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The neocons are trying to talk us into war -- again --- By Michael Lind

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Douglas Carpenter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-08-11 12:46 PM
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The neocons are trying to talk us into war -- again --- By Michael Lind

From salon.com






Tuesday, Mar 8, 2011 07:01 ET

The neocons are trying to talk us into war -- again


By Michael Lind


"They have learned nothing and forgotten nothing," Voltaire said of the members of the Hapsburg dynasty of his day. The same might be said of the American hawks who are calling for U.S. military intervention in Libya's civil war.

snip:

In Afghanistan, Afghan rebels played a key role in deposing the Taliban regime. But contrary to the promises of the Bush administration that the Afghan War would be short and decisive, the objective was redefined from removing the Taliban to "nation-building" and the conflict was then thoroughly Americanized. The result is today’s seemingly endless, expensive Afghan quagmire.

The lesson of these three wars is that the rhetoric of lift-and-strike is a gateway drug that leads to all-out American military invasion and occupation. Once the U.S. has committed itself to using limited military force to depose a foreign regime, the pressure to "stay the course" becomes irresistible. If lift-and-strike were to fail in Libya, the same neocon hawks who promised that it would succeed would not apologize for their mistake. Instead, they would up the ante. They would call for escalating American involvement further, because America’s prestige would now be on the line. They would denounce any alternative as a cowardly policy of "cut and run." And as soon as any American soldiers died in Libya, the hawks would claim that we would be betraying their memory, unless we conquered Libya and occupied it for years or decades until it became a functioning, pro-American democracy.

snip:

Robert Gates recently told an audience of West Point cadets:

" In my opinion, any future defense secretary who advises the president to again send a big American land army into Asia or into the Middle East or Africa should 'have his head examined,' as General MacArthur so delicately put it."


Gates is right. Those who propose U.S. military intervention in Libya, even as the U.S. remains bogged down in Iraq and Afghanistan, should get their heads examined.

link to full article:

http://www.salon.com/news/politics/war_room/index.html?story=/politics/war_room/2011/03/08/lind_libya_no_fly&source=newsletter&utm_source=contactology&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Salon_Daily%20Newsletter%20%28Not%20Premium%29_7_30_110



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Jefferson23 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-08-11 12:50 PM
Response to Original message
1. Neocons salivate at the prospect..pathetic minds. K&R. n/t
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Democrats_win Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-08-11 12:53 PM
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2. "Luckily," we don't have enough money for another Bush-big oil war.
Because if we did have enough money, surely they wouldn't be cutting almost all services for poor people. But just watch, we Will get involved in this mess because Michael Moore was right, there is no budget crisis!
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gratuitous Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-08-11 12:54 PM
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3. But war is so much fun and soooo profitable!
At least, when it's other people or their kids doing the killing and the dying. Besides, this time we'll just make a little bit of war. Very circumscribed. Certainly nothing to get all jazzed about. Hardly even notice it. We'll be out of there in no time flat. It's for a really, really good cause. Don't you care about the Libyan people? Come onnnnnnnn.
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Arkansas Granny Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-08-11 02:07 PM
Response to Reply #3
8. And it gives them such a wonderful opportunity to prove their patriotism by
waving their flags and putting those yellow ribbons all over everything.
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no_hypocrisy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-08-11 01:02 PM
Response to Original message
4. War as a franchise . . . .
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Marblehead Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-08-11 01:06 PM
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5. iraq
worked out so well. Libya should be a cake walk..:sarcasm:
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Aerows Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-08-11 01:18 PM
Response to Original message
6. Nothing new there
They have been screaming for a war with Iran for years. It doesn't seem to matter that they are hollering about the budget for taking care of our own people constantly - somehow, we can always seem to afford to throw away big bucks killing people in other countries, and getting our own people wounded and injured.

You know what would happen - it would be another decade long war that would cause more problems than it solved, and then the people that actually fought in it would be "too expensive" to take care of if they are injured - which is what they constantly attempt to claim.
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Scurrilous Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-08-11 01:46 PM
Response to Original message
7. K & R
:thumbsup:
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Douglas Carpenter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-08-11 04:55 PM
Response to Original message
9. Rasmussen Poll: 63% Say U.S. Should Stay Out of Libya Crisis


Tuesday, March 08, 2011

As official Washington buzzes with talk of possible U.S. military intervention in Libya, the majority of U.S. voters continue to favor a hands-off approach.

A new Rasmussen Reports national telephone survey finds that just 22% of Likely U.S. Voters think the United States should get more directly involved in the Libyan crisis. Sixty-three percent (63%) say America should leave the situation alone. Fifteen percent (15%) are not sure. (To see survey question wording, click here.)

These findings echo those in a survey in late February when 67% said the United States should stay out of the political situation unfolding in several Arab countries including Libya.

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/general_politics/march_2011/63_say_u_s_should_stay_out_of_libya_crisis

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Johnny_dollar Donating Member (29 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-08-11 07:42 PM
Response to Original message
10. There is little likelihood of the US getting involved in Libya...
Edited on Tue Mar-08-11 07:44 PM by Johnny_dollar
on orders from the Likud, It is conserving its resources to take on Iran.
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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-08-11 07:52 PM
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11. Rec'd but the lure of controlling that oil and stomping out MidEast Independence is too strong
A US expert on Libya, writing in Newsweek magazine Sunday, directly compared an intervention in Libya to the long-term US role in the Balkans. The political situation in Libya, he wrote, “suggests the Balkans rather than neighboring Egypt or Tunisia as likely precursors for state building in Libya. And as with the Balkans, the international community could have a large and positive role to play by providing expertise and, temporarily, security forces.”

In other words, Libya is to be turned into a semi-colony, ruled by the United States and its fellow predators from Western Europe, who will seize control of the oil reserves and transform the country’s territory into a strategic base of operations against the mass uprisings now sweeping the Middle East and North Africa.

http://www.wsws.org/articles/2011/mar2011/pers-m01.shtml
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reformist2 Donating Member (998 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-08-11 08:12 PM
Response to Original message
12. But wait, wouldn't this make their anti-deficit posture look silly???
Edited on Tue Mar-08-11 08:13 PM by reformist2
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gatorboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-08-11 08:29 PM
Response to Original message
13. Wasn't it the neo-cons who dropped terror sanctions against Libya in 2005?
I seem to recall how the Bush administration considered him "rehabilitated". If a Democrat had done this people would be going ballistic right now.
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-08-11 08:30 PM
Response to Original message
14. Stay out of Libya Obama
That is all
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-08-11 08:37 PM
Response to Original message
15. They didn't talk me into war the first time.
Instead, I said to everyone who'd listen that greedhead warmongering traitors belong in prison.
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Douglas Carpenter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-09-11 09:06 AM
Response to Original message
16. 67% Say U.S. Should Steer Clear of Political Unrest in Arab Nations


Wednesday, February 23, 2011

Americans are wary of the current chaotic political situation in several Arab countries including Libya but strongly believe the United States should stay out of the picture.

snip:

However, as with the recent turmoil in Egypt, most Americans (67%) say the United States should leave the situation in the Arab countries alone. Just 17% say the United States should get more directly involved in the political situation there, but another 17% are not sure.

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/current_events/israel_the_middle_east/67_say_u_s_should_steer_clear_of_political_unrest_in_arab_nations

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Douglas Carpenter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-09-11 10:06 AM
Response to Original message
17. one last kick
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