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What will be Obamas platform of promises for 2012?

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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:06 AM
Original message
What will be Obamas platform of promises for 2012?
His successful first term? The way he dealt with torture and wars and wall street? Helping homeowners? We've been had folks and as soon as we accept this and find a primary candidate, the better.
Yesterday, I posted a question asking the issues that du'ers were satisfied with re this administrations accomplishments. Its a pretty slim list with equal pay for women being the most stable.
He can't possible have the support that he had. I feel like we've been set up. Well we have..so many of us with so little power because someone will come here and post its impossible. Nothing is impossible especially in light of the betrayal we've just experienced.
The supporters are fewer and fewer at this point albeit vocal.
The idea of voting for him again is disgusting to me. Great orator but how can he possible prepare for the campaign trail with what hes done or not done..its a joke.
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Vincardog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:10 AM
Response to Original message
1. His hope is that the GOP has a string of jokes to run against him Win or lose the Moneyed interest
will win. I agree we need a real Progressive Populist to primary him.
Do you have a suggestion who?
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:12 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. the reason for the post..any anti war, anti wall street candidate will do
because he cant possible run on that..and that is what we want
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Jackpine Radical Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:39 AM
Response to Reply #1
67. Yes, but you're going to have to fight us for him.
We need him for Governor next January.
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roguevalley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:11 PM
Response to Reply #1
90. A CHICKEN IN EVERY POT! BUT IT WILL COST YOU $50!
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grahamhgreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 03:08 PM
Response to Reply #90
178. And you must buy the chicken from certain corporations and they can not be organic.
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TheKentuckian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 08:47 PM
Response to Reply #178
224. Perhaps a mandate to put whatever in the pot your work decides for ya, at whatever cost?
Well, if you are graced with a job. Otherwise we'll have some no bid rations and whatnot for those that can't be fleeced via their employers.
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Initech Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 03:54 PM
Response to Reply #1
187. Everyone the GOP is running is a joke. Romney? Palin? Newt? Not one of 'em stands a chance.
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JFN1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 07:57 PM
Response to Reply #187
205. Right! So it will be, "It's either Me or the whacko Republican"
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 07:58 PM by JFN1
And he's going to spend a billion dollars tellinbg us that.

You know, if the guy just did the job he promised, he wouldn't need to spend a million bucks telling us, let alone 1000 times that.
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old mark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:11 AM
Response to Original message
2. K&R-I think he will have a tough time, but there will be a long list of
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 10:15 AM by old mark
accomplishments that many people here don't think are so great.
He is a polished politician, however, and I am sure he will come up with something.

The GOP's rabid anti-Americanism will be a big help to him...he might not have to say very much at all.

ADDED: List of Obama's "successes" in his forst year in office according to Salon-

http://open.salon.com/blog/je_robertson/2010/01/06/obamas_first_year_a_vast_array_of_underreported_successes


mark
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atreides1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:14 AM
Response to Reply #2
6. That's what he is
A polished politician, too bad he never learned what it meant to be a leader...which is what this country has needed for a long time.
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littlewolf Donating Member (920 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:04 AM
Response to Reply #6
45. +1 Thank you
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Aryo Donating Member (84 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:12 AM
Response to Original message
4. He has had one of the strongest first terms
in presidential history IMHO. I will work just as hard in this reelection campaign as I did in 2008.
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originalpckelly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:16 AM
Response to Reply #4
10. I think he's honestly the best...
Republican the DNC ever nominated.
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somone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:25 AM
Response to Reply #10
22. +1984+
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OmmmSweetOmmm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 04:00 PM
Response to Reply #22
189. lol! +1984+++
:rofl:
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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:39 AM
Response to Reply #10
69. LOL !!!
:evilgrin:

:thumbsup::thumbsup:

:hi:
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Ship of Fools Donating Member (899 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:32 AM
Response to Reply #4
61. Thank you!
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11 Bravo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 07:47 PM
Response to Reply #61
200. Don't let it go to your head, the Obama bashers at DU are easily amused.
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roguevalley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:11 PM
Response to Reply #4
91. Yeah, I've never seen a Republican do so much for so few.
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sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:52 PM
Response to Reply #4
117. True, if you're a bank or part of the MIC.
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Lucian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:55 PM
Response to Reply #4
122. Yeah...
one of the strongest first terms if you've been a rich person.

You must be one of the top 1% money earners in this country, right?

:eyes:
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Lorien Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 12:51 AM
Response to Reply #4
267. Sure, for a Republican. nt
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Chris_Texas Donating Member (707 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 07:02 AM
Response to Reply #4
278. lol
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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:13 AM
Response to Original message
5. Promises to end the wars in Iraq, Afghanistan, Yemen and Libya
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 10:14 AM by Catherina
and to bring the troops home from places like Kosovo.
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:15 AM
Response to Reply #5
7. hes not gonna do it..hes a tool of the mic and wall street..blinders off here..nt
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Demit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:20 AM
Response to Reply #5
16. Yes, he now has 2 more wars to promise to end than he had to promise the last time.
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fittosurvive Donating Member (538 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:15 AM
Response to Original message
8. The unfolding sequence of present events will have a lot to do with determining that doctrine.
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alc Donating Member (649 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:15 AM
Response to Original message
9. "change - this time I mean it"
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originalpckelly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:18 AM
Response to Reply #9
11. Hope...
That I will not follow Mitt Romney's advice and double Guantanamo!
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:18 AM
Response to Reply #9
12. lol..tptb underestimate us..but this is more close to the truth i think
keep us distracted..oh look shiny penny..oh look natural disaster ..while the country and the middle class goes down the tubes
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somone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:28 AM
Response to Reply #9
25. "Change Is A Personal Responsibility"
aka "Fuck You, I Got Mine"
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Hotler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:19 AM
Response to Original message
13. More give away to the rich. n/t
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jillan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:20 AM
Response to Original message
14. I have sat at my computer many times wanting to start a thread similar to this one.

He definitely cannot run on hope and change.

The only thing he can run on is I'm better than Pawlenty (or Newt, or Trump).

The hard part is going to get people motivated to vote because no matter how disappointed people are, it's true.... he is still better than a goper.
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:23 AM
Response to Reply #14
20. we need a candidate..someone who is not in the pockets of the monied interest..nt
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creon Donating Member (723 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:02 PM
Response to Reply #14
84. motivate yourself
You are an adult and Obama is not your father.
You know full well what you need to do:

Organize, at the precinct and distrtict level.
Find, recruit, get nominated and elected good and competent progressives to Congress.

A progressive majority in Congress is the way to pass progressive legislation.
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brooklynite Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:26 PM
Response to Reply #84
102. Who will bell the cat?
I'm willing to bet that the same people sitting at their computers today demanding an alternative to President Obama will, in six months, still be sitting at their computers demanding an alternative to President Obama; nobody will have organized any effort to draft a candidate and nobody will have opened their wallet to find the hundreds of millions of dollars needed for such a campaign. Much too easy to stay at home and gripe.
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:54 PM
Response to Reply #102
120. looking for a candidate to rally behind..any ideas..nt
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creon Donating Member (723 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 07:37 PM
Response to Reply #120
197. I n my view
Congress is more important.
Obama can see to his own reelection.

We need a progressive majority in Congress - House and Senate - to pass progressive legislation.

I think that Congress needs to be the priority.

I am aware that I am in a permanent minority when I assert Congress has to be the priority.
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sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 06:24 AM
Response to Reply #197
277. Well, I agree with you and have said so over and over again.
I don't know why people cannot see that. The Presidency has been coopted, that is clear. But if Congress really was representative of the people, it would not matter who was in the WH, Dem or Repub or Dino for that matter.

We have to kick out all those who are bought and paid for, and somehow get good candidates elected. However, how do you overcome the money problem? To get elected they need money. If they take it, they are bought. But how can someone who doesn't take it, win?
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creon Donating Member (723 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 07:08 AM
Response to Reply #277
280. organize
Organize at the local level - precinct and district. The money has a problem getting down to that level.
That is about the only counter to the effect of money.

Overcoming apathy is difficult as well.
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creon Donating Member (723 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 07:32 PM
Response to Reply #102
196. agreed
It does take an awful lot of hard work to do that kind of political work.

Very few are ready willing and able to make that kind of an effort.
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elocs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:20 AM
Response to Original message
15. Fool me once, shame on you; fool me twice, shame on me.
It's likely to be shame on me in 2012 presented with a choice between bad and evil.

So much hope, so much disappointment.
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NightWatcher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:21 AM
Response to Original message
17. not a promise but a threat. You've got to vote for Obama or the evil repukes win
and that threat will be repeated by all those who keep defending his actions on war, torture, financial policy.

We're not even getting promised a pony this time.
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whattheidonot Donating Member (301 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:57 AM
Response to Reply #17
80. correct.
this is the line we will hear. Well maybe a Republican will be better. A Republican would make problems obvious. Obama , on the big issues has been a let down. His hands were tied to a degree but he really did not step out and change things in a big way.
The Republicans are all nut jobs but if the economy is bad anything can happen. Obama needs a challenge from the left and a very close race to wake him up. Who scraps off the independents will win. Right now polls show independents are coming back to Obama. The nut jobs are too much for the majority of independents.
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slay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 05:46 AM
Response to Reply #17
273. +1
and it will not work on me. i do not approve of his handling of the presidency AT ALL. he will not get my vote - threats be damned. i'm voting my way from here on out - at least i'll know i cast my ballot for the right person - even if others remain fooled. i will write in Dennis Kucinich or Bernie Sanders or Alan Grayson if I have to. this whole democracy thing is turning out to be one big scam where the 2 party system has actually become one - the corporate party.
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originalpckelly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:21 AM
Response to Original message
18. I know one thing: He'll God Bless America...
because lord knows we need all the help we can get with Democrats like him in charge.
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DefenseLawyer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:22 AM
Response to Original message
19. Obama/Biden 2012: "It Is What It Is"
That's the slogan I'd go with.
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:24 AM
Response to Reply #19
21. why?
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DefenseLawyer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:31 AM
Response to Reply #21
27. Well I'm thinking "Change" is probably out.
And I think just saying "Hey, we don't have to answer to you left wing nuts, we did what we had to do to keep the money flowing" is a bit harsh, and won't fit on a bumper sticker.
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mazzarro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 03:58 PM
Response to Reply #27
188. I've got it!
It will be "Tweaking You Can Count On". Because he does not believe in major change to the health care system; he does not believe in major change to B**h war doctrine; he does not believe in major change to Guantanamo; he does not believe in major change to the financial system nor the real estate problem; he does not believe in major change to any existing system - so re-elect him for GRADUALISM.
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Little Star Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 09:42 PM
Response to Reply #19
243. Yep! Cause there ain't nothing else to chose from! k&r
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villager Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:26 AM
Response to Original message
23. "Fooled you once....?"
:shrug:
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:32 AM
Response to Reply #23
28. cant get fooled again..thank you gwb...thats a slogan if i ever heard one
i'm in nor cal and i dont know anyone who is not disgusted...we just need someone..the way obama popped up for us to pin our hopes and dreams on..but this time a real representative...not a polished owned politician
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msongs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:27 AM
Response to Original message
24. I love republicans and someday they will love me back if I just give in often enough? nt
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Davis_X_Machina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:28 AM
Response to Original message
26. Whatever they are...
...they won't be enough, they won't be kept, and DU will stay home in November.

To Send A Message.

Obama's the anti-Stuart Smiley: "I'm Good Enough, I'm Smart Enough, and Doggone It, People Don't Like Me!"
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:37 AM
Response to Reply #26
65. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
RKP5637 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:32 AM
Response to Original message
29. The cornered wealth of this country and hence the real the power will put in their choice as
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 10:32 AM by RKP5637
president. The presidency and congress have become window dressing for the masses. Politicians come and go, the real wealth and power remains, behind the scenes pulling the strings.
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:33 AM
Response to Reply #29
31. we know that now and we know thats what we got this time..
everyone knows..we just need a leader
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RKP5637 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:07 AM
Response to Reply #31
47. What we need is someone like LBJ was, for example, that knew how to cut the
strings and pull them himself. I haven't seen/heard of anyone like that in these times.
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Andy823 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:32 AM
Response to Original message
30. Yeah...
A "republican" would be so much better, I mean just look at how "GREAT" the new governors of Wisconsin, Ohio, and Michigan are, and all the "wonderful" things they are doing for the people! :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm:

On Obama's worst day he is a million times better than the "best" republican running for the job, yet so many just can't see that! Look at what NOT voting got those in Wisconsin, Ohio, and Michigan! As for support he has a lot more support in the country than he has here! The "joke" is not voting and letting a republican win, but that "joke" won't be very funny in the long run!
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:36 AM
Response to Reply #30
34. no one said dont vote..i want to vote..but i want to vote for a candidate who IS a democrat
not just has a D behind their name
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Generic Other Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:34 AM
Response to Original message
32. empty
less thaN ZERO as far as I am concerned.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:35 AM
Response to Original message
33. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Life Long Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:56 AM
Response to Reply #33
44. Now that's disgusting!
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Karmadillo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:39 AM
Response to Original message
35. Several things he'll have no intention of doing if he's re-elected.
nt
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sasha031 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:44 AM
Response to Original message
36. that nauseous feeling I have felt and pain in my heart for so long
you have just summed it up with one word...
"betrayal"

Is going to point and wave his finger at us again, claim he gave us health care, when we question the past 3yrs.





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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:47 AM
Response to Reply #36
39. thats the thing about betrayal..not such an easy sell next time..just not..nt
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BlueIris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:46 AM
Response to Original message
37. Best. President. Ever.
Will be stated non-ironically about a billion times.
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:46 AM
Response to Original message
38. any suggestions for a candidate?
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sasha031 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:51 AM
Response to Reply #38
40. I know Bernie Sanders doesn't want to run
but how I love that man.
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bluedave Donating Member (206 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:26 AM
Response to Reply #38
56. Alan Grayson
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:35 AM
Response to Reply #56
63. my first choice..but someone will pop up and say..oh a one term congressman
however, he would get my vote in a minute..someoone who cant be bought, i think, i hope
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Obamanaut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:40 PM
Response to Reply #63
154. It might be a toss-up. A one term congressman vs one partial term senator. nt
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 01:40 PM by Obamanaut
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NorthCarolina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:54 AM
Response to Original message
41. He will likely dust off his Progressive suit again for the campaign, and begin to speak of things
like reducing health insurance costs through competition, eliminating unfair trade agreements such as NAFTA, bringing the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan (and maybe Libya) to a close and bringing the troops home, closing Guantanamo, ending the CIA program of extraordinary rendition, developing green power to free America from the grip of oil rich nations, JOBS JOBS JOBS, etc. Of course, after the election, he'll be able to burn that Progressive suit as he won't need it anymore.
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crazyjoe Donating Member (921 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:54 AM
Response to Original message
42. Well, at least he closed Abu Ghraib.....oh wait a minute....
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:48 AM
Response to Reply #42
75. Psst! FACT: Congress refused to authorize funding. President Obama tried.
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 11:49 AM by ClarkUSA
Check with Pulitzer-Prize winning Politifact.com for the facts. If you're at all interested, which is questionable.
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crazyjoe Donating Member (921 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 03:29 PM
Response to Reply #75
182. wow, how far in the sand can you stick your head?
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Chris_Texas Donating Member (707 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 07:06 AM
Response to Reply #75
279. It'sthree card monte, cept all three cards are face up, and all jokers
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LAGC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:55 AM
Response to Original message
43. Why don't you re-post this in GD:P?
That's where all the Obama fans hang out.

I'm sure you'll get more optimistic responses.
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:20 AM
Response to Reply #43
49. yesterday i had a post asking duers what issues they were pleased with
mostly responses from supporters ..i tried to keep the thread respectful as i truly wanted to hear their thoughts.. a few very reasoned and thoughtful responses but mostly i felt they had to stretch ..given the mandate and the support at the onset of this administration, the accomplishments are somewhat meager..yes, there are a few..but the writing is on the wall, as far as im concerned, and it needs to be addressed
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JoePhilly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:22 AM
Response to Reply #49
51. Once again ... here's an easy to read website of reasons to be pleased.
http://whatthefuckhasobamadonesofar.com/
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AlabamaLibrul Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:25 AM
Response to Reply #51
52. Here's a website to read some reasons people aren't pleased.
http://whatinthefuckhasobamadonesofar.com/
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JoePhilly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:28 AM
Response to Reply #52
57. EPIC FAIL .... This is the first item that popped up on that site just now ...
What in the fuck has Obama done so far?

Continued to defend the military's "Don't Ask Don't Tell Policy" from legal challenges

http://www.cnn.com/2010/POLITICS/10/13/military.gays.appeal/

Yeah, AND?

:rofl:
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sendero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 07:27 AM
Response to Reply #57
283. Real observant..
... the only issue out of about 100 he backtracked and fulfilled his promise on. And I could add several more that they missed.
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Angry Dragon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:25 AM
Response to Reply #51
53. The things he has not done has hurt the people more
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Shagbark Hickory Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:06 AM
Response to Original message
46. It doesn't matter what any of us thinks. What matters is what the swing voters think.
You know, the douchebags that can never seem to make up their mind until they get to the polls.

The blue states are going to vote for obama no matter what. That leaves us with NC, FL, MO, VA, IN and I know I'm leaving out at least one state.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:14 AM
Response to Original message
48. What garbage. Pres. Obama has accomplished more in his first two years than any president since FDR.
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 11:17 AM by ClarkUSA
The baseless rhetoric in your OP is refuted by Pulitzer Prize-winning Politifact.com via their long list of his 134 promises kept:
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/promises/obameter/

What the fuck has Obama done so far? Find out instead of ignoring the facts: http:/www.whatthefuckhasobamadonesofar.com

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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:25 AM
Response to Reply #48
54. bs..and im not buying it...i live in america..i know whats going on
i read the news..i know who he has surrounded himself with..i know homeowners have not been helped..nor gitmo closed..and we're in a war in afghanistan..why?...i know that wall street and the war machine continue to run rampant while half of my small town is losing their homes...i could go on..do not give me a croc of crap to read when i am living in this nightmare..
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:33 AM
Response to Reply #54
62. You're wrong. I offer facts. I'm not interested in baseless demonizing rhetoric.
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:38 AM
Response to Reply #62
66. you offer facts which please you. I live in America and I am not happy with this administration.
I live it daily. Your facts make you happy. Fine. Our perspectives are different. Fine. I do not want to convince you or sway your opinion...I know what I see and what I know and that's that.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:40 AM
Response to Reply #66
70. No, I offer objective facts from a Pulitzer-Prize winning Politifact.com.
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 11:41 AM by ClarkUSA
Your rhetoric is baseless and totally subjective.
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:44 AM
Response to Reply #70
72. yawn...please do not be insulting to my 60 year old hard working mind and body..nt
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:46 AM
Response to Reply #72
74. lol! Baseless rhetoric that unfairly demonizes our Democratic President insults my intelligence.
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 11:53 AM by ClarkUSA
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:56 AM
Response to Reply #74
79. u need a new phrase..baseless rhetoric is a bit overused..
and its not rhetoric..these are my feelings and no matter how many times you insult my feelings, you will not change them..only action by this administration can change the way i feel and think about them
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:04 PM
Response to Reply #79
86. lol! "baseless rhetoric" that demonizes Pres. Obama "is a bit overused" everywhere.
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 12:08 PM by ClarkUSA
Your OP is a case in point. "feelings" are not facts. They drive baseless rhetoric, which is a by-product of subjective opinion. Thus, my only interest is in objective facts, which radically differ from your "feelings".

Just wanted to make that clear.
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 02:51 PM
Response to Reply #86
173. i trust my feelings more than i trust your facts..inner bs barometer..
please do not attempt to discount my intuitive ability or anyone else's for that matter..out of your domain
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:58 PM
Response to Reply #79
124. One can't properly manipulate without catch phrases.
"Baseless rhetoric" is just today's attempt. Sort of like "Professional Left". I think it's pretty funny watching them work it so hard. :)
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:07 PM
Response to Reply #124
133. I stated the truth. So far, the OP has yet to prove any of her claims despite repeated requests.
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 01:12 PM by ClarkUSA
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:13 PM
Response to Reply #133
135. Doesn't change my point at all.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:21 PM
Response to Reply #135
142. So you're accusing me of trying to "properly manipulate" with the truth?
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 01:22 PM by ClarkUSA
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:41 PM
Response to Reply #142
156. I like how words and phrases are used, and yes, they are used with a purpose.
The truth isn't the point of my interest in this exchange, it's how people use certain phrases to push what they believe, and yes, to manipulate others into thinking the same thing. It's not a personal thing, we all do it. It's interesting to see which buzzwords and phrases people adopt to try and make their point, and then to watch how hard they push them.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:52 PM
Response to Reply #156
162. Is that a "yes" you are accusing ME of trying to "properly manipulate"?
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:58 PM
Response to Reply #162
165. You can figure it out.
Or perhaps you can't. Figure it out or don't. I can't say that it affects me either way.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 02:06 PM
Response to Reply #165
170. lol! "baseless rhetoric" indeed.
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 02:08 PM
Response to Reply #170
171. Everyone drink!
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creon Donating Member (723 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 07:18 AM
Response to Reply #48
282. I know that
So, there are two here who know that.

People seem to have forgotten that Congress writes and passes legislation. Not the Executive Branch.
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JoePhilly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:20 AM
Response to Original message
50. "A pretty slim list" is how you characterize the responses to your prior attack Obama OP?
Again ... this site provides quite a nice resource for things to be "pleased" about from Obama's first 2 years.

http://whatthefuckhasobamadonesofar.com/

I added these ... (with no response from you)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=439&topic_id=738871&mesg_id=739786

And your statement above that "equal pay for women is the most stable ... that is a joke, right?

As for your statement now today ... "the supporters are fewer and fewer albeit vocal" ... apparently you didn't see this DU poll ... even on DU, Obama gets 70% support.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=433&topic_id=638118&mesg_id=638118

I'm going to guess that you didn't get the kind of ant-Obama responses you were looking for in the other OP yesterday, so today, you reframe it looking for a better (more disgruntled) set of responses.

:rofl:

What an EPIC FAIL.
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:31 AM
Response to Reply #50
60. looking for a candidate who represents me...it is America after all
and your attacks on me do not change that. These are my thoughts and I am not alone. Yesterdays post was for supporters to tell me why. I wasn't impressed. You are. Thats ok. You will not change my mind about Obama no matter how many of my threads you attempt to derail. It is not about me. It is about an epic fail as a president imo...at a time when we needed a leader.

I will support any viable candidate. I will not support Obama. Get over it. Its a free country.
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JoePhilly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:48 PM
Response to Reply #60
161. You were clear yesterday ... there are a few issues that cause you to not be "pleased" period.
And so you seem to find it impossible to be pleased with anything else that he has done.

Isn't that basically what you said to me yesterday?

Nothing will please you. We get it.

As for your suggestion that I am trying to "change your mind" ... hardly.

In two days, you posted two OPs, both basically variations on the theme, "a non-specific call for others to take shots at Obama".

Regarding how you vote ... I'd suggest that your time might be better spent trying to find this alternative candidate you speak of so that you can vote for them.
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 02:55 PM
Response to Reply #161
175. your interpretation..today i posted my feelings..yesterday i asked for yours
and you are right..the idea of never ending war, continued corruption and multi million dollar bonuses for wall st, millions facing homelessness because no effective program is in place after 2 years, and lies about afghanistan while the defense budget boggles the mind..even the billion or so spent in libya this week. tim geithner..yes, those things overshadow just about everything else
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JoePhilly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 03:30 PM
Response to Reply #175
183. Like I said, better get started on that alternative candidate.
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 03:52 PM
Response to Reply #183
186. workin on it..nt
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quinnox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:26 AM
Response to Original message
55. Hold on. So you aren't happy with the glorious Libyan
freedom liberation, the awesome health care bill requiring us to pay for profit insurance companies, the extending of the Bush tax cuts for the ultra-rich, and the coming "shared sacrifices" due to hit the middle class and poor?

You sir, are clearly not a progressive or a loyal Democrat then! :patriot:

{Sarcasm}
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:28 AM
Response to Original message
58. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
lynne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:30 AM
Response to Original message
59. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on ME! n/t
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:35 AM
Response to Original message
64. FACTS: Pulitzer Prize-winning Politifact.com's long list of his 134 promises kept so far
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 11:44 AM by ClarkUSA
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/promises/obameter/

Your demonizing rhetoric is baseless. Polls have shown that since Pres. Obama's inauguration, a large majority of liberal Democrats like me approve of President Obama's job performance. I have proved that the facts back me up re: his promises kept, too.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:39 AM
Response to Original message
68. Are you trying to discourage Democrats from voting for the Democratic President?
What purpose does that serve? Who do you think would have been a better president?
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:43 AM
Response to Reply #68
71. I believe there should be a primary challenger ..ya got a problem with that?
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:45 AM
Response to Reply #71
73. I have a problem w/your baseless rhetoric. Who do you think would've have been a better president?
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:53 AM
Response to Reply #73
77. someone who kept the promises obama made on the campaign trail
reigning it wall street instead of surrounding himself with them, holding war profiteers and war criminals accountable, helping homeowners and stopping this downward spiral of the middle class, ending wars instead of escalating, why are we in afghanistan? now that was a promise he made which he kept and still cant figure out why?..i could go on but you get the idea
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:07 PM
Response to Reply #77
88. Who's that? Politifact.com has documented in detail 134 promises that Pres. Obama has kept.
Funny how you can't name one politician that you believe could've made a better president.
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:16 PM
Response to Reply #88
94. i voted for change i could believe in..now i dont believe that person any longer
any progressive anti war anti wall street pro main street candidate who is not owned by monied interest..
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:18 PM
Response to Reply #94
96. Funny how you refuse to acknowledge the 134 instances of "change" that Politifact.com documents.
:eyes:
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:59 PM
Response to Reply #73
127. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:05 PM
Response to Reply #127
131. We should make a drinking for every time people make up shit about Pres. Obama.
We could all be shitfaced in an hour.

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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:13 PM
Response to Reply #131
136. Well then get started.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:56 PM
Response to Reply #136
163. I would but I'm afraid it would turn me into an alcoholic.
:rofl:
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 02:09 PM
Response to Reply #163
172. Might help.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 07:44 PM
Response to Reply #172
198. Do you speak from personal experience?
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 07:44 PM by ClarkUSA
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 08:23 PM
Response to Reply #198
209. No, I've just read about people who struggle with day to day life.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 08:25 PM
Response to Reply #209
210. Yes, I can see how you would want to do that.
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 08:27 PM
Response to Reply #210
212. You don't want to relate to struggling people?
That explains a lot.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 08:31 PM
Response to Reply #212
215. How predictable. That's a strawman fallacy.
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 08:32 PM by ClarkUSA
"The Straw Man fallacy is committed when a person simply ignores a person's actual position and substitutes a distorted, exaggerated or misrepresented version of that position."

http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/straw-man.html
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 08:35 PM
Response to Reply #215
217. Your words, dude.
I said I cared about people who are struggling. Your reply, verbatim..."Yes, I can see how you would want to do that."

:hi:
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 08:40 PM
Response to Reply #217
220. No, they were not. I never said that. You're conflating my polite rejoinder into a strawman fallacy.
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 08:43 PM by ClarkUSA
<< I said I cared about people who are struggling. >>

That's false, too. Here's what you actually said:

Forkboy (1000+ posts) Sat Mar-26-11 09:23 PM
Response to Reply #200

212. No, I've just read about people who struggle with day to day life.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=439&topic_id=744674&mesg_id=748728
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 08:42 PM
Response to Reply #220
221. Can you explain what part of this quote isn't yours?
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 08:42 PM by Forkboy
Thanks in advance.

ClarkUSA: "Yes, I can see how you would want to do that."
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 08:44 PM
Response to Reply #221
223. Strawman fallacy: "You don't want to relate to struggling people?"
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 08:48 PM by ClarkUSA
I never said that. And you just proved yourself wrong by quoting what I actually said. :rofl:

<< I said I cared about people who are struggling. >>

No, you didn't. That's a false statement, too, and I can prove it by quoting you this time. Here's what you actually said:

Forkboy (1000+ posts) Sat Mar-26-11 09:23 PM
Response to Reply #200

212. No, I've just read about people who struggle with day to day life.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=439&topic_id=744674&mesg_id=748728


Tsk, tsk, Forkboy.


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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 08:58 PM
Response to Reply #223
228. The smilie face just shows your desperation.
You're not really laughing. I know it, you know it, anyone reading this knows it. The smilie is there for you, not for the rest of us.

But hey, it makes you feel good about yourself, so that can't be a bad thing. Every little bit helps.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 09:04 PM
Response to Reply #228
231. And here comes the red herring. lol!


Definition of red herring: http://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=red+herring&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 09:07 PM
Response to Reply #231
232. Work it, baby!
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 09:13 PM
Response to Reply #232
233. Sorry, not interested. Go back to reading.
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 09:20 PM
Response to Reply #233
234. Interested enough to reply, weren't you?
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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:50 AM
Response to Reply #68
76. The Democratic President Has Been Doing A Great Job Of That, All By Himself...
:shrug:
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leftstreet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:55 AM
Response to Reply #76
78. +1
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:04 PM
Response to Reply #76
87. Deleted message
Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:13 PM
Response to Reply #76
92. Do you have any facts to back up your predictable rhetoric? I doubt it.
FACT: Polls have disproved this false meme ever since Day One.
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grahamhgreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:03 PM
Response to Reply #68
85. A better president? Any of the WI 14. Half of the people on this board.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:14 PM
Response to Reply #85
93. ROFL!!! Prove it.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:17 PM
Response to Reply #93
95. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
grahamhgreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:20 PM
Response to Reply #93
97. Actually, a sprig of arugala could do a better job - it would have let the tax cuts for the rich
expire.

Proof enough?
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:21 PM
Response to Reply #97
99. lol
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:24 PM
Response to Reply #97
101. He and Congress made a deal in order to extend UI, get a 2nd stimulus (payroll tax holiday), etc.
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 12:29 PM by ClarkUSA
Does your enmity for the wealthy supercede your compassion for the unemployed and middle-class? That payroll-tax holiday is enough to pay one month of my mortgage and a bit of my monthly taxes. It's difficult for me to understand why people like you and the OP would want to take that financial relief away from me and hundreds of millions of other Americans just to stick it to the rich. Is that what you want? If so, I stand against you.

President Obama doesn't have a magic wand to coerce Republicans and blue dog Democrats to obey his every legislative wish but he did the best he could. Republicans whined about being tricked into voting for a huge second stimulus after the fact, too. Check out DU archives for the OPs documenting this fact. :D
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grahamhgreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:35 PM
Response to Reply #101
106. A sprig of arugala would not have passed mandatory crapsurance. You may have inspired an OP!
But, joking aside, the money for ALL of our countries problems will eventually come from a return to the tax rates of Eisenhower.

The money you think you got to pay your mortgage, is a actually an additional loan that you will have to pay back with interest.

You can not have real tax cuts when you are running a deficit, all you are doing is increasing your debt burden.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:40 PM
Response to Reply #106
109. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 09:41 PM
Response to Reply #106
241. Rhetorical nonsense does not refute the facts as documented by Politifacts.com
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:36 PM
Response to Reply #101
107. yet you support a president whose ineffective housing program has forced millions upon millions
into the streets..and more on the way...with no consequences for mortgage or bankster fraud..interesting
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:42 PM
Response to Reply #107
110. I'm not interested in hyperbolic rhetoric. Prove your claims with credibly sourced facts.
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 12:42 PM by ClarkUSA
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:47 PM
Response to Reply #110
113. oh puhlease..a huge part of the problem and you require links?
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 12:47 PM by xiamiam
cmon..google hamp and its effectiveness as well as every recent turn in favor of the banks vs the average american homeowner and you will come up with about 50000 million trillion links..do not act link you are not aware of this problem
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:59 PM
Response to Reply #113
128. Yes, because your claim is unjustified. FYI: 700,000 mortgages were modified by HAMP.
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 01:02 PM by ClarkUSA
Google: http://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=HAMP+modified&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8

I'm sure those people don't share your opinion. President Obama never promised that every single homeowner who's facing foreclosure was going to be approved, either.

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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:06 PM
Response to Reply #128
132. less than 1% have been given permanent modications
and by now, their homes are probably underwater..trial modifications were yanked in january and those folks were told to pay up or be foreclosed upon..short sales dominate the market..what we've got is a shocked citizenry faced with sleeping in their cars. I know you are not a part of that or you would get it...
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:08 PM
Response to Reply #132
134. Does that factor out to equal 700,000 mortgage modifications, as I have proved?
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 01:11 PM by ClarkUSA
Google proof link: http://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=HAMP+modified&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8

Do you have any source for your claim as I do?
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:37 PM
Response to Reply #134
150. your numbers are inaccurate..i'm not going to do your work for you
700k is not correct..try google..100s of articles will come up this month..

why do you have such a zealous support for something which is not working?
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:41 PM
Response to Reply #150
157. Wrong. I proved my claim with a link from Google. You offer nothing but more words.
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:48 PM
Response to Reply #157
160. yawn..a link from google..who do you think you are talking to?
one thing for sure, if i were obama, i would put you on the payroll because you are a true supporter. You haven't influenced me in any way but I'm sure you can be effective in some situations. He's not my guy any longer. I'm searching for a better representative and will continue to do so.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:57 PM
Response to Reply #160
164. Yes, I proved you wrong. Again. And still you offer nothing but words.
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 02:03 PM by ClarkUSA
I could care less who you vote for but I do care about the pushing of false memes.
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 02:06 PM
Response to Reply #164
169. 540k permanent mods..in 2 years..all over google..u didnt prove me wrong
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 02:06 PM by xiamiam
u just provided a source.. 160k off of your 700k claim is over 25% inaccurate
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 07:46 PM
Response to Reply #169
199. lol! Moving the goalpost? That's not what you said originally in Reply 132.
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 07:48 PM by ClarkUSA
This is what you said originally: " less than 1% have been given permanent modications"
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=439&topic_id=744674&mesg_id=745978

You have yet to prove this claim. Still waiting...
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ReggieVeggie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:10 PM
Response to Reply #68
89. isn't this a call out?
I bet it won't be deleted
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Marr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:32 PM
Response to Reply #68
104. Hmm... how about this guy?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EoSnqofelsQ
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:00 PM
Response to Reply #104
129. !
:rofl:
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Lorien Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 12:54 AM
Response to Reply #68
268. The DINO President. It's all been a scam that won't work again. nt
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creon Donating Member (723 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:57 AM
Response to Original message
81. don't vote for him.
Cast a blank vote for President.

Then, you may want to vote for Democrats down ballot.

Or, not vote at all. Don't have to vote you know.
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MadHound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:01 PM
Response to Original message
82. The usual shit, that he is somehow better than the alternative,
And if he wins, he will then proceed to go out and much the same as the alternative.
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grahamhgreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:02 PM
Response to Original message
83. He will promise to be a clear alternative to the RW whackos, but then he won't be.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:21 PM
Response to Reply #83
98. Politifact.com has 134 instances where he has been "a clear alternative to the RW whackos" thus far.
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 12:30 PM by ClarkUSA
Are you at all interested in the facts? If you are, then you would acknowledge them:
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/promises/obameter/
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Marr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:24 PM
Response to Original message
100. You don't change Presidents in the middle of a war!
Actually, I don't think he'll go quite *that* Republican.

If I had to take a guess, I'd say he'll pick a few traditional wedge issues that Madison Avenue has carefully honed over the years for dividing the population. You know, things that don't actually cost Wall Street a penny, like abortion or a very tightly-defined gay rights issue.
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:52 PM
Response to Reply #100
118. well that could be a problem because it looks like war is gonna be forever. nt
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:31 PM
Response to Original message
103. we each get one vote..most of us see the frivolity of war and war machine waste
as we lose our homes, jobs, savings,...and above all confidence that things will ever be different. One vote per person.
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Moondog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:33 PM
Response to Original message
105. "I suck less than the Puke, so vote for me."
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somone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:44 PM
Response to Reply #105
111. "Yes We Can Surrender to the GOP"
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Tierra_y_Libertad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:39 PM
Response to Original message
108. What he's accomplished. More war. More money for the rich. More caving to the the Republicans.
That,of course, is if he could be persuaded to be honest in his promises.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:46 PM
Response to Reply #108
112. What he's accomplished: Saved country from Great Depression 2, HCR, DADT repeal, Wall Street reform.
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 12:49 PM by ClarkUSA
Saved much of the American auto industry from extinction, turned a net loss -700K jobs under BushCo's last month to a net plus +300,000 jobs per month, turned US into most admired leadership on earth, ended Iraq war, regulated mountaintop removal into extinction, etc.

I could go on, but Pulitzer Prize winning Politifact.com has 134 promises kept so far in only two years.
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Marr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:48 PM
Response to Reply #112
114. Are you really defending that PR bullshit as "Wall Street Reform"?
C'mon-- seriously?
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Moondog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:50 PM
Response to Reply #114
116.  * snicker *
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:53 PM
Response to Reply #114
119. Yes, because the meme that Wall Street reform was "PR bullshit" is wrong. Here are the FACTS -->
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 12:55 PM by ClarkUSA
There has been plenty of "Change" from where I stand -- just not according to you.

Here are the facts of what Pres. Obama has accomplished in his first 20 months:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=433&topic_id=375811&mesg_id=375811

<< Are you really defending that PR bullshit as "Wall Street Reform"? >>

Um, yes. The facts are on my side, not yours:

The very first thing that the Reform Act done was lower interest rates. In the past, credit card companies had the ability to charge outrageous interest rates and then had the leverage to increase that rate on people who had a hard time paying their credit card payments. Credit cards had to be written off due to non payment and the amassed bad credit paid a toll on the companies. They say this contributed to the credit crisis. It did, but then again the credit card companies were still giving credit to anyone and everyone knowing that they had the option of the card being written off. Lower interest rates mean that cards will be paid off and not written off.


More benefits of credit card reform:

Fees Controlled

The biggest thing about the Credit Card Reform Act that has helped consumers is that the credit card companies can no longer charge those outrageous fees. Now they have to keep the same due date each month and not change it because someone is late on their payment. Credit card companies can no longer charge fees for payments made online or over the telephone. The little outrageous fees that the credit card companies were profiting on are now eliminated.


http://www.usmoneytalk.com/finance/credit-card-reform-act-does-this-actually-do-anything-for-anybody-909/

Here are some definitive positive changes that credit card reform created for consumers:

5 Positive Aspects Of The New Credit Card Regulations:

1. No retroactive interest increases – a credit card company cannot increase the interest rate and have it apply to a pre-existing balance.
2. Limits on Fees – the fees on a yearly credit card can be no more than 25% of the initial credit limit
3. Rates Cannot be Changed for Late payments on unrelated loans. If miss payments on an unrelated consumer loan, the credit company cannot use the practice known as universal default to increase your interest rate.
4. Application of Balance – If you pay over the minimum amount on your credit card each month, the additional amount must apply the payment to the balance with the highest interest rate.
5. Timely Billing – The credit card company cannot issue a bill several days before it is due and then charge you late fees. The bill must be issued at least 21 days before you must pay the bill each month.

Other Aspects

One aspect that may impact college age consumers is that a new credit card cannot be issued to a person who is under 21 years of age. Students in college and young people who enter the military cannot be issued credit cards. This prevents them from abusing credit, but it also prevent responsible people under the age of 21 from building credit.


http://www.usmoneytalk.com/finance/credit-card-reform-act-5-positive-aspects-for-americans-904/
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:58 PM
Response to Reply #119
125. wall street just bankrupt the middle class by betting against it
and you want to talk about interest rates on credit cards?..go tell that to the multi millions upon millions of americans who not only dont give a crap about credit cards but cant even stay in their homes..gheezh..this is weak..given the gravity of the situation facing us..you come up with credit card interest rates..you have got to be kidding
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:14 PM
Response to Reply #125
137. More empty rhetoric with not a shred of proof.
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Marr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:03 PM
Response to Reply #119
130. I asked if you were defending it was "Wall Street Reform".
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 01:11 PM by Marr
Calling a few basic regulations for consumer credit cards "Wall Street Reform" is like calling your rowboat the HMS Victory. Wall Street is running roughshod over our economy, using it like a casino with a guaranteed bailout provided by taxpayers whenever they lose their shirts. You're talking about the tiniest crumbs at the margins of their operations that the White House happily labeled "Wall Street Reform" because there was a public demand to do *something*.

It's PR bullshit, as I said.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:15 PM
Response to Reply #130
139. I showed proof that it was. Where are your facts? I'm not interested in your opinion.
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Marr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:20 PM
Response to Reply #139
141. What are you talking about?
You don't believe in Wall Street malfeasance? There's been reams of information published on the subject of Wall Street's creation of bubbles to enrich the big investment banks. It's what caused the recent market collapse. I'm not going to waste my time educating you on this-- go read something besides the White House press release site if you want to know about it.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:24 PM
Response to Reply #141
143. I proved your claims re: Wall Street reform wrong, so now the goalpost gets moved.
Gotcha.
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Marr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:29 PM
Response to Reply #143
146. You didn't prove anything. You posted info on consumer credit card regulations
and again called it "Wall Street Reform", which is what kicked off this little sub-thread.

I *know* there were regulations passed concerning consumer credit cards. I asked you if you were seriously trying to call that "Wall Street Reform". It isn't. It's consumer credit card reform. Calling it by the lofty name of "Wall Sreet Reform" is purely advertising, aka, PR bullshit.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:46 PM
Response to Reply #146
159. Wrong. Wall Street reform affected the banking industry. Politifact.com has more facts here --->
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2010/jul/16/facts-financial-reform/
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 02:00 PM
Response to Reply #159
168. there is a difference between living the experience and reading about it..nt
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Egnever Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 07:06 PM
Response to Reply #168
195. Agreed and the difference is
Your judgement is clouded by personal bias that has nothing whatsoever to do with the truth. Example if one were to only go to the grocery store when it was open in the daytime they could claim there was no need to hire stockers cause the shelves were always full. Since they had no personal knowledge of the stockers putting things on the shelves they could ignorantly claim there were no stockers.

Sort of what your argument is.
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Marr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:01 PM
Response to Reply #195
260. Your postion was neatly summed up by the noted political philosopher Britney Spears,
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 11:06 PM by Marr
when she said of President GW Bush, "I think we should just trust our president in every decision he makes and should just support that, you know, and be faithful in what happens".

It's you whose judgement is clouded by personal bias. I judge things based on the data before me. I refuse to introduce a variable to every equation so it always verifies my own beliefs.

If there's some information that makes Obama's positions more acceptable, he should share it.
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datasuspect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 05:53 AM
Response to Reply #159
274. do you get money from politifact.com
?

are you adbot's cousin or something?
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 08:43 PM
Response to Reply #143
222. Deleted message
Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
somone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:58 PM
Response to Reply #114
126. People are not that stupid



Chairman & Chief Executive of the Goldman Sachs Group Lloyd C. Blankfein, American Express Chief Executive Kenneth Chenault, Bank of America Corp. Chief Executive Kenneth Lewis and American Banker's Association President and Chief Executive Ed Yingling arrive at the White House
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:50 PM
Response to Reply #112
115. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
grahamhgreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:56 PM
Response to Reply #112
123. He saved the BANKS from a great depression, not the rest of us.
I'll give you the auto industry, though!
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:18 PM
Response to Reply #123
140. Economic indicators and credible independent economists disagree.
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 01:18 PM by ClarkUSA
Read Paul Krugman, who was skeptical of President Obama's efforts before he saw the results and became a supporter of Team Obama's economic policy efforts.
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:40 PM
Response to Reply #140
155. lol..
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Lucian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 12:54 PM
Response to Original message
121. He'll tell us he was the ultra-liberal President we've all wanted.
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Zorra Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:14 PM
Response to Original message
138. Mama drowned all the dummies.
I won't be listening this time.
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LWolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:25 PM
Response to Original message
144. Hmmm....
-to further disenfranchize and marginalize the left.
-to completely privatize public education.
-to abolish unions in the U.S.
-to make sure the MIC thrives by keeping the U.S. engaged in multiple wars
-to redefine torture
-to embrace energy policies and sources dangerous to the planet
-to ensure that no middle class remains
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:28 PM
Response to Reply #144
145. ROFL! What a laugh. I'd ask you to prove those ridiculous claims, but I know better.
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LWolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:30 PM
Response to Reply #145
147. Hyperbole? Yes. Ridiculous? No.
The sad fact is that, if you remove the obvious exaggeration, he's already worked for those things. That's the record he can run on.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:40 PM
Response to Reply #147
153. Prove it.
Here's the record he will run on... 134 promises kept:
www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/promises/obameter
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LWolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:59 PM
Response to Reply #153
167. Prove it?
Look at his record on each of those issues.

Surely you already know.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 07:49 PM
Response to Reply #167
201. lol! No proof, just as I expected. Just more words.
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LWolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 08:29 PM
Response to Reply #201
214. Proof has been posted again and again right here. Every day.
I could search it out and post it again, but why? I've already been working all day. At home. For no pay.

Grading. Planning. Communicating with students by email.

I've stopped in here and there when I needed a break, not to work to provide "proof" to someone who wouldn't acknowledge it if it landed in his lap and danced.

Really. If it weren't posted and pointed out here over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over, if it were really hard to find, it would be reasonable.

Under the circumstances, it's like GWB's supporters demanding "proof" that he's an idiot.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 08:53 PM
Response to Reply #214
226. No, bullshit "has been posted again and again right here. Every day." Still no proof, eh?
You have zero proof. All you have are just words. Not even a pretty speech... :rofl:
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LWolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 11:53 AM
Response to Reply #226
285. You make my point. nt
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BobbyBoring Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:36 PM
Response to Original message
148. I don't think it matters
I think whoever becomes POTUS is shown the Zapruder film before taking oath and therefore will play the game. Until, the PTB are exposed for the murderous thieves that they are and executed, not much will change~
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:38 PM
Response to Reply #148
152. and they money to entice ..nt
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onethatcares Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:36 PM
Response to Original message
149. ponies, we're finally gonna get our damn ponies
of course they might be mixed pieces from the wild horse slaughter, they might be old nags that have seen better days, but he'll tell us that in the spirit of bipartisanship he allowed the republicons to keep the best ponies for themselves and we should be glad he negotiated so hard on our behalf or we'd only get half ponies, or in the worst case no ponies at all.

Keeping the faith and running on hope, I remain.
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Obamanaut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:38 PM
Response to Original message
151. Republish the old ones, and add "And this time, I mean it." nt
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:43 PM
Response to Original message
158. Hope and Cringe.
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99th_Monkey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 01:59 PM
Response to Original message
166. Vote for "STRANGE YOU CAN BELIEVE IN" ~nt
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TBF Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 02:55 PM
Response to Original message
174. "chill out - i got this - for the wealthy owners" nt
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NYC Liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 03:05 PM
Response to Original message
176. To continue with the numerous accomplishments of his first term.
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 03:05 PM by NYC Liberal
He has accomplished more already than many presidents have in a full one or even two terms in some cases.

You asked DUers with what they were satisfied? DU is hardly representative of the real world. In the real world, the liberal base of the Democratic Party and the party overall overwhelmingly support President Obama and approve of his jpb performance.

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/promises/obameter/rulings/promise-kept/">134 promises made and kept so far.
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 03:10 PM
Response to Reply #176
179. not in my neck of the woods..nt
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Tierra_y_Libertad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 03:11 PM
Response to Reply #176
180. Well, he did keep his promise to escalate the lost war in Afghanistan.
A noteworthy promise and achievement.
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somone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 04:37 PM
Response to Reply #180
190. He didn't get the war prize for nuthin'
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 07:56 PM
Response to Reply #180
204. Garbage. He ended the war in Iraq. He'll end the war in Afghanistan, too.
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 08:28 PM
Response to Reply #204
213. The war in Iraq is over?
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 08:35 PM
Response to Reply #213
216. Google is your friend. You can also ask PM Maliki or contact the Iraq embassy
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 08:36 PM by ClarkUSA
Proof:

1. http://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=iraq+war+ended&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8
2. http://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=combat+troop&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8

Iraq Embassy contact info: http://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=iraq+embassy&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 08:37 PM
Response to Reply #216
218. Ah, well, as long as no troops remain all is good.
Thank you for the great news.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 08:54 PM
Response to Reply #218
227. In that case, we must be still at "war" with Germany, Japan and Korea, too.
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 08:54 PM by ClarkUSA
:rofl:
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 09:02 PM
Response to Reply #227
230. When was the last time an American soldier died in Germany, Japan or Korea?
When was the last time one died in Iraq?

Can we compare numbers? Please?
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 09:26 PM
Response to Reply #230
238. Still not interested, Clark?
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 09:42 PM
Response to Reply #230
242. Moving the goalpost? Again? lol! Your point is?
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 09:48 PM
Response to Reply #242
246. You brought the topic up. They're your goalposts. Duh!
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:05 PM
Response to Reply #246
248. Wrong again. You questioned whether the Iraq war ended, mentioned "troops" then "soldier died".
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 10:06 PM by ClarkUSA
That's two goalposts. I scored a hat trick, though. Go read now.
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:13 PM
Response to Reply #248
252. "In that case, we must be still at "war" with Germany, Japan and Korea, too."
ClarkUSA post #230

Tell me, out of the two of us, who brought up Germany, Korea and Japan first? Hmmmmm...got the guts to answer this question, Clark?

I'll ask again, since YOU brought it up, when did the last U.S. soldiers die in Iraq, Korea, Germany and Japan? I've looked the answers up, but you seemed to know what you were talking about, so I figure I'll run it by you first. So, what's your answer?
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:22 PM
Response to Reply #252
253. That was an apt reply to your goalpost re: "troops".
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 10:24 PM by ClarkUSA
<< I'll ask again, since YOU brought it up, when did the last U.S. soldiers die in Iraq, Korea, Germany and Japan? >>

Your point is?
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:04 PM
Response to Reply #253
262. You brought it all up, dude. Ask yourself what the point was.
Duh, once again.

Is this the kind of questions I should look forward to all night, or should I expect something approaching intelligence at some point?
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:16 PM
Response to Reply #253
265. And lets recap, as someone seems to be getting lost.....
You said the Iraq War was over. I then said, "Ah, well, as long as no troops remain all is good. Thank you for the great news."

Now, I may be nuts, but I don't see the words "Germany", "Japan" or "Korea" anywhere in my response. Do you? Didn't think so. However, your response to that post said this, "In that case, we must be still at "war" with Germany, Japan and Korea, too."

Then, when I asked you about the countries that YOU brought up in your reply, you said I was moving the goalposts. Is this recounting of events correct? I think the words still sitting there say "yes", but I'm sure you have a reason why your words above aren't really the words that every single other DUer can read....

Anyways, you're with me so far, right? Do you have any corrections to make to my recounting of events? Am I misquoting you or myself anywhere? If so, please include quotes where I got it wrong.
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-11 10:51 PM
Response to Reply #253
289. You ever going to come back and answer?
You were very interested in my point, but then avoided the answer like the plague. This is my third try to get you to respond and explain why you brought up the countries you did, and why you then turned around and accused me of moving the goalposts when I tried to discuss the things YOU yourself mentioned. You're all over DU tonight, and I find it hard you've missed the last two responses, but giving you the benefit of the doubt here's a third one. I'll kick it back up tomorrow in case you miss it tonight.
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Tierra_y_Libertad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:17 PM
Response to Reply #204
266. He escalated the war in Afghanistan. Have you been asleep?
Escalated. As in increased, raised, made more. And, now the "Peace prize" winner has involved us in another loser.
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 03:50 PM
Response to Reply #176
185. 87% of liberal democrats?..that is laughable..he threw us under the bus a long time ago..nt
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 07:54 PM
Response to Reply #185
202. Not at all. You represent a small minority. I am a liberal. You don't speak for me.
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NYC Liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 07:55 PM
Response to Reply #185
203. LOL, only in DU La-La Land. In the real world, most liberals
acknowledge Obama's accomplishments and understand how things actually work.
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BzaDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 07:59 PM
Response to Reply #185
208. If you call the data laughable, isn't that a problem with your conception of reality (rather than
the data)?
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 09:34 PM
Response to Reply #208
240. How did that data trranslate to good things in 2010?
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BzaDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 03:45 AM
Response to Reply #240
270. Simple. Liberal participation (and percentage of liberals voting for Democrats) was just as high as
the last midterm (when we took both houses).
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 11:09 AM
Response to Reply #270
284. That doesn't answer the question.
How did that data help the Democrats? Did we do good in the midterms?
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BzaDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 05:18 PM
Response to Reply #284
286. As far as liberals and Democrats are concerned, we did great. As far as right wingers and moderates
were concerned, we did not do well, since they thought our party was too far to the left. So in the end, Republicans won, but it had about as much to do with dissatisfaction from the left as did McCain's win in the Republican primary. Which is to say nothing.
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-11 03:17 PM
Response to Reply #286
287. What issues were we too far left on?
And which ones do you feel we should modify to more appeal to right wingers? Clearly, liberals and Democrats weren't enough by themselves, so we need more than us. What areas do you want us to be more like them so we can get their votes?

And isn't it kind of a disconnect to say that dissatisfaction on the Left had nothing to do with the losses in 2010 while being upset at the idea of a primary from the Left? What's to fear if there's nothing to fear? :shrug:
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BzaDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-11 05:13 PM
Response to Reply #287
288. I don't think we should move to the right or appeal to right wingers.
I think there was very little we could have done to win Independents in 2010, and to the extent mirroring the Republican party would have helped (which I doubt), I don't think we should have done it regardless.

I'm just saying that in 2010 at least, the reason we lost was generally not because of liberals and Democrats. It is of course true that there are always some liberals/Democrats that don't turn out, that could benefit individual races by turning out. But in aggregate, the liberal percentage of the vote was the same as it was in the last midterm election, where we swept both houses.
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Marr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 06:23 PM
Response to Reply #176
192. That list is just hilarious. The whole thing is summed up by this item:
"No. 37: Extend the Bush tax cuts for lower incomes
Extend the Bush tax cuts for those making less than $250,000 (couples) or $200,000 (single)
>> More"

Yeah, *and* the Bush Tax Cuts for millionaires, too. He could have let them expire and the Democrats could have advanced those middle class tax cuts on their own, but they chose to pretend they had no choice in the matter and extended those for the filthy rich as well. In other words, they just endorsed the Bush Tax Cuts... the same tax cuts they pretended to be so against when they were in the minority.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 07:59 PM
Response to Reply #192
207. lol! Talk about "hilarious"! You have yet to prove a thing you say.
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 08:23 PM by ClarkUSA
<< He could have let them expire and the Democrats could have advanced those middle class tax cuts on their own >>

Prove it.
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Marr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:48 PM
Response to Reply #207
255. I don't think you know what "prove" means.
You keep demanding proof for things that aren't in dispute.

1. The Bush Tax Cuts were set to expire.

2. The Democrats still controlled both houses of Congress at that time.

They could've introduced those middle class tax cuts as a separate bill if they'd chosen to. I assume you think they couldn't have been passed that way, and that the Republicans would've thrown themselves on their sword, pissing off their broader base in order to make a symbolic protest for their rich constituency. I think that's unlikely, but it doesn't change the fact that the items described *could* have been introduced separately.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:55 PM
Response to Reply #255
257. I don't think you know how Congress works.
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 10:57 PM by ClarkUSA
<< He could have let them expire and the Democrats could have advanced those middle class tax cuts on their own >>

With the Teabagger House set to take over??? No, they couldn't have without knowing they'd have zero chance of extending UI and passing a second stimulus, among other things important to the middle-class. Fortunately, Pres. Obama, Speaker Pelosi and Majority Leader Reid are not the type to cut off their nose to spite their face.
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Marr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:10 PM
Response to Reply #257
264. You do not get to make up your own facts, sorry.
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 11:16 PM by Marr
They could have introduced it separately. The Bush Tax Cuts were set to expire.

You can make up all the excuses you like for what might've happened if they had done, or how impossible it would have been to pass, or how the Democratic leadership's handling of the issue was actually brilliant politics and not a cynical method of prolonging the Bush Tax Cuts in their entirety-- that's your prerogative. But you cannot deny that they could have introduced middle class tax cuts separately.
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BzaDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 03:47 AM
Response to Reply #264
271. Of course they could have introduced them separately. So what? How is that at all relevant?
I mean, I could say things like "the Sun will rise tomorrow," and that is equally true, but it has about as much relevancy as your post.
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loudsue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 03:05 PM
Response to Original message
177. Al Franken would do in a heartbeat.
Not as liberal as I wish he was, but not a guy to mess with.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 03:17 PM
Response to Original message
181. Deleted message
Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
MannyGoldstein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 03:47 PM
Response to Original message
184. "Who the %&$# else ya gonna vote for, chumps?"
"I'm not Sarah Palin."
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joentokyo Donating Member (138 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 09:21 PM
Response to Reply #184
235. Maybe a uncultured ass will run. Have you considered running?
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MannyGoldstein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:56 PM
Response to Reply #235
258. At least my grammar is better than a tea bagger's nt
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 04:40 PM
Response to Original message
191. Deleted message
Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
slay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 06:45 PM
Response to Original message
193. I just hope we can get someone
to run against him in the primary. Otherwise many of us - under current DU rules - are going to get banned. I can not support him any longer either. I don't see how anyone who's been paying attention can! Great post. K&R.
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ProgressIn2008 Donating Member (848 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 06:52 PM
Response to Original message
194. Slogan: "Where else you think you can go, bitch?" That about sums it up. nt
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BzaDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 07:58 PM
Response to Original message
206. I think it will take another Republican president before posts like these suddenly stop showing up.
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 08:00 PM by BzaDem
Just like magic. Reality can have that effect.

In reality, it will be a long time before we ever have a President as liberal as Obama. And if that sounds ridiculous or "a joke" to you, that is a problem with your expectations (rather than with the proposition). But eventually, reality will continue rolling on and what is obvious to the vast majority of Democrats and liberals will become apparent to the remaining few.
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 09:23 PM
Response to Reply #206
237. or a real democrat..nt
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BzaDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 03:51 AM
Response to Reply #237
272. At what point are you going to realize that you aren't going to see a "real Democrat" as defined by
you?

in 20 years? 30 years? How long does it take before you finally admit it?

Both parties have small groups of people that will never be satisfied with ANYONE their party successfully elects. A similarly small group of people were complaining because Bush wasn't sufficiently conservative for them. But that doesn't make either group relevant or of non-negligible size.
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:06 PM
Response to Reply #206
250. Aim high!
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sarcasmo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 08:26 PM
Response to Original message
211. Legalizing Cannabis.
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markpkessinger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 08:37 PM
Response to Original message
219. Here's a better question:
Who will believe his platform of promises for 2012?
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 09:00 PM
Response to Reply #219
229. Those who read Politifact.com's list of 134 promises kept and accept the facts.
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 09:00 PM by ClarkUSA
Also, the 87% of the liberal Democratic base who approve of his job performance as of last week's Gallup polling, in addition to the majority of independents who approve of his job performance as per the most recent Pew poll and a small minority of Republicans (which is still larger than the tiny minority of Democrats who disapprove of him).
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 09:22 PM
Response to Reply #229
236. i'm sorry Clark but you are in for a rude awakening when that 87% dont show up for him
he had us...he so had us willing to do just about anything..but he has failed and has not represented liberals no matter how you spin it..or attempt to spin it..
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 09:31 PM
Response to Reply #236
239. Does your crystal ball do hurricane warnings, too? Or is that wishful thinking?
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 09:32 PM by ClarkUSA
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 09:44 PM
Response to Reply #239
244. time will tell...you are working so hard i just dont think you should be surprised..nt
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 09:47 PM
Response to Reply #244
245. You represent a tiny minority, happy to say. I hope you won't be surprised when Obama wins big.
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 09:50 PM by ClarkUSA
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:02 PM
Response to Reply #245
247. actually your position is the minority position here on du, i believe..
Edited on Sat Mar-26-11 10:05 PM by xiamiam
and while i know that du is not the real world..i can tell you that my opinion is reflective of my community in northern cal...
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:08 PM
Response to Reply #247
251. Really? Prove it. There are 169,401 user registrations. Have you polled every user?
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xiamiam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:34 PM
Response to Reply #251
254. i think if there were more supporters, you would not have needed to post 60 times in this thread..nt
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:01 PM
Response to Reply #254
259. lol! Just keep repeating that to yourself... and see what happens in 2012.
Pres. Obama's margin of victory will be even larger than in 2008, when he won by the largest margin since LBJ. Mark my words.
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Marr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:53 PM
Response to Reply #251
256. LMAO! There you go with the "prove it" again!
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:02 PM
Response to Reply #256
261. LMAO! There you go with "just words" again!
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Marr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 11:06 PM
Response to Reply #261
263. Prove it.
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datasuspect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 05:58 AM
Response to Reply #256
275. sounds like the newspaper comment section conservabots
they're always asking for "proof" (without saying what kind - primary sources? secondary sources?) as if taking people to task on discussion boards by pretending to be scholarly is something revolutionary or new.
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ReggieVeggie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 06:01 AM
Response to Reply #251
276. and maybe 5 or 6 thousand active users
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flvegan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 08:47 PM
Response to Original message
225. He should just try honesty.
Look, I'm not the best choice. I'm going to disappoint a lot of you, just not those of you so firmly entrenched in the GObama! camp who would be happy if I signed a resolution releasing the plague into our food and water systems. But the alternative is so much more worse and scary, and you're all so fearful already, just vote for me and be done with it.
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FLAprogressive Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-11 10:06 PM
Response to Original message
249. "I'm not [my opponent]".
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Godhumor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 02:02 AM
Response to Original message
269. Well, considering I am extremely happy with his first term, he doesn't need to say much
to get me to vote for him a second time. A "I'll stay the course" will do me just fine.
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creon Donating Member (723 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-11 07:12 AM
Response to Reply #269
281. so am I
Obama has been fine.

I am not satisfied with the performance of Congress.

For the 111th Congress, I give the HoR a "C-" . I give the Senate: "F".
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fried eggs Donating Member (178 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-11 10:57 PM
Response to Original message
290. frankly, I think he has done a good job of keeping his promises
as far is 2012 is concerned, I'm guessing his platform will be about moving forward and not backwards.
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