. They did not suffer any loss of benefits or pay.

In my worst bouts that has always been one of my symptoms, I keep bouncing my foot or my leg.

What worked for me was lithium aspartate at 10mg/day. I am 60% better because of it. I don't think I've had a severe episode in the last 3 months because of it.

It was the leg shaking in particular that got me - it was like looking in a mirror at myself 14 years ago. It was like that darn leg had a mind of its own. I do okay now - was off meds entirely for quite a few years. A series of reverses brought back some old familiar - and unwelcome - feelings so I went to the doc and am taking an anti-anxiety med that keeps me stable. I'm not averse to getting help when I need it, that's for sure.

Glad it's helping you.

So true.

PB

can indeed help to turn a life around. You gave this dear man a precious gift and I wish the best for him. Thank you!

:hug: That is so wonderful that he found you right then and was able to let it out, and most of all that you were able to identify with his feelings in such a deep way. I was in that dark place .... it's been almost 40 years now. It was a guy named Rob from Massachusetts that talked to me. He saved my life.

:thumbsup:

+1

:hug:

kind people like you. thank you for sharing this, skygazer.

What an inspiration you are!

I've read that 20% of our returning veterans have PTSD, so the situation you describe is more common than we realize. You did a good thing today, you can be justifiably proud.

A few months back, a local active duty Army fellow decided not to go on his 2nd tour. He got drunk and walked down the center of the road. That was all it took for him not to return to Iraq.

and sometimes it is because of folks like you, skygazer.

Sonoman

And I mean that.

Gotta love anti depressant boxes with their might cause suicide. WTF? I'm on Lexapro. free samples version. although ick Wellmark has a $6 alternative. so might as about that. It's a major pain to go across town to get the pills. (eek got punchy on the go button. cold in my room 54? no? although a friend has her's set at 55. I can't imagine how cold my room would be then.

anyway. I've always thought it best to talk things out. I've talked about my mental probs outloud. To others. It helps me and helps others understand.

Originally was OCD, then ADD at some point they figured out it was likely Panic Disorder that was causing the OCD. Then I Lost my job in 2008 and have severe clinical depression. Which kinda go's bye bye for a large chunk of the day after I take my Ritalin which I'm now typing with. Which is why I don't entirely sound too gloom at the moment.

:hug:

>>>But I can't help thinking about all the other kids - because so many of them are just kids - who are out there suffering the same shit. What the hell are we doing to our kids? Everyone pays lip service to this idea of "support the troops" but what does that mean? They don't need a bullshit ribbon on an SUV, they need someone to notice they're having trouble before it becomes full-blown PTSD and they're walking around with empty eyes and no hope. >>>>

cases on the OTHER side that will never be diagnosed and that we will never even notice.

They're every bit as much collateral damage of this demented, evil war.

Thank you for opening your heart, and allowing him to do the same.

:grouphug:

You've done a great service for this man, your community and vets.

Few people understand the spiral of PTSD, and even fewer truly care. A BCD for a DUI can be overturned and made a General Discharge by an appeal. Not sure of the time frame though, I think it's changed from the time of the BCD. That gives me something to look into. I do know that for a BCD he would have had to have faced a General Court Martial, a DUI doesn't seem to me to be a reason for a GCM.

He might have been discharged under, conduct other than honorable, and a lot of people confuse the two. In any case, he can appeal to have it up graded to a General Discharge under honorable conditions, they would have had to look at his entire military history and found something other than a a DUI for a BCD to come out of it. With over 4 years in, I find it highly improbable he received a GCM for this, but if he had a DUI, and is drinking heavily now, he needs to address that as well. The VA can help there as well.

Any Vet organization can help him with this, and if he's receiving VA health care, I doubt it's a BCD, but possibly under "other than honorable".

Just a little info, but it may help.

Thaks again for being there for this guy...I wish more people were concerned about our vets.

:patriot:

It was "conduct other than honorable" - I couldn't remember his phrasing and since I am not military, have no knowledge of the ins and outs. But reading that made me realize that's what he said. I will relay that info - I know he very much wants to go to school and he is an intelligent guy who should.

Since it was a General Discharge for Other Than Honorable Conditions, he should be able to go to school under the GI Bill that was passed, particularly if he served in a combat zone; judging from what you've said up top, I don't think it would be difficult, for an upgrade to General under Honorable Conditions. It's far more difficult if there was a General Court Martial, but this appears to have been an administrative decision by a commander of his, (even a Special Court Martial is relatively easy to upgrade, as it applies to non-felony conditions in most cases). In any case, it would be on his DD-214.

I'd like to see him address the alcohol situation though, that is a personal choice, he has to want to quit, and that can be difficult. I got a DUI in 1983 and it changed me dramatically. I had to sit in a cell for a day, and I tallied up the pros/cons I had a lot of cons, but could not come up with one pro. I figured, why spend any more money on this and a potential for ever getting behind the wheel again while under the influence and perhaps injuring or killing someone?

In this man's case, if he is being treated for PTSD and if he's taking any meds, there can be terrible consequences if he mixes the two. Like I said though, it will have to be his decision. I don't want to see anyone getting hurt, not this guy, you or anyone else.

Wish I could be there to help, thanks again for helping this vet out!

BCD. There must have been something else in his history, or the DUI was connected to a much more serious charge he is not talking about.

for a great human being :grouphug:

I saw my husband shut down in how much he would say about being in Iraq just after the first time mentioning it to someone. He was looking for understanding but the person looked at him with nothing on his face like he cared and didn't respond. (I know it's hard to know what to say in these cases, but a little something would have been nice for him I think). Anyway, I haven't seen him say anything to anyone else but me since then. And if he didn't have me, he might be exactly in the same place as this guy. You can only go so long keeping that kind of mess inside you.

So thank you, it must be something about you that helped him finally speak. Wish I could hug you.

Thanks for providing him with that connection.

:thumbsup:

You DID help him. If more people showed this level of empathy instead of trying out how to get ahead and fuck over anyone who gets in the way...we would all be in a better place.

As hard as it is at times to help, it is also difficult to be helped, and you and this man both did the right things. How brave of him to say a word, and I think somehow he knew you were the right person.
And you were. Good for you, and good for him. In my heathen meditations, both of you.

The world needs more people like you. :hug:

And PTSD is one of the things that are proof that war isn't natural to humanity. If it were natural soldiers returning from wars would be the most well adjusted people on the planet and the victims of war would be happy.

Can you contact your Congressperson or one of your Senators about getting this guy back his benefits? I think Barbara Boxer might be of help, as might Diane Feinstein.

means everything to a person who feels as if they are alone. Your compassion saved his life and sharing what you did may help save many lives. Good work.

Having a family member with PTSD I know how important it is to just listen.

Thank you for reaching out to your brother, from a former navycorpsman of 18 years you help him start to feel like a human again.
You gave support by letting him talk to you, he needs help you gave him what he needed, your time,your experience and your willingness
to stay in contact. You did more than a good thing, you did a human thing.

I left the Army as a Medical Platoon Sgt....:patriot:

about sending people into combat and horrible about taking care of them when they come back.

Congratulations for noticing his distress. Most people don't--or think it's none of their business.

When I lived on long Island in NY, the soldiers returning with TR from Spanish American War were left in Greenport with no way to get back to their homes. They stayed a few months, some drifting off, some settling down on the Island; most had to wait for TR to get the funding to get them home. By the end of WI, with the flu epidemic at full swing, the VA was set up to help the countless veterans that came back with horrific wounds and see them through the epidemic. After WWII, once again the VA got going, but it wasn't until after VN and Gulf WarI until things started to really shape up. The VA refused many a vet that suffered Agent Orange for years, many of them dying all in cost cutting measures. Amazing how the war profiteers are the first ones to squeal about taxation, so that funding is limited...all the while, they made tens to hundreds of millions, often billions of dollars while not ever once seeing a combat zone or theater.

Taking care of those who have been in the service of this nation should be a very high priority, but once the danger is gone, far too often, the vet has been left to his/her own devices...:(

At least that is changing, I get excellent care from the VA.

Oh, you definitely saved a life. Thank you for caring about a fellow human being, and for acting when you saw a need. So many people just look the other way.

I think it's especially profound that he opened up to you, and that you were able to share personal experience with him. I'll bet that meant the most to him - that he could talk to someone who had experienced some of the same things that he was having to deal with.

Glad to have you as a fellow DU'er. Makes me proud of us all.

thanks for being kind enough to take the time to talk to this person. It sounds as if he's fallen into the Slough of Despond. There are so many people in this country (and the world) who have been harmed in innumerable ways by wars and economic disparity. None of which is there fault. I am becoming so disgusted with this country I am thinking of becoming an ex-pat. It's good people like you that make a difference in one person's life. And, what about all the others?

When I was in home health care I requested and almost always got veterans to take care of. They all need to vent to someone who cares and can understand what happens on a battlefield. Even if they weren't under fire themselves. I wasn't in the military but am from a military family so I did have a better understanding.

As the son, nephew and brother of Veterans I thank you.

Michael

:thumbsup: :yourock:

And thanks for asking to take care of a vet...:patriot:

I think it is great that you took the time and gave him some support and hope. I'm glad you gave him your e-mail and phone number so that he knows he has somewhere to turn. And I hope- along with you -that he keeps going to the VA and he gets the help he needs.

these acts of kindness and caring make big differences.

may your example be one for us all.

:hug:

Hopefully, you inspired him to try to get more help.

It gives us hope when we hear about those who care about our brothers and sisters and take the extra step when it is needed.

Perhaps the critters at his Congresspersons' offices can help. They do stuff like that.

I saw buddies of my dad's from Korea. I knew then that they were suffering because of their service to our country. We all need to step up and be kind to them. And we need to stop having these stupid wars for no reason. It is a waste of our people.

signed up. I suffered for decades before allowed myself to be helped.

Sometimes having someone to listen is all one needs. Thanks.

Sometimes I'm amazed that I'm still alive. The worst thing is what it inflicted on my children. I'm so glad you got help and that we're both still around.

I'm sure you did save his life. You have a good heart.






k&r -because we need more kindness and love

I'm sorry the person couldn't have waited 24 hours. It seems 24 hours makes all the difference and this fellow was very lucky you were part of his 24 hours.

Wasn't that program terminated decades ago?

did save this man... I do hope he keeps in touch with you. Thank you for what you did for him.....

help they need. I am a person who likes to help people like that. BUT there is a causion we all need to remember and that is not to take on their problems as they are yours. I know that happened to me and he took over my life practically and my husband's boss called me in his office to help me. He was an Army Chaplain and he told me as long as you take on their problem they aren't going to solve them. I thought about that and he was right. I finally told this girl that she had to solve her problems herself and that I had my own family. You see allot of her problems were self induced. Well we ended up getting transferred and I went home to help my sister and my husband went overseas. Our mother had died and I needed to be with my sister. I ended up working on post and low and behold I found out this same girl was getting sent to the same army post. I told my sister to watch out for her because she is the type that takes advantage of the help they do provide families. Sure enough she showed up begging for help. I told my sister to stay away from her. I was shopping on post and saw her and she told me she was going to a counselor and he asked her did she have anyone here and she mentioned me. Well that was it and I told her that I couldn't help her because I had my own problems now and trying to get things squared away with my mother's estate and my sister was having her problems and I was there to help her through with her problems. I never heard from her again. Her family was one screwed up mess. But it all came from her own stupidity.

he was 2 months short of a 5 yr enlistment and got a dishonorable discharge for a DUI and lost his GI Bill benefits?? there wasn't a lesser punishment they could have given him? how convenient that it will save the government some money :sarcasm: .

http://www.digitaljournal.com/article/291022

"The military has been accused of falsely diagnosing -- and in at least one case using sleep deprivation -- some vets injured during their tours in Iraq and Afghanistan with personality disorder to keep from paying billions of dollars in medical costs.

The diagnosis of personality disorder (PD) has been falsely -- apparently somewhat regularly -- used to discharge veterans injured during their tours of duty to keep the military from having to pay billions of dollars in medical claims. Apparently, using more than half of all U.S. taxpayer dollars to fund the never-ending occupations of Iraq and Afghanistan by the military, which spends more than $700 billion per year, isn't enough. "



Advocates see trouble for misdiagnosed soldiers

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory?id=11404572

him. We're a cruel society most of the time.

Hey, if he emails you, send him this link:

http://www.wondereveryday.com/twn.html

and tell him to watch the 'preview.'

I felt so much better after seeing this....I'm always saying, 'Leave me alone,' to people who want 'normal.'

You saved a life, you showed us all how beautiful life can be, and you gave us an example of how not to sit idly by and live with regrets. :hug:

just when you were supposed to be. And you stepped up. :hug: I am so proud of you.

- until they come home fucked up from the war that I supported like a cheerleader on crank -

:)

If more people would take the time to do what you did for him, to just lend an ear, imagine what a better world we would be living in. Big kudos to you for such a selfless, caring act. :)

That just really gets me - this poor dude served all but TWO MONTHS of a five-year enlistment and he's bounced? And no benefits? And a Dishonorable Discharge? Shit. That hangs an anvil around his neck for life. And after he put in the time!

You did sacred work today, skygazer. I bet you burned off all your Purgatory time.

:yourock: :patriot: :thumbsup: :hug:

:bounce:

Our son began a nose-dive into self-destruction, trying to self-medicate, just spent 4 years in prison for non-violent drug offenses...I thank you so much for reaching out to this young man, being there for him. The ripples after a suicide go on and on.

It's amazing how some sympathy, empathy and advice from someone who's been there can change a life. Maybe even save a life. It's horrible how we send these kids off to fight in senseless wars, give plenty of lip service and little else to "supporting the troops," then ignore them when they need help for what they go through in their service to our country. Thank you for sharing your story with this veteran, and with us.

I do hope he keeps in touch with you and that his life gets better.


Poor guy..Sounds like the army really screwed him over.

Personally did 8 years in the army and two tours, 1 in Iraq and 1 in Afghan.. I relate a lot to the person in question.. Now I wouldn't go so far as to say that the army screwed up my life, on the contrary it helped me in some ways (made me more focus and kept me from committing serious offenses). I personally saw many of my buddies lives ruined, some like the person in question got chaptered out shortly before they were about to finish their contract.. It took me a number of years after leaving the army to become a well adjusted adult, I considered suicide a couple of times, but the worst of my problems seemed to stem from my temper, on a couple of occasions I came really close to strangling a couple of people to death with my bare hands, something I would have lived to regret for the rest of my life. I would break into outburst and couldn't control my actions.. Afterwards I would look back on my behavior and become even more depressed because I knew I didn't really want to hurt anyone, by true nature I am a pacifist, and would rather just live and let live. In truth I joined the army only because I was a poor minority with few prospects out of high school. My saving grace was meeting my wife, she helped me to adjust to civilian life, and taught me the meaning of unconditional love. Right now I am a teacher (believe it or not), and just want to live the rest of my life helping to build society in the best capacity possible..

For those who can't relate, I think the last few lines of platoon for me summarizes the best and worst the military, and in particular combat, can produce in an otherwise benevolent soul:

"The war is over for me now, but it will always be there for the rest of my days, as I am sure that Elias will be, fighting with Barnes for what Rhar called, possession of my soul. There are times since I have felt like the child born of these two fathers."

You've been on a quite a journey...So glad you've found love and light on it.

Welcome to DU....Always know you have friends here.:hug:

in the Houston news this Am was the fact that the Texas guards had more suicides than deaths in action

what does that tell you
the men and women who protect this country

are hurting

corporations abuse their work force ... We need to unite... But unfortunately when we speak out we are called names that have been demonized... Things like liberal or professional left, which are cleverly, replacing hippy/tree hugger. The affect is the same though-silencing decent...

I had my share of "life savers" years ago, people who took the time to listen to me, help me, and not give up on me. Now I try to be that person when I can. I hope I succeed. I'm certainly no saint, but it is the very least I can do to repay those who were so kind to me when I was down and out.

Sounds like you are that person too, and on behalf of human kind I thank you. We need more of you in this world.

:yourock: :yourock: :yourock: :yourock: :yourock: :yourock: :yourock: :yourock: :yourock:

that was really selfless and i'll bet it made his day.

him at just the right time. you may, indeed, have saved a life.